₦airaland Forum

Timbuktou:
TV, marriage is a mess right now. Everybody wants to go in safe. Women have been wailing about how bad theyve had it and have sought to improve their situation. Men are catching up with the game now and are also taking steps to protect themselves. It's always going to be lose-lose unless each party goes in with the other person's in in mind.

Why go into marriage when there is a super high chance that it could leave me much worse off than before I got in?

These scenarios will increase until there is common sense applied to the institution, I'm afraid.

I would rather say the "perception of marriage", along with how people view and embrace it. Marriage in it's original form still does exactly what it says on the tin. And even though I speak as one who subscribes to the Christian form, many traditional variations were not to far off that.

One can't allow wrong perception & practices at a societal level to overly impact their individual union. The rebuilding job will have to come from wise and understanding individuals revisiting, understanding and successfully applying the blueprint.

I would say feminist notions are perhaps the biggest anti-marriage factor at present. And it's not just affecting marriage - it's society wide. Conceptually, feminism demands that men and women be seen as and treated as equals in every respect and, even ensure outcomes are the same. To achieve that, there has to be serious re-engineering of on many levels. Legally, culturally and even biologically.

That's why we are discussing children not needing mothers, or reducing relationships to monetary transactions. It's simply not possible or even desirable. The essence of male/female differentiation is the sum is greater than the whole. This is embedded in our complimentarity. If we are the same, then we don't really need each other. One cannot even discuss difference without being labelled.

Individually, men and women should de-risk their unions by setting a solid foundation. All of which requisite elements we have discussed on here.

I remain an advocate for marriage in it's essence- not the kind of relationship that Franco and Vanessa had, which is way different, even if badged the same.


TV

Timbuktou:
Thanks everybody for your responses.

One more thing, though, I noticed user Peter Null state a couple of times that the 50-50 financial arrangement protects the guy's assets post-divorce. I think the rationale is, if he doesn't put up more than 50℅ of the finances for an item or expenditure, upon divorce the courts rule that that is the "life she's accustomed to" and as such he parts with nothing. Meaning if he had decided to spend more than the greed 50%, he would be required to part with assets upon divorce and even still pay alimony.


Our obodo oyibo peoples, TV01, Grams Tearoses, Raundeuter et al. Am I right in my interpretation or is there something I'm missing?

Crackhaus, another part that got me is when she became jealous of him playing with his chest hairs. . I'm eager to see our sistren's take on this.

I suppose it's a ploy worth considering if the prospect of divorce is real or something one fears? But if anything it would only serve to undermine the marriage and precipitate the very thing you fear Why not simply refrain from marriage?

Many women will agree to co-habbing, and more so feminists, who always have a point to prove . Although in many western nations, laws are being put on place around -"de-facto" relationships, which effectively give legal rights to co-habbees. Make her get her own place !

No escape really, even with the best of ploys, once you are legally married (or in a de-facto relationship where recognised) the system/judge has a wide scope, and an array of tools to deal harshly with the man/husband. Amplified if there are children involved.

Don't marry a feminist - pseudo-internet-feminists are usually manageable - or like Franco, marry a dumb one . Though many of us would consider the term "dumb feminist" a tautology , making this sentence a non-sequitur .


TV

What feminism wants, is not equality. Maybe at one point, in it's innocence, it was after "equal opportunity", but even that was misleading. What Feminism wants is power and privilege. Without the responsibility. Without the toil, the sweat, or the sacrifice.

Like I've maintained for a while, I'll give them some credence, when they are happy to marry lower status men with no problem whatsoever. I would wager that even if the case presented had "proportionate financing", she would still have wanted equal power.

Where are the screaming hordes? - actually, best stay off


TV

TooNoisy:
You must be the fallen Archangel.

The same bible says a man who is unable to provide for his family is worse than an infidel. The same bible that says a man should love his wife just like Christ had loved the Church, even to the point of sacrificing his life for his bride? The problem with people like you is that you choose to read one verse of the bible misunderstand it and spread your ignorance.

God expects high standards from both men and women. He is not partial and neither does he absolve anyone. Men have to live right, so do women. Several verses in the bible apply to men, and how they should conduct themselves.

The bible says the fallen archangel is here to deceive people. I now understand.

Because I couldn't just like this post, I also had to acknowledge it. Most excellent (It's at times like this I feel ashamed of not being a dab hand with gifs ).


TV

Drdreyy:
Well it does work(the punishment) for a large percentage of highly religious men. (those born with high libido)

I would first question your definition of "highly religious". For one who is of deep faith, has understanding, a modicum of discernment and most of all is continent, sex, or withholding it cannot be used as a form of punishment.

Not because he has a low or a high libido, but because he has a grasp of his physical appetites, and at least a degree of mastery. No recourse to self-servicing or looking outside. Honestly, even non-spiritual men can to some degree rise above being led by their members .


TV

skillzahblog:
Aside from that scenario, however, is there any reason that a 30-year-old woman can find love with a 37-year old and not a 44-year-old? How about a 50-year-old? Knowing that there are men of that age who are in great shape, physically attractive, interesting and successful is there a reason to categorically exclude these men?

A man of high status will typically be able to attract whatever kind of woman he chooses - younger ones inclusive - even beyond middle age. If he is of high status and physically fit with it, that's just gravy .

skillzahblog:
Men often pursue younger women, even if they aren’t interested in a family. The typical reason being, “that’s who I’m more attracted to.” But again, the “sex appeal boundary” gets pushed out further and further as women in their 50’s and 60’s find themselves as public sex symbols. Kim Catrell of Sex in the City fame is 55. Jane Seymour is 60. Jaclyn Smith is 62. And while most people aren’t as attractive as these, it is certainly possible to meet someone significantly older who is sexy and attractive.

The women you mentioned may have been "sex symbols" in their youth, but were not at the ages mentioned. Not to say they won't retain some significance too older men who found them attractive in their youth.

They were at best forced projections of the fact that many women like to think they can carry their attractiveness to men far past their menopause. The fact is they typically lose it years before, and become all but invisible to non-related, non-associated men at that point.

Age will always matter to discerning people, and the fact is that biologically men have a bit more more bandwidth.


TV

Drdreyy:
I hate chatting or dragging words with women due to their comprehension capacity and data/information interpretation.

Ah! The fatwa wey dem go put for your head eh! . Gird yourself 0, thunder cometh !

JoyChinwe22:
A man can rape his wife and that is a fact.

Very few men have the heart or desire to force themselves on women. And I would imagine even fewer who have been properly vetted and found worthy to be husbands. And, we roundly and unreservedly condemn any man, and more so a husband who forces himself on his wife.

However, marriage is at it's heart a conjugal union, and ATBE, a man has every right to enjoy physical intimacy with his wife. While one may "subjectively" consider coerced or forced sex (which cuts both ways by the way, and add manipulative sex often employed by wives) more heinous than women refusing sex, one cannot deny that objectively, the latter happens far more frequently and causes lots of men deep frustration.

Ergo, your OP is lopsided and biased. Any discussion of forced or coerced sex within marriage, must go hand in hand with the equally wrong act of withholding physical intimacy, manipulative sex and a lack of loving effort to ensure husbands are getting sex, by their wives.

I'll be happy to give it attention when there are social media drives, NGO's set-up, human rights activists mobilised and government intervention mandated equally on this deeply painful issue which is blighting the lives of many men .

Thank you for listening - fatwa already in effect to no effect, so don't waste your time .

Wey dem?

TV

cococandy:
Noted

...ah! See cheating, baba'nla ojoro . I made a comment - maybe a little tongue in cheek for emphasis - and get labelled a sexist. I back it up with reason and you tacitly demur, but leave the label . Nicely played

I'm happy to be challenged, have no problem being called out, and I'm not beyond reproach, but play fair na? Then when it gets heated, I get blamed for that too .

Anyway, back to the convo. We obviously come from different positions, but with no reason or relative facts, what's the point? So, let me ask you specifically, and anyone in general, this question;

If there had never been any historical, and there was no current oppression, of either sex, and if there were no social norms or imperatives advantaging, or restraining either sex, based on make-up only, would great inventors be pretty much split evenly between male and female?


TV

My response to Coco mostly answers this.

The handbag maker was one of a list of entrepreneurs, not creators or inventors, of which there was only 1.

I was not being demeaning, you chose to read it that way. Like I said, Branson and Dangote sef no enter. Am I gainsaying their achievements as entrepreneurs? No, just categorising them accordingly.

And make it personal by asking how many I can employ . Like I said, it's by category, and I also said, most men are excluded as well, be that as high-end creators (in view here) or entrepreneurs. Can you make a fact based case?

Your opinions on my posts mean nothing. In as much as I care, the ones you call good could actually be bad? You see what you want to see. Your surprise is mostly as a result of your own blind-spots.

Surprise me with facts, repudiating anything I've said.


TV

MizMyColi:
You would have made more sense if you yourself did not try to make this thread a sexist one by singling out the Handbag maker.

You would have made sense if you did not sound demeaning in addressing her as a handbag maker.

She mentioned other women who have stood out and performed above par in their chosen field of endeavor.

How you ignored those and chose to focus on a "Hand Bag Maker" beats my imagination.
So what if she's a handbag maker?

Can you employ the number of Labour that Handbag maker has employed?

Since when did it become norm to shame people's handiwork?

You won't stop with the surprises anytime soon, will you?

One minute, I read a TV post and I'm like, "This guy is good!"

The next minute I read another post of his and I'm like; "But why is this guy being this petty naaaa"

cococandy:
So it's only the bag maker you saw on that list? And yes she can represent the female folk because not only does she make bags as you put it, she influences lives with her female empowerment programs, philanthropy and foundations. Trust you to try belittle something beautiful just because a woman is the one doing it.

Nope, I saw one - the first - who could be considered a creator, then a bunch of mostly entrepreneurs. Males such as Richard Branson and Dangote would not make the equivalent list for men because they make, not create. And a great education is less a factor in being a successful entrepreneur.

cococandy:
What's your definition of real transformation? Do you know how many people's lives she has transformed? Pls don't be guided by blind sexism.

As I defined it. Inventing ab initio. Talent shows transform lives, so do lottery wins . We are talking a different type of transformation here. Not re-creating or even improving. And not buying & selling .

Sexism? Me . I speak plain truth. Look, how many women are nerds? How many would spend hours in a dark room trying to perfect something arcane? Obsessed with something they may not even be able to fathom the practicalities of at the time?

How many women are bird spotters,or spend inordinate amounts of time tinkering with old machines or waxing lyrical over the engineering of suspension bridges?

How many women dream of conquering the hood, the next country, the seas, or the distant planets, as opposed to the local shopping mall .

It's simply the way men are. The nerdiness, the obsessiveness, the curiosity, the drive, the ambition. Those are what lead to breakthroughs, even when they may not be being sought. A lot of transformational stuff is happenstance. Take gaming for example - and I personally don't get it - it's mostly men, mostly nerds, but the advances have been rapid It's wiring.

Sure women have it, women can do it, but not to the same degree. And I am all for them having the equal opportunity to avail themselves of it, if they so desire. It's not sexist, it's realist.

It seems you are set on seeing it through an ideological lens which says there is no difference between men and women, and the difference in achievement or representation is due to oppression (historic or current). But with "oppression" eliminated or factored, there would still be a gap.

Women want the bag, men want to be able to buy the bag for them. Balance, you know that's what you want . But seriously, more men may be at the cutting edge than women, but most men won't be anywhere near it either.


TV

crackhaus:
Maybe she's got a controlling personality afterall, like I noted in an earlier comment.

Possibly? I've seen some extreme examples of the "controlling spirit", to the "rule & reign" level . But even here, they still seek to control a man of means/status, not someone "beneath them so to speak. Again, you may be right, but I 'm still thinking there's a "but" in her bio.


TV

...so, we are talking Inventors, innovators that bring real transformation, and creators of cutting edge technology. And they present handbag makers to represent women .

Women do not have the same burden of performance that men do and are not typically as well-equipped, driven, or as ambitious to pioneer and break new ground. Even if all things were equal, they'd still lag, as they simply do not have the same desire or capacity for plain old hard work. Hence they will continue to be under-represented at that creator/innovator echelon, with or without a level playing field.

Good thing too, we need them mainly to birth and raise the innovators and creators, not be them.


TV

freecocoa:
You don't have any pictures to post and even if you did, it's not an issue since I've put up my pic here before, what could the picture possibly prove? Abegi.

Banter doesn't get personal and hateful like you always do, seriously I do wonder why a stranger's life on the net should bother anyone, anyways apologies accepted and I apologise too, but I'm sure you'll still stir up trouble someday,if not soon, you live for it.

Apology accepted...I was talking about my pix .


TV

Ujoan:
Her background and character definitely calls to question here, but I think the main issue here is the OP.

Possibly, if his story is far removed from the truth. I just feel something is missing about her bio though? I don't see why a girl of 28, from a well-to-do and respected family need marry beneath her? There is something we are missing, a big "but" about her.

crackhaus:
Along with her character and background, I'm of the opinion her age kinda aggravates the situation..first she's richer, and then older - that's the recipé for boy-toyism right there.

As above, then why at just 28 would she be pressed to marry down? There's a rap song I mean a big but in there somewhere .


TV

tearoses:
TV & Freecocoa please O it’s enough
Nothing to gain from all this
Nothing at all
Biko, sheath swords and move on

Birdman sef don find chick to marry

. Sheath swords ke? Like how? You think it's just sword lasan lasan I bought? Come see heavy, heavy, artillery, and cutting edge data mining aps . I was just re-positioning my troops and getting ready to advance . No quarter asked, no quarter given. This one na NL last moniker standing!

Ok I don hear . What? sheath and make peace? You jest? Oh, ok then.

Freecocoa, no vex huh? I think I can see what may have triggered you off, but it was not meant like that, like you said, just banter - and I was just on the verge of dropping pix .

Either way, apologies, I should know better, and I do feel a duty of care for everyone here. I'm sure you'll get your spec right and get your spec. I'll stop now as I'm almost overwhelmed by the urge to give advice . See you on the next thread. Make sure you views are tight sha!


TV

crackhaus:
Dude if I was you, my marriage to that woman would be so over in my mind—even if we don't separate/divorce physically, I'd be mentally detached from her by all accounts.

However, to keep yourself from being tagged an adulterer, you should divorce her...but make sure you continue taking care of your kids and be involved in everything concerning their upbringing.

Your wife didn't misbehave because her family is better placed in society than yours, she became that way simply because she is older than you. Don't get it twisted!
As much as people these days try to act modern by fire by force and recite the saying "age is just a number"... the truth is, that statement does not apply to Nigerians, don't let no one deceive you.

In Nigeria, age is everything but just a number.
We dey carry age for head, including the phony ones that feign exposure.


TV01 your attention is needed here...food don ready

What can I say?
I never advise divorce. This one sounds bad, but healing and reconciliation is possible.
Brother is far from blameless and his initial weakness is the genesis of all his woes. Men, get it right going in!!!
Why second guess yourself, or cede your manhood to others? Blaming parents, pastors, etc. doesn't wash even if true
A mans burden is performance - with no respite or leeway. When I get it wrong, it's my fault, when my wife gets it wrong it's my responsibility

If he takes her to Europe, there the real possibility of his wife taking her alleged madness into overdrive and completely finishing him. How will he know if she's truly repentant? But being away from her family with him having more authority may help?

A return home to first verify and establish things there may jeopardise things in Sweden? There are kids involved, they come first. Forty days and 40 nights situation. This one needs God, not His messenger .


TV

^{...not sure the age difference is the main factor, many have no problem with it. I think it's more her character and background.}

macarena:
Thank you every one for the advice. I got more than I expected.
And most of you were right, my self-esteem is nothing to brag about.

TV01, are you a psychologist?
All your descriptions were so apt.
I never knew it was this bad. When you said I was on my way to becoming damaged, I started crying because its so true.
I've always looked at relationships through Mills and Boon coloured glasses. Passionate fights brought you closer than ever.
Naive me!

I will learn to love and forgive myself though I don't know where to start from. And even though I find it hard, I'll go make friends.
I'll take it one day at a time.

You are most welcome. And apologies for being somewhat blunt. The trauma wearies one atimes.

You said you were in church? Nowadays that can mean many things, including the opposite of what it implies. However, if you truly believe, I would advise you head for Christ and the cross in the heart of things. I don't mean increased religious activity.

Give your self to prayer and to scripture. Understand who you are in Christ, and what he has done for you. Keep your self, and ensure your conduct aligns with scripture.

If there is an older, mature, female christian you can fellowship with for pointers, please find one. But be very discerning in who you choose and what you share. the closer to home she is the better.

Grace and mercy will bring about your healing - it's all grace and mercy really, God is good - and in time, you will be over this. The vision you had of "how it would be" will surely come to pass. When you meet the one, share all with him, not necessarily a detailed, but like at first here. Then honestly answer any questions.

He will be one with the shoulders and heart to love you despite, and even more so, because of what you went through. That will be the final step - perhaps almost imperceptible - in your restoration.

Ditch worldly therapeutic notions like self-esteem. Christs develop real spirituality and character, that is robust and speak to anything you will face.

Take any practical measures to avoid the person in question. If you have to see him, just be polite and aloof. If the conversation is forced, let him know you want nothing to do with him and ask that he respect that. Get an older person involved if you feel legitimately threatened.

I will remember you, may The Good Lord lift up His countenance upon you and give you His peace.


TV

^{...not sure what psycho I am, but it's not "ologist" . It is well and will be better. God bless}

I've been on NL for years and have pegged you for what you are - an ignorant blasphemer - and simply ignored you. I only quoted you once, when you chose to cruelly ridicule that guy for cheap sympathy and attention.

I may, or may not have quoted you first when I dissected your jonzeed intellect on the "gay fathers" thread - "do women bring anything unique, distinct or important to child-rearing?", to which you could only stutter and claim you wouldn't be bullied . Loud mouthed ignoramus .

The butt-hurt from those two episodes is what made you think you could hide behind the hyaenidae to extract some revenge on the "15 things" thread. Dem no reesh, and neither do you

And you came in here to mock OP - when you wailed you had exactly the same right to do what he is doing;

freecocoa:
We are discussing this from my angle, so excuse me if it appears selfish, I do have the right to want things.

So who is the hypocrite ?

Swear, curse hurl abuse all you like. It's expected, you are vulgar and unrefined. Call me old, at least I'm not desperate. Call me ugly, at least I have a beautiful wife, and don't have to mate with someone I don't even like or find attractive . Call me a sissy, but I'm more man than you can ever hope for in real life, or even picture in your jonzers imagination .

And if you call me a hypocrite, at least substantiate it, like I have done - and can do with most of the rubbish you post.


TV

freecocoa:
OYour level of stupidity knows no bound, like since being on NL, you and I that is, who's been the one to always quote the other, talking absolute crap? If that isn't you seeking my attention I don't know what is, of course you can say anything to save face but who are you f00ling?i Lmao

Then you talk about class and being unrefined, this man sef, I am a single girl, at least I have just myself to look out for now, what should be said about a married man with children, acting like you do? You should hide your fecked up face in shame Mr born again, it's better I'm blasphemous and any other thing you can think of than parade myself as a supposed child of your God and at the same time behave the way you do, how is it that you don't see how stupid you come across as? Well, how can you? You are stupid after all.

I am all you mentioned and more, yet you get er€ctions at my posts, now you are claiming it started with me taking a swipe at you on the single mother thread, may you not die from telling blatant lies o. We agree, I jonz about everything, now what will you do about it than type the nonsense you do, which will change absolutely nothing?

Calling you a sissy is an insult to sissies, hopeless agbaya, die if it pains you that I got the sympathy or attention you claim I was seeking, die morafucker die.

5minsmadness:
In fact, if we were to psychoanalyze this:

I had purposed to respond to the posts about your comments depicting men as sex-crazed and lacking self-control, but you did so quite aptly yourself.

Two sexually mature, but psychologically unprepared people in a close intimate relationship where the sexual frisson has been ramped up. How could what happened - in some form - not be expected at some point? I'd wager it was actually escalationary, and there'd been similar, if not as serious, situations before.

And she obviously encourage/wanted it to some degree, but was woefully unable to set boundaries or foresee potential outcomes. Was it sexual assault, yes it was. Does that kind of simplistic label speak fully to this situation? No it doesn't.

And no, not all men are sex-crazed or incontinent. But all can find themselves in potentially dangerous situations if care is no taken. And one day, perhaps people will understand, that the sexes respond differently to these situations and the outcomes are not always the same for both.

I doubt he'll be as troubled by this as she is, and what's likely to be more is his perception of women and how he goes on to treat them in the future.

We can't force the same outcomes, or legislate the same burdens. Maybe we should try setting the same expectations? Just saying!


TV

freecocoa:
Stop following me around loser, it'll get you no where, I've never said anything about your wife but now I'm really starting to pity her, at least the guy I wrote about was under 30 at the time, he still has time to grow up and become a better person, how old are you again and still acting like this? you should think about that.

Pity my wife! I will beat you with her beauty . "He has time to grow up" - ain't nothing wrong with the brother, it's you that's damaged . Which you demonstrated by publicly ridiculing him in order to gain cheap sympathy and attention

freecocoa:
Lmao @ whipping up male interest/ attention with fake persona (if only you know the gazillion pms I get and never take a 2nd look at ), aww, so it pains you that I get the supposed attention? Na wa o, your life must have sucked super bad as a kid, sweety I don't need a bunch of strangers on the net to feel awesome, in real life, I'm the amazing girl, like people go "you don't know how amazing you are, you are unique" I don't do fake boo boo, and I thought they said women are the ones who were often jealous of themselves, I'm glad we can all see clearly how that's not true, if I were a man and gay, I swear I'll not touch you with a pole, you are disgusting, tufiakwa! *spits on his ugly face*

Super-Jonzer

freecocoa:
You say you are not interested in me or whatever, now please tell us once and for all, why won't you let me be? Let's even say I'm a liar and everything about me is fake, just how is that any of your beeswax? Isn't it my 'fakeness' to be? Why does it bother you so much? F00l you need to get your priorities right and stop showing the world how much of a sissy you are, btw there are more stories about me, that I put on here by meself, you can keep digging to keep yourself busy since you are obviously jobless.

Because your are blasphemous and a jonzer. Jonz about your intelligence, jonz about your looks, jonz about your partners, jonz about your personality. And because you had the temerity to come onto the "15 things about" thread and take a sly swipe at me. Here is your reward .

freecocoa:
Lest I forget, I can sleep with or let anyone, even animal or thing I choose, put themselves in me, the toto is mine to give , I don't get how you don't understand that, thinking such comment is an insult to me, nigga you don't know shyt about me, fvck off already, fvcktard, whatever you think you hope to achieve with the nonsense you are doing is failed woefully, understand that I don't give a rat's ass what anyone on here thinks, the people that matter will only laugh at stuffs like this, hahaha.

No, no, no, please I beg you, don't get it wrong - I absolutely agree you have every right to do with it exactly as you please. Further, I would never seek to question or impinge that right. And, I care even less than you what anyone thinks about how you use your rights

My displeasure, is that you would dare suggest I would, for one instant, desire to be anywhere near that. That's a jonz to far . That's almost as bad as your blasphemies, and far worse than your ridiculing that brother, and will be dealt with . No need to force the smile to show how uncouth you are - we know already .

Classless, unrefined, base and guttersnipe jonzer - but that kinda follows really .


TV

freecocoa:
fvck you fvck you and fvck you some more, cvnt.

If I am old and a spinster, it is my right, just what is your own is what I want to know, it's clear you get off my noticing you, now better come back with a tangible response or I'll ignore you, I know that makes you sad, so it's your time to shine, buffoon.

...QQ, have you any class whatsoever ?


TV

One thing that struck me here is that you appear to be somewhat honest - although not going into that much detail - about what transpired here. Normally I'd pass, I prefer sharing with men, not least because they tend to be able to deal with the hard facts better.

I may touch on some points from your narration, but that is not really the issue here. What happened to you is merely symptomatic of the kind of character you're developing and person you are turning out to be.

I say "developing" and "to be", because I'm hopeful that this will be a turning point for you, that you'll go away and develop the kind of character that will keep you from such situations in future. Otherwise, you'll potentially turn out as many we see, becoming almost irretrievably "damaged".

Due to empowerment, liberty, freedom or whatever you want to term it, you've been able to get yourself into situations you simply do not have the maturity, experience or life-skills to deal with. In short, you, like many others, did not have the wherewithal to enter the kind of adult relationship you desired. Although you probably thought you did.

What you should do is simply forget about him, and any kind of intimate relationship for the time being. I have no idea of your antecedents in terms of culture, family upbringing, faith etc., but you need to pay attention to those things and develop a robust character.

Learn about relationships in their fullest sense, and not just as a response to lust or desire. About committed, healthy, fruitful relationships, About relationships where people seek to give as opposed to merely receive, to invest time, effort and sacrifice if need be. The closer to home these are the better.

Socialise widely, have lots of different interests, passions and friends/associates. Travel, broaden your horizons, mature and have more time to reflect instead of simply feel. Grow into yourself, not just what you see around you or that the world presents.

I believe a solid foundation in Christ is the best way to deal with this, but I am not being prescriptive, and while Christianity speaks to more than character and relationships, there are other ways to develop them.

Alternatively, being as yet unformed in the fullest sense, you could bounce around from one toxic situation to the next, and serialise being in bad, possibly abusive relationships. They'll affect you deeply, and you'll build up a defense of sorts in order to deal with it, without ever dealing with the underlying issue. That will leave you wounded and bitter, and most likely unable to be the wonderful partner, or form the wonderful relationship we all desire.

Your choice, all the best.


TV

^{To those women who will hear, you are best served by leaving these kind of encounters until you are mature, and when you are, forming serious, chaste relationships with a view to finding a spouse - my take. NSBM.}

macarena:
To the mature people in the house, pls help!

freshvine:
Five years ago you were out of the university and was on nairaland. 26 then and still under 20s now?
I can see you're good at arithmetic regression

Bolade005 got it exactly right when he described her as a "jonzer". Read her below, then follows a description of the fine boy she is dating

freecocoa:
Yea well, might be true for you but I'm into fine boys, so no, you don't qualify.

freecocoa:
He tends to get really angry when he gets angry and doesn't really give people second chances and that's something you don't like, as you on the other hand can give chances die and you wish he was taller than he is, funnier and act in what you believe is a "more civilised" way, he's not bush or anything, you just believe there's still room for refinement.

freecocoa:
Yea, he sulks longer and walai, it kinda pisses me off, I mean like "snap out of it already"

freecocoa:
I want him to see it my own way(i cast out every spirit of ITK in me) you know if I'm being totally honest, I just think am more intelligent and I guess it kinda bothers me, chai! Make una pray for me o.

So he has inter-alia;
1. Anger management issues
2. An unforgiving spirit
3. Lacks humor (what man or woman can live with that )
4. Is not "enlightened"
5. Is immature and a sulker
6. Relatively thick, as Free' intellectual deficiency has been repeatedly exposed up in here
7. Is short and physically unappealing

Freecocoa' definition of a fine boy . Well she got the "boy" part right . Not just a jonzer, but a jonzer in overdrive, a jonzer with a jonzer superhero cape . . You see in context jonzer is just another term for liar. With all your mouth, you let someone you don't even like or truly respect put himself in you . And you even had the gall to imply I'd be interested in that

freecocoa:
if you don't know, I'm still in my 20's, just incase you wanna say I'm desperate or something.

She even went on about "forcing the marriage". The type that will forcibly marry a man frustrate him, leave him, and then tag him an abuser to justify her wickedness. I laugh as I see her come up in here and try and whip up male interest and attention with her fake personna . Not just desperate, beyond desperate, but also ugly and thick, and an inveterate liar.

But we know Freecocoa in here. I didn't originally respond as I wanted her to enjoy her warm glow . I even liked her post. Perhaps you thought you'd appropriate the smoke assorted husband snatchers, gleeful divorcees and caretakers turned wives were throwing up. Past hurts huh . I already schooled you lot that physical references can't hurt a confident man, let alone a physically fit (read hot ) man.

So, the remark about me being a hypocrite, as ever, I challenge you or anyone else to show where I have ever made a hypocritical remark or contradictory post on NL. Do so and I will eat crow - however much you choose to serve me!

Raise a posse of the cackling g3nitalia obsessed hyaenidae to help if you like - still no decent or respectable person joining your cause - otherwise I'll be back to make you and anyone else who joins you smell your own nyashes.


TV

cococandy:
I have to agree with this. I think the OP is far from reality if he doesn't recognize that men marry so called independent women so that the family income can be bumped. Please what's the percentage of marred men who are sole bread winners? NL and her fairytales. Never rooted in reality.

I'm not even sure what a woman being independent is supposed to entail? Is it one who can take care of herself prior to marriage, or one who can comfortably finance the household after it?

For the vast majority of couples, even if one could single-handedly finance the home, the others income will not be entirely disbursed on non-family related items, or remain untouched will it?

Like I said, marriage is actually about co-dependence on so many levels. Trying to isolate "financial circumstances" as pivotal, not only to marriage, but to a womans other qualities is at best suspect.

And yes, given the times, and now the economic climate we live in, I'm sure some men will hope that their wives can render some level of financial support, but like OP rightly noted, the vast majority wold like to be able manage alone - even if for all the wrong reasons or solely ego' sake .

And while many may harbour a secret desire for a decently earning spouse, only few will make it a pivotal consideration when choosing. That still remains a bigger consideration for women - and rightly so, given the different burdens.


TV

@anxious"n"confused

Have a DNA test performed as soon as is feasibly possible. The longer this uncertainty persists the more damaging the fallout will be if the child is not yours.

You don't appear to be able to handle this in the calm manner that is required. Involve the right elders in your family. Anything else at this point is just story. Everything is up in the air until you know for sure either way. DNA test now!


TV

crackhaus:
There is some sanity to be found in her yet, to my utmost surprise.

https://m.facebook.com/nkechi.bianze/posts/10154880104472195

I personally see this as more of the same bovine scatology - pardon my French . Her thrust in that post was "Financial independence is a non-negotiable prerequisite for gender equality".

Financial differentials are not as a result of "gender inequality (I hate that word gender used in the context of male female ). In a pared down sense, sexual difference just means it makes more practical sense for men to till the field and women to tend the home front.

To be clear, it is at least as valid to see the biological difference as driving the role difference, which in turn drives the financial earning difference, as it is to assume the financial earnings (responsibility difference) drives the role difference. Equalising earnings/income will not equalise any other aspect of men and womens make-up.

I do take her point about women effectively prostituting themselves (although shouldn't real feminism just see that as their legitimate freewill choice?), but the truth is the majority of women - no matter their earnings or status - will always desire a higher earning/status man.


TV

Nothing to see here really. Just another arriviste of sorts forming enlightened ontop an ideology that is faulty, and one she probably doesn't fully grasp.

I take care of household tasks, I spend as much time as I can with my children - i.e. Saturdays I take the children shopping and on to the park, while Mama goes to the gym - and I bring home the bacon. She is not spewing this for todays man or family minded woman.

As ever these "gender equality" types parse everything through their 1 dimensional lens of finances and chores. Equality of the sexes in the sense described is neither optimal, or really desired by most of either sex.

The perceptions, motivators, triggers, stimuli and burdens for males and females vary in such a way as for them not to want this. They always overlook this essential real-life dynamic. Theirs is an "on-paper" ideology.

True equality would be higher earning/status women taking on lower earning/status men as spouses, like men have been doing for eons. Yes all doors have been opened or forcibly kicked down. There are no strictly sex-based roles, no societal demands or conventions one must adhere too.

Oya now equalists, show me where the above, as a general rule, is occurring in large, and successful numbers. Or even where conceptually, women accept this as quite an attractive proposition, then I'll take you seriously - otherwise it's more "running mouth" instead of "running homefront". And yes, lets see what her domestic set-up is.


TV

Berbierklaus:
To me I find her post challenging
Why?

using our immediate environment as an example,
A man hoping to settle down for family life searches for the widely accepted "wife material" criteria
Naturally a wife material(has different subjective meaning to different people) is a lady that is domesticated eg cooking,cleaning,washing,hospitable etc and etc.

Now he gets to fulfil his desire,and his wife comes up with this tactic of running the family, maybe as a result of wanting what that other family who are "happily married has".

Do you think our men should deviate from the recognised gender role?
Don't you think it will upset the bible preached doctrine of "wife/husband helpmate"?
Do you see it as a possibility that will not put an imbalance in marriages.

Just trying to get the rational behind "Adult responsibilty"


TV01
crackhaus

...well, well, well. If you'd asked me to name one, or take a wild guess, it would have been Bro Gbile of Gboko . He came to the church I attended in my very early days to present a 5 day workers seminar. It was deeply expository, especially for me at that stage.

He is actually the reason I say "almost all", when I dismiss our resident Nigerian MOGs. Not that I can vouch for anyone per se, but I really learnt from Him at that time and read a number of his books.


TV

yetseyi:
Okay, its PEACE HOUSE run by bro Gbile Akanni nothing really fancy (I mean in outlook) in most of their programmes but its the real deal.

They run discipleship classes in most parts of the country every week. I had/still have a personal discipler though its been a while I spoke to her last.When I say disciplers I mean they really do follow you up, I can tell sis lizy anything and I will get sound counselling or advice.

They do have christain students congress/meeting I never attended the one for the whole country at Gboko in Benue.They also have regional student congress.
They have retreats for ministers.
They have teachings/meetings for singles more like a training session for singles. At some point they were using shephard hill baptist Obanikoro. I think that's monthly.
They have retreat for "christain Ladies"

The weekly discipleship class is quite nice, not too large a meeting, We were around 12-15 in the class I attended then. We talk scriptures, bible study application in our everyday life(relationship with people, career, Knowing Gods will in every aspect of our life, marriage etc), following Jesus and you can always ask anything bothering there and we talk about it.

When you listen to sound teachings, especially from a non denominational source one realizes that the church is in a lot of trouble and you will be the only one seeing what is wrong in your local church and people begin to tag you as crazy.

Their books are quite cheap, not too fancy publications but deep, at least its not the paper I want to eat its the content. I do have some of their books and there's one written on marriage "No more two" a real show of what marriage should be like, practical teachings.etc


The major problem we have in church now is there is no moulding like Mrs tearoses said. No discipler to train up we the young ones, once you can catch them young, possibly from university train in the right way(of the lord) we make right choices, marry right etc.

Ohh and that's the first place I learnt not to get carried away by show of anointing by suitors looolz, the "powerful preachers outside and terrible husbands in the home" set of men and they are plenty ooo.





Yeah I understand now.

yetseyi:
There is only one christain organization not a church (that I know of) that is still in the process of building up young Individuals for different aspects of their lives(marriage very inclusive) its non denominational and there's no my church or our doctrine factor.In fact when I see a fellow believer behaving in a particular way I know that its likely that person at some point has been through that organization.

Pray tell, I'd be interested in knowing a bit more about the organisation

yetseyi:
Oga TV01 you used two different statements in your writeup A troubled marriage and a failed marriage I thought they are two different things entirely but the way you used the statements implied they are the same. I believe they are two different things. Whats your view?

They are two different things, and I actually meant them as different things. Apologies if that was not clear. However, in terms of ministry, I believe if a mans marriage is in either state, the outcome should be the same, he should step down, as it literally disqualifies him. It can also be an indicator of the fruit one is bearing and whether he is a actually a true Christian/truly serving God.


TV

One should look to scripture and not what one sees around them to discern these things. What does the bible say about those who call "Lord, Lord", or the "narrow path", or about "fruit" as evidence? In fact, looking to the institutional church or so-called MOGs is one of the worst things one can do.

We nominally attend the Anglican church, but to me many, if not most, of the leadership hierarchy are not only not christian, they are enemies of the faith. As much as I like to talk policy, principles and practice as opposed to people, I would not put an iota of trust in almost any high-profile Nigerian MOG one could name. Near fisticuffs at an extended family gathering lately - they are all RCCG'ers .

Where does the bible exhort husband and wife to live separate lives? And who can do that and maintain proper married life, if not the actual marriage itself. Does one even need scripture to take a view on that?

Any "MOG" in a failed union - let alone one beset with troubles - is not worth a plugged nickel to me, Two mature, God-fearing Christians cannot be in a failed marriage. Look into any so-called "failed christian union" and I promise you that will be the case. The term is a misnomer. Simples.

I have heard and I have seen, I've never come across a mature and committed Christian couple in a troubled marriage. How can?

I know I sound harsh and perhaps judgmental, but I can't see it any other way and say I believe God or scripture.


TV

tearoses:
Yetseyi & TV
The truth is that men (and women) and even MOG are of flesh and sincerely it takes the grace of God to be what God wants you to be.
Plenty plenty moulding needs to take place constantly

I know what I am saying when I say that a lot is happening in so called Christian Homes
Are we going to say the 2 pastor Chris's did not pray enough or are bad people?
I do agree that for every Pastor Chris, there are thousands and thousands of happy homes, but every broken home is a sad occurrence that affects everyone....husband, wife, children, friends, family and even the wider community.

A lot of things are also down bad doctrines, teachings and ideas
My hubby was at the ATM a few weeks back and came home with this story. He was laughing about it, but I was sad when I heard the story.
He got there and asked who was the last person. No one answered so he asked the man who was standing close by "are you the last person"
If only my hubby had known ........
God forbid, I will never be the last person
Last person is not my portion
I will be in front always
I come against every spirit of backwardness
bla bla bla bla bla bla
My hubby come dey beg am sef before the man kept quiet


Why it is sad to me is that that is the level of Christianity some people go around with
This is a man in his 40's to 50's o!
Will this kind of person even smile to his wife & kids
Yet he is a Christian
Not so?

TV and yetseyi I have ive seen & heard plenty. Sometimes I just tire

This is one of the reasons I don't just watch religious channels anyhow cos some of the things you hear

Maybe I don't rightly get it, but I'm not sure I agree overall, or with some of the detail. There are a number of conflations and premises I'm not sure about.

For one, "putting something on the table", does not necessarily mean "independent". More importantly, marriage itself in some sense centres around co-dependency. Although this co-dependency is over and beyond finances, for most couples, there will be some monetary overlap after marriage, whatever there respective financial positions before it.

flashope:
Most people do have a misconception about most men crave to marrying a woman who puts something on the table. Responsible men dont want any dime from a woman. All they need is their intellectual capacity and high level of in-depth reasoning to contribute to the family because with that a man gets novel ideas periodically and have a knowledgeable person who repackages and critically analyse all ideas he tables. Your wisdom, knowledge and positive words are all what a man really need from a woman. Wealth, beauty are all secondary.

I mostly agree to this point. However, what a real man wants and what the practicalities of a situation suggest can be very different .

flashope:
Most women that are financially independence have these qualities and value money more. So it's imperative for men to go for such woman because that is partial confirmation that the woman's reasoning is up to par. Such people don't are more interested in discussions that will propell both partners and shy from irrelevant discussions and their less dependence on the man will open more avenues for investment and more income.

Here I start to part ways with you.
1. I don't agree your opening sentence here necessarily holds true - both parts of it.
2. Or the follow-on inference that it makes them "up to par"
3. And even if it does as you suggest to some degree, there may be downsides to this independence

flashope:
Therefore, dear ladies please focus on your internal-internal and not external-external. Amass more knowledge , get more independent, be humble, be more reasonable, upgrade your character positively and dont just sit down hours beautifying your face,spend more of your time beautifying your mind and responsible men of vision will find their ways into your life.

Good advice, but financial independence is not necessarily key or a predicate for any of the other "qualities".

I have known men who are not so well to do financially, become so after marrying women who are. The reverse can also hold true. Both a man and woman may be independent prior to marriage, the cost of running a home and raising a family for most means a considered mutuality after marriage, whatever the case before.

And what should these financially independent women be looking for in a man?


TV

freecocoa:
She said she'd post them on that thread, not send it to me so I don't know what you are on about.

...if you wanted to see TV' pics, simply ask TV

freecocoa:
I guess you can tell yourself that men don't need to be fine to be attractive to women, I don't see how that makes the statement true.

It's certainly true for me - posted pics of my wife too

freecocoa:
Why are you bothered about me and what I want in a man bla bla bla, shebi you married, you wan marry me too? I no understand why you won't let me alone o, hian.

For the same reason I'm interested in Baldman, I care about people . And yes, I am happily married - and even if I wasn't, I already know our specs don't match

So, happy to help, or not, as desired . You'll be so enamoured in your union, you'll have no time for other peoples husbands, or pictures of them .


TV