₦airaland Forum

Thatssobeyonce:
Bn a half caste challenges my dad is yellow nd my mom is brown,nd I'm brown too fair skin is beautiful bt the beauty in black skin last longer as they say blacks don't crack so accept ur skin d way it is

You're a pretty damsel i take back my Nicki minaj give me her and i will be OK

Every light skinned person is white to Nigerians...

Guy it is simple it just two race all other race are sub race under this two and we in africa get to view it like that black and white irrespective of indian white,european White etc

I remember back then growing up, pastors will preach that the idolatry in nigeria is the cause of nigeria setback....soon this idolatry went extinct over the years....
They came up with village people in the village, but now our villages are now empty even the ones who leaves in the village are now convert....
the people are now facing them that they are the cause of nigeria setback that the are exploiting us ,that they dont need jesus anymore, they should close down all church the youth are now becoming atheists

Should karma be blamed or religion.....

sogodihno:
Well, if what Awolowo acheived to you is a failure, I am sorry, I can't help u

If we stop judging based on sentiment then we will Begin to have fine leaders respectively of tribes

sogodihno:
Tell me [b][/b]what yr father that didnt take rat poison has achieved in his life

Must my father achieve anything before i can correct some funny notion about someone why did you have to bring my father into it ...same trash to run away from the truth but never mind....



Everything....i guess you want to start using money as a base to judge achievement then be assured i will knock some sense into your thick skull ....awolowo failed woefully is likes in nigria are not meant to be honoured you better accept the true fact and leave bigotry behind.....

Don't think am an Igboman am an edoman so judge it as one

Misterdhee1:
You don't know Awolowo's legacy? Is this an intentional error or you're just clowing around?

That he took a rat poison and infested our youth of today with intentions of suicide

compton11:
if u have the opportunity now,which black celebrity would you like to marry ??

Nicki minaj

Abiodun0202:
There's been different reasons causing setback/drawbacks to Nigeria as a country, but have you take your time to reason why this culture of a thing jeopardize the prosperity if this country..

There’s no single culture in Nigeria, and the multiple cultures present are very disimilar. However, there is what can be seen as a sort of universal belief and behaviours. These behaviours are not exactly unique to Nigerians but in some way they are magnified in a typical Nigerian. Some of these beliefs are listed below alongside what can be termed their nagatives.

Too much emphasies on respect for older people regardless of a situation (Not necessarily old people bit anyone who is older than you even by just 2 years). Which creates some psychologocal problems.
This automatically creates a nation of people who bare fearful and not exactly confident...

Its really disheartening seeing some reasons that should have been clear enough but no why do we chose no to see it...

* Bigotry
* Tolerance

These are further explained by a renowned prof.

https://fornaij.com/question/what-are-some-problems-created-by-nigerian-culture/

Your article is so poor and empty go and write more and then come back again for approval

compton11:
me too,the features I want in women is only possessed by black woman plus black women don't age like milk

Yea...blacks marry white women for show off nothing more, i would rather still use my black women for that same show off too...i dont really see any attraction towards the white ladies....

Sorry if i maybe sounding racist to the foreign guy am just been truthfull as i can

compton11:
white people have brainwashed every race but the most brainwashed are blacks,see all bitch ass black Brazil footballers and samba artist are marry white, from there they give birth to black enemies like neymar and Ronaldo de lima and those also marry whites and give birth to white children and from there black race gone.

I will rather have my black lady all shaped than have a white pady with no shape

RTSC2:
He is talking population, you are talking landmass.

Edo state is a single state dominated by minority groups.
Igbo's are spread across five States at least and are the third largest Nigerian population.

Use your head.

That is true i agree to this....

Edo would be the third populous people in germany against igbos and yorubas .because majourity of the binis in edo that get to travel internationally. and if it happens that the entire travels just tye way as the the benins they will still make it in the third place because of thier low population

morpheus24:
I don't know what LGBT has to do with all what I just said??

The decreass in white population

morpheus24:
Psychology is a very powerful tool so I am not sure what you mean by blacks in South America taking it. "white" is seen as possessing privilege, power and wealth. This is the society you are groomed in so psychologically you are already indoctrinated unless that cycle or though process is severed or broken, so you will continue to see this happen as long as the status quo remains the same

Over here we dont buy that idea ...though we arent not privileged yet in our various black country we have hope we will rise aomeday...we believe is blacks against white on this earth
No matter the white you are Hispanic, indians ,eurpoean we see them as all one race against the black race[/quote]ironically the birth rate of Whites in on the major decline. What this implies is that there will be more of a mixed race racial identity in the future in South America as opposed to a purely white one with the genetic traits of Europeans being recessive in nature, therefore ultimately no one will be technically "white" in most South American countries unless it is socially engineered to remain so

That will be to the fact of accepting lgbt homosexuals in the society...
Soon the white race might even go completely lost if they dont increase thier birthrate....

morpheus24:
very simple answer

The hierarchy of power in South America in general is correlated to the hierarchy of color where White skin has been given the status or "privilege" of being supreme, therefore everyone in a society where this culture and psychology is persistent will have people in the perceived lower tier trying to move up the color ladder while despising that which is perceived as the Lowest color spectrum.

The hierarchy of power!!! ...if the white decide to hold onto power for themselves fine ,but the fact about whitening a different race it is totally bullshit ...
I don't know how the blacks in south america are taking it...if they even agree to it...?
But if they dont then civil war would be inevitable in the country....
South america countries would never rise if one part of thier population is neglected and poor ...it is just the simple logic here
They better start seeing everyone as equal and help the blacks south americans stand on thier feet

Amujale:
We have to unite towards a common purpose.

Why?

Because our people are truly the envy of the world.

I agree with Op, Ethiopia is a great and influential African country, arguably the best, although they are after Nigeria in the ranking on my watch.

Furthemore, secure our future in todays world, concentrate on our part of the world.

Lets concentrate our focus on Africa. How to make the world a better place.

The world will only be a better place, when all our people are successfully elivated out of poverty.

Unity is worth the fuss.


Africans invents both the paper and the ink-pen.

You putting nigeria there is wrong... Yea Ethiopia is well respected for is history putting Ethiopia best is not wrong but best in what ....

compton11:
yes both Dominican and Brazil want to whitening their afro population.

But why are they ashamed of the black skin what is so fascinating with the light skin that me alone am not seeing .i was thinking only the blackmen was mental slaved ,but so as the whitemen too for thinking of whitening thier nation neymar is even denieling the fact he has an africa gene
is that what Brazilian want . countrys are using both races in the us to make money through Hollywood

Since they do not share thesame skin ...then they are guided

Elijahrona:
1. No Nigerian life was lost
2. Those xenophobic videos we saw online happened in the previous xenophobic attack, not this one
3. Even if Nigerian lives and property got lost, it does not justify us to steal from the shops of our fellow Nigerians thinking that they're South African shops.
4. I end up by saying... An eye for an eye will blind the whole world. There are more matured ways to resolve this issue. Violence and looting aren't part of those ways because they'll only imply that we're no better than South Africans.

You should have told that sermon to the south Africans when they attacked your people unjustfully .i hope the world wouldn't go blind ...if i kill your family member would you still preach this sermon of peace to me.....
Am happy Now you know it didn't happen during the apartheid...there is no justification that is worth a human life ... If you dont value the life of our fellow countrymen .i do and if i was the president and Nigeria just have only a grenade as weapon i will throw it so high till it reaches southafrica then after that we can be at Peace

Elijahrona:
So the thieves should go free? Who will pay back what they stole from the shops?

Like... Sentiments asides bro

Who are going to pay for the nigerian shop in south africa and who is going to bring them back to life dont qoute me if you dont have reasonable answer

Miaraka:
Nigerians, why do you like spreading lies about our country. What are you trying to achieve? Is someone paying you to do this? How much? Maybe I could also make some money purveying lies about Nigerians. Which Nigerian has ever been burnt alive in SA? What was his name or should I say what were their names? Stop posting photos or videos which have nothing to do with you. Only one foreigner, a Mozambican, was burnt alive. Everybody else who has ever been burnt alive was South African and that was during the struggle against apartheid for being traitors and nowadays for crimes such as rape and murder when the police are not around. Please respect yourselves. Maybe our government should share with the world evidence of the crimes that your cultists and criminals commit in this country, including killing your own people and blaming it on so-called South African xenophobia.

During apartheid was that the clothes the police were putting on....lol have they even invented bullet Proof jack then you must be joking and you must be a somali not a nigerian

Mzee1Kahuna:

.i really do love the unity of Nigerians on this one.
if not for those godforbidden politicians who separates us with religion and tribes
we're One

and i want to use this medium to curse the mod who banned me on my birthday eve, you'll loose your testicles on the day of your honeymoon.

That is too harsh....lol

Chi59:
Look before you type. I'm a female.
Now, run along.

So because you a female you had to spill trash ....

Chi59:
Nawa o.
Let's bear in mind that although Shoprite, dstv and mtn are owned by South African nationals, most of the people in its employ are Nigerians.
Burning down these placed might seem like the things to do, but it's tantamount to shooting ourselves in the foot.
It's high time the Nigerian government ACT and stop typing eloquent speeches on twitter.

Mr adviser i can't believe you spill this rubbish you made out from .we will never let your kind to even own govern is own family because it will be tantamount act ..forgodskake are you trying hard just to make a speech and get recongnised you made a comment did you watch the videos how nigerians were burnt alive now you are here talking about job ..... Job finish you there...

Pls someone send this man to sabisa forest to save him a job

preshdoh:
Should I go and impregnate my landlord's daughter

It is the best option it will automatically make you the caretaker of his house....

Go ye forth for i am with you

freemanbubble:
This are weak men
That is why sometimes he good make man dey smoke or womanize or drink alcohol. If you dey do any of this three ehnnnn suicide nor go fit come your mind


Nothing go make me commit suicide

No matter what because me i dey do the three things. I dey carry woman, I dey drink and i dey smoke weed.

When i check my result last year
Na so so F i see

Fortran F
Pascal F

Immediately na im i call my guy make he buy 1500 naira weed
Na so i smoke all night till 2am
Devil punish Uniben na me them want frustrate.
Las last i go dey alright because nor be only school them take dey better

I like ur style my bro...na thesame uniben we dey
Uniben cannot kill us
We just pray suicide nor many for school this semester sha

I Will be leaving this page for now for time sake and promise to return or replied mention and also gst to read all the comment fdom this page

It shouldn't be said i ran i know tao11 or what do they call him will take chances and even be happy to say i was humbly Defeated by him and i i had to quit....

But untill then tao11 provide me with not just quote or claims from international sources with references but artefact to show as proves
As backing and also pictures showinvg the centre of craft casting in ife

Yes the yoruba wore beeds since God knowns when yea all source claim so but no one has given or showed this bead that existed in the 10c they claim they discovered i need pictures not quote...quote and reference are gotten from claims which maybe wrong


Untill then see you all months from now

TAO11:
Except that you have not been able to disprove anything.

Haha i told you present me pictures showing the centres of ife art work production af ife


I also told you to provide ife sculpture dating to the 12c with stamp approval or from a reliable foreign source not just mere quote and references

Until then

TAO11:
That's exactly my point!

That is, even in the 15th century when beads were already in use, the use of other forms of necklaces is noticeable, let alone in the 1300s when beads were not yet in use according to Benin traditions.

And of course I already knew that I slaughtered, squashed, and erased you. You didn't have to admit the obvious.

It is palpably perceptible even to the deaf and blind that you're not a match. I am light years beyond your feather-weight league.

You see you keep on beliwving on people claims when it suit you ... Hahaa cunny man ....

I disproved the works of my kingsmen if there is need to

TAO11:
(1) Regardless of whatever you think you "know" in advance, I am not obliged to prove your own claims for you.

So, whether you are able or unable to defend your claims has nothing to do with me defending them for you.

Defend your claims, as highlighted for you from (a) to (f), because you made them.


(2) It is a contradiction to remark that a dating result is scholarly yet a mere claim scholar. You have to make up your mind. It is either scholarly (i.e., a redoubtable evidence) or a mere claim (attributable only to a layperson like yourself), but not possibly both.

So, like I have schooled you before now, a statement is a mere claim only when it is attributable only to lay persons like yourself.

Thus, it is not just a picture which necessarily makes a statement become factual, rather it is the authority and competence of the source to which the statement is attributable.

In sum, provide your evidence how ever you want to, provided the "evidence" is attributable to expert, scholarly, academic sources.


(3) You have just taken your first step towards truth by now admitting unequivocally that the oldest sculpture found in Benin kingdom dates to the 14th century.

In other words, you've just admitted that you've been lying all along when you've been claiming that Benin kingdom has artworks dating to the 12th century.

However, you still habour a significant chunk of dishonesty (even in the presence of evidence) when you added that the oldest Ife artworks also dates to the 14th century. Lol!

Your foregoing additional remark here is a clear laughable reflection of your bitterness and disappointment. It is obviously a we are going down together attitude.

But your additional remark is obviously false and unfounded because the first screenshot I attached shows the results (obtained by Willet and Flemming) of thermoluminescence dating of a number of Ita Yemoo (Ife) sculptures to circa year 1275.

Refer, one more time, to the first attached screenshot: Merrick Posnansky: "Review: Brass Casting and Its Antecedents in West Africa", The Journal of African History, Vol. 18, No. 2 (1977), p. 296.


Also, the second attached screenshot shows that a number of terracotta figures, from shrines in Ife, dates to circa year 1150 as well as to circa year 1060.

Refer, one more time, to the second attached screenshot: D. Calvocoressi & Nicholas David: "A New Survey of Radiocarbon and Thermoluminescence Dates for West Africa", The Journal of African History, Vol. 20, No. 1 (1979), p. 18.


I can only imagine how bitter and frustrated you must be feeling at this juncture.


(4) Here, I am not sure what language you're typing in when you noted that "terracotta works" means "pure works of assumptions".

Do you mind typing in English language?


(5) I do not require that you should thank me for spoon-feeding you, instead I really want you to reflect over your technological challenge and incompetence which is so bad that struggle to use "Google" (if you ever had any clue what that was).

Moreover, it is my prerogative to decide whether or not I would spoon-feed you whenever you beg to be spoon-fed.

What is necessary is that I provide detailed, sufficient, and relevant expert, scholarly, academic references in whatever manner I see fit. This I have consistently and repeatedly done.


(6) As I have shown with evidence, not merely did modern Ife people (or even West Africans more generally) know the "location" of those Ife ancient artworks (before others were excavated in the 20th century by the Europeans); the locals actually know what these artworks physically looked like and felt like, because it was always in their custody.

The Olokun head was in the Ebolokun grove, , while the the Obalufon mask and the Lajuwa head was in the custody of the Ooni at the palace.


Refer, one more time, to: "The Olokun Head Reconsidered" --- A publication of The British Museum cited in my earlier comment.


Refer, one more time, to: Page 4 and page 5 of the following publication of The University of Iowa Stanley Museum of Art found here: https://africa.uima.uiowa.edu/chapters/ancient-africa/ife/?start=0 for details of the foregoing information on the Obalufon mask and the Lajuwa head.

I am not sure how you do not see that the foregoing facts (even with your partial admittance) exposes your lie that it wasn't until the 20th century archaeological excavations that ancient artworks came to be known in Ife.


(7) Firstly, no German man excavated the Olokun head, you should go back to class.

Secondly, I would rather be an "owner" who willingly and freely chooses to sell whatever portion of what he owns (at a price determined under the fair invisible forces of demand and supply), than to be an owner who loses all he owns to daylight robbery under his nose, while he nurses the wounds of a punitive massacre; got expelled from his own residence; and continues to beg for the return of all he owns even up to more than one century later.

The latter "owner" sounds somehow like Benin kingdom and its government at the end of the 19th century, or is it?


(8 ) I am not sure why you tried to save-face and distract by attempting to drag the Igbos and the Hausas in as a substitute for the Binis.

No, I think the Binis should be able to debate the Yorubas as well ass defend their own claims without needing any help from the Igbos and the Hausas.

Moreover, that you or anyone merely make a claim is not one and the same thing as proving the claim. Quickly appreciate the difference between these two.


(9) What you've tagged as "questions" are actually not put forward as questions but as claims. The following are your precise words (with correction to your typos):

"Ife has no centre of its artwork origination. The sculptor who made the Ife artworks can't be traced. There is no no evidence that the ife art works were made in life."

It therefore becomes clear that what you put forward we're not question but loads of claims.

And as common sense should by now have informed you that it is you from who I should be demanding evidence for your claims and not the other way round.

So, defend your claims, as I had already highlighted them for you from points (a) to (f), because you made them.


(10) Okay, I "promise" not to expose you that you ran away after you became well exposed for the liar and ignoramus that you are.

I would kept your secret as a secret.


(11) Although your excuse here (that you reject any dating which spans two centuries) is in itself an embodiment of everything called "ignorance"; however, my point here was never about dating in the first place. I have dealt already with dating before that point, and I have alluded to it here again in point number 3.

My point actually was about the fact that the Lajuwa head and the Obalufon mask were in the custody of the Ooni at the palace. I referred you specifically to page 4 and page 5, NOT page 1. Refer to point number 6 here.


(12) As shown here in my point 9, what you put forward are not questions but loads of claims.

This is another opportunity to ask you to provide the evidence for these claims you made, which in detailed form are as follows:

[s](a) Provide evidence for your lie that some Benin artworks have been dated to the 12th century (i.e., the 1100s), or even to the 13th century (i.e., the 1200s).[/s]

Now struck out because you just admitted in point 3 that you lied.

(b) Provide me evidence for your lie that Ile-Ife had no centre of production of artworks.

(c) Provide me evidence for your idiotic lie that there is no evidence that the Ife arts are Ife arts.

(d) Provide me evidence for your implicit claim that one artist made all the Ife arts spanning many centuries.

(e) Provide me evidence for your idiotic implicit claim that there is no known name to which any Ife artwork may be traced.

(f) Provide me evidence for the name of the artist who made the Benin artworks (in case you truly believe that one artist made them).

Laughable that is simply a pdf file done by anyone and refrenced it could even be a project work done by a Yoruba student in nigeria. he could decide to add and edit qorms he refrenced

Though i told you not to give me write ups or claims but sculpture to prove this art works date this period if necessarily stamps of aprroval like i did for the dwarfs

Must i get to say this all the time i could post a pdf file stating benin art date to 12c but it will be claims because no art works to prove it but only schloars writeup....

Can we now see it now pictures

The writter also mention that for pottery artwork made from clay or sand are difficult to take dating from which the terrocotta heads falls into most of writers you post quote from have not even see this artworks because they are few so they didn't even get to do carbon dating the only people who had access to this artworks are the british the rest probably had a protype of it thats why you go on net to search on ife art works same art works will be having different dating because of poor research work the german who wrote about the ife art after trying to purchase the olokun head and failed went back to germany to write on the art work and hw even dated it without no carbin dating research


Also regarding the ife art saying it widely known in africa before the arrivalc of the britsh is a fallacy

Yes i made my statement in claims and ask you to defend it but instead you are throwing it back. are you indirectly saying you cant prove my , claims wrong that am right i thought u were praised by your colleagues that you are a great yoruba scholar lol
What a shame all you have is claims pdf no proves

I have a claim that art works were done during the ogiso time back 3c can i post it .
Lol


You rather sell your artwork for a price art work that is scared to your peopls religion thia this statement come as a result of pride or your own reasoning

Hmm ooh my ....you bleeped

[quote author=TAO11 post=81610382]The fact that the king owned the dwarf who (according to the accompanying documents you attached) served as a palace clown and errand servant makes the dwarf his slaves and not a member of his family.


Moreover, there is NO source in any language which gives the definition of "royalty" as:

[/i]A person whom the king owns as his servant or clown.[/i]

No, the definition of "royalty", whether by Merriam-Webster or by the dictionary which you yourself attached, remains:

A person who is a MEMBER of the king's FAMILY.


So, saying that the dwarf wore a beaded necklace to wherever he goes is to commit a logical fallacy known in argumentation as circular reasoning or begging the question.

In other words, you do not include the conclusion which you are expected to prove as an assumption in your premise.


Regarding your waiting:

The dictates of analytical logic does not demand, in any way, shape, or form (in this context) that, I particularly point out the nature of the necklace material adorned by the dwarf, provided I demonstrate (in other ways) that he certainly did not adorn a beaded necklace.


In contrast, it is you who are obliged to demonstrate, with evidence, that the dwarf was adorning a beaded necklace.

And so far, I have demonstrated from the "status" of the dwarf (i.e., a palace clown and errand servant who, thus obviously, was NOT A MEMBER OF THE KING'S FAMILY --- that is, NOT A "ROYALTY" ); and the dating of the artefact itself (i.e., dating to the 1300s --- a century earlier than the period admitted in Benin tradition as relating to the introduction of beads' use in Benin kingdom by Ewuare1) that the dwarf certainly was not adorning a bead.

And to bolster and corroborate my argument, I have demonstrated with pictorial evidence that certain Benin sculptures ardon necklaces made of materials other than beads, such as leopard's teeth



You showed a sculpture of the 15c showing leopards teeth when at the 15c bead were seeing in all sculpture too


Am done you won biko...

Olu317:
As far as I am concerned, you can defend ypur identity as regard Edoland and I don't doubt the fact that Oba Binu was absolute in authority over his domain in that era, with a totalitarian monarchial system. But let us not mix the identities of royal blood and slave up because :

1. Freeborn is different from a slave though can become a servant.

2. Freeborn can become a slave if being captured by another kingdom which isn't of his/her ancestral home land. And this isn't in contention

3. A dwarf of Oba Binu lineage's (doubt it) can't be a slave nor be under a law which would had made him a royal guard. Though can be a Prince warrior son who may go on expedition or some sort to found a new kingdom e.g Ora in Edo land.

4. There is a difference between royalty and commoners in the ancient time . In fact, certain names are purely restricted within noble and royal bloodline.

5. Yes, there are times that a slave or servant assumes the position of Oyatse in Bini kingdom,which is as a result of war persecution or great exploits in the old Binuland.

6.You need understand that there were two different dynasty that existed in Edoland, which were, Pre and Post 1170AD , according to Binu chronology. Oramia(Oranmiyah) era was actually seen as the era of Oba, which falls within the era of Lost Wax in West Africa.


7. Beads production in Yoruba people had been in Bc Beside because there are prototypes of alloy works,terracotta, Clay etc outside Africa. In fact, similar sculpture art works are found in Near East

Please i want to see the exact to this terracotta works most times i get to see claims on tge treccotta artworks eg 12 to 15c like kilode is that what the machine reads or is what tge yoruba claim untikk then the okdest art work with sustainable adequate date 14c and no more the others are claims


I like the fact that you see what i tried to portray to your brother toaf abi sister ....
I just simply drew a logical explanation to why that guy might have been wearing beeds even when it is a known fact in benin history that dwarfs are Royal by law he doubted and i brought out possible reasons too..

Your brother toaf is too cunny he comes with quote from sources and reference's and never post the links to the source like who does that? then when ask he tells me to go read the book or find the link my self...this claims he would present with authority .
The same claim i made that ceremonial sword was made during the ogiso era he doubted even it came from edo site but he expect me to believes is claim becsuse he attach foreign reference....

I have decided not to respond to him again

TAO11:
(1) Oh ye dummy, I am only obliged to substantiate my own claims and not yours.

You need to prove your own lie that Benin kingdom has artworks dating to the 12th century (i.e., the 1100s)".
Produce the proof for your own lie, I can't wait no more.

For the record again, the few OLDEST known Benin artworks date to the earliest of the 14th century (i.e., the 1300s).


Moreover, my own claim which I am obliged to defend now with expert, scholarly, academic evidence is that "many Ife artworks date to the 1200s and others to centuries earlier", thus making Ife artworks earlier than the oldest known Benin artworks dating to the 1300s.


Firstly, in a peer-reviewed journal article published in the prestigious "The Journal of African History" under the title "Review: Brass Casting and Its Antecedents in West Africa", it becomes clear that "the results of thermoluminescence dating ... obtained by Willett and Fleming" for some "Ita Yemoo (Ife) figures" date to circa year 1275, and some others from the same site to latest of circa 1440.

Refer to the first attached screenshot of the relevant page from:

Merrick Posnansky: "Review: Brass Casting and Its Antecedents in West Africa", The Journal of African History, Vol. 18, No. 2 (1977), p. 296.


Furthermore, in another peer-reviewed journal article published in the same prestigious "The Journal of African History" under the title "A New Survey of Radiocarbon and Thermoluminescence Dates for West Africa", it becomes clear that certain Ife figures have been dated to circa year 1150, and to circa year 1060.

Refer to the second attached screenshot of the relevant page from:

D. Calvocoressi & Nicholas David: "A New Survey of Radiocarbon and Thermoluminescence Dates for West Africa", The Journal of African History, Vol. 20, No. 1 (1979), p. 18.


It becomes clear, therefore from the foregoing, that Ife artworks date not just to the 1200s, but farther to the 1000s (and perhaps even much farther).


(2) Regarding my earlier reply to your lie that Ife artworks were unknown until the Europeans' 20th-century excavation. I had noted that, prior to the first archaeological excavation conducted in Ife in 1910, it was already known that the ancient Ife people had artworks.

To substantiate my statement, I made reference to three artworks namely: the Olokun Head, the Obalufon mask, and the Lajuwa head.

I am disappointed that even with my mention of these names, you still had no clue about anything whatsoever that these heads relate to, yet you want to have a discussion on Ife Art. Really?


But even as ignorant as I knew you to be, I expected that would have been proactive and simply do the obvious. But since you lack the initiative I would say, going forward, you should always do the work yourself (rather than requesting for help to be spoonfed) by typing those names viz. the Olokun Head, the Obalufon mask, and the Lajuwa head into an internet search engine known as "Google". This "Google" then provides you with a number of options from which you can then make a choice depending on the authority, detail, etc. of the information provided.

So that you know when "Google" comes up, it looks something like is seen in the third screenshot below.


However, choosing on my own volition to spoonfeed you at this time, consider the following information on the Head of Olokun, showing that it was already known as an Ife Art even before the first archaeological excavation conducted in Ife in the 20th century.


The following words are from a joint publication by experts at The British Museum's entitled "The Olokun Head Reconsidered":

"... the ‘Olokun’ head ("figs. 1 & 2" ) was first shown to the German ethnographer and traveller, Leo Frobenius on his arrival in Ife in 1910 ..."

This shows definitively that this head was already well-known by the natives particularly (and as will be seen by West Africans more generally) even before Leo Frobenius will conduct the first archaeological excavation in Ife in the year 1910.

Moreover, the publication continues:

"In the course of his travels through West Africa in 1908 L. Frobenius heard frequent stories of a wonderful statue of the god Olokun located in Ife ... Medieval Ife had been an important city state in West Africa which flourished as a commercial, political and spiritual centre with access to lucrative trade networks ("Johnson 1921" ). L. Frobenius travelled to Ife in 1910, visited numerous sites and started excavating and uncovering an impressive collection of stone and terracotta art works. After repeated enquiries about the statue, he was taken out to the Ebolokun, an extensive grove dedicated to Olokun, the god of wealth and the sea, and shown not a statue but a brass head. In Frobenius’ words ("Frobenius 1913: 98" ) ‘Before us stood a head of marvellous beauty, wonderfully cast in antique bronze, true to life, encrusted with a patina of ­glorious dark green’."

Refer here for details: https://journals.openedition.org/aaa/266#quotation

The authors include: Paul T. Craddock, Janet Ambers, Maickel van Bellegem, Caroline R. Cartwright, Julie Hudson, and Susan La Niece et Michela Spataro.


It becomes clear, therefore from the foregoing, that not only were ancient Ife artworks well known in Ife and Yorubaland, they are also well-known in the West African region more generally, even prior to their discovery by the Europeans.


Furthermore, refer to page 4 and page 5 of the publication of The University of Iowa Stanley Museum of Art (found here https://africa.uima.uiowa.edu/chapters/ancient-africa/ife/?start=0) showing respectively that the Lajuwa head and the Obalufon mask have always been kept in the king's palace.


(3) Regarding your last claims here, I must say that it is very obvious that you sound pained and frustrated. However, I leave it to you to prove your claim since it is you who made the claims rather than begin to refute you when you yourself haven't shown any intention of seriousness by attempting to bring forward anything that even remotely looks like an evidence or proof for the claims.


To close out on this, I like to very quickly remind of my opening request as well as issue new request to you in relation to your claims:

(a) Provide evidence for your lie that some Benin artworks have been dated to the 12th century (i.e., the 1100s), or even to the 13th century (i.e., the 1200s).

(b) Provide me evidence for your lie that Ile-Ife had no centre of production of artworks.

(c) Provide me evidence for your idiotic lie that there is no evidence that the Ife arts are Ife arts.

(d) Provide me evidence for your implicit claim that one artist made all the Ife arts spanning many centuries.

(e) Provide me evidence for your idiotic implicit claim that there is no known name to which any Ife artwork may be traced.

(f) Provide me evidence for the name of the artist who made the Benin artworks (in case you truly believe that one artist made them).

I know you wont be able to defend it nevertheless if i begin to defend the claims
that benin art date to the 12c i would only come out with mere claims from different scholars with no sculpture to prove it ....and thats what you have been giving me mere claims of scholars record not fact not evidence if i am to go that road just as you i will be an hypocrite of my own judgement
The oldest sculpture found in benin date 14c just thesame as ife oldest artwork this lives me a question which is oldest
Mind you don't come here and write ife terracotta works they are pure works of assumptions

I read trough the links thanks i want you to that often but you dont when you intend hiding the truth....

You were correct on the fact that ife knew some(not all as some were seen by Chance) of the location of their art works
Just as the olokon head and i got to read that the ooni and the custodian of the olokon shrine
Sold this art work to the German man who did the excavation it took the help of the britsh to return it ....haha

Little wonder why igbos and hausas refers to yorubas as slaves


Note if you can answer my previous question dont quote me anymore and mind you dont go around saying you defeated me and i ran


Regarding the second link it state that the sculpture rep a king of 11c or 12c which means it was not certain it was an account told by someone no research was done to determine the exact years of the artwork...

Did you see that approval i screenshot for you with stamp was there anything like 12 to 15c dont give me that please give me real date

I just left because you wont answer the question untill then