₦airaland Forum

Dayokanu, i think arguing with people like you can make one to fall ill. You points and examples are so naive and myopic that i am begining to wonder if you, ve ever been to school before. Anyway sha Christino has answered your question.

Donmayor, no be story i dey yarn, i mean what i am saying. I have met with graduates of statistics from UI, Ife, Ilorin, Unilag and Benin who were among the best graduates in their schools. One of them had a 1st class and the rest 2.1 and 2.2. Mind you i lived in Lagos and that was where i did my NYSC, so u can imagine the number of statistics/mathematics graduates that would be in lagos camp. I may not have met all sha but i met with a good number of them. You know statisticians are not as many as other professionals like accountants and engineers. Honestly some of them confessed to me that they never used computers in their universities. There is a particular course i took that is very fundamental in statistics; INDUSTRIAL STATISTICS & QUALITY CONTROL, i was surprised to hear from some of them that they did not do it. Yes, i agree with you that some university graduates are superb. That reminds me, when i was in my ND2, i had a corper lecturer from UNIMAID that took me that particular course STAT 217- industrial stats & QC; honestly she confessed to me that though they knew how important and relevant that course was they were not taught. But because she was good she was asked to take the course, and before you knew it she had read and brushed up industrial stats & QC and behold she was already teaching the course properly. I had a good text book on it then, and she decided to borrow the text book which really helped her. I must confess that my proper understanding and knowledge of industrial stats and quality control was as a result of that lady. I did the advance part of the course in my HND2 again and it was a work-over for me because that lady had given me a good foundation already in my ND. So ZEBUDAYA and DONMAYOR, we all need each other as i have said in my earlier posts before. When i was in school some postgraduate students especially MBA and MBF students were coming to meet me to teach them Quantitative Techniques, Quantitative analysis, decision analysis and some operational research techniques. Some of them still hail me till today because of the knowledge i imparted on them. That does not mean that every one with HND in stats would have been able to teach those guys, NO; they new what they wanted and where to get it without much stress that was why they patronized me. Infact some of my classmates would not have solved a simple quadratic or simultaneous equation for you; it may sound funny but that is the truth. Hey, some people in my class then could not write and run very simple QBASIC programs, and they had access to computers. Funny abi?? That means polytecnics and universities only teach us a certain percentage of what we need to know and not everything, while we do extra work on our own to know the remaining things that we were not taught. Obviously i was not taught all i know today in the polytechnic but with my own efforts i learnt so many things that even some of my lecturers taught no student would have known then, and most of them were consulting me too. Men i Love you guys and i really enjoyed every bit of this debate because it was an insult-free debate. I love the maturity we all displayed here. Cheers. Love to read your comments again.

If universities can be engaging the services of polytechnic lecturers to help them run their masters programs why cant the polytechnics run their own masters program? There is politics in nigerian educational system and policies.

Analytical and HH, you guys are rational, and i love chatting with people like you. I will not forget to hail my bros, HND-holder, who is really making this forum lively. Cheers!!!

Zebudaya, i should be asking you that question whether you people in the universities know what Excel, minitab and spss is?? It is well known that polytechnics run computer science and statistics programs with computer practicals. Infact most guys dat read statistics in the universities did not use computers to run the course, simply because they dont have computers. Guys with Bsc in computer science, mathematics and statistics have confirmed that to me already. But in the polytechnic NBTE will not accredit statistics and computer science at ND and HND levels if any polytechnic does not have a standard computer lab. My guy i don't only know how to use excel, minitab and spss to carryout statistical analysis, but i can as well write custom algorithms and programs to perform complex statistical analysis. I am a statistical programmer for your information, and i got such skills from the polytechnic i attended in nigeria. You hear?? The relevant and important courses i did in the polytechnic, Bsc ststistics graduates did not do some of them. You can ask any of them; i have seen the course work for Bsc statistics in O.A.U. Ife and UI, they cannot withstand those of us that have HND in statistics. Let any Bsc Statistics graduate from any Nigerian university come out and defend Bsc statistics graduates, i swear i will bring you people out. For your information almost all the stats courses we offered had computer applications.

Zebudaya, do you want us to start listing courses offered by poly and uni in mechanical engineering or any field in science and technology?? Polytechnics do the science and technology of engineering, although with much bias in technology. Pally dont talk about what you dont know about. Pls if you know anybody that read Bsc Statistics or computer science, ask the person to list all the course he/she offered from 100 level to 400 levels in the university and i will list all the courses we offered from ND1 to HND2 in the polytechnic. I can bet with you that we do more statistics and more computer science in Nigerian polytechnics than u people in the universities. Lets list out the courses if you wish. As for engineering i can still do that too if you wish. list out your own let me see. Pally dont let us expose you people o. If you are ready list the courses lets see.

But na wa oo, so becos professor Wole soyinka teach you english that means to say you go sabi english pass oyibo people sef. Good talk. So if professor chike obi teach you mathematics you go sabi maths pass every other person on earth?? So where people wey soyinka teach english and chike obi teach maths dey now?? Why we no dey hear about them?? Pally you are being naive and talking from a myopic direction.

Hey, Analytical i'm enjoying you. So you actually started from poly too? Why did you not do HND? In the polytechnics we did borrowed courses from other departments too. Students in accountancy and bus admin, public admin, marketing etc. do biology, physics and chemistry as part of their course. Science and engineering students do economics, government, psychology, international relations, history of africa and so on. Dont you think all these also broaden the minds of polytechnic students?? you were a good polytechnic ND student i believe, so coping in the university would not have been a problem to you.

HAHAHAHAHA, HND-holder you go kill me with laugh here. But that is the truth sha oo; i 4got to tell analytical that most professors and Doctors lecture post graduate students and not under graduates. Even in the polytechnic too we had professors who were also our lecturers. Dr. Asiribo (now professor Asiribo) in the Dept of Statistics, uni agric abeokuta was my lecturer in the polytechnic; he took us Design and Analysis of Experiment and Non-parametric statistical techniques in our 300 and 400 levels (HND I and II). All this professors and Doctors you talk about also lecture or teach in the polytechnics too. Funny enough some polytechnic products that have MSc and PHd now also teach in the universities as well. But really o, why is it that university graduates are always afraid and never comfortable each time they see polytechnic HND holders around them?? They always think we want to take over their jobs from them.

Analytical, you have spoken. I must confess I'm enjoying this debate with you. Yes, programming is just one aspect of computer science, agreed. So you have to agree with me too that university graduates and professors cannot know and do everything, but the way you people talk about professors potray them as people who know everything in this world. There are some things that are better done by polytechnic graduates. My point is this; university graduates and their professors cannot know or do everything better than polytechnic graduates. There are some things that are better left for the polytechnic graduates to handle. You have your own role to play as an engineer while the engineering technologist has his own role to play in any engineering project. And no engineering project can be done without technicians and technologist. Let me ask you one question; can you do the job of an engineering Technologist??

And so what if seun is a 1st class elect engineering graduate from ife? Dont we have people with Distinction in engineering from polytechnics?? We also have poly graduates that have built websites too. Polytechnic engineering technologist do a lot too. Engineer zebudaya, polytechnics do engineering Technology better than universities. Engineering requires good practical skills which the polytechnic graduates posses and not theory. And for accounting practical you are exposed to real-life government, industrial and company accounting and auditing which makes you practically better in accounting and auditing jobs. Hey accounting departments in the polytechnics have accounting Labs where they carry our practical accounting and auditing.

hey pally it does nt matter, atleast POLYTECHNIC OF NAMIBIA ranks higher than all the universities in nigeria and most of the univesities in africa. I still stand by my word that university graduates are not better than polytechnic graduates. Stop all these about professors. Does a professor turn people into genius?? I expect all uni graduates to be geniuses becos they were tutored by professors. Rubbish!! A Professor in computer science that cannot write a functional C++ or Java program is of no use to the computing and IT world, whereas a Diploma holder in computer that can write out algorithms and programs in C++ and Java to solve real life problems is of significance to the computing and IT world.

I wonder for nigeria and nigerians oo.

Donmayor, does coming from a wealthy family make a person a genius?? Bill gates was not a genius because he came from a wealthy family. He was determined to excel and he excelled above all his pairs. Is it every child that comes from a wealthy home in Nigeria that is intelligent or a genius?? Bill Gates was neither a university nor polytechnic graduate but yet he was able to do what professors could not have imagined or thought of doing. Lets not use our Degrees and Diplomas to intimidate people; rather we should think of what to create or invent that would convince people that we are actually what we claim to be.

Analytical, i am not completely saying that professors are not well-knowledged; what i am saying is that some professors in nigeria are not worthy to be called professors. Some of them got there by virtue of academic politics and not by virtue of academic excellence. But in an ideal situation as you,ve said professors are supposed to be better than every other person in the academics.

With God all things are possible.

Yes, you have made good points. But I will not agree with you that professors are better than people who are not professors. Is Bill Gates a professor?? NO, but he has written algorithms as well as designed compilers and operating systems. Infact he designed and developed the most widely used operating system in the world today Microsoft windows, and yet he has no Bsc nor PHD in computer science from any college or university.
The problem is with the university graduates; they always believe they are better than polytechnic graduates, and that they cannot have anything in common; so help us tell them or else we will always tell them that they and their professors are not better than ND holders, which incidentally is true because there are so many things the professors cannot do that the ND holder can do (atleast some ND holders can write functional C++ and Java programs which some professors in computer science cannot do). As long as they claim superiority over polytechnics we will make sure we prove them wrong and bring them out. Imagine someone using entry requirements to judge quality. What a naive statement!! Is it possible?? If it's possible then people with distinctions in their o’level subjects should always graduate with distinction or first class too. Enough is enough, no Bsc holder should say that he/she is better than HND holders, else they will not find rest. Let them ask themselves if their right eyes are better than their left eyes. Let's prove ourselves on neutral ground academically and practically.

Look at this one, you want to use professors and input to judge. Which professors are you talking about?? is it the political professors we have in nigeria today that know nothing about advancements in science & technology?? All they have in their brains has to do with 1960's and 1970's. They are not better than non-professors, i totally disagree with you. I have seen a professor in computer science that could not write a working C++ and Java program and yet he is a professor in computer science, whereas even people with ND in computer science will write working programs with those languages. The professor's excuse was that he has never tried learning those languages because they were not available during his time. Keep that one aside i beg. And secondly, if you want to use input to judge why is that those with 8 or 9 distinctions that go into the university dont always graduate with 1st class?? Some people with C6 in 5 o'level subjects even beat them hands down with their distinctions. It will be very naive of you to believe that your entry qualification (input) determines your graduating grade (output) in this case. That law of gabbage in gabbage out does not hold here. Look for something better and tell us jo.

Zebudaya, HND has never been inferior to a Bsc. It is you and the society that believes that anything that does not come from the university is inferior. We have proved you and your cohort wrong long ago; we reject that claim. Prove yourself is the most important thing. My broda, dont even try comparing what you learnt in the university with what we did in the polytechnics. We have seen your course curriculum and have been able to compare and contrast. Sorry, you people did less work than we did, and as such we cannot agree that Bsc graduates know better than HND graduates. We have enough evidences to give to you. Ask ICAN they will tell you. That is why we beat most of you hands down in tests and interviews. And for your information we do our courses with practicals in the polytechnics. Lastly we dont need to go and get a Bachelor's degree which we consider to be less in quality than our HND, rather we will go ahead to do PGD and Msc in the university. And i dont think you you are better than any polytechnic HND graduate in your field. What course did you read anyway??

get my point. University is a theoretical school while university is a practical school. How do you expect someone that knows the theory of computing for example to teach very well practical computing? I dont think its possible. You can only teach people something you know about and not what you dont know or cannot do. thats why i said govt should make it in such a way that you must have passed thru poly 1st b4 you can be allowed to lecture in the polytechnic. Polytechnics should churn out practical graduates.

What are they waiting for? Let Ribadu arrest him now? Abi dem want till him die b4 dem go start worry him family the way they did to Abacha's family? This is the right time to arrest IBB.

Nurenga, we are all proud HND holders . And as for employment, we will make sure very soon that only polytechnic graduates are allowed to teach in polytechnics and work in NBTE. How do you expect uni graduates to give polytechnic students the practical skills they need? Is it not when you know something that you will be able to impart it into others?? That is why these days you see lazy polytechnic graduates, they were all taught by university graduates.

tako muyiw:
i believe that instead of trying to find out which is the superior qualification ,hnd or bsc. hnd holders should spend more time in proving their worth.

PALLY WE HAVE PROVED OURSELVES SEVERAL TIMES. DO YOU WANT US TO STILL DO IT AGAIN?? OK FIND OUT FROM ICAN HEADOFFICE.

Remember, with God all things are possible.

Let all nigerians stand up against IBB. Let him face the law like charles taylor and saddam hussein.

This maxtor HDD is funny o; my own just crashed last week; I tried replacing it with another maxtor that i have known to be good but it became bad suddenly too. Please were MAXTOR HDD programmed to fail in 2006?? I have replaced the HDD with a different brand which is working now. But i lost every data in the fucking maxtor HDD.

But come oo, why is it that most polytechnic lecturers are university graduates? Do you think they can give the polytechnic students the practical experience they need?? Is it that HND graduates cannot teach? Because from my little experience, you can only teach people something you know and can do well, not something you dont know. Its already affecting polytechnic graduaates because some of them if not most, were taught by uni graduates. I think its high time NBTE looked into that issue. Funny enough they employ HND holders as instructors in the polytechnic while Bsc holders are employed as lecturers. Charity begins at home oo. let the polytechnics stop discriminating their own products too . Pls HND-holder take note of this and help us pass it to NBTE, let them do something about it. Let them make it in such a way that, if you must lecture in the polytechnic you should have passed thru the poly system.

Please i need help from hardware gurus. I just assembled a new system, and everything seems to be working fine except the USB ports and the floppy disc controller. I have gone to setup and enabled both, but if i connect a floppy drive the system does nt recognise it. I have 6 USB ports and none is working. If i connect any USB device it does nt see it and it and the computer displays an error message that the USB has a malfunction. Please what do you think could be the problem?? I need responses from you guys please.

some of them are trying sha.

Donmayor, its funny oo; so you dont believe anything could work in nigeria? And secondly you dont believe in nigerian higher institutions. Well i agree with you to some extent. Things are that bad in nigeria that even the legal system itself is not left out. But we are praying for things to change for better.

wholex i wish you a safe trip down to kd. u can get me on this line. i dont have a fone 4 now. let me know when u get to kd. send a message to my box. ishmaelxy@yahoo.com

omosefe, i know where your office is. i know constitution road very well. i stay in kaduna south. i'll give you a suprise visit one of these days. pls give me your e-mail address and your gsm/office phone no. i'll give you a suprise call. cheers!!