₦airaland Forum

patriot4: Not true.

http://www.nigerdeltacongress.com/narticles/nigerian-us%20military%20pact,%20fine%20prints.htm

agaugust psated this verey link.

nigeria is fast becoming a western puppet.

Henry120: @patriot, I agree with you 100%, the south africans placed their hope on france, and the french betrayed them. You do not go into a country which is at war, to protect your holdings, with just 400 under equipped men. That for me was the first military failure. They should have gone into CAR with nothing less than a fully mechanised battalion of troops, with at the very least, 2 attack helicopters to provide air cover.

The south africans have major minning holdings in CAR, and france wasn't going to let that happen. The french had APV's, ILV's, with 50 cals, more than enough to send the rebels running into their mothers wombs, but they tactfully, avoided any sort of intervention. Instead the french went to the airports.


I believe the french wanted bozeze toppled. The new man in charge of CAR has revoked all contracts the south africans had signed with bozize, the deposed president. He has invited the europeans, and in particular the french, to come in and take over the minning contracts.

This is both a military and economic loss for south africa. I still maintain that the mission was bound for failure, as soon as south africa only deployed 400 lightly armed troops.

Has I have said before. France never gave up on it's holdings in Africa.

patriot4: OK I believe you.
But here is my suggestion, in this type of operation always make sure you have enough men to fight alone. Always make sure you have sufficient logistics. You were betrayed, that's a fact. Chad and France probably have something to do with it. France should have joined your men in battle but didn't. On the other hand, 13 hours is enough to bring in air support and to fly in more men from South Africa. So some people are not doing theirs jobs well. Unless of course you lost communication.

The problem air support is range. Has in it is to far. Though the DRC will let use the air basses the problem there nothing there. Meaning it not kust taking off and flying to the resscue. We needed to set up a air base closer to the battel.

agaugust: You too can spend your time to do the comparison and post for us all to see, or there's no Google in south africa ?

The exercise would also help us to judge your intelligence and fairness.

Problem is we don't know what they will be armend with since they not built yet. I would not bother comparing them with the chinnes version.

patriot4: The rebels look more like mercenaries to me. They certainly know how to handle military strategy.
I do not think they lost 500 people to the South africans, and I do think the South african were 400, it is possible that the rebels who attacked SANDF were between 800 and 1200. They defeated the South africans mostly by strategy and infiltration of the area. They probably also used the armed children as human shields.
SANDF is new to this kind of war. I suggest more cooperation between SANDF and NA.
I no longer think the SANDF pulled the white flag, I think it was a mutual agreement between the SA soldiers and the rebels to stop the fight. Also I think the South africans might have been significantly desarmed by the rebels at the end of the agreement in order for them not to pose a threat to the new president of CAR.

The report released is the most factual and up to date report.

Total number of SANDF troops was 260 with 200 flown in during the battel. This is not the first time we seen child solders but it is the first time we have been attacked by them. Remember many of those parabats would be farthers so shooting a child then hearing said child cry for there mothers is not a easy thing to go through.



It is not hard for them to get up to 500 kills in that type of battel. The SANDF where on the deffense and the rebels where trying to over run them. A one 81mm motar and kill mor than 10 people if they group togerther.


Has for rebel wounded. I posted a source dealling with the fact the hospitils are over flowing with rebel wounded. Since even the Rebels Say the heavest fight was with the SANDF it is resonbil to assume the SANDF killed a lot of them.


The SANDF where not dissarmend. Though they where out of ammo at that time for all there support level wepaons. And there vechiels damged and destroyed by gun fire.

Henry120: So you know admit that, SANDF got dealt with in CAR.

I don't think, I'd keep it with SA. Nigeria would surely come out strong this year. As you can see from our procurements, we mean business.

The only problem is that nigeria and RSA do not conduct joint military operations, so their is no way to test our capabilities.

Though there is no gaurinty that people would not have died there loss would have been lower if they had certain things. Example a AIR assert. Even a unarmend Dron could have been of use. Twice the SANDF sent out a patrol to see what was happing and twice they came under attack and took wounded. Thing is there are a number of drone projects but has of now only the seek is being used for anti poaching ops. Thae artielry do have there own small drone to observe shellings and provid targeting but I don't know about it's statuse since I am not in the army. All I know is that it doese not need a runway and is operate by the army not air force.

With the replacment of the Eland for the rooikat we lost somthing we never knew we had. The abliety to deploy proper armour with a C130. 2 could fit in a C130(though only one if you want to fly to CAR unless you land half way for fuel) and they had 90mm guns. Though the mamba/casspir replament will have a 25mm auto canon.

With only a limted number of C130s we struggel to provide enough air lift for all it's forghin ops. We where ment to get A400M and denel actualy still makes componts for it but delays and politics ment a aircraft that we where suppossed to have in 2011 is not here. Though we did just recover the money from it meaning we can buy somthing else. The yanks are advertissing the C17 and 3 pluse a few more C130s and a cargo version of the suacepan MPa will give use all the lift we need.

We all so lost many thing in the 1990s that we should get back. We operate a Awac. Has in a 747 with a giant Radar. But it was removed with out a replasment. We bought A109s but they not really a milltary helicopter and struggel in the heat of Africa.

Basical what I am saying is that the SANDF has it's faults and there is a plan to address them in the new defense review(that gives us a bigger budget) and since nothing swings votes more than body bags we may get what we need. But don't assumm we lost we never won in CAR but we never lost either. Tough I suspect if we had a full para battlion there we would have won or the battel would still be going on at least. You can deffend a town with 265 men. It just not possibli.


So does SAN. Biro(OPV/corvets and IPVs) and sucepan(MPA/light transport) where both made priorty projects. Along with the refurbished strike craft we would have 14 war ships 3 subs and 4 to 6 IPVs that will have 35mm guns. More than a lot of OPVs


The cost doese not warrent it.

Just to point out that the addstional 10 OPVs is only in the plaing stage, same as SAN LHD is in a planing stage.

All so it indergates they will be bought has OPVs not corvets or frigats. Though this may be a ploy has many countries say the buying OPVs whe actually it a corvet. Either way most of the orders seem to focus on lirol or brown water operastions. This is somthing SAN dose not have a need for. The Biro ships are rather large because SA has lots of deep water and rough seas to cover. And a masive coast line. This forcess SAN to have a strong navy. All so has SADCs only naval force it now has a area of resbielty from Angola to Tanzania with agrement between our goverment.

A not oven mentioned is the warrio clss Strike craft of SAN. Current plans are to put all 4 (there was just 2 and a half) back at 100% servise level. The first 3 have/are being upgraded.

Though small they pack a punch. Armend with a 76mm two 20mm and two 12,7mm along with space for 6 anti ship missiels(non are loaded since there is no need to intergrate the exocet with them and the skerpion are out of producstion.) The aft 76mm has been removed for space for SF/Marines and there small boats. Though a 35mm could be add since it does not penortriaght the deck. The big problem with them is range but they make up with it for out right speed and fire power.

All though they did not get in to fights the stike craft conducted a lot of covert missions in Angola. Useing there small size to affoad been seen. They where used to depoy and recover SF units. A role they still great at.


All from boat israel though up in the 1960s.

[url][/url]

Henry120: Nigerian navy public acquisition of ships deals made in 2012


* 4 Pipavav OPVs(patterned on the Russian Tigr light frigates)

* 2 Chinese stealth OPVs/ light frigates

* three OPVs/OPCs coming through NIMASA( coast guard)

* Request put in for a used USCG 3,250 ton Hamilton-class frigate.

The nigerian navy and coast guard would be getting 10 ships in total. With these acquisitions the navy would be the undisputed champion of african seas.

We already have africa's largest haul of small and medium crafts.




http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-27286/

The contract is worth 11.92 billion rupees (US$213 million) and includes options for another two vessels, which can be exercised within 24 months. In this case the contract value may go up to 25.04 billion rupees (US$448 million).

Both vessels will be delivered in 32 months including option vessels, if exercised, Pipavav announced on August 6. Nigeria may be the source of the order as Strategic Defence Intelligence in February this year reported that Nigeria was undertaking an offshore patrol vessels contract for two vessels, to be finalised in the third quarter of this year. It is assumed that the two OPVs are in addition to the two 1 800 ton OPVs ordered by the Nigerian Navy from China Shipbuilding and Offshore International Limited on April 18 this year.

I am still keeping it at SAN. With project biro our fleet will returen to to its old abilety.


And it not all about numbers. The valour class are with out qustion the best warship in africa


If our defense rieviw gets sighend in SA will buy 2 more valour clalls frigats and 1 to 2 LHDs.


Thanks to CAR the chance is high that it will be aproved

sheyie2007: a quote "the local content of the OPV Project would almost certainly be executed at the 10,000 ton docking facility of the partially-privatised Naval Dockyard, Lagos.

Be that as it may, the ultramodern Franco-Nigerian West Atlantic Shipyard in Port Harcourt can handle the construction of 105m 7,000 ton vessels while the similarly ultramodern Swiss-Nigerian Continental Shipyard in Lagos can handle the construction of 122m 6,000 ton vessels."... andrewza are you happy now?

Yes. Thank you

agaugust: i am no dummy, i think and you know i think. i never said one missile will sink a carrier. type 056 can launch rapidly 4 anti ship missiles and 6 torpedoes on one target.

one excocet missile sank a whole british destroyer HMS sheffield in falklands war, a destroyer is bigger than a frigate.

i think before i talk, even though i am not perfect, i am human. only God is perfect.


ECM/ECW weapons valour vs type 056 cannot be determined by us, only real war can determine the winner. type 056 carries the bst chinese technology as the ship just entered service last year 2012 and is designed to counter the best and most modern american navy warship and submarine threat to china in the south sea of china and taiwan.

the chinese put all their best into the type 056 and it is replacing all chinese frigates.

nigeria is buying two for its navy, so your south african navy is going to face a very very modern nigeria navy stealth warship, NOT NNS Aradu and NNS Thunder.

nigerian navy will be a more powerful force in africa when those new stealth warships arrive

it will also be the most balanced naval force in africa with combination of world class 300 vessels massive and modern brown water force that egypt, algeria, south africa CANNOT match in any way. nigerian navy has the the largest and most modern brown water navy in the world, even america CANNOT beat us in that aspect.

i have googled USA, Russia, China, and all major brown water navy forces in the world, NONE can challenge nigerian navy.

nigerian coastline is only 850km, so the two new 95m stealths paid for and under construction, and the two planned 110m stealth frigates will be enough with our six new 38m stealth fast strike crafts (four on order, but two delivered NNS ZARIA and NNS BURUTU) combined with out israeli sea drones USV that no other country has in the whole of Africa, then nigerian navy is a MAJOR threat to every other african country including Egypt, Algeria, and South Africa.




.

The brits destroys from that eara are actualy smaller than our frigats. Longer yes but smaller. I know beacuse the have visted us more than a few times.

America is not the best with ECM/EW(though it is not bad). They do have one of the best radars though but even then the dutch 3D radar is better in my eyes.

Chinas plan for the war(if it happens) is to blind the US navies radar so they can hit them with antie ship missiels. SAN operorats with out there radar(why be stealth if you just going to give away your postion) for much of there fights at sea and uses other means to find there targets. So the ECM/EW may be set up diffrent wrong to fight SAN.


Has I said before the biro ships will keep the ballance of power in our hands.



SAN has no need for a larg fleet of small gun boats. The envioroment will mean they would not be of much use. Even our current small boats have no real job other than routine patrols and war games. Though the xena make great boats to operate in flood ares. With no prop they can go any where there hull can and they can go in some prety shallow waters. Combinded with a large passenger sectsion for it's size, it a great river boat and humaterian boat. It can all so go over 30knts and be armend with MGs. Though I still preffer the barricuda. It a speed boat built to be beached and deploy SF teams. But it can carry a 20mm cannon and LMGs and has insane speeds. Though right now the main SF styl boat used is there RIB filled with ballsict foam not air(so it will not go flat with gun fire) used by SF and MRS in sea boarding. It the same boat the USN seals and marine force recon use.


I have all ways said I liked nigerias gun boats.


NN was foolish to buy 2. You should have at least 3. Resoane. All milltary hardware but ships and aircraft spesficly have a 1 out 3 operationl level. What this means is

1 operting/1 in reserve, light maintance, prepering to becom opertsniol/1 in a major maintiance priode or refit.

With 4 frigats SAN barly manges to keep 1 on anti piracy and one ready for local needs and one on stand by(normally busy with light maintaince)

With only 2 OPV/corvets/FFL if one hits a problem(has in somthing breaks) NN could have no OPV/corvets/FFL

agaugust: you speak english ? or only dutch/afrikaans ? i gave you a whole internet wikipedia definition details that says corvettes and frigates are names used interchangeably depending of the role and weapons on the ship, not only a matter of hull size, and that certain class of corvettes are also called light frigates.

NNS thunder is no frigate despite its size 115m

TYPE 056 is light frigate based on its anti-ship/submarine/aircraft ability,and on board helicopter despite its size 95m

the type 056 weapons and ECM are about equal to the valour frigate, gun size, missiles, and all. only real war can prove a winner between them.

a valour frigate is in great danger facing a type 056 light frigate, the type 056 missiles can sink an aircraft carrier, but NN thunder is no threat.

updaate your knwoledge and dont confuse other people here :

"
Corvettes are fast (around 25 knots or better), well-armed ships that displace between 700 and 2000 tons. A corvette is generally not intended for extended ocean-going operations, and is best suited for regional operations. Corvettes are generally the smallest platforms capable of accommodating the sensors, weapons, and combat systems needed to operate in a medium threat environment. Corvettes are sometimes referred to as light frigates (FFLs). It can be assumed that the hull design for a corvette and that of an offshore patrol vessel are very similar. The differences will be in propulsion and outfitting. Corvettes will have higher speed and therefore less endurance and range than OPV, much greater armament, and less space for provisions and habitability."

weblink source :

http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakistan-navy/33514-what-difference-between-frigate-destroyer.html#ixzz2PBcDaiDd

I doubt the ECM/ECW are the same has a valour

Lol sink a aircraft carrier. Yes if you hit the thing enough times. There is only one way to sink a aircraft carrie with one shot. And that is a nuke. Hence there are nukelare torpedos, mines and anti ship missiles.

agaugust: 1990 is not old for a war ship? why did south africa buy 2005 valour frigates then?

year 2005 submarine hiding under the wide ocean targeting a year 1990 warship exposed on the ocean surface, ask your little son in elementary school to predict the winner. i have made my point. case closed.

The same resone that if you have the cash you buy a new car.

The year dose not matter. There are only 2 typs of ships. Submarins and targets.

agaugust: thanks i have removed my post of his photo and 'data' and i also apologized.

i think @andrewza pushed @patriot4 to the wall with his thinking or lack of thinking, such that the guy wanted to sniff out who he really was. i will be honest with you all, since the day i was born, i have NEVER met any human being that thinks like @andrewza, his comments many times shows he does not think or he does not want to think.

it may be a medical issue, i guess, so i stopped insulting him even when he provokes me. he has Dyslexia, but he didnt tell us early enough. he also didnt tell us he is white until last week.

i have decided to be tolerant of him because of the medical disclosure. maybe it affects his thinking once in a while because he just writes posts/comments that can drive people nuts. very annoying comments.

imagine his comment on nigerian navy new type 056 light frigate, even when i posted web sources that it is technically a light frigate based on weaponry,functions,and manufacturer' specifications, and with english dictionary definitions of warships types, he still said its a orvette not light frigate. very annoying.

same way he said south african navy can challenge USA navy with valour class frigates that the americans will sink in one hour.

the south african GV6 gun has manufacturer tested maximum range of 73km, he claimed it is 100km, crazy like a ballistic missile ! he said his source is guinness books of record and he couldnt quote it to prove and is still adamant on it.

@andrewza can be very annoying, and he gets worse by the day, almost becoming like @snydergp

his strange ways made the france guy sniff him out on facebook.

The link you gave me called it a corvet.


I never said sink the entire USN. I said the vallour class is better than the US equvlent. It is. The lCS are very power in war ship to warship fights, even the USN says this. NNS thunder(the US donated one) would give a LCS one hell of a fight. The perry class is now in it's last stage of live. I nver siad it was the best frigat in the world(the germains have that) nor the best stealth war ship(that either sweeden or finland) but it is better than the nearst US equvlent. The only ships USN have that are better are destroyers that cost at least doubil the amount.


That is the operastional rang. Has in the range it fires at during war. It did how ever fire a expermeental round 100km during a IDEX. Stting a world record. The round was built for range.



I fail to see how race had any thing to do with any thing.

agaugust:

the south african navy submarine was used to target 5 old outdated NATO warships and only 1 modern frigate



HOLLAND's naval ship is a 2005 technology stealth ship and is the only modern ship in the whole 6 ship NATO task force

the 5 other NATO navy ships are much older technology and close to their retirement age, they are :

USA navy ship is 1988 technology and now retired from a service
CANADA's navy ship is 1990 technology
PROTUGAL SICK BABY OF EUROPE's navy ship is 1991 technology
DENMARK navy's ships is 1981 technology and now retired from service
GERMANY's naval ship is an ordinary fuel storage tanker ship with 1977 technology

the SOUTH AFRICAN navy submarine is 2006 technology used against 5 outdated old warships with inferior technology


the NATO navies had better warships but did not bring them to south africa. also, no british, french, german or italian navy warship was present in the NATO force, and these are the 4 most powerful NATO countries in europe.

British navy stealth destroyer warship HMS Daring and US navy Arleigh Burke stealth destroyer warship have both been fully operational since 2006, a year before the so called defeat of NATO warships and they did not come to south africa then for the NATO war game.

nigerian navy too can use our 2009 stealth eagle class fast attack vessel NNS ZARIA to missile target lock the same american 1988 warship because it cannot see the nigeria stealth vessel built with the worlds best stealth technology in austarlia the world stealth masters, then we come to nairaland and boast that nigeria navy defeated american warship !

EGYPT HAS PAID FOR 2 OF THE SAME SOUTH AFRICAN TYPE 209 SUBMARINE

On 31 August 2012, the Egyptian navy commander General/ Osama Ahmed stated that a contract has been signed with the German side to build two type 209 submarines for the Egyptian navy including the latest technology this type has reached.

ALGERIA HAS PAID FOR 2 OF THE SAME SOUTH AFRICAN VALOUR CLASS STEALTH FRIGATES

NIGERIA HAS PAID FOR 2 TYPE 056 LIGHT FRIGATE STEALTH WARSHIPS WITH YEAR 2013 LATEST TECHNOLOGY

these 3 african navies are strongly contesting power for the sea with south african navy, and we cannot know who will win the sea war until the navies clash for real war, not just posting photos on nairaland.

stop deceiving yourselves in south africa, your military can be beaten and r.oasted as we just saw now in CAR by local illiterate rebels.


weblink source : google internet wikipedia of all the ships named in this post, and their full details will be confirmed
.

1990 is not old for a ship. Most of the USN is that old or older. The point made is, that fleet has more ASW caperbielties than the entire nigerian navy. That is a fact.




Algeria is not just buying a valour frigat, they buy the exact same ships with SA providing a lot of there sytems.


Sa has put a request for quotsion
For up to 6 corvets sized ships and a simlar number IPV, the ship will all be build in SA. KND is overing the Gowind class has a opstion though we may go with somthing along the meko 100A line to. All that's known, that later this year we will have a order for a larger number of new ships.


All so SA is in the proccsess of upgrading it's strike crafts. The plan is to upgade all 4 including the 2 decomoissiond ones. The upgarde will not change the wepaons or engiiens (a 76mm is really has big has you can go on somthing that small and it max speed is to fast for the hull and has to be limted) it will how ever have the aft 76mm removed and replaced with boat launches fof SF boats and have increased accomdastion. The missel deck is still empty has there is no need for them in it's current role.

Henry120: This is the hilux( pick up truck) used for counter-terrorism operations up-armoured by proforce. The picture quality might not be very good, however una go manage am like that


The second photo, same purpose as the first.

the top one reminds me of the ones cops use in SA has sort of a prisoner van the bottom one reminds me of the G wagon actually i thing the bottom is a merc.

agaugust: @andrewza exposed via facebook.


P O S T E D C O N T E N T R E M O V E D by @agaugust for privacy reasons.

@andrewza i apologize to you for this post, i have deleted your photo and 'data'

I still have a facebook page.

patriot4: Can someone end this topic please ?
I am starting to have pitty for the South africans.
At the begginning I just couldn't take the level of ignorance they were using to mock us, now I just feel sad for them.
Please moderator, end this topic.

I have posted the end all source, the fact you want to still refuseb the truth I have given you is the only thing that is "SAD".

Henry120: Nigeria has a new wheeled armoured personnel carrier/ operational support vehicle. PROFORCE1

PROFORCE LIMITED’s Pf1 is a wheeled Tactical Armoured Personnel Carrier (APC) capable of traveling across rough terrain and fording water or any other form of obstacles up to 800mm depth.
The vehicle has excellent battlefield or civil deployment mobility and is extremely versatile. The Pf1 has been specially designed and manufactured by PROFORCE (Defence) LIMITED. The Pf1 has the seating capacity of ten (10) personnel including driver and commander.

THE BALLISTICS
Transparent & opaque ballistic materials that are installed on all of the makes and models of Proforce Limited’s Armored Personnel Carriers-APCs are routinely and carefully being tested in-house as well as by certified independent test laboratories.

VARIANTSCHARACTERISTICS TECHNICAL SPECIFICATION
- Police–Pf1
- Armoured Personnel Carrier-Pf1
- Combat Surveillance–Pf1
- Missile Weapon Carrier-Pf1
- Command & Control Vehicle-Pf1
- Ambulance-Pf1Fording: 800mm
Slide Slope: 40%
Gradient: 60%
Obstacle: 500mm
Trench: 750mmMTU 4R 106 Td21 Diesel Turbocharged – Intercooled( Euro 3) Welded Ballistic Steel Armour Complied to STANAG 4569 Level 1 Controls and Instruments
DIMENSION & WEIGHTPf1 – MILITARYPf1 – POLICE
Length (mm)51005474
Width (mm)24902600
Height (mm)25002460
Ground Clearance (mm)367374
Wheelbase (mm)29002900
Approach Angle (deg)4529.2
Departure Angle (deg)5037.2
Kerb Weight (kg)78507850
Combat Weight (kg)1000010000
Payload (kg)20002000
PERFORMANCE CHARACTERISTICS ENGINE
Max. forward speed (km/h): 110
Max. reverse speed (km/h): 15
Min. crawl speed (km/h): 4
Cruising speed (km/h): 90
Cruising range (km/h): 500
Cruising long range tank (km/h): 800
Acceleration 0 to 80 (secs): 26
Turning circle (wall to wall): 14.5
Power to weight ratio: 21.5Type: MTU 4R 106 Td21, 4cy. In-line. Diesel Turbocharged-Intercooled (Euro 3)
Displacement (cc): 4800
Gross power (kW/rpm):160(218hp)/2200
Peak Torque (Nm/rpm): 750/1500
TRANSMISSION, DRIVE LINE & SUSPENSION

Transmission: Allison 2000 series, 4th generation automatic, 5 speed auto with lock-up
Transfer case: ZF VG 750, 2 speed with lock-upfitted
Axles: Axles 3000 series planetary axles
Types: XZL Michelin 365/80 R20 fitted with Hutchinson VFI run flat insert(CTIS system-optional
Wheel/Rims: 11x 20, aluminium split rim
Suspension: Hydro-pneumatic multi-link, spring element; hydro-pneumatic studs, axles control: 3 longitudinal links with panhard rod
Brakes: Air operated spring disc with ABS
Parking brake: Pneumatic control on wheels of 2nd axles
Steering: ZF 8095, hydraulic assisted integral re-circulation ball with variable ratio steering gear box
FEATURES

Electrical system: 24 V(2 X 12V)
Air conditioning system: 6 kW cooling capacity, spot cooling
Armament – main: 7.62mm GPMG (Pintle Mount), 2 banks of 3 x 76mm Grenade Launcher
Armour protection-(Kinetic-all round): STANAG 4569 Level 2 (Level 4-optional), STANAG 4569 Level 1(Level 2 & 4- optional)
Land mine: STANAG 4569 Level 2b (Level 3a- optional)
Winch: 4,000kg (9,000lb) electric type & portable
CCTV system: Heavy duty outdoor for all round observation
PA system: Siren PA with speaker
Searchlights: Fitted at front & rear of the vehicle
OPTIONAL EQUIPMENT

Radio communication system: I x VHF, I x HF with intercom 4 crew, I x HF with intercom 2 crew
Wheel mounting/dismounting: For run flat tyre system
Armament – main: 7.62mm GPMG (Pintle Mount), 2 banks of 3 x 76mm Grenade Launcher
BC system: Overpressure system

though there is nothing wrong with it, if i was desghing it i would make a few changes, based on SA experiance with these types of small wheeled APCs.

1 larger windows or go like SA new APC,s and IFV and have cammras all round with internal mointors. this is for all round visbielty.

roof hatches in the passger compartment and fireports. allows you to have a infantry sectsion fire while moving.

agaugust:
i thought south africans say AK-47 rifle is outdated, why did they die when child soldiers fired AK-47 bullets on south african army in CAR ?

.

A sword made in the 1100 will still kill you. Do you want to give all your solders swords.



There is nothing wrong with the AK47 diesghin. The problem is there are far better optstions. The Nigerian police in somlia show what I mean. They have AKs but you can clearly see it is not the 47. If you switched over to the AK101 has your main wepaon for exampil you would only need 1 max 2 days to retrain some one.

Henry120: Inasmuch as I do not subscribe to my compatriot @patriot4 invading your privacy as he has done, the post above shows that we(nigerians) have been right all along. As your country man in the attachment posted by @patriot4 alludes to all of what we have said, and continue to say on this thread.

SANDF personnel were roundly defeated by SELEKA rebels in CAR and your troops ran away in apparent clear show of cowardice.

Your EGO, andrewza would not allow you accept the true fact that you were defeated in CAR. If this is how your fellow service men in SANDF think, I'm sorry to say, you'd get defeated again, and again in CAR. You should be humble, take the defeat like a man.

You know I stoped posting on this thread, because I was waiting for the report I posted. I knew it was comming and that it is the final proof. The fact that I disagreed with a rascit aparthied loyalist has nothing to do with that fact. That man hates all black and thinks you not even human and yet you want to go and use him.

patriot4: OK, I guess it is a problem of funding.
Please tell me, why does SA keep protecting dictators ?

ANC is loyal to thos who helped them during the struggel. It not SA it is the ANC. We in the SANDF have to follow legal orders no matter.

Same resoane other countries(america, china, france extra) we have control of somthing.

patriot4: Why are your boys not in mali ?

We where never asked. Ecomog dose not SA since the SAS drakensberg insodent.

Money. With out montary support SA will not deploy a force so far from her borders unless it was only a small force. And what the point of sending a few hundred in to mali.

Not our problem really. If the securty in Mali get bade both Nigeria and Chad will suffer. Hence those to sent a large force. How ever SA has only limted inrtisted in mali(we funded some museum) and has no extrimist islamic force.

Those are logical resaons. How ever since Zuma did say if the UN/AU put in mission in place SA would provide men. I would go with the first one has the resone.

EFCC1: 5 SA soldier killed in an helicopter crash while on patrol...RIP to d dead

To give more detials. It was a A109 in the kruger national park. And it was a anti rhino patrol

Since there still a investigastion not much can be said on the cause. Though A109 where grounded not long ago due to manfuctor deffects discoverd.

patriot4: "A built from a 14 year old is just has deadly has a built from a 40 year old" Lord of war

Yes. But it is true non the less.

agaugust: even if @andrewza wants to surrender to @patriot4, he won't be able because south African soldiers lost their white flag while running away so fast from the CAR rebels.

Once again find a credbrill source to back up your claim or sit down a keep dreaming about your nigerian navy.

patriot4: Needless to say that five hundred dead kids would have made the news everywhere in the world, and the Red Cross would have picked on that, such as other NGOs, so I get the fealing SANDF surrendered to children. That is the ultimate redicule.
Enough said.

First not all of them where kids
Second both the un and red cross have mentioned the fact child solders where used
3rd a 16 year old is considerd a child by law.
4th find a source that says sa surrended at all

5th. I find it funny hoe you agree with sa sourses when the suit you

nig2change: Pls SA troops were fighting child soldiers. See link. http://m.timesofindia.com/world/rest-of-world/Child-soldiers-killed-in-Central-African-Republic-South-African-troops-claim/articleshow/19309919.cms?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=tweets

A large portion of the rebels wheer in there teens.


It funny how Nigerians will accept what south african sources say when it suits them but dissmiss what dose not. Even if it is the very dame source.


And nigeria fough child solders in seirr leon. So your point is what again.

A built from a 14 year old is just has deadly has a built from a 40 year old.

patriot4: Names of NGO's and links their reports, please.
Everyone here, even the SA boys are now convinced I was saying the truth, I think it is impossible to show you the truth. You are like a blind man.

Really. Because I was not convinced.

I have given the most comprehnsive report on the events. Untill you can dissprove it, it only shows your blidness to the truth.

patriot4: I can see you debating with your compatriots here:
avatar RabbleRouser - March 26, 2013 at 12:34 Report commentComments Policy
Don't hold your breath for any intelligent answers. The ones that have been delivered so far are so thin and pathetic that it is an insult to one's intelligence.

'National interests' is just an euphemism for business interest of top ANC business people and politicians. They have simply sent in some pawns in an attempt to protect and defend their investments and shares in business activities there. The ANC led government has absolutely no interest in the well being of the citizens of CAR or the veiled excuse called peace.

Neveretheless, it has revealed how run down the SANDF has become. The SANDF has simply descended into a tin pot unit that cannot even prop up a tin pot dictator. They just sent in some CAR guards.
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avatar Andrew Coetzee - March 26, 2013 at 12:35 Report commentComments Policy
On how our men where able to hold out. Maybe because they good at what they do and did not run away.
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avatar slipslidinaway - March 26, 2013 at 14:49 Report commentComments Policy
erm... mate, they held nothing out... And they did run away to hide inside their barracks - not that I blame them, I would too - please, just don't harbour any illusions about bravery of the soldiers or their "purpose" in being there. A waste from start to finish.
0 0

And the point of bring out that is.

patriot4: Yes they were found, later on.

All of themm alive?

patriot4: Andrew Coetzee I am fed up, I have posted news reports in which those groups claimed you were badly beaten.
Yet you refuse to admit it, and the ngo's you are talking about: you didn't even give their names, talkless of giving links to this your claim.

You posted peoples opion. Who gave nothing to back it, just like you. I on the other hand posted a report from a well kowen miiltary anylasty that is consided a credbil source. He view is the one I took from the start. I was meerly waiting for him to release his report. Every thing you say is just showing your blindness to the truth.

You like the cubans going on and on about 3 tanks. Give it up. You know you have no way to produce a source more credbil than the one I have given.