₦airaland Forum

benalvino: Are you calling God a thing now? how can you make such statement? Jesus as a created thing cannot be the creator of everything... Anyhow you twist am jesus was never created... he is coeternal... except there was a time God never had word... and how can GOD create him self? if you say he created his own word.

Smh.........

And your thoughts as to ""word" is geting twisted.......is the bible which is also Gods word co-equal and co-eternal with God??...............

benalvino: Why except authority... Una say God create Jesus only then Jesus create everything else or through Jesus God create everything... But through God's word he creates everything therefore Jesus is God. The bible say all authority in heaven n earth why exception?

Smdh!!!!!!.........

1 corinthians 15:27...

New International Version
(©2011)
For he "has put everything under
his feet." Now when it says that
"everything" has been put under
him, it is clear that this does not
include God himself, who put
everything under Christ.


When ever all is used as regards to Jesus it always excludes God who is the source of everything..........

Smh!!!!!....

And my problem is you still can't even grasp the basic truth of the 1 corinthians 8:6 you read......

Ben who is the one GOD that Jesus and all of us worship??.........is it a trinity ??.....

benalvino: Let me say U use through because U don find the translation wey support U small... So through Jesus God create him own power? The thing is this the word of God is Jesus... GOD's word is part of God and when God Speaks let there be light what happened... You see why the word of God is God and not a god? Your hand voice is part of you...

Was there a time God doesn't have words? Or voice? So he has to create part of him self the word? Through God's words every thing was created so why Una they argue?

By means through...check up the root word used........

And when it is said the bible is Gods word what does it mean??........

You are in effect telling me that people today who go by the name "GODs LIGHT " are now GOD abi??......

God did not use Jesus to create his own throne........Gods throne or authority is excepted........

When all is used it is ofcourse in exception of God who caused Jesus to become or to exist......

Have you not been following up scriptures upon scriptures??.....

Boomark: Please can any of the trinitarians help my brother and answer this question. Why did Jesus call the Father his God? So we can learn from his example.

Yes! Jesus is the king of kings and Lord of lords. Any other question? You should know that you have failed to answer the bolded question above. You can't call anybody your god because of your relationship with him or just because you are humble to the person. Mba!

More to that is that the scriptures and Jesu§ himself has clearly shown that we and Jesus share the same Father and GOD........

If we share the same God and father which is the one God with Jesus then claiming Jesus is the same GOD as the Father or equal to the Father only makes us the almighty GOD too.....

This is what trinitarians have not yet grasped........

And I have asked this question a million times.........why is Jesus just like everyone of us the image of the invisible GOD....??......

Smh......

Dux-01:
what does ''For him'' mean

For HIM signifies Jesus' right as the firstborn of GOD...........

This is the concept of PRIMOGENITURE......God passed on this same concept to the isrealites and enshrined it in the law and in all of nature........

Deuteronomy 21:17

NET Bible (©2006)
Rather, he must acknowledge the
son of the less loved wife as
firstborn and give him the double
portion of all he has, for that son
is the beginning of his father's
procreative power--to him should
go the right of the firstborn.


2 chronicles 21:3...

International Standard Version
(©2012)
Their father gave them many gifts
made of silver, and gold, as well as
valuable things, along with
fortified cities in Judah, but he
passed the kingdom to Jehoram
because Jehoram was his
firstborn.


Do you understand??............

Boomark: that you "Really?" is against what? If there is anything wrong with what i posted up there, point it out. Cos what i wrote is different from what you want me to answer in Colossians.

If your problem in Colossians 1:16 is "by," check your dictionary(online) and that it also means "through." "For by (through) him.... I have explained this before in another thread.

He is running away from that word describing one who is an agent......THROUGH or BY

How does pharoah conferring so much power to Joseph and ruling egypt through Joseph now make Joseph the supreme ruler of egypt.........

benalvino: Colossians 1:15-18
The Supremacy of the Son of God:

Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

what I understand is Jesus created all thrones whether heaven or earth... even the One God is sitting on Now?
does this mean the rulership God have in Heaven was Created by Jesus? does it mean Jesus Creates the Fathers power or Gods power? whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him. So all the thrones are created by him and for him?

my friend ijawkid teach me something that makes me realize Jesus is Michael the archangel... Yes Jesus is Michael the archangel... but Is jesus and angel? Bible says no... does Archangel means angel... bible definition I think the answer is no... archangel means chief angel which means leader of the angels. just like Obama is commander in chief but he is not in the army.

ijawkid told me Michael did only what Jesus can do... cast satan out of heaven I think. But when Jesus do only what God can do and the Glory that God will not share with anyone Jesus has it... and many Unique things about God that That jesus have and yet John 1:1-14 states the Word is God and became flesh.

Jesus is God...

Are u asking a question by the bolded or you're answering??.....

That Jesus created his Fathers throne or authority even when from the scriptures you've seen that Jesus existence is dependent on the Father??.........

please read 1 corinthians 8:6 and tell me if you're still confused....you're reading colossians alone wouldn't be clear enough.....

New International Version
(©2011)
yet for us there is but one God,
the Father, from whom all things
came and for whom we live; and
there is but one Lord, Jesus
Christ, through whom all things
came and through whom we live.


Now can you please take note of the bolded....apart from the fact that that scripture has already clearly and unequivocally told us who the one God is it further tells us who is the source of all life........

if through Jesus(being Gods agent) all things were created it is in exception of God and his authority and Gods power because God himself caused Jesus' existence.......

Don't you just get this clear truth??.........

And you're up with the arch angel issue...I think I better refer u to a thread where the arch angel micheal wahala was trashed right left center........

Pygru: No lie ooh
all liars = hell fire

.........

You no well o pygru...........

Pygru: Ijawkid, answer this question na

I have answered this question succintly and clearly on one of OLAs thread.......

It sEems you had not created this your camouflage I'd back then.........

I don't have to repeat myself.........

Or do you care for the answers too??.....

.......

musKeeto: Men, just testing each before I settle.. Better an open mind than a closed one anyways.. But I sense I'm moving towards deism everyday. My mind's been dwelling on the origin of life and consciousness. Maybe, we have the wrong concept of GOD.

Let me dance azonto......muskeeto on the move...........

Leave that LB,mazaje,pleatton.thehomer,ooman etc group alone.............

Dux-01:
@ijawkid are u a jehovah witness?

Yes I am.....and frosbel isn't ......

Dux-01:
it said All.You were the one who added Jesus.

If we and Jesus share the same God and Father what do you expect Jesus to be doing??.........

Dux-01:
read what i said.i did not say father of God.i said Father IS OF God(three persons)meaning that he is the first member of the trinity.

If the bolded can be seen in the bible then I would run naked on bayelsa yenagoa road.............

There is nothing like first ,second and third....abi somebody been set GMATHs exam for them??............there is only one God and that person is the Father alone......

Dux-01:
@ijawkid.Well that is what i don't believe, that Jesus WORSHIPS the Father.

now i see where your problem lies....

then what is The Father the God of Jesus for??.....is the Father the God of Jesus for fancy??

Dux-01:
why are you referring to the Father ONLY as God in your last sentence instead of sayn that the Father is Of God?

please read ephesians 4:6

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
And One is God The Father of all, and over all, and with all and in us all.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
one God and Father of all, who is over everything, through everything, and in everything.

it is impossible to say the Father is of God because the Father is the one God and not a combo of 3 gods making one God or a Godhead.....the Father is the one God over all(Jesus inclusive)............

nlMediator: Interesting question. I'm glad you wrote clearly here that God is the Source of Life. And when shown that the Bible says that Jesus is also the Source of Life, which equates to saying that Jesus and God are one and the same, you pretend you don't understand and ask me where I'm coming from?

and where did i say Jesus is the source of life in any of my statement??...

did you by any means not read john 6:57??

[quote author=Pygru][/quote]and in all your analysis you never even mentioned if the holy spirit has a name or not.....whatt is the nme of the holy spirit??....

and where is it said the holy spirit is God....you guys have failed to answer the OP....

Dux-01:
Pls i beg you ijawkid is there ANY kind of worship more than this at least it was men who were worshipping God as you said in that passage but here look at more complex and sophisticated beings worshipping both The Father and Jesus.Is there any reverence that is greater than this''Then I heard every creature in HEAVEN(the four living creatures: cherubim and seraphim,twenty four elders and the billions of angels) and on EARTH and UNDER the earth(just imagine!!!the creatures under the earth) and on the sea and ALL that is in them singing To Him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb(Jesus) be praise and honour and Glory and power for ever and ever(Rev 5 Vs13-14) .If Jesus was Just God's appointed king don't you think there could have been a limit to his exaltation?there is no exaltation higher than this.This is the Highest exaltation God received in the bible.If The Father received worship from Jesus why did he not receive this highest level of exaltation alone.The Truth is right here before you.Jesus is not Just a king But He is the King of kings.I pray that you understand.

lol...so now the beings paying homage to God and his son is now the problem??.....what part of the fact that Jesus himself worships the Father dont you understand??......are you even denying that Jesus worships the Father??....for the fact Jesus himself worships the Father and is subjected to the Father shows the Father recieves all honor...the truth is those honouring Jesus are all doing it to the glory of Yahweh the Father and God of Jesus,........

do you even know that God the father is the God and father of Jesus??

Dux-01:
The Holy Spirit Is a person.There is no Way anyOne can Fully understand The Trinity(God).There is no Other higher form of worship,reverence,praise,glory or honour than the one that the 24 elders and the four living creatures gave to ''him that sat upon the throne and to the LAMB(which is Jesus christ).There is no higher form of worship that God the Father has received that was higher than the One Jesus received as The Lamb in revelation.Even Jesus said that the Father wanted The Son to be honoured Just as the father was honoured not more than the Son. .John 5:22-23.That is why It is Jesus christ that is going to Judge and not the Father.

What is the name of the holy spirit??..........

And please the bolded is out of point......it is Yahweh who recieves the highest form of worship....for goodness sake Jesus worships Yahweh........Yahweh is the GOD of Jesus......

I have quoted from the scriptures to show you how GOD and his appointed kings are being honoured or adored........

And that is exactly what the 24 elders and all the angels are doing in heaven to God and his appointed king(JESUS).......

Thank you....

Isn't the tradÍtional marraige,marraige itself??........

Dux-01:
well, i knew you would not believe it and if you believ in the book of Rev you should not have any problem believing that Jesus is worthy of praise as God.and wait, do you believe that Jesus is the Lamb talked about in Rev

I know Jesus is the lamb talked about in rev because the same scriptures Éxplicitly calls him the lamb that takes Àway our sins...........your lÍnking a rainbow around Gods throne to mean the holy spirit shows that you are not even sure if the holy spirit is a person to start with more or else the holy spirit sitting on Gods throne.......

Jesus is indeed worthy of praise...I've never said he isn't worthy of it..... What the scriptures teaches is that exclusive worship belongs only to the Father.........Jesus himself sÀid it..........

Please I would want you to read this scripture to see how Persons in the past reverenced both God and his appointed king......

King James Bible (Cambridge
Ed.)
And David said to all the
congregation, Now bless the LORD
your God. And all the congregation
blessed the LORD God of their
fathers, and bowed down their
heads, and worshipped the LORD,
and the king.


Holman Christian Standard Bible
(©2009)
Then David said to the whole
assembly, "Praise the LORD your
God." So the whole assembly
praised the LORD God of their
ancestors. They bowed down and
paid homage to the LORD and the
king.


Appointed kiÑgs of God were always adored,worshipped(not in the literal sense of worship as regards rendering exlusive devotion),paid homage to,..........

Dux-01:
believe me the emerald rainbow i encircling the throne Rev 4:3 refers to the Holy spirit.emerald is green and green stands for power,productivity,and mercy which refers to the Holy Spirit.

Chei.....

Smh!!!!!!..........

And may I remind all of us about the topic of this thread??........

Its even about the holyspirit and where it is refered to as GOD in the scriptures........

And my guy the rainbow around Gods throne does not mean the holy spirit......

I just don't know where you got that understanding from..........

benalvino: because he is with the one giving the revelation... and the Bible still doesn't Apply the O God to Solomon... even the apostles have thrones in heaven... when I finish my chat with Sasha on Skype then I will Show you everything you need to know.. I like the fact that you understand this one not with Dictionary but with bible...

I can't believe you can utter the bolded..........

......

Please u can say this to stephen,daniel,isaiah,david,paul etc who had visions of Jesus sitting at the right hand of God............

So you have now confined the holy spirit to a particular space..........chei....

While you are at it please inform us when the holy spirit joined Jesus Christ on Gods throne.........

And psalm 45:6-7 had its first fulfillment on a hunman king....please read down from verse 8 and 9 and see that that psalm aPplied to a human king.........

nlMediator: I take it that everybody now accepts the irrefutable fact that Jesus is the Source of Life. And that can only mean that He is God. I wonder why the continued waste of space arguing on the issue of His divinity.

And where are you coming from??.......

And benalvino....the holy spirit was no where to be found sitting close to GOD in heaven....I think that fact alone squashes the trinity...........

benalvino: The thrones both in heaven and earth was all created by Jesus... you question you always ask where is the holy spirit when Jesus sat on the right hand of God... he sat at the throne abi?

Yeah the thrones in heaven and on earth were created through Jesus.......

But ofcourse Gods(who is the God over Jesus) own throne is excepted........abi you disagree??........

Have we not read 1 corinthians 15:24-28 earlier??.........

Dux-01:
i just don't understand o

You guys still don't get it.......

Ask how Jesus sat on davids throne...........

That is why I say ruminate on the very source of that throne or authority that is confered on Jesus..............

I had already quoted daniel 7:13-14 to hit the nail on the head.....

benalvino: thank you... now you are talking... is there only one throne in Heaven?

Please have you read up boomarks quote from revelation??.......

benalvino: he sat on his fathers throne David... you mean say Solomon go Heaven go sitdown for God throne... na wa for you o.

Throne does not mean a physical throne or OBA chair......throne signifies rulership and authority........

What you should be asking is how Jesus sat on davids throne...........

Now you see..........

Dux-01:
are you tryin to say that it is worthy to worship,serve or glorify Jesus

When you say worship what do you mean??......worship has so many meanings.........

I can serve Jesus,I can adore him,but to worship Jesus in the literal sense of worship I wouldn't .......you know why??...

Listen to Jesus himself...

Hear Jesus' words...

Luke 4:8.....

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
(©2010)
Yeshua answered and said to him,
“It is written: 'you shall worship
THE LORD JEHOVAH your God,
and him only you shall serve.' “


We should be able to know how the word worship applies..........

benalvino: so where is the throne?

What you should be asking is where is the source of the throne.............

At least you have seen solomon sat on Gods throne..........the source is what you should be concerned about.........

Well Jesus would be ruling from heaven while solomon and david ruled when on earth.......but all of them sat on Gods throne which is divine........

......

That is why I say the source is what you should acknowledge.......

benalvino: you and I know Solomon throne cannot last forever and ever... so don't worry it is applied to Jesus.

Oh yeat it can and will..because actually the throne solomon sat on is Gods throne...and it is that same throne Jesus would be sitting on...that is why the throne is rendered as DIVINE.......

Corroborate this whole discuss with the kingdoms and rulership that the son of Man was given to when he was presented before the ancient of days..........

.....

Thank you.....