₦airaland Forum

solite3:
if you have Jesus as your mediator in heaven why do you need another mediatrix?

actually I don't need any other, Truth is I can pray all alone, every day, but the Christianity Jesus Christ the mediator established, isn't just personal, it is also communal.

so even though I can pray alone , ( and I do that most often) I love and cherish praying in the company of other believers.

I know I can approach the throne of grace with Jesus the mediator standing for me... (it is good and I do it often), I also enjoy approaching the throne of grace with the mediator and members of his body....


it is not either/or, it is both/and.

doyinbaby:
all I know is the scales are fall of some Catholics.....you will see that some not bow to those images again..... people are getting enlightened as we keep hammering that it is a sin before God to bow to graven image

at the same time many Protestants are seeing that Protestantism isn't interpreting the Bible rightly and are becoming Catholics.

SalC:
Just seeing it

sure to stir some nest... seems the catechism will be revised.

Shelumiel:
What about the victims and their families who are seeking justice ? Do you know that the death penalty serves as a deterrent to so that those in society are not encouraged to do such? Please rethink on this

a good question is: are they really asking for justice or revenge? Justice for a criminal usually has 3 aims 1. punishment, 2. correction/rehabilitation 3. deterrence.


the death penalty is ofcource deterrence and punishment but it sadly does not offer hope for correction, it takes away from the criminal the opportunity to make reparations for his crimes.... we are not God we are mere men, we don't judge perfectly.... in fact sometimes the guilty go scot free and the innocent are framed and murdered by government approved death penalty.


We are not God we don't know every thing about any body or the mitigating circumstances, we are not qualified to be the deciders of other peoples life or death verdict.

a long prison term is deterrence, we don't need to kill people who we can't create.


let God have the death verdict.

bloodofthelamb:
Ubenedictus, pls consider this. The apostle in all their letters inspired by the Holy Ghost never made mentioned of any devotion to Mary.

Mary was just a vessel through which God used to accomplish his will. Mary role ended after she gave birth to Jesus.

Friend think about it.

my dear I am willing to consider these issues with you, to address your misconceptions and clarify ambiguities but sadly that is not the topic of THIS thread... I am most happy to discuss the role of Mary


but the issue before me today is about the use of the phrase mother of God which I have consistently held to be right and doctrinally correct.

It is this topic that we are discussing today and it is offensive to me whenever people attempt to divert the discussion we are having instead of creating a new thread.

Bloodofthelamb I ask you this, did Mary give birth to her God, her Lord, her creator, or not?

Has anyone here seen this


http://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2018/08/02/180802b.html

orisa37:
This Pope is a relevant Thoughter.

what is a thoughter?

Shelumiel:
Why should death penalty be abolished ? This does not make sense at all!

it should be abolished because it is against the dignity of the human person, it was allowed in extreme cases where the common good demanded it, in most places that condition no longer exists hence more humane ways are encouraged to punish a criminal

"Recourse to the death penalty on the part of legitimate authority, following a fair trial, was long considered an appropriate response to the gravity of certain crimes and an acceptable, albeit extreme, means of safeguarding the common good," the Vatican said.

"Today, however, there is an increasing awareness that the dignity of the person is not lost even after the commission of very serious crimes."

Prior to the change, the Church was not opposed to capital punishment "if this is the only possible way of effectively defending human lives against the unjust aggressor."

The change was enacted by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the Vatican department responsible for defending Catholic teaching, and is contained in the universal catechism, a summary of the Church’s teaching on sexual, social and moral issues.

But it could face trenchant opposition from some Catholics, particularly conservatives in the US, who support the death penalty.

The Vatican said it would “work with determination” to help bring about an end to capital punishment in every country in the world.

Pope Francis, who often visits prisoners in jail on his trips abroad, has long been opposed to the death penalty, even for the worst crimes.

Last year he said that human life "is always sacred in the eyes of the creator."

He acknowledged that in past centuries the Papal States had used the death penalty, saying that was a mistake.

He argued that executing criminals was “cruel, inhumane and degrading” and that there was always the risk of “judicial errors” leading to innocent people being killed.

The change in Catholic doctrine builds on pronouncements made by Pope John Paul II, who repeatedly called for the death penalty to be abolished.

He said it was not justifiable “even for someone who has done great evil”. His successor, Pope Benedict XVI, made similar appeals.

Pope Francis’s decision was welcomed by Amnesty International as an "important step forward."

doyinbaby:
when in the Bible is making graven image of Mary recommend,justified or commanded.......... catholic church keep leading millions to bow to graven image of Mary..... it is wrong and will always be wrong

here comes the usual Protestant unable to hold a simple discussion so has to jump from topic to topic.


You just can't stick to the topic of your thread

blueAgent:
I rather go to hell for my personal wrong idea than going to Hell becos i leased out my brain to some fake popes and fathers to do the thinking for me.

You Catholic members are sheepie.

yet thus far you are the person who seems to have leased your mind to anti Catholic bias

"Recourse to the death penalty on the part of legitimate authority, following a fair trial, was long considered an appropriate response to the gravity of certain crimes and an acceptable, albeit extreme, means of safeguarding the common good," the Vatican said.

"Today, however, there is an increasing awareness that the dignity of the person is not lost even after the commission of very serious crimes."

Prior to the change, the Church was not opposed to capital punishment "if this is the only possible way of effectively defending human lives against the unjust aggressor."

The change was enacted by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the Vatican department responsible for defending Catholic teaching, and is contained in the universal catechism, a summary of the Church’s teaching on sexual, social and moral issues.

But it could face trenchant opposition from some Catholics, particularly conservatives in the US, who support the death penalty.

The Vatican said it would “work with determination” to help bring about an end to capital punishment in every country in the world.

Pope Francis, who often visits prisoners in jail on his trips abroad, has long been opposed to the death penalty, even for the worst crimes.

Last year he said that human life "is always sacred in the eyes of the creator."

He acknowledged that in past centuries the Papal States had used the death penalty, saying that was a mistake.

He argued that executing criminals was “cruel, inhumane and degrading” and that there was always the risk of “judicial errors” leading to innocent people being killed.

The change in Catholic doctrine builds on pronouncements made by Pope John Paul II, who repeatedly called for the death penalty to be abolished.

He said it was not justifiable “even for someone who has done great evil”. His successor, Pope Benedict XVI, made similar appeals.

Pope Francis’s decision was welcomed by Amnesty International as an "important step forward."

MuttleyLaff:
[img]https://s1/images/MuttAmin.gif[/img]

None of them on the issue are kids

Are you minding blueAgent splitting hairs
He just wanted to take a jab at Catholics

PS: Ubenedictus, its MuttleyLaff by the way and not Mutteylaff, there are two ls and not one l, in the moniker

taking a jab at Catholics can be a good past time but at least one shouldn't do it until after fully considering the issue.

Your username is pretty confusing, I'll try and correct myself

blueAgent:
Why not you and your Church stick to calling Mary mother of Jesus alone, if that is even relevant?

that is pretty simple, we call her mother of Jesus because that is who she is, we also call her mother of our savior because that is who she is, we call her mother of our Lord and God because that is who she is but we actually particularly use the later title because it is an implicit declaration that we believe in the divinity of Jesus, it means clearly that I believe Jesus is God.



Lastly you ask about the relevance, I suggest you Read up on the nestorian heresy AKA Nestorianism, that particular phrase means the church believes in the hypostatic union, the true identity of Jesus.... Those who deny is are the nestorians who divide the nature of Christ.

frbona:
Fact: mary is mother of God the son
Not God the father.
Enough with the word play

it is still the same thing, mother of God the son, mother of God incarnate, mother of God.


Nobody called her mother of God the father that is heresy, God the father wasn't incarnate.



The least you can do is check out the meaning of the term before you begin your criticism.

blueAgent:
The fact is there is no biblical prove to support your argument that Mary should be called mother of God, why not maintain the accepted mother of Jesus.
Your Church is known for Blasphemy go and lookup sites that talks about your Church Satanic and pagan roots.

why not stick to one argument at a time.


I know you don't like the Catholic church and whatever she teaches but don't use your bias to judge every topic.


Jesus is God, whoever gave birth to him gave birth to God in human flesh. she is the mother of God Incarnate.


Mary is a mere creature, created by Jesus yet he chose her to give birth to him.


mary gave birth to her creator, her savior, her lord and her God, yes she did....she is the mother of God.


if you don't like Catholics saying it then maybe you can discuss it with a non Catholic like mutteylaff, but whether you agree or not it is true to deny this is to DENY that Jesus is God.

MosesAlex:
It is quite interesting that in the picture shared there is a picture of the crucifix.

Why not find out what the Church teaches about the communion of saints. If one of your revered pastor comes around, many would turn up to see him/her hoping for some miracle. But when it comes to the mother of Jesus, you forget that the prayer of a righteous man availeth much( James 5:16)
Holy Mary, Mother of God pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen

Now about the dead rising--have you not read in the Book of Moses, in the account of the burning bush, how God said to him, 'I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'?He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. You are badly mistaken!"(Mark 12:26-27)

I thought I will see a cross with Mary I should have known it is normal protestant propaganda.

bloodofthelamb:
It is well with the souls in Catholic(Marian) Church being led astray.

They pray to Mary but use Jesus to save face.

nope, Catholics always pray to God through Jesus Christ our mediator we just enjoy doing it in company of other Christians.

Baroba:
Okwa ezigbo shut up, this clown used to disturb my sleep with his stupid adoration crusade when I was in Trans Ekulu Enugh; am an old school Catholic, I don't believe in Ndi Father who are Pentecostal wannabe preachers..

The man keeps spitting rubbish, am sure he still not happy Buhari hasn't paid him for did campaign work he did for him.. vision my asss.

what money will buhari give mbaka, u claimed to live in Enugu so you should know mbaka isn't poor, he is probably the richest priest in that axis, not to talk of the fact he has consistently improved the lives of people from that area..


buhari can't pay him, Jonathan messed up and deserved the bad prophecy he got, buhari messed up and is getting the same bad prophecy.

seguno2:
Rebuild Nigeria the way that he rebuilt the biggest economy into recession?
Olorun maje. God forbid.
Do you know what you are talking about
Buhari is a monumental error of gargantuan proportions that must be corrected in 2019!

the economy was falling into recession from the last years of gej.

Windflower:
Been wondering the same thing too o, there was this day I followed a friend to a Catholic church, they were doing adoration.
The pastor started speaking in tongues and people were falling, everyone closed their eyes, na so me open my eye dey watch pastor perform miracle. He took notice and laid his eyes on me turned me round for more than ten times,I no gree fall. I just had to pretend , cos I was feeling dizzy from the turning.

are you sure this happened in a Catholic Church?

Homeboiy:
They are not supposed to be paid


Igbasa ozi oma bu na efu

even the Bible says a labourer deserve his wages. they receive their stipend, they get paid. some years ago the diocesan priest received about 30k from his parish, I'm not sure what they receive now.


the parish is responsible for their welfare, the religious priests, monk priests etc are the guys who actually don't get paid.

360degreess:
.Woe to u priest!!! only God knows the magnitude of the atrosity that u have committed b4 getting 2 that position..ritualisms,419,adultery,impregnenting young girls,illegal tithe collections etc.are common in the christian world..several pastors have "prophecised" the death of Buhari severally,but some of them have died disgracefully(e.g CAN leader in taraba state) recently..Buhari is God sent,no one can change that...God bless nigeria.

I hope you read what the priest said and didn't just jump to conclusion after reading the thread title.

Nedfed:
I was invited to a Catholic church some weeks back and I noticed/observed only some set of people are allowed to part take of the holy communion, while last week I was in another church were almost everyone took part in this same communion just that they only make an altar call for the sinners before the communion.

Please what does the bible say about this?
I need an explanation, tnx.

communion is for baptised, still believing Catholics who are in grace

the biblical guideline for who comes for communion is

1 cor 11


28Each one must examine himself before he eats
of the bread and drinks of the cup. 29 For anyone
who eats and drinks without recognizing the body
eats and drinks judgment on himself. 30 That is why
many among you are weak and sick, and a number of
you have fallen asleep.…
B

brocab:
When we see this below: it must make us wonder if Rome is Christian?
http://romancatholicbeliefs.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/satanic-pope-hexagram.jpg

that is usually called the star of David, it is not occult and has been used as part of Christian symbols for long.

it is not occult


http://www.catholicforum.com/forums/showthread.php?45605-The-Pope-can-wear-a-Star-of-David-too!

somehow:
Why did he give him a smaller seat and even sat him further away from him?

ooni is a distant relation, oba of Benin is an immediate relation+overlord.

lacum:
Brothers and Sisters I just discovered a new site like Nairaland today and I think we should also go there and counter a thread on the origin of the Jesuits. Salc and our brothers please don't ignore.

where the site

Themandator:
Purgatory kwa.... this doctrine made many Catholics to commit atrocities on behalf of the church during the inquisition era. The pope promised them that should they side with the church that when they die they would go straight to heaven without the need to temporal holding bay called purgatory.


The money made from that exercise was actually used to build the new Vatican, as we know it today

they should side with the Church? I don't get it

spongeisback:
So all catholic parishes don't have same rules? If collecting dues in such cases wasn't a standard I am sure the parishioners would've written to Rome because they're good at that.

P.S visiting a place doesn't mean you actually know the ins and outs.

this is not standard Catholic Church rules, you probably will never see it outside Nigeria and if it is true you will not see it in every Nigerian parish.



I have seen priest admonish that people should be careful of debt of any kind and family members should be happy to clear such but I have never seen anyone make such funny rules. my guess it that the rule was made by the choir.... for instance in my Church, the family burying or wedding must give the choir a stipend, if the family member is a chorister the stipend is waved...my guess is that the choir made a rule that the stipend will not be waved for choristers who didn't pay their dues which means the choir will not be there if the stipend isn't given.


the priest will perform the funeral without the choir, it is a weird rule that should be amended but it is simply a local choir thing not a Catholic thing.


my grand dad died of a long illness, he couldn't come to Church, the priest had to come to our house every week to conduct his own communion service for him, counsel him and hear confession and sometimes just keep him company, by the time he died he was owing years of CMO dues, but nobody asked us for it, the priest was extremely cordial, we buried him with the full Catholic community in attendance and simply settled the choir and other functionaries like the mass servers as is customary.


again all these are local Church rules and I believe it was the choir who established the weird rule

good evening all

solite3:
yes even if a Christian is not fruitful in good works he will be still be saved but he would have no reward.
Like the story of the prodigal son although he lost his reward as a son but he was still accepted.
Example of a born again who went to heaven without reward was the theif on the cross although he was fruitless in good works but he was saved.


the unprofitable servant was an unsaved man.

the prodigal son and the good thief repented and were forgiven and accepted, 1st John says if were confess he will forgive and clean us of unrighteousness. nor was the good thief fruitless in good works, he defended the cause of an innocent man and stopped his mockers.


no sir, the unprofitable servant is not an unsaved man, the unprofitable servant is one who refused to work with the grace he had received.

Matthew 25:26


His master replied, ‘You wicked, lazy servant!
So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown
and gather where I have not scattered seed?
Well then, you should have put my money on
deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I
would have received it back with interest.
“‘So take the bag of gold from him and give it
to the one who has ten bags. For whoever has
will be given more, and they will have an
abundance. Whoever does not have, even what
they have will be taken from them. And throw
that worthless servant outside, into the darkness,
where there will be weeping and gnashing of
teeth.’


even the goats according to Jesus are those who refused to work.

“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart
from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire
prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was
hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was
thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I
was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I
needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was
sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’



you will be judged based on works, the Bible is clear.


Romans 2:6-8 New American Bible (Revised
Edition) (NABRE)
who will repay everyone according to his works:
eternal life to those who seek glory, honor,
and immortality through perseverance in good
works, but wrath and fury to those who selfishly
disobey the truth and obey wickedness.

solite3:
a branch that abides in Christian cannot barren.
the fruit that is produce is from the vine not the branch mind you.
a man who is born again is a new creature that is the fruit.


mathew25:30 that unprofitable servants is not born again so i don't know what you are even saying.

you said even if the believer be unfruitful he will make heaven,

Jesus say,

And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer
darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of
teeth.