₦airaland Forum

Is Quran free from error or contradcition?

ayenny02: you didn't show me anything except you exposed more of your falsehood

I know the truth is so far away from you for typing this and it really shows that Quran is full of lies. If you can remember, I've asked you on this same thread that did Quran support lie? To win an arguement is not by lying.

I stop to repling to your post because you keep exposing your ignorance.

Yes, enough contradiction see urself here https://www.nairaland.com/1337631/book-god-what-happened

compare these two statement @ayenny

Jesus said abt Mohammad (saw) not holy spirit

Why can't you be specific?

If you want to condem Bible, condem It and if you want to support It so that you can use It as an evidence for the coming of spirit-to-man support It and stand on your point.

For you to claim that Bible contradict and still claim Bible support the coming of spirit-to-man it means you're du.mbness.

I heard the news this moring from a RADIO program called "Moring Drive" in Abuja, that NCC said over 27million SIM users are not yet register their SIM and the deadline is on SUNDAY otherwise all the SIM will be disconnected.

Incase you're among those 27M you can do something between now and Sunday or you can still comfirm from your network customer care to be very sure your SIM has been registered.

I want Ooman and Kay 17 to have OBE oneday, hope my prayer will be answered

ayenny02: I have shown you where some prophet of God have more than one wife and they even married more than We muslims because we should not marry more than fourGood that you accepted that they didn't ask jesus abt polygamy. They just approached jesus with a question about whether or not it is allowed for a man to divorce his wife

Now listen to yourself prophet marry more than one wife, the point or question you haven't answered is was it written that they can marry more than one or the act was performed by individual that do so?

That verses was talking abt DIVORCE NOT POLYGAMY

Do you understand!!!!!!!!

Yes I do!
What I'm saying is, the question is base on divorce but the answer is more than divorce according to the verse "He said to them,“Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives,...." definitely there're other things that Moses will permit them to do not because it is a law. Even the evidence is very glering as we can see in the Bible. They provoke him(Moses), rejected his God e.t.c

ayenny02: NOW YOU HAVE HUG THE TRANSFORMER

You said jesus is GOD. Fine!

From your answer to my Question 2, you said Jesus is Son of God.

Now I want you to take one out of the TWO, Either you take Jesus is God and deny Jesus is Son of God OR
Take Jesus is Son of God and deny Jesus is God
Pls take ONE and DENY one

Both!!!

The perspective that Jesus call Himself the son of God is on earth which is what they are expecting from God but the perspective that Jesus is God is clear in many of His statements

He said where two or three are gather in my name I will be there-Omnipresent

He said also: "after the tribulation, shall the sun darken, and the moon will fail to give is light......"Omniscient because He created them He knows that without sun, moon can't give light--comfirmed by scientist.

Many more of His statement.

My Question is WHO added mark 9-20

Me!

Why simple english is your problem? Try to reread the post you quote for an answer.

ayenny02: Yes. You must show where jesus said Polygamy is not allowed by God. If you can't show it definitely Bible and God support itWhich verses you shown to you, did it relate to Polygamy
In the verses you qouted, we see that Jesus was approached with a question about whether or not it is allowed for a man to divorce his wife in Matthew 19:3.  Jesus immediately referred to the Old Testament for the answer in Matthew 19:4. He referred to Adam and Eve, one man and one woman.  The Old Testament does talk about the story of Adam and Eve as one husband and one wife.   However, the Old Testament which Jesus had referred to in Matthew 19:3 does allow polygamy.

Then show where the Bible says you can practise POLYGAMY.

DID THEY ASK HIM ABOUT POLYGAMY?

No! But why did you conclude He allows polygamy too?

Beside must you being told before you descerned that no two wifes was allowed in His statement. Remember is plainly written in Quran.

Can you show me in bible where God said to those Prophets that Married more than one wife that God was not allow it and they just done it on their own interest

Mathew 19:8 -He said to them,“Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives,......"

From this verse the divorce, and any other thing they practiced was permitted not a law but because the question was centered on divorce yet as an intellectual somebody you can reason that some things were permitted not given as law. The laws are difference from what they permit them to do.


What do you understand in this statement?
"Matt 19:6-So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”

ayenny02: [img][/img]Yes. I believe that we all came from God.

Jesus said "Here, O Israel:  The Lord our God is one Lord."   The words "our God" indicate that Jesus had a higher God over him, a stronger God than him.  Jesus didn't say "Your God".  He said "our God" which includes Jesus as the creation of GOD.

My Question is Can we call JESUS is God Himself?

If it is the issue of Jesus is God is already being proved. Jesus is the Lord(God)!!!

Don't derail the thread.

The oldest copies of the Gospel of Mark, the Sinaitic and Vatican, end at Mark 16:8. A note in the New International Version of the Bible states: "The most reliable early manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do not have Mark 16:9-20." Verses 9 to 20 appear to have been added later by an unknown person

WHO ADDED verses 9 to 20?

Initially verses 9-20 was not in the original manuscript but in that footnote they make it clear that at the end of verse 8 of original manuscript this statement was there which was omitted in interpretaion of verse 8 "Then they quickly reported all these instructions to those around Peter. After this, Jesus himself also sent out through them from east to west the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation. Amen. It was this statement they interpreted to verses 9-20 and if you look at this statement is correlated with the statement in that verses 9-20, get wisdom ayenny!

The people that later interpret the Bible from original manuscripts added it. Nothing like forgery.

So you are telling me that Catholic Bible was not from God, it was forgery

Is Quran a book from God and forgery?

ayenny02: In Exodus 21:10, a man can marry an infinite amount of women without any limits to how many he can marry.

In Deuteronomy 21:15 "If a man has two wives, and he loves one but not the other, and both bear him sons...."

After my explanation on the two verses you can still hold on to it as an evidence.

ayenny02: This man you get problem. I said give me verses where JESUS SAID POLYGAMY IS PROHIBITED in Bible

must it be wirtten boldly that POLYGAMY is not allow when many verse has been shown to you, what else do you want?

You just want to calim that Bible support polygamy so that Quran is right too practice it.

Let me remind you Jesus said: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets;

This verse is a major one that most people misinterpreted in Bible. See @ayenny you can't interpret Bible without having the Holyspirit(pracalete) in you.

Jesus statement here is as clear as pure water. He didn't come to deny their laws or any prophets who gave the laws but to let them know that He came to fulfill them.

Then if I may ask; are you fuifilling law or you obey law? But because the Jews believe that the Old Testament is full of laws that why they refer to it sometime as Mosaic Law (Book) that's why Jesus refers to book as laws but indirectly He was talking about the prophecies inside.

I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.  I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished.  (Matthew 5:17-18)"

Wxplain above

Let us look at some of the verses from the Old Testament that allow polygamy:

In Exodus 21:10, a man can marry an infinite amount of women without any limits to how many he can marry.

In 2 Samuel 5:13; 1 Chronicles 3:1-9, 14:3, King David had six wives and numerous concubines.

In 1 Kings 11:3, King Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines.

In 2 Chronicles 11:21, King Solomon's son Rehoboam had 18 wives and 60 concubines.

In Deuteronomy 21:15 "If a man has two wives, and he loves one but not the other, and both bear him sons...."

All this mentioning above is people that marry more than one wife I'm expecting you to quote where Bible says you can marry more than one wife. Not that Bible allow it but they decided to do it in their own ways.
And Jesus says the reason why it was allow to be so in the Old Testament but later says from beginning it was one wife one husband which we must continue.

You can continue to marry wife as many as you want because Quran support it but we christians know that it's one wife and one husband because Bible against it.

There are a lot more verses from the Old Testament that allow polygamy, but I think that the above are sufficient enough to prove my point.

Out of it!!!

ayenny02: in John 10:30, jesus and God = God
in John 17:21-23, Disciples +Jesus+ God=God

Your last equation is correct as you equate it to God because we all came out from God but it will be more perfect if the third entity (Jesus) is added, have you added Jesus to your life to be one in God? remember this is the major reason while Jesus came to this world to reconcile us back to God. I so much love this your equation.

why can't we called disciples "God" when Jesus was called God

What you miss there is that Jesus was talking about their life after His departure.

Details of John 17:21-23 in bracket!

21that they all may be one(be in unity), as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us(have a body of Christ and spirit of His Father), that the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one(be in unity) just as We are one(as nobody can seperate Jesus and His Father): 23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one,(be in unity with us) and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.

The point Jesus want to bring out is them to be in unity so that they can be part of His Father

http://niv.scripturetext.com/mark/16.htm

The key point you miss here it that you fail to get the clue of what they meant by footnote, Footnotes:
a8 Some manuscripts have the following ending between verses 8 and 9, and one manuscript has it after verse 8 (omitting verses 9-20): Then they quickly reported all these instructions to those around Peter. After this, Jesus himself also sent out through them from east to west the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation. Amen.

@bold-at original manuscripts they omitted the statement above which they later translated to verse 9-20.

Do you believe in Apocrypha

Is Apocrypha God? Why will I believe in Apocrypha? They're books written after the prophet Malachi inwhich the Jews themselves confess that no voice of any prophets were heard during that perion.

ayenny02: If you read Matthew (28:1-10), Mark (16:1-20), Luke (24:1-12), and John (20: 1-18), you will find contradicting stories. They all agreed that the tomb was guarded for three days. However, they reported the discovery of the empty tomb differently.

They all gave an accurate account about the tomb but the perspective you interpret them to cover the truth make it looks that way.

Matthew (28) and John (20) reported that Mary Magdalene and the other Mary were the first to discover the tomb.

Yes!!!

Mark (16) reports that Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James, and Salome were the first to discover the empty tomb.

Yes! The report of Mathew and John just make it clear that it's not one Mary but other Mary was there too which Mark gave the actual detail of the other Mary, because of a day like this.

Mark (28) reports that there was an earthquake that removed the rock from over the tomb. He says that an angel caused it. The other gospels do not mention of an earthquake.

I believe you mean Mathew here because Mark stop @ 16!

Mathew was the only Gospel that gives details of how the stone was removed while other just talk about event that happened after the stone has been removed, if not a day like this your question might be; how the stone was removed by two women or do they sure that the tomb was covered? Mathew also report what happened to the keepers for the fear of the angel that rolled it away.

Matthew and Mark say that only ONE man in white clothes was sitting on the tomb when the women arrived, and that he was an angel.

Their report is at the entering of the tomb not inside the tomb. That's why Mathew report the Angel said to them ".....come, see the place where the Lord lay." Matt 28:6 meanwhile, Mark report the Angel said "....: behold the place where they laid Him". Which means the Angel gave them the order to enter in both gospel and usher them in.

Luke says that TWO men in white clothes, who were angels, were sitting.

When they enter they saw two men whom are Angels. The other angel is Jesus that appeared inform of an angel--Angel that appear inform of Christ is called Christophany while inform of God is called Theophany.

Johns says that the two women did not meet anybody the first time they came to the tomb, but when they returned, they saw TWO people, ONE was an ANGEL, and the other was JESUS.

Note: John first report was after the women went and call Jesus desciples as you can see Peter was there meanwhile others report event of the two women only before they call the desciples.
It was John who made it clear that what LUKE report is truely an angel but the other one is an angel who appears as Christophany.

Matthew reports that when the guards reported this to the chief priest, the chief priest paid them a large sum of money, telling them: "You have to say that his disciples came at night and stole his body." He claims that the soldiers took money and spread the story around and since then, the story had been circulating among the Jews until today (according to Matthew). The other gospels do not report of any such thing.

Mathew report only to let you know how cunning the Jews are, after the keepers reported the real incident they still want to cover the truth: (as Ayenny is doing today) to make it seems fake but if Jesus' body was stolen who now woke Him up from death? because He resurrected and show Himself to many people before He was taken to Heaven.

Are you preparing for His second coming because has He was taken into heaven, He will surely return likewise.

QUESTION 6. Which narration now is more authentic?

All!!!

ayenny02: QUESTION 1. So why did they give the previous "one" a different meaning from the other five "ones?

Because you've been blindfolded you're unable to realised that Jesus was praying for His desciple they should be one as 'He and His father' are one. Refer to Act 2:1 "When the Day of Pentecost had fully come, they were all with one accord in one place." Which Jesus has prayed for.

QUESTION 2. Why does the Bible say that Jesus wanted to die on the cross, when the one on the cross was shouting "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" according to Matthew 27:45 and Mark 15:33?

Because God's eyes cannot behold iniquity, He has to forsake His only begotten Son.
 

QUESTION 3. Christians say that people go to Heaven ONLY THROUGH JESUS, yet Paul says in 1 CORINTHIANS 7:8-16

Your assumption here is totally false. Paul only addresses the issue of marriage as a christian marry an unbeliever. John 14:6 "Jesus said to him, I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me."

 

QUESTION 4. Christians say that the Paraclete means the Holy Spirit (John 14;26). Jesus said in John 16:7-8 "If I do not go away the Paraclete will not come to you". This could not mean the Holy spirit, since the Holy spirit was said to have been there before Jesus was even born as in Luke 1:41 "Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit". Here, the Holy spirit was also present during Jesus life time. So how could this fit with the condition that Jesus must go away so that the Holy spirit will come?

Proved: Holyspirit is the comforter!

QUESTION 5. If the Holy Spirit.....

Not all christians are truely Christ-like. People that are truely Christlike enjoying the existence of God, Jesus and the Holyspirit in their life. By the way the same is applicable to Muslim to can you give your reason?
 

QUESTION 7. Why doesn’t Mark 16:9-20 exist in as many versions of the Bible while it exists as a footnote or between brackets in some other versions? Is a footnote in the Bible still considered as God’s word, especially when it addresses an important feature like the Ascension?

Where did you read it that is a footnote?

QUESTION 8. Why does the Catholic Bible contain 73 books while the Protestant Bible has only 66? With both claiming to have the complete Word of God, which one should be believed and why?

They were more than 14 books called Apocrypha written close at the end of the OT (400BC), the Jews themselves clearly state that no voice of any prophets was heard during this time and the OT has been compiled called Septuagin before the Birth of Christ. So some people still went ahead to include those Apocrypha into their book. John 8:32 "Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall made you free"

QUESTION 9. As a Christian, do you agree that out of fairness and honesty you must investigate what Islam says about God, Jesus, including this life and the hereafter?

If not some Christians have been quoting from Quran on this thread as you can see. BUT do you also do the same to Bible?

QUESTION10. Being a Christian, do you also believe that we must all stand accountable to our Creator and that the Creator is Perfect and Just? As a sincere believer in God, don’t you owe it upon yourself to find out the entire unadulterated truth regardless of the consequences.

God will never lie! So He said and that's how it will be.

Question 6 to be answer later because of space.

@Ayenny

Let me just say this; though I may continue to help your ignorance after you agree with my conclusion.

Firstly, you stake on Marriage: it's just a pity that you interpret Bible just to suit your fallacious point not what the Bible really teaches.

You claim no verse in the NT tha support single wife whereas Jesus statement make it clear that is one wife.
Matt 19:4-6 "4 And He answered and said to them,“Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning ‘made them male and female,’ 5 and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? 6 So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”
Note the @bold carefully.

Later they quote from Moses book and He reply them this way in verse 8-9 "8 He said to them, “Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. 9 And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is divorced commits adultery.”

because of their heart hardedness that's why moses said they can divorce their wife but Jesus now tell them whosoever that do so committed adultery. Immediately, His desciples realised that the law is too hard they reply it's better not to even marry then but He let them know it's possible but only for those who are ready to receive it--verse 11-12
Even God hate divorce Malachi 2:16 “For the Lord God of Israel says That He hates divorce,
For it covers one’s garment with violence,”...........

So for Christian it is one wife and one husband.

You quote Exodus 21:10, Deut 21:15.

That's why I always shake my head when I see the way you twist Bible just to support your lies and the truth is so far away from you and you didn't realise it yet you just want to prove your religion is right by condeming Bible.

In Exodus 21:10 that you quote why can't you tell the truth for once AYENNY, and did Quran support lie too?

The verse is talking about a maidservant under his master that if pleases his master to marry her to his son, the maidservant must have the final say. In v10 the writer continue that if the master marry another wife for his son the right of that maidservant must be granted. Then it means if you don't have a maidservant you must not marry two wife, and for the people that have maidservant with what is happening today if I ask, how many rich man's son can marry their housemaid? though it happens sometimes but the range is very wide.

In Deu 21:15 Moses said IF a man is not FOR you that have it simply means is something that is not common but in case it happens then this is how to treat them---whereas Jesus make it clear why Moses permitted them in Math 19 and Jesus made it clear it was not so, it still remains one wife and one husband.

For us to continue with the remaining question, do you believe that Bible contradict? And for you to believe then Jesus is not talking about Muhammad. Agree or Disagree?

Arosa: Good luck with that, you are going to need it.

I dey tell you, ten years of my research.

unphilaz: Jesus Christ the Enigma.

This personality has baffled men on three or so points

- Did He Exist

- If He Exist, Was He crucified?

- If He was crucified, Did he really resurrect?

I dey tell you!

It always baffles and I make me ask myself, is it because they can hold on to their belief/evidence or as a result of conscience?

The next arguement will be "we want the video evidence of His resurrection".

All of you we soon begin to patronize made in Nigeria by the time I invent my own engine that doesn't use petrol, diesel or battery. Just AIR & Water!

[quote author=From_Guiriga]I have not taken back my position. My initial argument is still my main argument.

I have told you they are books that were put together by man/scribes. The bible is a collection of books or writings. People chose which books to include and which books to leave out. Some authors are know and some are unknown. I mean, these and more are the facts.
Why not accept them?[/quote]@bold-Actually they're epistles puting together and called it Bible.

The bones of my contention is the content inside. Afterall all books are compile and print using electronics device. The content inside is what make It 'Holy & True' because it came out from Holyspirit. So it's a HolyBook!

hisblud: Always the same lame excuse of recycled work.... if its not God is non - existent, if the divinity is too hard for em to comprehend, they throw up that He (Jesus Christ) NEVER existed... furthermore they compare Jesus and Socrates and prefer socrates becos he was just a philosopher unlike Jesus who claimed divinity, hence their distaste for Him...una never tire... if He is a myth why all this brohaha ... why disturb your limited life?

Why??

This Jesus Christ done hear am oh? Just typed Jesus Christ on google 139 Million topic for or against Him, typed julius ceasar it showed 447, 000 and socrates showed 15 Million.

back to the topic, are you sure about the above people you posted up there?

Eyaa, kpele oh...

I dey tell you my Brother!

This is a call to all christians to increase the tempo of our call.

Like play like play Bible is fulfilling Its prophesy.

striktlymi: Morning Emusan,

Same!!!

Now can you show us where I said or implied the following:
1) God lied!
2) The creation account in Genesis is wrong.

No! I didn't say so pls.

What I mean is the view of the OP 'Day is Day' which is just 24hrs and the Genesis made it clear that it happened instantly. If event happened in a day it doesn't mean it spand from 12:00am-11:59pm but we still term it a day.

Now, if you can believe that the day talked about in Genesis is just a few hours, what then is wrong with me saying that it might just be 100,000 years? Note that I didn't even state what I believe like you did!

Well Emusan, the bold are your words not mine....when one says that the 'day' talked about in Genesis could mean a thousand years, this is not the same as the individual saying that God cannot create the Universe in an istant.

You agree that God finished the work of creation in 6 consecutive days...does this mean that God cannot finish the same task in just one day or one second?...do we now say that because God decided to do it this way then he is not omnipotent?

The point you are missing here is this: Saying that God decided to do something in a particular way is different from saying that God cannot do it.

If God choose to create the world in 6 days, evenly spread over 5 million years, then that's his choice... Sacred scriptures made us understand that the way God looks at a day is very different from the way humans look at it...

2 Peter 3:8
King James Version (KJV)
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.


Psalm 90:4
King James Version (KJV)
4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.

This is one major reason why people get confused when Jesus said he will come soon...we expect the soon to be as man defines it but God's ways are not the ways of man.

So Emusan, I do not see any conflict between my OP and sacred scriptures...if there is any, do point it out.

Ok!

I don't think you are referring to this thread because no Atheist posted before you and no one has talked about photosynthesis.

I have change it I meant a thread.

ayenny02: that is CONTRADICTION for you

I know you will misunderstand that statement, you said any man cannot address his Mother 'woman' I now ask did Jesus say anything like Mother about the woman?

The miracle of Jonah was that he was alive for 3 days and 3 nights

If Jonah was alive for three days and three nights, then Jesus also ought to have been alive in the tomb as he himself had foretold! But Christianity hangs on the flimsy thread of the death" of Jesus for its salvation. So it has to answer that Jesus was DEAD for three days and three nights.

Jesus died on the cross of calvary and He was laid in a tomb for three days.

The contradiction  between his utterance and its fulfilment is obvious. Jonah ALIVE, Jesus DEAD! Very UNLIKE Jonah! Jesus had said "LIKE Jonah" not UNLIKE Jonah. If this is true then according to his own test Jesus is not the TRUE Messiah of the Jews. If the Gospel record is genuine then how can we blame the Jews for rejecting "CHRIST"

I will give you more detail about Jonah story just relax.

Remember you once claim that Jesus is the Messiah even Quran support it for you now to say His not the Messiah I think there something wrong somewhere.

Any 5 year old can do the Math and work out that from Friday night to sunday morning is not 3 days/3 nights!

Whos is a kid here?

Even thou Bible didn't give the actual day when Jesus was crucified I can still explain little reason they might have choosen Friday-Sunday.

Everybody will agree that Day start by 12:00AM and end by 11:59 PM. The day that Jesus was crucified it was around afternoon and He died around evening which is still part of that day.

Look at this:

12:00am(Friday)-11:59pm(Friday)
12:00am(Sat)-11:59pm(Sat)
12:00am(Sun)-11:59pm(Sun)

You can see is three days!

Remember any event that happen in a day it doesn't last through the whole day but just few hours within the day. The day you were born the event just last for few hours but it was termed as it happened for the whole day.

How do you expect me to browse any site when I have bible to refute your claims, or you don't believe in Bible again or all my claims was it not in the Bible. OLODO

I so much believe in Bible than any other books.

You claim Jesus was not crucified.

Whereas Jesus Himself made it clear that He will die. You said it's not true.

Bible mentions the name of Jesus' relatives that witness Jesus crucifixion, yet you said isn't true.

I as a friend of Jesus said My Lord was crucified, you said it's a lie.

Then Jesus enemy now said He was crucified, do you have a claim @Ayenny?

That's why I gave you that site so that you can see many Jesus' ENEMIES that testify to His crucifixion though some of them use it to mocked Him but it's a good evidence that He was crucified and exist.

You have seriously display your ignorance:

*You claim Bible contradict Itself
*You claim Jesus was the Messiah
*You claim Jesus is not the Son of God
*You claim Jesus word contradicting.
*Finally, you calim Jesus support the coming of your prophet.

Sharing knowledge with you, is like sharing knowledge with an infant.

@OLAADEGBU
Thanks for bringing this thread up! The idea of billion years by secular people is still rolling in the mind of some christians today that's why, they themselves can't speak authoritatively to support their stand in Genesis. Many christians support the billion years by looking at the natural world through the glass of evolution. Even some christians cannot say precisely that Life originated from God but you will see them saying something "well God might use evolution to make life happen". I pray we christians will continue to interpret this natural world with the power of the Holyspirit.

@strik
Please let's hold on to God's word. God cannot lie! We should know if account of creations in Genesis is wrong then the whole Bible is wrong-Note that

In the Bible the word 'Hour' occurs more than 50times but anywhere is being used it simply means 'instantly'. If Hour means 'instantly' then 'Day' I believe is just like few hours then.

Again by saying literal Day can be 100,000years it means we limited God's omnipotent, what make Him God if He cannot command and action takes place? I have seen on a thread when one atheist said in the creation of Plants there was a day, night and photosynthesis before sun appeard that means Bible is wrong. To my surprise no christian give accurate answer because we're still looking at the works of God through evolutionary perspective.

Photosynthesis is just a method by which plants make their food to enable them to grow and produce seed. Which is a process that God has placed upon all plants to survive.

If Jesus can command a fig tree to dry up instantly, can God also not command a mature trees to come out instantly?

Remember the first statement in creations account is 'Let there be........ Not let the light begins to appear, let plants begin to grow......but Let there be' which is a command statement from omnipotent God and any statement that follow must obey the command.

Thanks.

ayenny02: The Bible says that Jesus addressed his mother from the cross as “ Woman! ” (John 19:26). No mean person will address his mother as “Woman! ”. It is only because the person on the cross was Judas and not Jesus (pbuh) that he addresses Mary as “ Women! ” If you believe that Jesus was crucified, can you please explain this verse to me Matthew 12:40

See how you keep exposing your ignorance, Nobody will address his Mother 'woman'! Did Jesus later call her Mother or not?

Matt 12:40 Jesus was talking about His dead and the days He will spend in the position of death.

Why can't you disprove my statement above? It's better you accept the true way (Jesus) so that you can reign with Him.

There're over 5 prominent ancient people that write about Jesus crucifixion i.e Flavius Josephus, Tacitus, Pliny The Young, Tallus e.t.c so claiming Jesus wasn't crucified according to Quran means your Quran is an imaginary work of ordinary man.

You can browse about those names or check this link if your BP will not rise above normal.

http://beginningandend.com/jesus-exist-historical-evidence-jesus-christ/

plaetton: Just to educate you, the terms BC and AD are no longer used for the very same reasons I have mentioned here: There is no historical validity to the existence of Jesus.
For several decades now, these terms have been discarded from historical and academic literature .
They have been replaced by BCE( Before The Common Era) and CE(Common Era).

Era of what oooo plaetton?

Era-"A system of chronology dating from a particular noteworthy event" please which event is noteworthy in 2000years ago?

If the BC and AD is being discarded, can they discard the year derived in it. Remember 2013AD is at the middle very soon 2014AD will come.

Plato, Julius Ceaser, Homer are prominent people that did great thing and they live before Christ yet their event or time was not taken, why Jesus?

Is like you're dudging this post let me repost it again.

If I charge to court of committen an offence:

*If I said I'm not guity! It doesn't hold any truth because I won't like see myself in jail.

*If any of my family says I'm not guity, perhaps he/she loves me and try to prevent me of going to jail.

*If my best friend says I'm not guity, well maybe is because he's my best friend and never want me to rot in jail.

*But what if my worst enemy now says I'm not guity (probably he/she will want me to rot in jail). Then I'm not guity.

What does the above mean?

One of the greatest enemy of early christians is Lucian of Samosata : THE PASSING OF PEREGRINUS. If Samosata could clearly state in his book that Jesus was crucified I think no arguement should go beyond that.
Samosata 11. “It was then that he learned the wondrous lore of the Christians, by associating with their priests and scribes in Palestine. And—how else could it be?—in a trice he made them all look like children, for he was prophet, cult-leader, head of the synagogue, and everything, all by himself. He interpreted and explained some of their books and even composed many, and they revered him as a god, made use of him as a lawgiver, and set him down as a protector, next after that other, to be sure, whom 11 they still worship, the man who was crucified in Palestine because he introduced this new cult into the world.

http://www.tertullian.org/rpearse/lucian /peregrinus.htm

He even recognises the remaining 11 desciples of Jesus Christ. Then shall we say Jesus didn't exist?

In his book he mocked Christianity but it's a great evidence to prove that Jesus actually exist.

I will like you to disprove this, the website is there too.

truthman2012: there is nothing they will not call their muhammad self. any prophet mentioned in the bible, they say is he, they say he is the holy ghost, now ayenny says he is an angel. angel ko angeli ni. confused folk.

The guy is a liar.

@Ayenny
Please why are you lying?

You created all these threads:

What Happened In Between:jesus's Crucifixion, Death & Resurrection

On this thread you try to claim that Jesus was not crucified and Jesus didn't talk about His crucifixion. Later you've quote from Bible that Jesus cry on the cross

Ayenny02: Why Jesus cry on the cross when he was already known that the purpose of coming to this world was to die?

On this thread also:
Who Is an Anti-christ Btw Islam & Christianity

You make it clear that Christianity is an anti-christ and anyone that denied the teaching of Jesus is an anti-christ.

You state this statement too:

Ayenny02: However, if u examine the bible carefully, u would observe that Paul and the disciples were not preaching the same doctrine and did not believe in the same Jesus.

You created this thread also:
Jesus Will Follow Which Religion When Comes Back?

Here you believe that If Jesus comes He will join Islam.
You claim Jesus is the 'Messiah'

Ayenny02: Now Jesus is indeed the Messiah, but that doesn't make him God, not at all, it is a title of honor given to Jesus.

If I may ask; What is the meaning of Messiah?

In another thread you claimed that what Jesus said in John 14:2 "In my Father's house are many mansions:........" means Jesus will only come and take His own people to His own mansion why Quran make it clear that Allah send many prophet to this world so they have thier own mansion too.

And the purpose of creating this thread before the topic shifted or rest on Holyspirit is that you make it clear that BIBLE 'contradict Itself' now the same Bible that contradict itself -by Ayenny is the same Bible that strongly support the prophesy of your prophet.

After gone through your threads and posts I decided to end any discusion with you because you contradict yourself and interpret the Bible to support your lies.

You claim you believe in Jesus teaching and that Jesus is the Messiah yet you have proved that Jesus is not the Son of God.

You claim Jesus was not crucified but later believe He is a Messiah, then what make Him a Messiah?

You calim that Paul and Jesus' desciples didn't witness and follow the teaching of Jesus but most Bible quote you've ever quoted are from desciples books because none of those books were written by Jesus.

Just go through your own thread you've ever created and begin to compare and contrast I believe you will ashame of yourself contradtion.

plaetton: So, the idea of AD and BC came from the calendars of christian European emperors, therefore the the story of jesus must be true? That is the best you can come up with?

Honestly, I shake my head in sadness and shame when I read some of your posts.
The shame of trying to debate with a retard is what really gets to me.

@bold- I can see there's tiny membrane that covered your eyes which couldn't allow you to see my quote with Rossik. What can you say about that?

You call it Christian European Calendar but remember is universal.

Why Pleatton choose to allow his date of birth to come from Christian calendar?
Why Dawnians didn't create his own calendar despite that he believed human has been in existence over hundred thousand years ago?
Why Jesus date was taken and universal despite there're many prominent people and religion before His birth? There are many chances for the birth of Christ to be cancelled as a reference to another people or event but isn't possible because His prophesy must be fulfilled.
It was after the Birth and Death of Jesus that wisdom and knowledge begin to increased.
Isaiah 33:6 "And wisdom and knowledge shall be the stability of thy times,......."

I know you can't see these as a prove because the truth is far away fron you.

ayenny02: Mr ENGLISH, you have problem Jesus said ANOTHER COMFORTER"
So you want to tell me that there is another GOD somewhere or another another Holy spirit Somewhere, get problem for your head.

Not about another comforter I'm telling you a complete statement you misinterpreted. Huhh! Get life.

So Jesus was talking about ANOTHER Holyspirit pls tell me how many Holy spirit do we have in BIBLE

One Holyspirit!

I believe in Jesus (as) teaching but we don't believe that Jesus is a son of God, or God or Holyspirit but we believe him as a Prophet of God and bible confirmed it also

I will repeat it again you believe Jesus when He said He will send your prophet but you don't believe Him when He Himself says He the son of God.

Though you give a blunt answer when I ask the first time.

Jesus Himself declared He is a son of God.

Can you see you're just deceiving yourself.

By the way if you believe in Jesus teaching have you received the baptism of the Holyspirit? because that's what make you a true believer of His word.

plaetton: So Jesus Jesus exists because the calendar says?
Don't even insult kindergarten children with that silly logic

Not only because calendar says so, but where the idea of everything dated on earth is either BC or AD came from?

That's the question you should ask yourself.

Rossikk: You expect me to prove a negative? That would be quite a task. I'm sorry but the onus is on you to prove that Jesus existed.

And no... ''the bible says so'' is not proof.

Do you know there was no writer contemporaneous to the Jesus era who wrote a single word about Jesus? The Jewish/Greek hellenistic period was an era in which there were hundreds of writers who wrote even the most mundane records... yet, not one word about a 'Jesus'. All accounts of a 'Jesus' were written several decades after his 'ascension', and were based on HEARSAY, not eyewitness evidence.

Secondly, the Gospels are written by anonymous persons, at least 100 years AFTER the alleged events occurred. The scrolls were 'found' somewhere, and names like 'Matthew', 'Mark', 'Luke' etc attached to them, to give the impression, still held by most christians, that those characters actually wrote the respective volumes attributed to them.

But there's no evidence for the existence of a 'Luke', or a 'Mark', or 'John' who wrote any gospels. They are fictional characters. MIND YOU THESE THINGS I'M STATING ARE NOT CONTESTED BY THE CHURCH OR BY THEOLOGIANS OR RELIGIOUS SCHOLARS. They just don't go about publicizing these facts to the faithful.

Please where the idea of our calender came from if Jesus didn't exist?

Again you said no record of Jesus Christ was kept.

If I'm charge to court of committen an offence:
*If I said I'm not guity! It doesn't hold any truth because I won't like see myself in jail.
*If any of my family says I'm not guity, perhaps he/she loves me and try to prevent me of going to jail.
*If my best friend says I'm not guity, well maybe is because he's my best friend and never want me to rot in jail.
*But what if my worst enemy now says I'm not guity (probably he/she will want me to rot in jail). Then I'm not guity.

What does the above mean?
One of the greatest enemy of early christians is Lucian of Samosata : THE PASSING OF PEREGRINUS. If Samosata could clearly state in his book that Jesus was crucified I think no arguement should go beyond that.

Samosata 11. “It was then that he learned the wondrous lore of the Christians, by associating with their priests and scribes in Palestine. And—how else could it be?—in a trice he made them all look like children, for he was prophet, cult-leader, head of the synagogue, and everything, all by himself. He interpreted and explained some of their books and even composed many, and they revered him as a god, made use of him as a lawgiver, and set him down as a protector, next after that other, to be sure, whom 11 they still worship, the man who was crucified in Palestine because he introduced this new cult into the world.

http://www.tertullian.org/rpearse/lucian/peregrinus.htm

He even recognises the remaining 11 desciples of Jesus Christ. Then shall we say Jesus didn't exist?

It's up to you to judge!

plaetton: Hagins or not, the fact remains that there is absolutely no evidence for the existence of Jesus.
The gospels , written by unknowns, do not meet the minimum criteria to be taken seriously as historical facts.

It is actually quite suspicious that Jesus, son of the creator of the universe, somehow forgot yo put his teachings in writing for posterity.

If there is no evidence for Jesus existence kindly change your date of Birth to **/**/100,198*.

The funny part of it even Dawnians date of Birth was taken after the Death of Christ (AD) even though he believe man has been in existence about thousands of years, have you asked youself why everything is taken from Christ date? i.e BC or AD!

Keep deluding yourself!

I will like unbelievers to change their date of Birth/calender to over hundred thousand years before I will join you people.

Don't forget this year you are in is 2013AD.

ayenny02: DESIKA, am disappointed in you to still come out and says Holy spirit is God from your mouth, after I have lecture you on Holy spirit, spirit of God and angel and you still come out and say this.

Holyspirit is God!

Jesus said: "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another advocate(parakletos)."

The comforter/advocate is still they same as Holyspirit don't seperate them.

So from DESIKA definition of Holy spirit as God:
1. DESIKA is now saying that Jesus will pray to father to send "ANOTHER God"

He will send His own spirit to abide with people for ever which only come to perform work in time past but not stay this time around He will stay.

2.DESIKA is now saying that God was not abide with them before,That ANOTHER GOD will come and abide with them for ever:[quote]Not another God still they same God who can transform Himself in many ways.


[quote]3. DESIKA is now saying that ANOTHER GOD will come that He shall not speak of himself:

Yes! He will only speak what the God of the father will tell Him

4. DESIKA is now saying that ANOTHER GOD shall bring all things into their remembrance:

Same God!

DESIKA ARE U STILL WITH YOUR MIND OR YOU MADE A MISTAKE TO TELL ME THAT HOLY SPIRIT AND PARACLETE IS GOD. NO! NO!! NO!!! IT WAS A MISTAKE FROM YOU, YOU NEED A DOCTOR TO ATTEND TO YOU AND RE-THINK AGAIN

Try to check yours first.

Can't you see yourself, you are saying RUBBISH!. You better give me time to come and lecture you more on HOLY SPIRIT and God. OLODO

Do you have Holyspirit on you for you to lecture him? Because I'm very sure if you have Holyspirit on you, you won't interpret Bible this way.

Beside check the down of page 2 for my reply I know you will boycott it.

ayenny02: How did crucifixion and ressurrection occur?
Who were those who witnessed the whole account of crucifixion and resurrection

Anytime I see your thread about Christian it always gives me power to read Bible more and it so painful that I can't reply most of your post both here or another thread.

But let me just erase your mind from this thread so that it can increase your BP because I know you, studing Bible isn't to know the truth in it but to use it against Christian.

If they charge me to court for committen an offence;
*then if I said I didn't do it it doesn't hold any truth.
*If my relatives said I didn't do it, it might be because he/she loves me.
*If my best friend said I didn't do it, maybe he/she doesn't want me to go to jail because is my best friend.
*but if my worst enemy said I didn't do it, (probably he/she will like to see me rotten in jail). Then I'm not guity of it!

what does the above mean?
The best enemy of early Christians is Lucian of Samosata : THE PASSING OF PEREGRINUS but if Samosata could state it clearly in his book that Jesus was crucified then we don't need any prove than that.

Samosata 11. “It was then that he learned the wondrous lore of the Christians, by associating with their priests and scribes in Palestine. And—how else could it be?—in a trice he made them all look like children, for he was prophet, cult-leader, head of the synagogue, and everything, all by himself. He inter preted and explained some of their books and even composed many, and they revered him as a god, made use of him as a lawgiver, and set him down as a protector, next after that other, to be sure, whom 11 they still worship, the man who was crucified in Palestine because he introduced this new cult into the world.

As you can see in his statement, he even recognized the remaining 11 desciples and Jesus crucifixion.

http://www.tertullian.org/rpearse/lucian/peregrinus.htm

I just believe God will have mercy on you the way you interpret the Bible.