₦airaland Forum

Maynman:
The fish is so brilliant it knows how to swim.

Exactly!
You think it is automatic?

The ability was programmed in them

satmaniac:
My tradition you say. Still trying to force Hadith down my throat? . When were the said traditions written? What was Imam Malik, the author of Muwatta, or Bukhari the author of Sahih Bukahari using to pray before they compile the Hadith? Does that mean people were not praying between the period of prophet Muhammad death and when those books were collected? Answer these questions before moving to another topic. Can you please stay on topic? Most of the things you keep throwing in other to avoid answering my questions, have answers. Five daily prayers not in the Quran. Yes they are. Like I told you, the reason Salat details can't be found in the Quran is that Salat is not a strange concept even among the polytheist of Mecca. The only thing is they directed their worship to the idols in the Kaábah, instead of the God of Abraham Allah. Check the following verse about the polytheist performing salat. 8:35 "Their contact prayers(Salat) at the shrine(Kaábah) were no more than a mockery..... " and this one about Muhammad even before the nightly journey were he was "allegedly", given the fifty prayer. 96:9-10 "Have you seen the one who enjoins. Others from praying(Sallah)?"

So, there is no need to give details of what was already known. It is like I said. If you are going to ask me were I get my prayers from, just look at the billions of Muslim praying in the world, despite the difference in sect have the basics details of the prayer the same. hell even the Samaritan Jews pray the way the Muslim pray too. Are you going to ask them what hadith they get their prayers from? It is simple, practices get passed down from generation to generation. That is why in the bible you reference how some apostle of God fell on their faces, even though the present day cristian and Jews don't do that. Telling me that without Hadith, I can't pray, is like telling a Fulani person without a book on how to make fura da nono, that was written today, he/she can not make the Fura and Nono. It silly asking that question.



You are going to use the above verses Mut'ah? Where is Mutáh here help me understand please.

4;24 said "Also prohibited are the women who are already married, unless they flee their disbelieving husbands who are at war with you.* These are God's commandments to you. All other categories are permitted for you in marriage, so long as you pay them their due dowries. You shall maintain your morality, by not committing adultery. Thus, whoever you like among them, you shall pay them the dowry decreed for them. You commit no error by mutually agreeing to any adjustments to the dowry. God is Omniscient, Most Wise."

Where is Mut'ah here too?

24:33 Those who cannot afford to get married shall maintain morality until God provides for them from His grace. Those among your servants who wish to be freed in order to marry, you shall grant them their wish, once you realize that they are honest. And give them from God's money that He has bestowed upon you. You shall not force your girls to commit prostitution, seeking the materials of this world, if they wish to be chaste. If anyone forces them, then God, seeing that they are forced, is Forgiver, Merciful.



I know you will bring this up. Let me quote the verse here and from the source that seeks to promotes such understanding. 65:4 "As for your women past the age of menstruation, in case you do not know, their waiting period is three months, and those who have not menstruated as well. As for those who are pregnant, their waiting period ends with delivery.1 And whoever is mindful of Allah, He will make their matters easy for them."
The bolded above is what the translator choose to put there obviously to support the notion that Quran permits child marriage. I will tell you why the above translation is wrong and is just their to serve certain people interests, prejudices and whims. First the translation violate the Quranic condition for marriage in 4:6 "And test the orphans (to see) that they have reached marriageable (age). If you find them of sound judgement" بَلَغُوا النِّكَاحَ means marriageable age. .
Secondly, the translation of the Arabic word lam yahidna as who have not menstruated is wrong because it suggest that they will do in the future, in this way they have not yet menstruated, which will give the meaning of someone who have not attained puberty(prepubescent). Well the Arabic word lam(لَمْ) which is being translated as "have not", also appear in 112:3-4 The same word was used to show God did not beget, nor was he begotten. Lam(did not/Never) yalid(beget) wa lam(never) yulad(begotten). I hope you understand thhe game the translators playing now. Lam appropriately means never/did not. Till today there exist women who experience a condition known as amenorrhea, a condition where a woman fails to have menstrual periods. It is called primary amenorrhea when the woman has never menstruated. So this is what the verse is talking about.

Why do we kill animal(slaughter)? Sacrifice or eating? The purpose of the sacrifice is stated in the same verse. Go back and read. Don't act like you don't know the question has been answered.

I wouldn't want us to start another bout of arguments on these because there are objections to each of your points.

The important thing of essence to note is that
1. Mohammed forbid the Muslims from writing stuffs about him
2. Muslims out of reverence and good faith decided to collect hadiths of their prophet
3. The vast majority of the narrators of the hadiths meant well and the collectors (Bukhari, Muslim etc) did their best to sanitizer, filter and organise these hadiths
4. With time Muslim scholars graded these hadiths as Sahih, Hassan, Daif or Mawḍū.
5. Unfortunately, some of the reports of what was classed as even Sahih are DISTURBING to modern Muslims


The Question is simple :
1. Should we discard the Hadiths, Tafsir and Tarikhs as FALSE simply because they said things we are not comfortable with?
2. Do we think our Islam is better now than the early Muslims who wrote these things about Mohammed?
3. When seem to trust the memory of Arabs with the Qur'an BUT why do we now doubt their memory when the speak of Mohammed?
4. Would you have accepted this kind of argument from Christians if we had the same situation?

satmaniac:
The denial of Hadith did not start today, brother. It is as old as the Quran. What do you think Quran 6:112-114 is saying? The fact is there is no Hadith until after the prophet death. The questions you should be asking is who authorised following the Hadith? Yeas 6:112-114 had already answered that.

I agree with you.
Mohammed himself did forbid Muslims from writing hadith about him BUT you Muslims love and rever him so much that you collected everything about your prophet to aid your religion.

Up till recently, Muslims have no issues or problems with the hadiths because there are many embarrassing things reported of Mohammed.

Unfortunately, when the biographer of any history writes about themselves things that are demeaning or uncomfortable, such is most likely true. (Because self Biographies like photographs are designed to present the BEST of the actors even if it is a lie or exaggeration)

I think the problem of Muslim is like
Will you believe us if Christians claim that Jesus was misrepresented by his enemies as crucified on the cross: that Jesus vanished before the eyes of the Jews is actually the real story (despite the fact that we have report of his death in the Bible)

The fact that you don't like the stories is not a prove that the hadiths are fabrications.
For example :
The fact that Mohammed married Zainab (the wife of his adopted son) may be an uncomfortable truth, but it did happen in real time. Should Muslims deny it?
If the history is denied, does it change the reality?

Finally, you Muslims respect Aisha so much and any hadith from her is taken seriously. Aisha know many private things about Mohammed as his wife than even his companions.

Assignment :
Without the use of machines or any mechanical aid, 10 of you should carry an alligator over the roof of a bungalow from the ground level


Note:
If you are in a hurry, watch the video from 1:45 mark.
It's just brilliant!

I can't just help marvel at my God.
Why?
Look at these ants, their brain is probably 1/(1,000,000) times smaller that my brain, yet they displayed this amazing brilliance in completing a task that many civil engineering students will fail.

These ants,
Their life span is so short - - meaning that not much can be passed down from the wiser ones
They can't speak nor write - - the best they can do is to lay down chemical trails which is at best a mundane way of communicating.
BUT
They just seem to know
They seem to know about organisation
They seem to have a grand purpose
They seem to be highly intelligent


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RkUIGNVY50

What do I see:
Divine Programing by the Source of Life:
1. With Data and Purpose written in
2. With Instructions and Functions
Its a complete AI package written in the biology of the Ant.

If you have any problem with this, buy yourself a cold bottle of water and drink.

My God is amazing and it blows away my little sense.

AlfajiriAfrika:
I'm still skeptical about the movie, can anyone truthfully rate the movie?

Just watch the trailer first. Then you can decide if you need to watch the full movie.
The trailer to me is appetising enough at least with respect to Nollywood standards

jagorinho:
Lol at your ignorance, most of the casualties in the Yoruba wars were by hacking, how many people dey use guns that time.please if you do not know much on a subject, you can always read more on it.

The use of Guns depend on the time of the storyline.

It is in record that the Yoruba have been fighting with Guns since 1877

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiriji_War

MT:
Oga, Yorubas dont fight like Romans. That movie is a roman empire classic movie.

In the olden days, we read it that the two commanders will face themselves and chant incantations till one commander overwhelms the other. Then fight will ensue.

The film misrepresents Yoruba culture so badly. Go and watch the "woman king" on netflix - it was a failed attempt to replicate it.

No sir!
Yorubas fought wars with Bows, Spears, Swords and Clubs all supported with incantations and charms. The only times two warriors will face themselves with incantation in a fight is when they both know that weapons will not be of any effect on both sides.

It's just like in Chinese kung-fu movies : we are almost believing that the Chinese would rather fight with kung-fu rather than with guns. Even in modern kung-fu movies, the actors will manage to both loose their guns so that they can fight with their hands. It is called cinema effects. Yoruba movies have created the cinema effect of entertaining viewers with display of incantations in fights.

ThatFairGuy1:
Advocatejare, the half-baked knowledge you had about Islam from what you read online only makes you looks stupid Everytime (not an insult)...

You need to enrol in Islamic school and start from learning from elementary level, that time you'll be ashamed of all jargons you've been putting online for years

Unfortunately,
This is TenQ writing and not Advocatejare.

You can be sure I have evidence for everything I write about Islam.
Now I have gotten some of you to start denying your Hadiths.

If you think ANYTHING is untrue according to your Islamic sources then, bring it on. Otherwise, consider adopting the Truth

satmaniac:
You made many points and I am going respond to them. You sounds just like the supporters of Hadiths and for a good reason. You need the Hadith to attack the Quran.

The point you made about needing Hadith to pray, fast etc, is a weak point. Because, I ask a question which you or any supporter of Hadith has not answered yet. If Hadith, were collected long after the prophet was gone, what were the Muslims then praying with? And also I need you to back up your claim were you said Hadith teaches prayers and other aspect of the religion. Please, provide the Hadiths that gie the details of salat, like you asked me to do? I dare you or any one to provide that Hadith. The point you people seems to miss is you think the Muslim prayer, fasting and hajj begins with Muhammad. The Quran always remind us that these practices are nothing new. Abraham, Jacob, Isaac, Ismail etc did perform salat(Check Quran 8:35, 9:54, 16:123, 21:73, 22:27, 28:27).

I said:

Of course we know that the hadiths were collected much later and so were most of the historical books of Islam and the Tafsir.
The traditions and the history were what people collected as the hadiths, tafsir and history of Islam.
1. How will you know how to pray from the Qur'an alone
2. How will you know how to slaughter from the Qur'an alone

Or

I think the reasons these hadiths and Tafsir especially came in were to explain the Context of the verses of the Qur'an especially as Islam began to spread to areas with knowledgeable Jews and Christians on matters of History in the earlier revealed scriptures disputing with the Islamic claims
It is impossible to explain from the Qur'an alone
1. The denial of the Crucifixion of Jesus
.....

You will note that I have not based my arguments on the hadiths alone. I have based it on your TRADITIONS found in your religious books such as the Hadiths, Tafsir and the Historical books.

It is a conjecture to believe that Islam was practiced by Abraham, Isaac, Jacob etc otherwise, your religion would be identical with the Religion on the Jews. I still maintain my stance on this sir. Islam is incomprehensible without these other books of the Hadiths, Tafsir and other Islamic historical books. By the Qur'an alone, you would be praying 3times and NOT 5 times per day.

satmaniac:
Practicing Mutah from Quran alone? Where exactly do you have that in the Quran?

Qur'an 4:24 and
Qur'an 24:33 sir.

satmaniac:
Where do you get it from the Quran that someone can marry a pre-puberscent girl?

Qur'an 65:4 speaking about divorcing wives who have not started menstruation.

satmaniac:
No 2? Haba bro did you have to bring that up. The Quran has answered that already checked Quran 22:36.

2. How will you know how to slaughter from the Qur'an alone
Unfortunately, you need the Tafsir to understand Qur'an 22:36 as one can only imply that Allah speaks of sacrifice here

satmaniac:
knowing the meaning of Messiah and who Israel is has nothing to do with my salvation or truth. The point you and most Muslims seems to missed is Quran is not a book of stories. There is a reason it calls itself the Furqan. The truth is Islam as well as Christainity had been corrupted and made to deviate from its original purpose. This is what Quran will correct if we give it the chance. Just let the Quran speaks for itself. Stop imposing meanings from external sources or your heart desire. It is easy to understand for the sincere seeker(Quran 54:17).

Please, don't forget to provide pure Quranic text that encourages Mutah and marrying pre-puberscent girls.

But you have no guarantee of salvation in Islam. What you have is a guarantee for the fire of hell even though TEMPORARILY!

Quran 19:71
There is not one of you who will not go down to it (the fire), that is a fixed Decree of your Lord
Quran 19:72
Then, We will save those who were cautious of Us, but the harmdoers shall be left there hobbling on their knees

After all you muslims enter the fire, THEN Allah will THEREAFTER remove the good muslims and leave others in the fire.

What is the original purpose if you claim that Islam and Christianity has been corrupted. You must at least show us that which has NOT been corrupted as a standard. Is the Religion of the Jews also corrupted? How?

satmaniac:
No islam without Hadith? Did you know the Hadith at most came 200 years letter after the death of prophet Muhammad? Go search when was Muwatta Imam malik(One of the earliest Hadith) was collected. So you mean to tell me people have not been practicing Islam until the Hadiths were collected long after Muhammad was gone?

Of course we know that the hadiths were collected much later and so were most of the historical books of Islam and the Tafsir.
The traditions and the history were what people collected as the hadiths, tafsir and history of Islam.
1. How will you know how to pray from the Qur'an alone
2. How will you know how to slaughter from the Qur'an alone
3. Would you not be practicing Mutah from the Qur'an alone?
4. From the Qur'an alone won't you be practicing marriage of pre-puberscent girls and divorcing them?

The problem is that the Qur'an is in fragments and incomplete without the other books. For instance, from the Qur'an alone can you tell me the meaning of Messiah? From the Qur'an alone can you tell me who Israel is?

This is a big problem sir. The problem was hidden all along simply because only the Rich Scholars could afford the collection of the full library of compilation of the books of hadiths, Tafsir and History of Islam. But now, the internet broke this barrier plus the barrier of the mastery of the Arabic language.

satmaniac:
She has hidden her own copy of the stoning, and yet she said it used to be there. Does this sound like someone trying to hide something? The thing I am trying to tell you is there is no event of Gharaneeq and neither is there law approving stoning of adultery. Guess where we can find that. Yeah, in the bible. I think someone tried smuggling the Jewish law into Islam and sine there is no basis for it from the Quran. He or her manufactured such stories.

But it wasn't Aisha alone who gave narrations of the report of stoning and breastfeeding in the hadiths. They ALL agreed the the verses USED to be RECITED as part of the Qur'an.
Of course, this is not the only verses acclaimed by early Muslims to be absent from the Qur'an of Uthman. Many of these were forgotten and some remembered in fragments.

satmaniac:
A lot of historical truth you say. Yet these embarrassing accounts can't be found in the Quran, unless in invented sources that were fabricated long after the apostle of God was gone?
So,if you want to know what Muhammad had said or done, then pick up a Quran. This is how you know. The coomand of what he should and should not do, were given in there. That is how you know what is truth or not. Unless you and your opponent are trying to say he disoby the commands.
Who grade as Sahih? God or his appostle? You need to dig deeper into the history of Hadith, you will understand that Hadith is an attempt by satan to corrupt the pure teachings contains in the Quran. Oh the all-knowing God, the creator of all has foreseen this and forecast it in the Quran, in the following verses 6:112 "We have permitted the enemies of every prophet-human and jinn devils-to inspire in each other fancy words(like goat eating revelations) in order to deceive. Had your willed they would have not done it. You should disregard them and their fabrications."
Ignoring such fabrications: This what I am doing and Iurge you and your opponent to do the same.

I think the reasons these hadiths and Tafsir especially came in were to explain the Context of the verses of the Qur'an especially as Islam began to spread to areas with knowledgeable Jews and Christians on matters of History in the earlier revealed scriptures disputing with the Islamic claims
It is impossible to explain from the Qur'an alone
1. The denial of the Crucifixion of Jesus
2. The seeming Prophethood of Zhulqanain
3. Mohammed not knowing with certainty if he's going to paradise or hell fire
4. All Muslims entering the fire of Hell (but later removed)
5. Mary mother of Jesus mistaken for Mariam daughter of Amran who was sister of Aaron and Moses

Without the Hadiths and Tafsir and the Historical books, no body would be able to make sense of the Qur'an. It's like a book that dropped right out of the blues that even though is expected to be a follow up of the earlier revealed scriptures contradict it so much that they can't be bound together in a single volume (like the old and new Testament).

Denying the Hadiths, Tafsir and the Islamic Historical books creates other dilemma and unsolvable problems for Islam.

But why would these sincere Muslims of Old write damning things about their beloved Prophet? You will agree with me that Fabrications in religion are usually done by people to embellish the truth to make it more grander, nicer and glorious. Report of events that are seemingly Raw, Unpolished and Derogatory are usually Truths as the events happened.

Pwettylinda:
Why is this truck built like this?
Looking, it appears the tires are up to 44 in total. What exactly are these for?

Just two reasons
1. To spread the weight of the load over a larger Area to reduce the pressure on the tared roads
2. To share the weight of the load over several tires to reduce the tendency of bursting under load and temperature

satmaniac:
Well what I understand from the Quran, is most of narrations in hadith are somewhat at odds with the Quranic teaching. Hadith look like the work of someone who has never seen nor read the Quran. If you are sincere researcher you would have noticed that by now. At best, I can say Hadith is a work of people trying to understand the Quran, in their own way. I have proofs to demonstrate how hadiths had been fabricated and attributed to the belove prophet of God(Muhammad). But that is beyond the scope of our discussion.

Only Aisha spoke about her own written verse that was eaten by lame sheep? Is that all you have to say to wave the irregularities in the story away? A revelation that was said to be revealed in the presence of multitudes of people both from the polytheists and the believer side. You mean to tell me Only Aisha recorded it? Haba oga! If others recorded there own did the goat ate them too? We might want to also know why the goat is so selective.

You see I don't care about what the Hadith said as I don't believe in them. I am just pointing irregularities in the story for you to thinl and reflect, if the hadith has anything to do with the Quran. I am not here to argue with you. In fact I am happy. Perhaps this will make them think and see what this Hadith are truly are.

I appreciate your observation, unfortunately,
1. There is no Islam without the hadiths
2. Muslim scholars have tried to sanitise the hadiths by grading them as Sahih, Hassan, Daif and Fabricated. All the hadiths I've quoted are Sahih except for the one of tame sheep eating the Qur'an which is Hassan.
3. Except Muslims generally by nature are liars, there is no reason for most of the hadiths being untrustworthy
4. Since non of you modern Muslims were around at the writing of the hadiths, how can you prove that the hadiths are untruthful?
5. I am sure you dont practice Mutah, unfortunately, this you got from the hadiths not the Qur'an.


Aisha had a written copy BUT she also has a reason to hide the copy of the verse on stoning (and breastfeeding) so that the case of adultery may not be revisited over her after the death of Mohammed. Of course, there were other hadiths that reported that the RECITATION of the verses used to be done by Muslims .

I agree that a lot of historical truths about Islam is embarrassing to modern Muslims and thus, you want to DELETE it from Islam if possible. It's not only about the hadiths alone but also about the oldest set of historical books about Islam. Unfortunately, the Qur'an cannot stand alone as an Islamic source for Muslims.

Thanks and have a good night rest sir

Ohyoudidnt:
Does your sharing of videos that point at wrong titling justifies your falsehoods?

Don't these Mushafs include the style and transmitters?

Are what you labelled as Ibn 'Amir an Shaybah and Hisham an Ibn 'Amir different from Hafs ibn Asim?

Is this too different from Yaqub an Nafi'?

What is different between Khalaf an Hamzah,
Khallad an Hamzah?

Look picking names of transmitters instead of their reading doesn't amount to different Quran.

Why weren't these different books opened by Jay Smith to show differences in their verses?

I can't help but laugh at you.

Only one ERROR is enough to burst the comedy of your standard Islamic Narrative.

Which of these Qur'an is the Exact Quraish Arabic Qur'an on the mother tablet in Heaven dictated to Mohammed?

Is it the Hafs or the Warsh or the numerous other Qurans in existence?

Ohyoudidnt:
I haven't seen your truth

You stated 27 and listed 17 what happened your truth motor ran out of gas?

How could you be this shameless.
If you have the time, transcribe out the list for me from the two attached videos.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7YFb92_Npk


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLq3GOwmC8M


Above is what you claim not to watch and SEE : watch it now and it even has audio for you to simultaneously LISTEN to it for correct pronunciation!

From only 1 Qur'an, you claim 7 dialects: anything after 7 is not defendable sir!

Ohyoudidnt:
You have claimed 27, 32 and say we will get to 70 but named only 17. You forgot the names of the 10 to make it to 27?

Nevertheless, were there variations in recitation done by Muhammad pbuh?

Was he aware his companions and other muslims recited differently?

Did he say one recitation was wrong and the other right?

Did the companions continue this trend?

You worry about an act to safeguard the variations from possible corruption which is referred to as the Uthmani codex yet are in awe that ancient arabic writing accomodates the 7 or 10 styles of recitations. Simply
by adding a letter or omitting a letter, or elongating or shortening a vowel or placement of diacritical marks.

We have gone through a few specific examples and there aren't any critical or worrisome differences in the meaning of the verse.

Now; if these variations were not known in the time of the Prophet pbuh there will be issues but they have been known in his presence. He did not condemn or forbid them. An added benefit to grant from Allah ease to his followers. You know the just before dawn meal and end of the fast by sunset is another of these grants.

These variations all fall within set limits such that for any accepted recitation;
* It must have an authentic chain of narration where the chain of narrators was continuous

* The narrators were all known to be righteous
* The narrators were all known to possess
good memories.
* The recitation be conveyed by a large
number of narrators on each level of the
chain of narration below the level of a
companion of the prophet.

Where there were authentic chains but insufficient number of narrators the recitations were accepted as explanations (Tafseer) of the companions but were not considered as methods of reciting the Qur'an.

All others are rejected.

The narrators have good memories yet Uthman rejected all their Qur'an for his own standardised Qur'an.

At least, I have shown you CHANGES in meanings in black and white as a result of your changes in spellings.

No matter how you repeat falsehoods, it doesn't make it True.


So my friend,
Is the Qur'an still perfectly preserved word for word up to the diacritical marks according to the Islamic preferred Narrative ?

Ehinjuola:
My husband is not the same man I fell in love with.

My husband changed totally after wedding day, in fact, it started on the wedding night and its giving me a lot of concern.

It's not that he is not talking to me or we are fighting, but he is not the cheerful happy person anymore.

After months of trying to get what the problem is, he finally opened up to me and I don't know what my fault is, I think he is overreacting.

My husband works in an insurance company and he is just a junior staff, he earns 150k per month, so he is not doing that bad.

When we wanted to get married, my dad wrote the wedding list and everything he would bring, when he saw them, he fumed that they were too much and they should reduce it but my dad insisted that he won't collect it twice, I also told him if he really loves me, he would provide them, he could get help from his family too, it is called bride price and other things, and it is once.

We had little issue then but he later resolved it.

He brought everything they ask him for

During the wedding, my parents told him to buy a cow, rent a hall and decorate it then they'll take care of other things. He said he didn't have money for a big hall and he would prefer a field ground but my dad insisted that rain could disrupt things and he has many people coming.

That almost cause issues too, I had to support him with 50k to get the hall because I know who my dad is, he won't back out.

I didn't know how he did it, he took the hall and designed it, he bought cow too.

His family brought food and everything went fine and that was it.

I don't know what was keeping him moody until he spoke up.

He said I couldn't fight for him, I was there supporting my parents and watch them extorting him, did I even know he had to collect loan to pay for those things?

I got angry because he used the word 'extorting'.

He was the one that wanted to have my hand in marriage and if he cherish me, he should do all they wanted since he is not paying twice.

After I said this, he stopped talking in the house, he comes home, eat and go to bed.

I tried talking to him but he would listen but not talk, he is cold to himself and prefer his privacy.

Have I said something wrong?

I don't like whats happening. My marriage is too young to be going through all these.

I am tired, I don't know what to do.

Please call yourself a big fool who doesn't know that she destroyed with her own mouth and family greed the marriage she hopes to have.

If you want a solution, reply sensibly and I will give you wisdom for damage control.

Ohyoudidnt:
How many recitations exist in Islam and how many styles are there?

What is the difference between the recitations and styles?

You tell me.?

At least I have shown you that Warsh Qur'an and Hafs Qur'an doesn't agree with earth other.

So, my Sheik Ohyoudidnt, from Qur'an 2:125, is watakhizu still the same as watakhazu ?

Or maybe It's just a style of pronunciation written down so that it changes the word of Allah into something Allah didn't say!

Have a nice day sir.
It's important to know that your Islamic scholars play Taqqiya on you in glorifying the Qur'an.

When you know the Truth , the Truth will set you free.
Jesus said:
I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, no one comes to the Father except by Me.

Ohyoudidnt:
No, explicitly name the 27 you stated first then we can continue 70.

You are the joke if you don't name the 27

I agree that I am a Joke.
Allah revealed one Qur'an to you Muslims and it multiplied in your hands.

You can see how perfectly preserved the Qur'an is!?

I agree that I am a joke : I don't dispute that as far as you are concerned. Watch the video I attached, you even have more than 27.

LOL!

You see, didn't I warn you.
I told you to stop, but you didn't.

Sheik Ohyoudidnt ,
This is another one for you o!

See the Warsh Qur'an
Warsh Qur'an 2:125
{ وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا اَ۬لْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةٗ لِّلنَّاسِ وَأَمْناٗ وَاتَّخَذُواْ مِن مَّقَامِ إِبْرَٰهِيمَ مُصَلّيٗۖ وَعَهِدْنَآ إِلَيٰٓ إِبْرَٰهِيمَ وَإِسْمَٰعِيلَ أَن طَهِّرَا بَيْتِيَ لِلطَّآئِفِينَ وَالْعَٰكِفِينَ وَالرُّكَّعِ اِ۬لسُّجُودِۖ }


Did you read in this passage : watakhazu ?


Warsh Qur'an 2:125
"And when We made the House a place of return for the people and security, and they took from the standing place of Abraham a place of prayer. And We made a covenant with Abraham and Ishmael, [saying], 'Purify My House for those who perform Tawaf and those who are staying [there] for worship and those who bow and prostrate [in prayer].'"

Check the Hafs Qur'an!

Hafs Qur'an 2:125
وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا ٱلْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةً لِّلنَّاسِ وَأَمْنًا وَٱتَّخِذُوا۟ مِن مَّقَامِ إِبْرَٰهِۦمَ مُصَلًّى ۖ وَعَهِدْنَآ إِلَىٰٓ إِبْرَٰهِۦمَ وَإِسْمَٰعِيلَ أَن طَهِّرَا بَيْتِىَ لِلطَّآئِفِينَ وَٱلْعَٰكِفِينَ وَٱلرُّكَّعِ ٱلسُّجُودِ


Did you read in this passage : watakhizu ?



Hafs Qur'an 2:125
"And [mention] when We made the House a place of return for the people and [a place of] security. And take , from the standing place of Abraham a place of prayer. And We charged Abraham and Ishmael, 'Purify My House for those who perform Tawaf and those who are staying [there] for worship and those who bow and prostrate.'"




So, my Sheik Ohyoudidnt,
Is watakhizu the same as watakhazu?

Ohyoudidnt:
You say there are 27 Qurans then list just 17 and 2 Videos?

Is each video equal to 5 Qurans?

Your video title says 32 different Qurans so I don't get concisely what you are saying.

Can yoy be precise?

Exactly, still counting.
Before long we shall see 70 Qur'ans.


All we needed to show you was 8 Qur'ans, then you can explain where the 8th Qur'an came from. But we found 3, then 5, the 9, them 13, then 17, then 27 and now 32!?

What a joke!

Ohyoudidnt:
Are these 27 Qurans?

List them then

Hafs an Aasim
Warsh an Naafi'
Qalun an Naafi'
Al-Duri an Abu Amr
Khalaf an Hamzah
Khallad an Hamzah
Ibn Kathir an Tha'labi
Al-Kisa'i an Abi Amr
Ibn 'Amir an Shaybah
Hisham an Ibn 'Amir
Abu Ja'far an Madinah
Yaqub an Nafi'
Ruways an Rawh
Rooh an Rawh
Ishaq an Ibrahim
Idris an Dawood
Isa an Ubayd

The rest


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7YFb92_Npk

Part 2


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLq3GOwmC8M

Ohyoudidnt:
Enough for the tribes. 7.

What tribe are Umar bin Al-Khattab and Hisham bin Hakim?

But we have up to 27 Arabic Qurans: how?

We should only be able to account for 7 and no more!

Ohyoudidnt:
You say 27 Quran. Are you mixing Ahroof and Qiraah?


Which of your claimed versions has no established trace back to prophet Muhammad pbuh?

How many Qur'an dialects were given to Mohammed?
Is it 7 or 27?

On whose authority the extra 20 Qur'ans?

Ohyoudidnt:
Angels are with Allah in what way?

My translator automatically converts the nun to ba however you realize the difference here is the position of the dot.

You however know the evolution of the arabic alphabet or don't you?

Is it a mistake that ibaad was used in place of inda ?

OR


When did ibaad evolved to inda ?

Ohyoudidnt:
They are both original
Helping me out after I already posted? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣.
How come it was so difficult to do before?

What essentially is different in the two verses you posted?

Which is outside the revealed?

تَقُولُونَ or يَقُولُونَ is a problem for you? 🤣🤣🤣


Have you crosschecked?
Quran 43:19
Hafs: ibaad (slaves)
Warsh: inda (with)

Okay!
We are getting there small small.
Depending on the Qur'an with you ibaad can also translate to inda ?

So is there two Qur'ans in the heaven of Allah in the mother tablet?

Which of the 27 Qur'an is the Quran of Allah

Ohyoudidnt:
Quran 43:19
ibaad (slaves) = inda (with)
[/i]

I actually started here and it betrays your inability to read arabic as Ibaadu (slave) occurs in both hafs and warsh.

Watch your preacher/hero's sweet tongue and do be entrapped in their valleys of deceitful lies.

There isn't anything like inda in any of the styles for this verse.

Dear Sheik Ohyoudidnt, Master of Arabic!
Do you see why I asked you to post the Arabic of both the Warsh and Hafs Qur'an here because it seems your arabic is as shaky as a trembling mouse.



Warsh Quran 43:19
{ وَجَعَلُواْ اُ۬لْمَلَٰٓئِكَةَ اَ۬لذِينَ هُمْ عِندَ اَ۬لرَّحْمَٰنِ إِنَٰثاًۖ اَ۟شْهِدُواْ خَلْقَهُمْۖ سَتُكْتَبُ شَهَٰدَتُهُمْ وَيُسْـَٔلُونَۖ }
Did you read in this passage : "inda alrrahmani"?

Hafs Qur'an 43:19
"And they attributed to the angels, who are with the Most Merciful, females. Did they witness their creation? Their testimony will be recorded, and they will be asked."

Hafs Qur'an 43:19
وَجَعَلُوا۟ ٱلْمَلَٰٓئِكَةَ ٱلَّذِينَ هُمْ عِبَٰدُ ٱلرَّحْمَٰنِ إِنَٰثًا ۚ أَشَهِدُوا۟ خَلْقَهُمْ ۚ سَتُكْتَبُ شَهَٰدَتُهُمْ وَيُسْـَٔلُونَ
Did you read in this passage: "ibādu ar-Raḥmāni"

Hafs Qur'an 43:19
And they made the angels, who are servants of the Most Merciful, females. Did they witness their creation? Their testimony will be recorded, and they will be asked."




I beg you master of Arabic language : Is "inda" exactly the same as "ibada" ?

Ohyoudidnt:
Lets look at 2:140

Or do you say that Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the Descendants were Jews or Christians? Say, "Are you more knowing or is Allah ?" And who is more unjust than one who conceals a testimony he has from Allah ? And Allah is not unaware of what you do.

And

Or do they say that Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the Descendants were Jews or Christians? Say, "Are you more knowing or is Allah ?" And who is more unjust than one who conceals a testimony he has from Allah ? And Allah is not unaware of what you do

How have the emboldened affected the meaning of the verses?


These recitations are acceptable; most of the differences in them are either phonetic, or in letter dotting, the application of diacritics, the use of Hamza, the interchange among vowels. The limited slight variations in word meanings are particular to individual words not to the general meaning of the verse.


The Ulama are aware of these variations and they do not change the meaning of the verses.


Do you know there's a special name for a reciter who can master and perform all 10 recitations with their variations; is called Jamial Qiraah (Gatherer of recitations).
They are rare and unlike the tale you try to promote these variations are not novel or unknown.

It actually is something miraculous to recite with these variations and retain the general same meaning.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n281Zyywyn4

Let me help you out

Warsh Qur'an 2:140
{ أَمْ يَقُولُونَ إِنَّ إِبْرَٰهِيمَ وَإِسْمَٰعِيلَ وَإِسْحَٰقَ وَيَعْقُوبَ وَالَاسْبَاطَ كَانُواْ هُوداً اَوْ نَصَٰر۪يٰۖ قُلَ آٰنتُمُۥٓ أَعْلَمُ أَمِ اِ۬للَّهُۖ وَمَنَ اَظْلَمُ مِمَّن كَتَمَ شَهَٰدَةً عِندَهُۥ مِنَ اَ۬للَّهِۖ وَمَا اَ۬للَّهُ بِغَٰفِلٍ عَمَّا تَعْمَلُونَۖ }

Translation Qur'an 2:140
"Or do they say that Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob, and the tribes were Jews or Christians? Say, 'Are you more knowledgeable or is Allah?' And who is more unjust than one who conceals a testimony he has from Allah? And Allah is not unaware of what you do."



Hafs Qur'an 2:140
أَمْ تَقُولُونَ إِنَّ إِبْرَٰهِۦمَ وَإِسْمَٰعِيلَ وَإِسْحَٰقَ وَيَعْقُوبَ وَٱلْأَسْبَاطَ كَانُوا۟ هُودًا أَوْ نَصَٰرَىٰ ۗ قُلْ ءَأَنتُمْ أَعْلَمُ أَمِ ٱللَّهُ ۗ وَمَنْ أَظْلَمُ مِمَّن كَتَمَ شَهَٰدَةً عِندَهُۥ مِنَ ٱللَّهِ ۗ وَمَا ٱللَّهُ بِغَٰفِلٍ عَمَّا تَعْمَلُونَ

Translation Hafs Qur'an 2:140
Or do you say that Abraham, Isma'il Isaac, Jacob and the Tribes were Jews or Christians? Say: Do ye know better than Allah? Ah! who is more unjust than those who conceal the testimony they have from Allah? but Allah is not unmindful of what ye do!


Which one of the highlighted is the true original statement of Allah?

Ohyoudidnt:
Those words in absence of the full verses/sentence don't say much.

Write out the full sentences please

Did I not ask you to download the Warsh Qur'an from Google playstore and prove me wrong.

If as a Muslim you don't have a copy of the Warsh Qur'an but depend only on the Hafs Qur'an, how can you know?

I have simplified your job by giving you the exact words to look for.

Post the Arabic for the given verses then we can talk. Otherwise, to your tent everyone!


I repeat :
If you don't have the copy of the Warsh Qur'an, everything we say is meaningless!
Just post the Arabic for both Hafs and Warsh Qur'an and we look at the dissident words

Endeared:
Has your Sim dialed and make calls on its own before?

Mtn Sims are no longer safe for use...my opinion.

Those retail agents registering and selling sim cards are not to be trusted..my opinion.

It could be VIRUS or other MALWARES!

OndoRaph:
Whenever I eat pasta based products like spaghetti and macroni, my entire body seems to swell the next morning when I wake, especially my face, hands and legs. For the face, I even feel the weight of sudden chunky skin even without a reflection in the mirror. What could possibly be the explanation to this. Am I alone or any other person feels same?

Anyone who eat a load of worms must experience swelling naw!

Ohyoudidnt:
This truth that you shy away from presenting here
If truly you speak a truth why not share it fully here for me and all to see.

Ohyoudidnt:
Sadly I cannot see the differences. Do oblige me by fully sharing what you have.

I have shown you some of the differences in both Warsh and Hafs Qur'an.

But as you've said by your knowledge of English and Arabic languages that
DIFFERENCE HAFS AND WARSH QUR'ANS
Quran 2:125
watakhizu (you shall take) =watakhazu (they have taken)

Quran 2:140
taquluna (You say) = yaquluna (They say)

Quran 2:184
miskeenin (poor person = masakeena (poor people)

Quran 3:146
qatala (fought) = qutila (was killed)

Quran 40:26
aw an (or that) = wa an (and that)

Quran 43:19
ibaad (slaves) = inda (with)


Then, there is NOTHING else to say as you are a confirmation of the Muslims slogan of:
"Don't confuse me with the Truth because I have already made up my mind"


To this end, TRUTH doesn't matter to you and thus, I leave you to your captivity!


Have a nice day sir!

[quote author=Ohyoudidnt post=124967646][/quote]You said :
You just wrote words without writing out the full verses to see how the meanings changed



I wrote CHANGES in meanings so that you can VERIFY if my claim is TRUE or FALSE!


You didn't say anything about the differences between the Warsh Qur'an and the Hafs Qur'an I gave you. Are These also linguistic variations?


I guess you should open the Arabic Warsh and Hafs Qur'an and thus explain the differences in these verses

Quran 2:125
Hafs: watakhizu (you shall take)
Warsh: watakhazu (they have taken)

Quran 2:140
Hafs: taquluna (You say)
Warsh: yaquluna (They say)

Quran 2:184
Hafs: miskeenin (poor person
Warsh: masakeena (poor people)

Quran 3:146
Hafs: qatala (fought)
Warsh: qutila (was killed)

Quran 40:26
Hafs: aw an (or that)
Warsh: wa an (and that)

Quran 43:19
Hafs: ibaad (slaves)
Warsh: inda (with)



If you don't have the Warsh Qur'an, please download one from the Google Playstore

Note that All these change in meaning is from the Arabic Qur'an. Change of Language (Linguistic Variations or Differences) must not change the meaning of a SENTENCE : Should it?


So my brother,
While the standard Islamic Narratives paint perfect picture of Islam to you Muslims, there are so many underlining LIES and MISINFORMATION within it.
Why do you think Poison is mixed with good food? Is it not to kill the unsuspecting prey?



My CHALLENGE:
If you are interested in the Truth, Open the Arabic Warsh and Hafs Qur'an, copy the Arabic words and Prove to me that they have EXACTLY the same MEANING!