₦airaland Forum

Enigma: I wish to say one thing here about "tradition" as used by Roman Catholics. Many Roman Catholics, and even more so on Nairaland, are actually not even clear on what their denomination means by "tradition". There are also some who simply use the word "tradition" for anything they do that cannot be supported by Scripture.

On the other hand, Roman Catholic teaching is that for "tradition" to be upheld, it must be uniformly supported by the "church fathers". Thus if there is disagreement among the "fathers" the teaching is not really established

this isn't exactly true, we dont need 100% of the fathers to teach a doctrine before it is considered sacred Tradition, i only need a majority witnessing to what was recieved.

Enigma: I wish to say one thing here about "tradition" as used by Roman Catholics. Many Roman Catholics, and even more so on Nairaland, are actually not even clear on what their denomination means by "tradition". There are also some who simply use the word "tradition" for anything they do that cannot be supported by Scripture.

On the other hand, Roman Catholic teaching is that for "tradition" to be upheld, it must be uniformly supported by the "church fathers". Thus if there is disagreement among the "fathers" the teaching is not really established

this isn't exactly true, we dont need 100% of the fathers to teach a doctrine before it is considered sacred Tradition, i only need a majority.

Sal C: Syncan please come and finish what you started.

But oga Uben: if you are a lecturer, your students will surely work hard to pass,

if u meet an informed protestant these questions will pop up, only it wont be charitable.

Olugbenger: My brother please address the issue raised and stop pontificating.

young man, i'm not obligated to answer anything or anyone for that matter and i am averse to answering rude people who instead of seeking to know y are busy condemning and accusing. For your assignment learn the meaning of 'pontificating'.

POPE II: I want a football team(11children) hope she won't refuse

make una take am easy na! Sofry. Gege

Hmm, quarter mark...

POPE II: For me papal infallibility is trusting the pope and respecting his decisions even if we do not agree . it means that as the "leader" of the Church he can't lead his church on the wrong path. I think that's why the election of a new pope is exhausting and they check his morality and past actions

Please come again, e b like say i no hear you well...

Sal C: Abeg no fear 12 is not much.

But pope honorius taught heresy, how do u reconcile that?

Syncan: The pope can only throw new light into the meaning or understanding of, or affirm in stronger words, what the church has recieved via sacred tradition ( oral and written). The magisterium is there to aid him. Christs mandate to the church to preach to all nations, his specific order to Peter to feed the sheep, his promise to be with the church till the end of time, and that the gates of hell shall not prevail, all depicts infallibility. The fact that the apostles in acts 15 chose to say " it has pleased us and the holy spirit" means they understand it so. Also scripture calls the church " pillar and foundation of truth" When the pillar of truth declares, there is no room for error. God has made it so, He is omnipotent, He can do it. The various anthemas in the early church and condemnation of heresies showed that the early fathers understood it so.

God knows what you will do. Very simple.

How do you expect a civilised discussion when your opening post was full of accusations against those you believe aren't christians.

adsonstone: The first statement is not completely correct....the part in bold is wrong with emphasis on 'write any books'.

John is instructed by Jesus Christ to write the book of revelation- rev 1:11 (that makes your statement a lie).
No subtle lie(s) again please.


regarding the next in bold, I hope you don't mind giving at least one doctrine that originates from oral tradition that the bible is silent about.

do you read revelation alone?

Syncan: The pope cannot err when he speaks "ex cathedral" as the shepherd of the universal church, in matters of faith and moral.

does this mean the pope can make doctrines in the church? Does this mean he is infallible when he teaches without recourse to d deposit of faith? Besides you got it right. Where does scriptures and tradition teach papal infallibility?

Msgamble: why insult n abuse ur fellow christain? Frustration? Permit my spelling nt dodgma buh 'Dogma' u're just trying to obstruct d truth by laying lame emphasis on dodgma u know what i mean even with spelling/typing error..am sure if i was there wen Christ turned water to wine, u ppl will b saying 'Msgamble pray for us' lyk am God or Christ that livest forever, hmmn

now that you know the spelling thank God. I also want to tell you that there is no sacred book in catholicism called dogma, quote me anywhere.

Unongu, pope and eberex, this thread is meant to riddicle, take a bow. The questions will come up again and you'll have time to answer them. Don't waste ur time here. Move on.

DrummaBoy: J I Packer and Charles Haddon Spurgeon are foremost Grace Preachers. That is all that C H Spurgeon preached in his over 40 years ministration at the The London Metropolitan Terbanacle. I have read J I Packer's works before and I can assure you that he is a Grace Preacher.

It is from a firm foundation of what the Grace of God can do in the hearts of men that they made the statements they made above. If you cannot explain to us what the grace of God can do, why lay a demand of the law on men who naturally cannot do anything to help themselves as far keeping the law is concerned.

The error of the Holiness Movement, for which these two men were known antagonists, is that it sets the cart before the horse. God's grace must do a work in the hearts of men before they can keep the law. And the law that must be kept is not the ten commandments but the law of the Spirit of life, written expressely in the epistle and the teachings of Christ.

they are grace preacher who know how to use the law.

Without checking the net and books, what is papal infallibility?

Una no go kill me with laugh oh! @mamma sal c, are u serious? 12? Abeg no make me fear. Afraid don dey catch me small small, make una no take me run abeg oh.

Goshen360: You err! You should have asked me explain further. Carefully notice what I am jumping on Ola for. He recommends the ten commandments as a cure for sin and that's what I'm attacking. Get your facts right.

where on the thread did he say d 10 commandment is a cure for sin?

mr judge careful, ola presents a case of a sinner who doesn't feel guilty for his sins, goshen thinks he should be told that he has been saved through faith, the bible doesn't teach that as the right course of action. Instead the right teaching is that of sin and condemnation we have earned according to the law then you proceed to teach that God has offered a way out of sin and e condemnation of the law i.e grace.

Logicboy03: Goshen is right.....

Joshthefirst and Ubeedictus are preaching falsehoods....they are assuming that a non believer has no conscience or guilt about his sin......


That is false and we even have christians who lack remorse for sin....Hitler and pastor King come to mind

I don't have d time for a long arguement so pray tell me how will you preach grace to a sinner who has NO CONSCIOUSNESS OF SIN?

Goshen360: I thought you know better than what you wrote up there. That the gospel of grace is for only believers? I can't believe you said that. What gospel are you saved by? Law? Did you obey any ten commandments when you were a sinner to get saved? Gospel of grace saved us and we continue in it. It is BY GRACE YOU ARE SAVED THROUGH FAITH

Joshthefirst: but the preaching of the law in the gospel convicts the sinner of his sins, not so?

Sin which is the breaking of the law.
And repentance based on grace which is God not inputing the punishment of your sins on you since Jesus has died and resurrected?

I thought being saved had foremost evidence in repentance from sin?

amen 1tim 1,8 shows us the right way to use the law and ola got it right.

Alfa Seltzer: Exactly!
If you assert that you love god, you should be certain of what love means.

and he you were condemning people who love, them u should know what love is before you condemn it.

Goshen360: You cannot make remedy to sin consciousness by recommending ten commandments instead of recommending the righteousness of God in our new status in Christ.

When people know who they are in Christ, as God righteous people, they will live live from the righteous position not the sin revival message you preaching here. Please try sit down on your own and study the word, leave these men alone for once because, their teachings are always contradictory one to another.

I was alive, Paul said, without the law BUT WHEN THE COMMANDMENTS CAME, SIN REVIVED IN ME AND I DIE.

Christ is the cure to sin, not the ten commandments.

careful goshen, ola is right. Paul was very clear about the use of the ten commandment, it is a very good lesson for the sinner, the gospel of grace is for the believer not for the sinner who has no consciousness of sin.

Kay17, you seems to think that suffering is an evil in and of itself. I don't share the thought, probably the reason why i can believe in a loving God who allows suffering.

popes honorius and vigilius. If u are discussing papal infallibility be careful when those names appear.

chidima: @ ubenedictus, give us the answer to your question na.

@all, we hav to very careful what we read. Especially concerning the church. This is becos there are so many sites owned by sedecantists and we are there greatest enemies. Thats why you will see then calling all popes after vatican 2 heretics. So if answered ubenedictus question with any pope after vatican 2, then you have fallen into there trap.

As for our protestant brothers, we just have to tolerate then. Knowing fully well that the church extends salvation to them. Becos every truth they teach, comes from the catholic church. The diff between them and us is that we have the truth in its fullness while they don' t , but have only elements of the truth such as baptism. I tell my catchumens that our own judgement wil be more intense, becos God has given us all the graces we need never to miss heaven. That really should be our concern. You also have a duty to preach this truth which the church teaches to the protestant. Remember you can't teach sincerely if don't love.

That being said , i wish us all a happy sunday.

same 2 u. This is very good advice.

Msgamble: no such bk as dogma? Then u're a kid in catholicsm better ask ur priest,sisters or google what 'dogma' is..dogma is a set of principles laid down by d church authority,some catholic refers to it as (church-) traditions..when Pope visit brazil few mnth back gving sermon he only qoute Bible verses few tyms buh always pointin n qouting dogma as church stance against homo,abortion etc

your friend said there is a book called dodgma, i stand on my words, there is no sacred book in catholicism called dodgma. If you have the book please tell. It is only arrogance ore ignorance that will make you presume that i am a kid in catholicism.

frosbel: It is not mentioned in any of the other gospels or epistles, if it was such a huge event I am sure it would have been corroborated all over the new testament.

The general feel is that it is bogus.

so ur bible is bogus? Hehehe.

italo: I don fall your hand tay tay...sotay I use your hand sweep ground sef...

hehehe, oga afraid don begin catch me oh. Dis ur joke no get part 2. comedy business fit you.

idomalord: simple, when u join d catholic cult. And u have increased in the confusion they call knowledge

i am in the Catholic Church, and i have increase in grace and knowledge and yet there is no such book as 'dodgma'.

(6) categorizing sins as venial and mortal thereby making sins seem as if they have different punihment by God.

we didn't just categorise sins out of tin air, as per d teaching of the apostles sins has category. The apostle john taught. 'sin is sin, but there is a sin that lead not to death'. If you had read your bible well you would have found that passage.

italo: Sal C-omputer!



As you don answer the only question wey boys for fit answer...ehn make we siddon together dey look Ube face na...

lol, oga italo make an attempt, d pope condemned after death by an ecumenical council for ambiguity and indifference to heresy, d pope who was previously an heretic. No fall my hand oh.