₦airaland Forum

CAPTIVATOR:
Back to the context.

You said back to the context but you never address any of my points.

Mary conceived by the holyspirit ! TRUE OR FALSE ?

SO, IF the holyspirit is a person , the one who got mary Pregnant , WHO IS THE FATHER OF JESUS ?

This is not where we started from,

Do you agree Holy spirit as a person can appear in form of Dove or Fire just as Jehovah who is a person can also appear in form of Cloud and Fire?

Beside go and check your dictionary very well about the meaning of PERSON before make any statement about it.


MODIFY:
I can see you've modified your post to Do you even read the context of that scripture at all

The context is so cleared for a good scriptural student to understand; "The Holy spirit with WILL COME UPON you," the question is what is the meaning of this Idioms COME UPON? This is where you got it wrong since it says come upon and He's a person it means He must sex Mary...SMH

CAPTIVATOR:
Oh sorry, I DONT Deal with abusive beings

" put away from yourselves every kind of malicious bitterness, anger , wrath, screaming and abusive speech, as well as everything in jurious" Eph 4:31

Na today

An educated person who couldn't differentiate between COME UPON and LIE WITH

CAPTIVATOR:
How does this answer my questions .... , [size=14pt]DONT answer questions with questions For Me Again..[/size]

Why will you see it as an answer to your questions when you left your brain somewhere before you spew those thrash.
You said the bolded part but you never follow it.

So u think uv answered the three questions.
.... Lets see

Imaging I didn't answer your questions but you can come with another verses DIFFERENT from the one you posted.

1) psalm 97:2 answers that Jehovah sits on his righteous throne, but Cloud are all around him and Fire goes before him.

- From the above, Jehovah is a person ... He sits on his throne ,

WHY DIDNT the holyspirit have a throne ?

2) Colosian 3:1 says God sits on his throne , and Jesus sits at his right hand , this are real persons who sits on throne, their making abode therefore doesnt mean they will move from heaven to earth , Rather God and Jesus will be with such persons .

Once again, WHY DIDNT the holyspirit have a throne?

Do you agree Holy spirit can appear in a form of Dove or Fire as a person?

That's the point don't shift your ignorance to another place.

3) Calm Down, Ananias heart was filled to do what ? TO LIE ! Nothin like intimacy here, do we read that Ananias Conceived ? NOT AT ALL

Then how can Satan as a person FILL Ananias' heart?

Back to the context
" Holyspirit [size=14pt]will come upon you ( Mary)"[/size] Luke 1: 35 ,holyspirit a person according to you, [size=14pt]will come upon[/size] another female person , and the result will be pregnancy ? haba

" for what has been conceived in her ( a female person) is by holyspirit ( a person)" Matt 1:20.
Okay, holyspirit is the father of JESUS NOT God!

I can't just stop laughing at you, I will take you serious only when you can differentiate between 'COME UPON' and 'LIE WITH'

Cant u see the ABSURDITY of makin the POWER ( Force of doin somethng) of God" Luke 1:35, a person by human tradition?

The only ABSURDITY I see here is an educated person who couldn't differentiate between COME UPON and LIE WITH...SMH

Meaning of 'COME UPON'...

come upon

Also found in: Dictionary/thesaurus, Medical, Legal, Wikipedia.


come upon

v.
To discover or meet someone or something by accident: While walking down the road, I came upon a strange old house.

See also: come, upon

The American Heritage® Dictionary of Phrasal Verbs. Copyright © 2005 by Houghton Mifflin Harcourt Publishing Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Harcourt Publishing Company. All rights reserved.

[size=14pt]come upon somebody/something[/size]

to find or meet someone or something, esp. unexpectedly, We came upon a farmer setting a fire to clear off dead grass from the pasture.

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/come+upon

CAPTIVATOR:
Lets examine ur claim on the bible verse given ( Act 15: 14, 17)

- Verse 14 said its God who turned his attention to the nations to bring out a people for his name ! Which clearly refer to Jehovah God

- Didnt you see that Verse 15 - 17 is a DIRECT QUOTATION from Amos 9:11,12 WHERE THE NAME " JEHOVAH " appears ? .NOT the fabricated " LORD" concept subtituted by human tradition into most bibles.

Read the conversation between your brother and I we have dealt with this so don't take us back to Egypt.

- INTERESTINGLY, during the event narrated by James which actually Happened to Peter, peter makes it clear that the apostles are ' WITNESSES APPOINTED BY JEHOVAH GOD , who raised Jesus from the dead' Act 10:40,41

Then this proves that Jesus is Jehovah God because Jesus is the one choses and COMMADED those to witness about Him.


Before you derail this thread the point is Acts 15 where James quoted OT scriptures and applied them to GENTILES.

thehomer:
The Holy Spirit impregnated Mary without her consent.

Can you provide evidence for this?

CAPTIVATOR:
RESEARCH more .... The greek word translated 'helper' in John 16:13 carries a masculine gender , thats why its perfectly normal for Jesus to personify the holyspirit with "he" while refferin to "helper" , the holyspirit itself was personified .

See lie so because of helper that's why Jesus used HE instead of IT.

If something is not PERSONIFIED it will be FIGURATIVE for JWs.

Its not uncommon to see such examples of things personified in the scriptures

FOOT speaks ( 1 cor 12: 15)

The EAR talks { 1 cor 12:16}

Trees are said to be rejoicing in psalm 96:11,12

Mountains sing ( Isa 55:12)

Trees Clap Their Hands ( Isa 55:12)

ALL ARE PERSONIFICATION.

But Holy spirit has mind and emotions, is that personification too?

BUT if u still insist according to your dogma that the holyspirit is a person, then answer this.

The person who is living in dogma saying someone else insist in dogma.

In fact if not because you've been brainwashed beyond control you wouldn't have asked these questions.

1) why does the holyspirit appear as a dove, and also as tongue BUT NEVER as a person ?

Why will Jehovah appear in form of CLOUD or FIRE if is a person?

I know you never reason that way

2) since the dogma says holyspirit is a person, and every so - called christian claimed to have it, so how many holyspirits exist since millions of people say that person lives within them?

Since your delusion has sunk you so deep in the ocean of perpetual ignorance, you would have asked first why Jesus and Jehovah who are persons WILL MAKE THEIR ABODE with ALL THOSE who LOVE Them?

Does that mean there are many Jehovahs and Jesuses?

3) if the holyspirit is a person , arent u sayin it had sex with MARY?

Another Jehovah's witness dumb question.

You believe Satan is a person but Satan filled Ananias' heart to lie in Acts 5:3, does it mean that Satan slept with Ananias?

thehomer:
How do you know that the Holy Spirit didn't give him those instructions?

Simply because no scriptural back up for it.

For the last time stop disgracing yourself on this thread.

Please show me the SONG you're talking about here before my post.

You lied again keep it up

9jaforlife:
Cool down... You're frustrated. Here's how the discussion went...

Do you even ask yourself question sometimes about what you typed?

Because I can't see how a reasonable person will be talking as you do here.

I posted a quote about rape from the bible. You disagreed and said it wasn't about rape as shown in the first screenshot.

I quoted part of the bible quote again, asking you this question... "Dividing the spoils of war, a girl or two for each warrior" means what? That's screenshot 2.

In your second screenshot you're the one who advised me to read the WHOLE CHAPTER which I did and replied TO THE SAME POST OF YOURS.

[size=14pt]Then you said verse one was talking about a SONG.[/size] Because I had posted a song from the bible not far from that time, I had the impression that you were referring to that post (of song from the bible). And that was what I was explaining in shot 3, see the circled part. I'd rather disagree with you than lie.

The bolded part is where the problem lies, you said yourself here that I said "VERSE ONE" did you ask yourself am I replying to the song you quoted or YOUR POST THAT I QUOTED?

And it's so evident from my post that I'm not even talking about the song you're talking about because what I wrote is so too clear for an intelligent one to conceive this is what I wrote after you advised me to read the whole chapter;

Analysis of the WHOLE CHAPTER
I then said *verse 1 was talking about a SONG sang BY DEBORAH AND BARAK* which I went ahead to quote the same verse 1 which says *on that day Deborah and Barak son of Abinoan sang this song*

It's obvious that you didn't even know anything about the verse you're talking about if not you'd have known who is Deborah and Barak or did the verse you quoted about song has the names Deborah and Barak?

Just continue to add to your delusion.

[size=14pt]Sharing girls who are war victims is rape,[/size]

I can't just stop laughing at your ignorance. You know yourself that that verse never talked about RAPE that's why you've to come with this awkward explanation.

Bookmark this

the s*ex is not consensual. It was carried out by characters in the bible, whether it was in form of a song or not.

Show me where the verse says they slept with those girls.

Even if you contest this particular quote, I will post more quotes that are more direct. Deuteronomy 20:10-14 and Judges 31: 7-18 are more explicit about rape.

You know that that verse wasn't directly talking about RAPE.

I hope you'll understand these ones too

Don't get angry with me, direct your anger at your christian brethren who go about saying that Islam encourages rape but the bible is only full of love and forgiveness things. I'm only following their example!

Angry with someone who doesn't know what s/he is talking about.

So because of this you must FORCE RAPE in the verse that doesn't even talk about RAPE.

9jaforlife:
So what

What has that got to do with the topic of discussion? [size=14pt]The fact that I referred to you as a she makes it obvious that I thought you were female.[/size] Must you fight about everything? Gosh you're soo petty! And you call yourself a guy?? Where is the wisdom in this? Funny you're asking me to get wisdom

I can't just stop laughing when I read the bolded and said to myself and this is coming from an intelligent being who thought he doesn't need wisdom.

9jaforlife:
God bless you! When these people see embarrassing things in the bible they start behaving like r*etards.. See the way she's going back and forth about a clear quote! Smh

You're an embarrassment to Muslim instead of you to find something cover your face and sneak out of this thread you're still boasting upon your delusion.

Not only about you and Songs of Solomon but despite the fact that you've quoted me more than two times you couldn't see that my moniker is (m) but you can still address my as SHE.

You seriously need to get wisdom fast.

Binb:
so what exactly is the verse talking about since you claimed it is not talking about rape

Did you even see anything like RAPE in that verse?
Beside the song was sang to praise God which is a poetic song.

Second question, what is the moral of the verses in the bible talking about inces.t (and they are many)

If only you're being open-minded than your brothers then you can digest my point here.

Firstly, Christians will never deny those verses I mean that they won't claim it's not in their Bible.

Secondly, you must know that those verses were DESCRIPTIVE and not PRESCRIPTIVE.

Thirdly, there's no moral about those verses BUT WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW ALSO is that NEITHER did God have pleasure on them, that's why we aren't commanded to practice them.

Fourthly, Bible contains a lot of historical event ON HOW GOD dealt with a particular tribe in their SERVICES to God, their humanity activities, their weaknesses and strengths and their good and bad.

Fifthly, the writers of the Old Testament were not written on their OWN initiatives which can make them bias by chosen to write the GOOD part ONLY and ignored their BAD side through their human nature BUT the writers were carried along by Holy spirit to write what God wants.

Sixthly, why will God allow such things to be written in His inspired Word? This is the main question.

Lastly, God informed us through Paul that NIV: "For everything that was written in the past was written to teach us, so that through the endurance taught in the Scriptures and the encouragement they provide we might have hope. Romans 15:4

9jaforlife:
If the bible finds the quote suitable enough to grace it on its pages, why should I be ashamed to post it here

Your case is pathetic, does the verse talk about rape? That's the question.

YOU are the confused one! [size=14pt]I posted songs of Solomon[/size] and this bible quote in case you missed it...

See broad day LIE @bolded part, please show me where you posted SONGS OF Solomon

Yet you said below that I was the one who referred you to Songs of Solomon and you corrected me that your quote is from Judges not Songs of Solomon.

Bible Condones Rape of War Victims
"Are they not finding and dividing the spoil-- a girl or two for each warrior, the spoil of colored garments for Sisera, the spoil of an embroidered garment or two for my neck?" Judges 5:30

[size=14pt]You went ahead and referred me to rape in songs of Solomon and I simply corrected you that this was the quote I was referring to!![/size]

What do I need to say again after reading this your open day light lies which is evident that you're just typing what you've been programmed to do.

Did I refer you to Songs of Solomon or I simply tell you that the verse you quoted was a SONG SANG BY DEBORAH AND BARAK?

Muslims always prove to us that Qur'an has wiped away their brains and replaced it with confusions and lies.

Get life man!

RikoduoSennin:
Key: JW is more than JUST a literature group. You are not familiar with their early history. Members reference other bible translation but because of unified teaching-one translation is used (Jehovah is not a God of disorder). Try to understand why JW says what they say @ JW.ORG

@bolded-because of this unified teaching how many Greek scholars participated and approved the ONLY translation that JWs used?

I care to know...

You have not personally compare different translations with NWT, neither have you read the prologue/appendix to these bible translations. Research from both side before you make conclusion- one sided opinion is flawed.

I believe this statement is a joke because we do compare many TRANSLATIONS with NWT and the differences are so glaring and also we do know what Greek scholars say about the NWT in fact the most astonish part is the Dr. M. Mertzger Bruce whom JWs always cited as a prove, see what Bruce says about NWT;

"Far more pernicious in this same verse is the rendering, “… and the Word was a god,” with the following footnote: “‘A god.’ In contrast with ‘the God.’” It must be stated quite frankly that, if the Jehovah’s Witnesses take this translation seriously, they are polytheists. In view of the additional light which is available during this age of Grace, such a representation is even more reprehensible than were the heathenish, polytheistic errors into which ancient Israel was so prone to fall." Erroneous Translations pt 1, A Biblical and Theological Appraisal By Bruce M. Metzger
http://www.bible-researcher.com/metzger.jw.html

JMAN05:
All true Christians are witnesses of Jehovah.

Do you yourself agree with that?

Ok let me agree with it but my question now is WHO ARE THE TRUE CHRISTIANS according to the scriptures?

Go read that article from beginning.

And you think I didn't do this before I opened this thread.

You think am like you? I have said here that your understanding is poor, that's why you couldn't understand that the context clearly is talking about God. Or you simply are not being frank to yourself.

Why will you insert YOUR OWN word when the author didn't do so and you couldn't indicate that it's your word?

That was exactly what Christ says, [size=14pt]and am telling you that witnessing about Jesus is witnessing about Jesus.[/size] About the wonderful things God did through Jesus.

Are you serious about the bolded part, confused or mistaken?

God elevated that name Jesus. [size=14pt]He couldn't tell them to bear his Father's name cos they are His witnesses as far as they be replaced those who had that privilege.[/size] Even as a natural Jew, they were Jehovah's witnesses.

@bolded-In fact I have to give up here for your double standard point.

This is the question from my point you replied to

"the point is not THE QUOTATION OF OT by James The point is WHO DID James HAVE IN MIND Before QUOTING from OT?

Whose name will the gentiles bear according to the verses you've been quoting since?

Here are the verses we are talking about "14 Symeon hath rehearsed how first God visited the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.,... 17 That the residue of men may seek after the Lord, And all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called,

So according to you James sited from OT which is talking about the Jehovah and from here both HIS NAME & MY NAME mean Jehovah's name WHICH IS THE BASIS for JWs to claim that TRUE CHRISTIANS are also witness of Jehovah since they (True Christians) as a spiritual Israelite now replaced the natural Israelite.

So going by your analogy and explanation of those verses the TRUE CHRISTIANS supposed to BEAR THE NAME of the FATHER (which you called Jehovah) NOT THE EXALTED NAME OF the Lord Jesus Christ, now you're speaking from other side of your mouth that He couldn't tell them TO BEAR HIS FATHER'S NAME. So now that He couldn't say so, why ARE YOU CALLING YOURSELF Jehovah's Witness?

In fact this is the bone of my contention that JWs have MISINTERPRETED these verses which is evident from your post.

The fact is James quoted those verses to buttress his point of how the OT prophecies find its fulfilment in Jesus Christ which is also the reason why Jesus can tell Paul that he will BEAR HIS NAME before the Gentiles.

Now your gross misunderstanding of the scriptures is plainly opened to you.

just SMH...

No. Out of anger over your deliberate blindness.

Do you rather believe the scripture when it says in that verse "kill" and "dead"?

The point is that Jesus death and resurrection are God's work. So bearing witness to it is bearing witness to God.



You ignored the point of my comment.

Peter made mention of so many things God did in the life of Jesus, and the scriptures include all that as the "thorough WITNESS" Peter bored. That is one prove of witness about God you dispute.

The Luke you quoted is in no way against the fact that God raise Jesus Christ. Point of correction, from the scripture God raised Jesus. Acts 3:15.

That Luke said it was "written" that Christ will die and be raised.

Who inspired that prophesy that was written?

Peter acknowledged that God was the one who really raised Jesus. That was Peter's point. In this, the prophets agree (hos 6:1, 2).



Christians mostly, and The Way.

And as we bear witness about Jesus, we bear witness for the One who sent him forth, whose delight Jesus will make have success. Isai 53:10



Oga that is a paraphrase. Nawa o.

From the context, it was God Peter had in mind. He was in fact using a scripture applied to natural Israelites and applied it to the new nation. Barne's note I showed you made the same point.

Jesus is spoken of as calling, but these are people whom God want to be called. John 6:44

The one who ultimately call believers is thus, Jehovah.



Jesus stated that he cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, he does what his Father taught him to do. He is a son well tutored by his Father. John 8:28
God gave him a command that Jesus stuck to. John 14:31

He confesses, "what I teach is not mine". John 7:16

So all in all, everything has always been to the glory of Jehovah.



Of course, true Christians bear Jesus name. Since Jehovah who they witness his name had elevated Jesus name, He procures His glory through that name too. God gave Jesus great privileges. But all is to His glory.



That message included making his Father's name known. John 17:6, 26



Thank God you know that one.



I take the yes part. I wonder what you are still arguing.



Was Peter convinced that God performed powerful works through Jesus? Is Paul convinced that God created the world?

When they proclaim these, what do you call them?

Consult the Barnes note I gave you for further explanation of what is involved in declaring excellences as used in that verse. If what should be done there is out of conviction, then fix up your question.



Know when the end will come? No.

But the Father can grant him many privileges cos He loves him. John 5:20. But the Father never granted him power to do all He does.

What his Father did not teach him, he won't do. John 7:28



Witnesses of Jehovah. Please add "true" Christians.



A natural Israelite like Jesus and his apostle need not be reminded of what they are as a nation.

Since they declare the work of Jehovah as performed in Jesus, they are fulfilling the work of witnesses of Jehovah. Of course, Peter used the word applied to Jehovah's witnesses upon them. Showing they now bear that name the natural Jew bore. They are also God's name people.

I think we have achieved the purpose of the thread

You statement above made my tired of replying your next post because it evident that you don't know what you're saying.

Binb:
is the song not part of the "inspired" Bible? so there are some portions of the bible that are conveniently attributed to singers. Abeg who are the singers. just curious

It's part of the Bible but the point you're missing is, THE VERSE NEVER TALKED ABOUT RAPING SOMEONE.

It's a song COMPOSED BY DEBORAH in fact had it been you read from verse 1-31 you would've understand the point the LYRICS is pointing to.

Let me quote few verses for you;

"...19 “Kings came, they fought,
the kings of Canaan fought.
At Taanach, by the waters of Megiddo,
they took no plunder of silver.
20 From the heavens the stars fought,
from their courses they fought against Sisera.
21 The river Kishon swept them away,
the age-old river, the river Kishon.
March on, my soul; be strong!
22 Then thundered the horses’ hooves—
galloping, galloping go his mighty steeds.
23 ‘Curse Meroz,’ said the angel of the Lord.
‘Curse its people bitterly,
because they did not come to help the Lord,
to help the Lord against the mighty.’


24 “Most blessed of women be Jael,
the wife of Heber the Kenite,
most blessed of tent-dwelling women.
25 He asked for water, and she gave him milk;
in a bowl fit for nobles she brought him curdled milk.
26 Her hand reached for the tent peg,
her right hand for the workman’s hammer.
She struck Sisera, she crushed his head,
she shattered and pierced his temple.
27 At her feet he sank,
he fell; there he lay.
At her feet he sank, he fell;
where he sank, there he fell—dead.


28 “Through the window peered Sisera’s mother;
behind the lattice she cried out,
‘Why is his chariot so long in coming?
Why is the clatter of his chariots delayed?’
29 The wisest of her ladies answer her;
indeed, she keeps saying to herself,
30 ‘Are they not finding and dividing the spoils:
a woman or two for each man,
colorful garments as plunder for Sisera,
colorful garments embroidered,
highly embroidered garments for my neck—
all this as plunder?’


31 “So may all your enemies perish, Lord!
But may all who love you be like the sun
when it rises in its strength.”

Then the land had peace forty years. Judges 5:19-31 NIV

If you pay close attention to these verses you can find a lot of figurative expression here as I Bolden them.

My point here is the verse your brother quoted wasn't in anyway talking about RAPE but pure MISUNDERSTANDING of that verse.

TopsyKrete:
"Where was God coming from before HE started creation"?

But seriously, where was God coming from?

Where do you think God is going or do you read it somewhere that God is going somewhere?

9jaforlife:
I didn't talk about rape in songs. Here is the quote about rape...

"Are they not finding and dividing the spoil-- a girl or two for each warrior, the spoil of colored garments for Sisera, the spoil of an embroidered garment or two for my neck?" Judges 5:30

It is just so shameful that you can still repeat this.

In fact the underlined & bolded part show how confused you are.

9jaforlife:
Because you'll still refuse to get it! Why would I bother wasting my time going back and forth when you'll end up talking out of context?!

I can see that you have problem with simple English.

You claimed my post FULL OF CONTRADICTIONS and I went ahead to challenge you to highlight ALL THE CONTRADICTIONS in my post so that people can see them.

But you are here giving another dumb excuses.

9jaforlife:
"Dividing the spoil... a girl or two for each warrior" means what Spoil means gains of war. Go and read the whole chapter.

You can deny it. I understand it's embarassing.

Now see the whole chapter analysis

Verse 1 was talking about a SONG sang by Deborah and Barak "On that day Deborah and Barak son of Abinoam sang this song:"

From verse 2-end show the lyrics of the song.
So how can you apply a SONG SANG BY SINGERS to mean RAPE? that's what I couldn't phantom from your post which shows your dumbness.

9jaforlife:
You're too confused. Your post makes no sense, it's full of contradictions!

Why can't you point out the contradictions for people to see?

Typical Muslims excuse.

After I've exposed your ignorance about the verse you quoted that never even talked about RAPE.

9jaforlife:
[size=14pt]DUMB TALKS!![/size]

Can you see your life outside?

How can you quote a verse that is not even talking about RAPE to mean Bible condones RAPE? SMH

9jaforlife:
As for rape of war victims, see what the bible has to say...

Bible Condones Rape of War Victims
"Are they not finding and dividing the spoil-- a girl or two for each warrior, the spoil of colored garments for Sisera, the spoil of an embroidered garment or two for my neck?" Judges 5:30

And if that church was to follow the bible's instructions, the pastor and those women would have been dead....

‘If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress are to be put to death" Leviticus 20:10

So, keep on rambling!

The astonish part of your post is to quote a verse that is not even talking about rape to mean Bible condones RAPE very pathetic and dumbness.

But what you (Muslims) who always refer to Bible for a post like this fail to understand is that [b]If both Bible and Quran actually condone RAPE then God can't be the inspire Author BUT if the Biblical text never condone RAPE and Islamic source condone RAPE then it means God never inspired it.

9jaforlife:
Infact, ALL of your post fall out any form of sense.

Really So what about the poo you just posted?

You're not in support of the act but you're trying to diminish the gravity of it Saying one form of barbarity is better is pure hypocricy!

Wrong conception about my post, evil cannot be done away in human society until Jesus comes but as we live in evil generation MAN believe that less evil should befall them than TOTAL ELIMINATED FROM life. If someone was hit by a vehicle even to the point of death the Family will continue to spend money to make sure the person survive death.

First I DON'T PREFER any form of savagery. All forms of inhumanity are bad and should be condemned, especially when committed in the name of God.

You DON'T PREFER it but the truth of the matter is YOU CAN'T STOP IT which you must have alternative IN CASE such happened

You talk as if the children kidnapped by Boko Haram were in night clubs when they were abducted.

Please where does my post imply your statement?

Do you think that you've been spared from BH violence because you're smart??

So you know this and you DON'T PREFER one to another. Now that I know I'm not smart but I'LL PREFER MY DAUGHTER TO FALL into the hand of man who will impregnate her THAN BOKO HARAM to kill her.

You all love to sing the tune of how there's so much fights in Muslim countries, is it not your so called loving christian nations that are fueling the fights? Creating and funding terrorist groups and providing them with weapons to distabilize their territories just to be able to gain control of their oil?

Lol Now it is Christians who founded Islamic terrorist because of their oil, please does Borno state have oil?

Your bible is full of 'kill' quotes but you never pay attention to that.

Thank God that you say we never pay ATTENTION TO IT which is better THAN MUSLIMS who PAY attention to their own which is the point you're confusing with each other.

When millions of people die in christian inspired wars you blame the initiators

INSPIRED BY WHO? please provide evidence.

but when a Muslim is involved in any crime you blame Islam.

Because the founder of Islam PRACTICE THEM and at the same time PRESCRIBED for Muslims.

When Hilary Clinton confessed that America created Al Qaeda or when Bush said God (of christians) inspired him to fight Iraq war, did you blame christianity??

Is America Christianity?
Bush made the same claim that this man made as God inspired him (Them) but the question is was it commanded by GOD in the Bible or PRACTICE BY JESUS HIMSELF or they draw their inspiration from the Bible?
I think the only evidence here is to ask God Himself whether He truly inspired them.

Yet, when some lunatics who are also condemned by Muslims claim that they're following Islam by killing others, you people will say it's Islam that truly taught them.

Was it not stated clearly in the Quran?
When Clinton says (according to you) America created Al-qeada does it support it with Biblical quote?
When Bush says (according to you) God inspired him to fight Iraq did he have any Biblical support for it?

I believe as Muhammad claimed that Allah sent Gabriel to him if Muhammad never wrote it down will you just believe in his claim?

The claim that violence in the Middle East are supported by the Quran is pure lies and propaganda that generations of Islamophobes like you have heartlessly circulated for long. [size=14pt]If all your attacks against Islam had worked, no Muslim would be alive today.[/size] But you've always ended up right where you started and you ALWAYS will.

Imaging Islamophobes are circulating what was boldly written in the Quran.

That bolded part is pure delusion is it only Islam that has been attacked in history of religions?
All religions have their attackers, Muslims attacked Christians for manipulations of their Bible, called Paul a liar e.t.c does that stop Christianity from being alive today?

You need wisdom man!

Yooguyz:
Bruce M. Metzger, Professor of New Testament Language and Literature at Princeton Theological Seminary, one of the world's leading authorities on the Greek language, and recognized as such by the Jehovah's Witnesses who quote him on occasion in a favorable way, wrote an article in 1950 pointing out the errors in many Christological passages in the New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures. 26

In fact this is the main problem with the Jehovah witness, how can JWs so trust this man by taking his writing as a prove? Yet this same man has pointed out the errors in their Bible.

9jaforlife:
[size=14pt]If it was a Muslim who did this,[/size] you would have seen the likes of Ifeann aka parisbookaddict drooling all over this place. [size=14pt]She would have claimed that it's the spirit of Muhammad but now that it's a Christian,[/size] she will perfectly understand that devil is at work. Crazy world!!

In fact the two bolded parts fall out simple sense.

Not that I'm in support of this act but comparing this with what is happening in Muslims world today is pathetic.

Firstly, I believe you'll prefer someone impregnating your daughter than the person to kill your daughter. At least if Boko Haram, ISIS, Taliban e.t.c are only impregnating women today the case will be different (Husband will warn his wife and parents will warn their daughters not to move anyhow) but taking LIFE is so heartfelt.

Secondly, what is going on in Muslims world today ARE PRESCRIBE in the Qu'ran that's why the evil men always have Qu'ran back up for their act but this man ONLY CLAIMED GOD DIRECTED him, which doesn't have any scriptural back up or can be traced to JESUS CHRIST or ALL the blessed Apostles who took over from Jesus. It's now left for you to do a research whether God truly told him so or not but I can challenge you to bring any verse where it was commanded to practice this from the Bible.

So if a Muslim killed it is as a result of what Muhammad practiced and prescribed for him/her.

JMAN05:
We witness for Jah and Jesus too. Witnessing about Jehovah today involve speaking about what he did through His son. This son he elevated. how many times will I tell you that witnessing about Jesus is witnessing about Jehovah?

But that statement read "True Christians SERVE as witness of Jehovah" (I'll add ONLY) which doesn't include Jesus which is different from your point.
How many times have I asked that if witness of Jesus means witness of Jehovah then do you agree that ALL Christians are WITNESS of Jehovah or Jehovah's witness?
Remember what you called witness of Jehovah "Witnessing about Jehovah today involve speaking about what he did through His son."

the article you quoted is speaking from a different context.

So what is the context does it speaking about?

You poor scriptural understanding is a major problem I don't think I can help you out from.

Lolzzz the above statement so fits you like cloth

The Bible Exposition Commentary states about that verse: "James called these gentiles 'a people for His [God's] name". this scholar and many more knew the verse is talking about God's name. only your childish understanding won't grasp it.

I know you purposely inserted 'God's' there but the point is not THE QUOTATION OF OT by James The point is WHO DID James HAVE IN MIND Before QUOTING from OT? This is the vital point I see you missing from this thread. Jesus Himself told Paul that he will bear HIS NAME before gentiles and the believers belong to Jesus.

If you don't get it. please forget it. if you like believe the devil created you. that's your biz. you won't say no one told you.

Lolzzz talking out of frustration.

After telling the crowd how God poured out the spirit, how He raised Jesus and more, the account called it "thorough witness". Acts 2:39,40.

God stated he would raise his son from the dead. What prove does God have for this? the apostles were witnesses of this great work of God. acts 3:15

And you believe that The PRINCE of LIFE of Acts 3:15 can die...

See how you keep confusing issue, let me bring out the point the Blessed Apostles were making when they say God raised Christ from Christ own word "and said to them, "Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer and on the third day rise from the dead, 47 and that repentance and forgiveness of sins should be preached in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem. 48 You are witnesses of these things. Luke 24:46-48 RSV

In fact Jesus Himself said here it is through HIS NAME NOT JEHOVAH that people will be going from place to place as a result of what have been written.
Though it's still through the WORK of God that Christ resurrected in a sense that to unbeliever someone who they knew AS HUMAN BEING can't rise from dead without divine intervention but from scriptures God raised Christ and Christ raised Himself.

So the Apostles were only talking about the LIVING CHRIST which is no more in GRAVE.

They are people for his name, they replaced the natural Israelites. the commentary above gave the same point.

And I then asked whose NAME are we being called today? why simple question is so difficult for you to answer

What do you call people called to proclaim God's excellencies? 1Pet. 2:9

Please show me from any translation where the phrase [b]God's excellences appear in 1 Peter 2:9 what was written there is the excellences of the "ONE WHO CALLED YOU OUT..." the question now is who called US? the Bible made answer it both God and Jesus Christ called US.

Whose witness is he? Did he proclaim his message?

Lolzzz Witness of Himself.

He proclaimed the message of His Father and His own.

who elevated Jesus and gave him a great name?

The Father

But my question is, WHOSE NAME DID THE APOSTLE BEAR BEFORE GENTILES?
Did Jesus lie when He said Paul will bear HIS NAME before the Gentiles?

whose message did Jesus bear?

At least it is message not NAME, see above answer

During Pentecost, the people were declaring the magnificent things of who? acts 2:11

God or do you want them to declare the things of MAN before.

what do you call that? weaknessing? tomorrow you will start making noise you argued in nairaland. rubbish!

Lolzzzz it pains you sorry ooo

First do you agree that the Christian congregation was formed as God's name people?

YES because Jesus is God

2. When you proclaim someone's excellencies are you witnessing for Him?

Proclaiming excellences is different from witnessing
According to JWs A witness is a person who proclaims views or truth of which he is CONVINCED. (Bold and capital mine)
www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/name-jehovahs-witnesses/

Please how does this definition fit the mixing up of your proclaiming excellences with witnessing

3. Do you believe that Jesus powerful works and resurrection were all possible cos of God? Acts 2:22-24

I do and at the same time don't forget the Son can do whatever the Father does.

4. Do you believe that proclaiming the magnificent things of God is a witness about God? Acts 2:11

Yes and that makes us all Christians witnesses of God, do you agree?

Do you believe that what God did on the side of Jesus is among this magnificent thing?

I do,
NOTE: All these your human terminologies won't save you unless you embrace the sovereign Word of God over your own by simply agree that Jehovah never commanded anyone to witness for Him rather it is Jesus who made the COMMANDMENT and all the Apostles including the FATHER Himself bear witness of Jesus.

Please kindly provide answers to my questions the way I did to yours here.

JMAN05:
The sources you provided was wrong. the other one never gave an authoritative information. that was clear. However, Jehovah's witnesses never said so.

I don't know why you're stressing this to this time, the link I provided isn't from Anti-JWs site but a DEFEND of JW. If my sources was WRONG then the problem is not mine it's theirs.

I will repeat this for the last time, since I can provide A LINK and also HEARD it from TWO different JWs then it evident that my claim is right.

So now you know, but you were asking silly question.

Lol...it's only people like you can reason this way when my statement was a pure rephrasing one to tell me the meaning SINCE YOU ASSUME I don't know it.

just short short up, do I look you like someone you can deceive? Jesus is the literal word of God. If God speaks, that utterance is Jesus. Since the literal word is no longer there in heaven, God can no longer speak. That is the folly of the reasoning.

Unless you will raise another funny statement that there are many 'Jesuses'. Jesus is the spoken word, so when God spoke to Jesus, He was transmitting Jesus to Jesus. lol. doctrine. nawa o!

If he talk, wettin e talk na Jesus na. ie two Jesuses or a speech of Jesuses. Ekwe! doctrinology.

Man you need to grow in knowledge because I don't know how simple sentences are so hard for you to comprehend.

For the last time, The WORD of God WAS CORVERED with FLESH (INCARNATED) seen in HUMAN form and called Jesus Christ, that's why Jesus Christ has TWO NATURE both Human (flesh) and DIVINE form (God) and the TWO natures never MIXED together.

Your problem is viewing my point as Jesus is the Word of God and as being found in human flesh to mean The Word of God CHANGE! CHANGE!! CHANGE!!! to Jesus Christ. Jesus doesn't cease to exist as the Word of God while on Earth since The WORD ONLY CORVERED WITH FLESH. So when the Father speaks while Christ was on earth doesn't mean the Father is speaking out THE HUMAN FLESH OF CHRIST which is what a grown man like you couldn't comprehend.

No, I only see how confused you are. what's wrong with what I said.

oh! na run you won run? Nwoke m answer the question.

Lolzzz it is so shameful that you couldn't see how confused you are after I've brought out all your points.
If I will run away not for a confused soul like your who couldn't comprehend simple statement mixing HUMANITY WITH DIVINTY.

Now let me help you open your confusion more clearer;

Very IMPORTANTLY both God's knowledge, His knowledge, and Knowledge of God mean the same thing.

*You first said: "God's knowledge is not a person." here you agreed [b]God's knowledge (WHICH can also be written as His knowledge or Knowledge of God) is NOT a PERSON.
*You also said: "God's knowledge was expressed in His creation...," God's knowledge again (WHICH can also be written as His knowledge or Knowledge of God
*You go further to say this fantastic statement: "I never claimed Jesus was not called God's knowledge...," Here you said YOU NEVER CLAIMED Jesus was NOT CALLED God's knowledge (WHICH can also be written as His knowledge or Knowledge of God)
*You then asked: "If Jesus is called God's knowledge, does it then mean that he is the literal knowledge of God?...," Now see how you switched in your question from God's knowledge to knowledge of God as if these two phrases have different meaning.

*The most RIDICULOUS one is when you finally asked: ""Where is he called this "knowledge of God"? Whereas you've already CLAIMED that Jesus is called GOD'S KNOWLEDGE (WHICH can also be written as knowledge of God or His knowledge) but after this you can still ask that question.

Please is there any difference between these two phrases 'God's knowledge and knowledge of God'?

It is evident that you don't know that God's knowledge and knowledge of God mean the same thing.

If you like tell us that Jesus is the literal knowledge of God. let's keep adding your errors. You will earn an award for that.

SMH, just face your confusion above.

AgricSalt:
I did not join the world this year. Besides, I tap from the knowledge of my ever existing God - Jehovah, through His Word - the Bible, and His faithful and dynamic organisation on earth - the Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses.

If you want to learn more visit http://www.jw.org/en/

You tapped from the knowledge of Jehovah yet you couldn't comprehend my posts.

Thank God that you said it yourself that YOUR organisation is DYNAMIC no wonder they keep changing their teaching.

TroGunn:
To be a witness means to "testify to; give or afford evidence of" (dictionary.com). Thus a witness is "a person who proclaims views or truths of which he is convinced".

Jesus himself is a witness of Jehovah. He did or said nothing by his own power, but as he was instructed his Father, Jehovah.

John 6:38 - "For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me".

John 14:23,24: "Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me" .

Thus Jesus could pray thus to Jehovah, at John 17:25,26 - "O righteous Father, although the world has not known You, yet I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me; and I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them.""

Clearly, witnessing (proclaiming the truth) about Jesus Christ is actually witnessing about Jehovah, the one who sent him and is the head of the Christ (1 Cor. 11:3).

Jesus and the early apostles clearly understood that. Anyone who is humble and ready to drop false/confusing traditional beliefs, and peer into the bible would also.

The funny thing is after your own definition of WITNESS you still went ahead to go against it.

Please is "testify to; give or afford evidence of"" according to your dictionary the same as "He did or said nothing by his own power,"?

Now I will insert your meaning of WITNESS (testify to; give or afford evidence of) into my previous post on those who witness of Jesus Christ and you will do me a favour by providing equivalent word of it from Jesus Himself or the Apostles IN JUST A SINGLE VERSE without your caricature explanation.

1) The Father Himself: When reading the scriptures one thing that is very sure is that NOWHERE Jesus Himself witnesses about The Father rather it's The Father who WITNESSED about His Son, in fact the GREATEST witness is that of the Father;
*John 5:36-37 "But I have greater witness than [that] of John:..., And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath testify to; give or afford evidence of me..."(KJV)
*John 8:18 "I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me testify to; give or afford evidence of me."(KJV)
*1 John 5:9 "If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the testify to; give or afford evidence of God which he hath testified of his Son. (KJV)

2) The Holyspirit: 1 John 5:6 "This is he that came by water and blood, [even] Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that testify to; give or afford evidence of, because the Spirit is truth." (KJV)
*Acts 5:32 "...and [so is] also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him." (KJV)

3) The Prophets: Acts 10:43 "To him give all the prophets testify to; give or afford evidence of, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins." (KJV)

4) The Apostles:[/b] *Acts 4:33 "And with great power gave the apostles testify to; give or afford evidence of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all." (KJV)
*Acts 5:32 "And we are his testifier; given or afford evidence of these things;..." (KJV)

5) John the Baptist: *John 1:7-8 "The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all [men] through him might believe. He was not that Light, but [was sent] to testify to; give or afford evidence of that Light." (KJV)
*John 5:33 "Ye sent unto John, and he testify to; give or afford evidence unto the truth." (KJV)

6) Paul: Acts 23:11 "And the night following the Lord stood by him, and said, Be of good cheer, Paul: for as thou hast testified of me in Jerusalem, so must thou testify to; give or afford evidence of (me) also at Rome." (KJV)

AgricSalt:
I wanted to brand him apostate, but I see he does not even have a base. He just blabs.
That scripture I ascribed to him is what fits him. 'because he says he sees, he will remain blind' ~ John 9:41

You join this forum this year and you quickly want to brand someone an APOSTATE, don't worry you're welcome.

JMAN05:
Your detaching my writeup out of context is hilarious. The reason for the post is to prove that the apostles were witnesses of [size=14pt]Jehovah too.[/size]

Please how did I detach your post out of context? I only reply your post quote by quote.
Funny of you, at the bolded part if that's what Watchtower claimed this thread won't have been opened but Watchtower claim was "True Christians SERVE as WITNESS of JEHOVAH but your post only showed that The Apostles were Witness of Jehovah TOO notice the word "TOO"

I have also stated why the quotation the article made from that Acts 15 is not wrong. The spiritual replaced the natural and it retained its status as Jehovah's witnesses. It never ceased God from having witnesses.

Neither do I claim that the quotation is wrong too but misapplication of that verse by JWs is my major concerns. This is not the only place where NT writer apply OT scripture to Jesus Christ, the purpose of quoting that verse was stressed out in their letter to the SAME GENTILE Acts 15:26 "men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.(NIV)

Since you said "It never ceased God from having witnesses." then just give me a SINGLE VERSE where any of the Apostles WITNESS of Jehovah, this is another time I'll ask for this.

[size=14pt]As a group they were witnesses of Jehovah.[/size] there they're witnessing about Jesus being a part of that witness for Jehovah. He elevated Jesus to occupy a prominent position in the outworking of His purpose. Many miracles performed concerning this Jesus were God's work that need to be proclaimed.

Please provide the scriptures for the bolded part if there's no scripture for it then I still take it as your own word to justify JWs claim.
Did they witness of Jesus or Jehovah? answer this and stop dancing around.

I ve shown why Jesus is a witness of Jehovah both as a natural Jew, the head of the new nation and by his own teaching. compare Rev 1:5

Still referring to Rev 1:5 as if it says Jesus is a witness of Jehovah whereas I gave verses where Jehovah Himself witness of Jesus.

Jehovah called them to declare His excellencies (1Pet. 2:9), part of which is witnessing about Jesus. JW's witness for Jehovah and Jesus. The former encompassing the latter.

The questions according to those verses are;
1. Whose name did the Apostles bear before the Gentiles? Jesus Christ!
2. Whose name were the NATURAL Israelite and SPIRITUAL Israelite (Gentiles) been called? It is Christian! because it was at Antioch (Gentile city) that the DESCIPLES were FIRST CALLED Christian which is the NAME we were been called till today not Jehovah's name unless if you want to tell me that the name Jehovah and Jesus Christ are the same.

That is the purpose of the thread. When you agree that the article was not in the wrong, you can now point out what you disagree with in the other points I made there.

The purpose of this thread is misinterpretation of Acts 15:14,17 by JWs that made the Faithful Apostles a FALSE CHRISTIANS because they never SERVE as witness of Jehovah but witness of Jesus Christ which were BOLDLY spelled out throughout the New Testament. Since this is true then the article was wrong.

JMAN05:
JW do not teach that. finish with.
You go ask that JW why he said so, he is the rightful person to answer that.

I should go and ask only ONE person when I gave TWO INSTANCE together with A LINK to buttress my claim.
Well I've done what you required of me.

sorry, I wont. If you a lad, check your dictionary before talking.

LOl...since you assumed that I don't know what literal mean, so you who know it why can't you tell me?

Now you are specific, yet the point is childish.

When JESUS was doing his baptism, what do you call that voice that came from heaven?

When Jesus died, what happened to God's speech?

Didn't it look so ridiculous if you couldn't have known what I'm talking about before

I don't even know your problem, The Word of God which (was given the name Jesus Christ on earth) ONLY TOOK ON FLESH NOT THAT HE CEASED TO EXIST AS THE WORD OF GOD, that's why I asked you the other time is it possible for God to speak in all 36 states of Nigeria at once? but unfortunately you couldn't provide answer to it.

So if the Word of God was on earth in form of HUMAN, is it still possible for God not to talk again?

oga, comma can take the place of a parenthesis. That is done, only try and get the point the writer is making.

Alright

Just see how your below post confirmed that you're confused.

God's knowledge is not a person. God's knowledge was expressed in His creation.

I never claimed Jesus was not called God's knowledge. I implied that God's omniscience, which is part of him, cannot be Jesus.

If Jesus is called God's knowledge, does it then mean that he is the literal knowledge of God? Even without being told, the answer must be no. why? for that will mean that God lacked knowledge when Jesus died. Or that He lacked knowledge in heaven when Jesus was on earth.

Secondly, Jesus' knowledge cannot be compared with the endless knowledge of Jehovah. rom 11:33

If there is something Jesus do not know, God shouldn't know it. If that statement is not true, then Jesus isn't the literal knowledge of God.

Where is he called this "knowledge of God"? Maybe we can start from there. Col 2:2 didnt say so.

Now imaging all these from the above post; "God's knowledge is not a person. God's knowledge was expressed in His creation..., I never claimed [size=14pt]Jesus was not called God's knowledge..., If Jesus is called God's knowledge,[/size] does it then mean that he is the literal knowledge of God?..., you then asked "Where is he called this "knowledge of God"?

Maybe you've forgotten that knowledge of God, God's knowledge, His knowledge all mean the same thing. Can you see how confused you are now? SMH...