₦airaland Forum

chukwudi44:
please elaborate are you saying that the Apostles played politics in the formation of the church.

what made u think the church foundation is faulty,the scriptures explicitly declared in1 Tim 3:15 that the church is the pillar and foundation of truth.JESUS himself declares in matt 18 that the gates of hell shall never prevail against his church ,are u trying to say that the scriptures did not get it right there.

sorry to disapoint you,these churches did not exist parallelly with the roman catholic church rather they broke away from the cathjolic church,the oriental orthox churches like ethiopian ,armenian and coptic orthodox churches broke away after the council of chalcedon in 451 CE,The greek orthodox church with the rest of the other orthodox churches left the church in 1054 CE.

SEE THE LINKS BELOW

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oriental_Orthodoxy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East-West_Schism

kUNLE!! KUNLE!! KUNLE !!!

How many times did I call u,you are gradually moving towards heresy,gnosticism was a second century heretical belief that was condenmed by the early church fathers most notably St Ireneaus of Lyons in his work Against the heretics written in 175 CE,

The roman catholic,eastern orthodox,oriental orthodox and indeed all branches of Apostolic christianity do not subscribe to gnosticism

My brother you don't seem to be able to distinguish between the church as a body of christ and the instituitionalized roman catholic church that was established under the political influence of emperor constantine of Rome. It is very wrong to suggest that the apostles established the roman catholic church. We also know from biblical records that the roman catholic church is NOT the first church as the pualine letters depict. We have the Galatian church, ephesian church, colossian church, corithian church e.t.c all operating under the supervision of he apostles long before the roman catholic church was instituitionalized and politics brought in to the church. Early pointers to the establishment of the Ethopian church is even recorded in the Acts of the Apostles this is long before the establishment of the catholic church in the fourth century AD.

I am very proud of my father land too despite all the crooks in goverment and the curse of bad leaders we have.

OBVIOUS:
peace unto you, I am Gnostic too! But I mix some African traditional practices with my Christianity---- There is also a book of Mary Magdalene---- I think.

That is nice to know, can you educate me on your essential beliefs as a gnostic christian as opposed to the orthodox variation. Also to what extent do you mix African traditional beliefs with your christianity and what is the basis for the mix. As in are they scripturally compatible?

Pastor AIO:
Gnosticism itself is very wide and varied. I think you might be repulsed by some of the Gnostic traditions, as you are attracted by others.

A interesting scholar to start with is Elaine pagels.

http://www.pinn.net/~sunshine/book-sum/gnostic.html

It might also interest you to check out Neo-Platonism.

Thanx for the link very eye opening, still thirsty for more knowledge though.

tensor777:
The figures for GDP are pretty accurate since of couse they don't by definition include remittances but rather the total value of goods and services produced in a country.
So what they count are exports and goods and services produced and consumed locally.
Of course you don't expect them to include proceeds from activities like 419 and drug trafficking.

The figures can't possibly be accurate as at least 50% of the economic activities is informal and illegal sector which does not go recorded. Most Nigerains don't make tax returns hence goverment is not able to capture this activity a record it as a part of our GDP. Calculation of GDP does not allow for estimates only officially recorded data is acceptable. But whilst over 90% of economic activites is captured and recorded in the western world less than 50% is captured in countries like Nigeria hence our GDP figures are faulty. I think the problem is the econmic fathers employing the same standards for all countries irrespective of their level of development. However this leads to faulty economic planning as the realities on ground are not captured. For instance in 2001 when MTN first rolled out their network in Nigeria they planned to build a much smaller network based on the low GDP and per capita income figures they were supplied with, it took them only three months to realize thiere was something wrong with the figures as their revenue projections for one year was surpassed in only three months, they went back to the drawing board and expanded but they could't keep up with the demand which they already planned for base on our faulty GDP figure. This then made the then MD of MTN to declare that our GDP figures must be grossly understated as the Average revenue per subscriber then was even higher than some supposedly richer european countries. Today MTN Nigeria is by far richer than it's parent company in South Africa even though there is a lot more competition in Nigeria [over 20 operational telcos] as opposed to only four operators in South Africa. This is even a pointer to the fact that Nigeria's GDP is potentially larger than South Africa's cause G.S.M business penetrates all levels of the economy and revenues derived from there is a good reflection of the strength of the economy in real terms becos the income from the informal and illegal sectors which GDP doesn't capture goes into G.S.M revenues as such a good statistican can determine a more accurate GDP using the average percentage of income spent on telecommunications by Nigerians and extrapolating it to get a more accurate figure

Based on my studies and research on the christian belief system, i remain convinced that most churches have strayed away from the true gospel / teachings of Jesus christ either deliberately, by ommission or for lack of knowledge. I also know that a lot of politics went into the establishment of the first Instituitionalized church[catholic] who then decided which books they wanted to cannonize as scripture. Most christian denominations today especially in the western world and their former colonies derive their roots in the catholic church of which i believe the foundation is faulty. But then there were other churches that evolved parrallely with the catholic church this are mainly the ethopian church, coptic church, syrian church, Armenian church, greek orthodox church e.t.c Amongst these denominations, we have those who subscribe to the gnostic beleif system which essentially preaches you can attain salvation through knowledge and spiritual development. They also have a few other cannonized scripture rejected by the catholic church[for what ever reason] such books as the "gospel of Thomas" which i find very inspirational was rejected by the catholic church.

As a christian i have come to understand that we know very little and the quest for knowledge is a never ending one, unfortunately most christians believe that every thing there is to know is already contained in the catholic cannonized bible even when scripture makes it clear that a lot of information is left out[John 21:25] I subscrbe to the gnostic belief system that knowledge is essential for our spiritual development however i know very little about gnostism a such i would like to interview a gnostic christian wo might be able to shed more light on their belief system.

Inviting foreign pastors to preach in their jamborees crusades is also a good marketing strategy becos of the complex Nigerians have for Europeans/Americans. We assume just becos the pastor is a foreigner he has some special "annointing" which is not available locally. Nigerains are guarranteed to troop there if they see an oyinbo face. And as we all know these crusades are very good psyco therapy sessions were the congregation are eventually cajoled into parting with large sums of money under various guises in the belief they are giving to God. Also a substantial unbiblical honourarium is also collected for the foreign preacher as his own reward for helping boost the revenue drive of the crusaders.

playboy08:
much around. alive and kicking.may i help u?

How was your vacation in hell?

Pastor AIO:
I am without doubt that without the apocrypha it is next to impossible to get the context of the gospels and those that read about Jesus without knowledge of the apocrypha are getting a different picture altogether.

That is a very strong allegation you have made above. Can you please explain the reasons why you are so convinced and also what the proper unerstanding of the gospel of Jesus should be in your understanding.

@Deepsight/ Pastor AIO
When you guys have the time i would like to to read this article http://www.modernghana.com/news/247818/1/the-jews-lied-against-africa-to-ascend.html makes interesting reading with very strong logic. Even though some of the submissions can be faulted it is a real eye opener. Would like to read your comments on it.

This concept of belief in the bible is faulty and not necessarily "christian" i think what is more important is belief in the gospel of our lord Jesus christ and obeying his commandments. that is what makes us christians and not belief in the bible which contains so many things that is not in tune with the gospel of christ[especially in the old testament]. The jewish religion and practises which forms most part of the old testament is quite different from the teachings of christ. As christians i believe we should focus more on the gospel of christ than the bible as a whole which is just a collection of books cannonized by religious leaders in their opinion. I am not discounting the bible here but it would help if christians get the focus of their beliefs right. The bible is just a tool to help us develop our faith it is not meant to be what we believe in.

jolian:
I think Rev.King is a real Man of God. I am from Lagos Nigeria the incident of having sex in Kiriki Maximum all stories are fake, And I still believe that his transfer from Kuje to Kaduna shall still be as a result of wickedness to Government, because all allegation against Rev. King is not True. We Nigeria is aware. So we are waiting for Government to release him ooooo and I shall visit his church, because he is the only man of God I have seen that is real.

hostin:
I hear say the man dey cure HIV/AIDS and all manners of diseases even there in the prison he still does great miracles and i am too sure that it maybe the reason why all the inmates follows him. This man too much and he is the kind of treasure that this country needs to become number 1 in the whole world. Make Almighty God fire all those bad bad people them when dey say all the lies again rev king. yes ooooooooooo

hostin:
If after all the pressure and criticism that Nigeria media have done to remove the mind of people from rev king and the man of God still controls the minds of Nigerians then the man must be the SON of God because even the president of Nigeria or any personality have not been able to do that. This man is innocent and the earlier the Government or court grant him bail and punish his accusers the better it will become for the country to prosper. After all said and done this man rev king still rule as king anywhere he goes. My respect to him and all that believed in him

Dukin:
If that is the case that Rev. King is controlling minds Nigerians even in jail which means the Lord has given Rev. King the Authority and Power over every Man kind on earth, so let it not been surprised to any body on earth, because even in Heaven all the Angels recognized Rev. King as the person whom the Lord has given his authority to all Man kind.

If the Man in prison can control minds of Nigerians even in jail which mean the Man is not an ordinary Man, I have to believed what he said that he is God in Black skin through this summary of this discussion topic.

I have believed the Man now. And I will go to his Church in fact I will worship him.

O boy na waoooooo the Man na the Lord ooooooo look at things.

Who is this demon possessed idiot registering different user names to defend Satan's chief represenatative in Nigeria The vampire's travails has just started, his accomplices and masters are eagerly waiting for him in hell were they would burn together forever in eternity.

AjanleKoko:
Hmm. Are you saying the World Bank is infallible? To a large extent, I suspect those statisticians will base their estimates on published remittance figures from agencies like Western Union, as well as surveys and interviews with a sample of Nigerians in the Diaspora. That's guaranteed to be off the mark, as a lot of people would probably not let on just how much they send home informally.

But that's not the point anyway. Whether $10bn or $2bn, I am much more concerned about our so-called stated GDP. We say we generate, what, $180bn GDP locally? My question is, how?
Now I'm no economist but. . . when you look at our local economy, we don't really produce anything. We export oil and natural gas, and government taxes multinationals, which form like 90% of tax-paying business. The banking sector to a large extent depends on government funds, individuals and SMEs to a large extent do not pay tax, or are undertaxed, and nowadays government is not even financing infrastructure projects anymore. We have a huge unemployed labour force, very few small-scale enterpreneurs, and hardly any infrastructure that can support growth.
To a large extent, government revenue, either from oil proceeds or IGR, is likely to be repatriated as we don't even have local expertise to support government projects. They hire foreign contractors for just about everything, or even spend more by their so-called local-content policy, which merely creates a class of middlemen or brokers. To cut a long story short, the bulk of the funds in the system finds its way out to other economies.

If the $180bn story is true, I'd like to know what it is made up of. Maybe you guys can provide some insights. But I suspect that, just in the same way that local funds are largely outside the banking system, this so-called GDP may just be made up of a significant chunk of repatriated funds from Nigerians abroad!

Gross Domestic Product[GDP] is the total value of goods and services produced in an economy within one year net of external trade. It gives a fair idea of the size of the economy of the country in perspective. However to know the real or average impact on it's citizens we also have what we call the per capita income which is the GDP divided by the population of that country. In our case our per capita income currently stands at $1200 per person[capita] which is really small. What this means is that the average Nigerian earns $1,200[N180,000] per anum. So in real terms whilst $180 billion dollars might sound like a lot of money, for a country with the population of Nigeria it is still very small. In the U.K their per capita income is over $60,000 whilst our neighbouring Ghana per capita is almost $3,000.


PS: The above figures of Nigeria's GDP are merely official figures which are far from accurate, it is my opinion that our GDP is much higher than that.

adconline:
Kunle

[color=#990000]Well it is not a good comparison to use federal budget to compare remittances from abroad if you really want to know how much
This is a skewed reasoning. Why not compare what govt spends annually with what diasporans send home annually? You are still not accepting the fact that folks in diaspora contribute immensely to theNigerian economy. Going by your $180b analysis, $10 billion represents 5.5% of the GDP. So you projection of $360 billion as real GPD without taking into account what folks in diaspora send to Naija via unofficial means like carrying raw cash, sending of goods like cars, trucks, wears, computers etc which could could easily be up to $50 billion. So this is still a substantial gain for Naija economy. compare what naija spends in a year with what folks in diaspora send to Naija in a year. This is no rocket science

There is no point in deceiving ourselves what your diaspora folks send home is just a tiny fraction of our GDP[economy] it might be a lot to some of you who personally receive it but in the larger economic picture, it is no biggie. You would be amazed the number of Nigerians sending money to support their relatives abroad especially in this times of global meltdown. Comparing remmitance with federal budget alone is very shallow and narrow minded as the federal budget is not a good measure of the level of economic activity in this country.

sara j:
There is a new movie coming out in
November about alien abductions
that allegedly took place in Alaska.
The name of the movie is the fourth
kind and it is was written and directed
by Olatunde Osunsanmi and stars Milla
Jovovich.
It looks really interesting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fourth_Kind

Any news about the above stated film? is it out yet? Looking forward to it. I watched the 2012 movie yesterday it's a sci-fi movie based on a distorted interpretation of the 2012 end date of the Mayan calendar. The film was really mind blowing.

Godmother:
I read a book last week and what I saw really shocked me. Okay, I agree with the Bible's perspective that the wife should be submissive to the husband, but I heard a new twist to it. For the wife to be submissive in finance, she has to hand over her paycheck to the husband. How true is this. Personnally, I dont think I can do this o. What do you guys think?

No true man worth his salt would even think of asking for his wife's pay check. Whoever wrote that book is a complete disgrace to the male specie. A man should in addition to what ever his wife is earning give to her additional money to at least take care of the home and the children if any. That is not to say a woman should not contribute to the up keep of the house though.

jagunlabi:
Is that a recruitment for the 72 virgins jobs in islamic heaven?I wonder . . .

he probably can't wait to get to heaven before he starts enjoying his own 72 200 virgins harlots.

[quote author=A_K_O link=topic=352044.msg4929251#msg4929251 date=1258290792]Abuzola, a little bit of reason [/b]and [b]self-respect would go a long way.[/quote]Islam does not give any room for reasoning

Pastor AIO:
The Lord shall provide. Can your church not afford to put you on the payroll. Other pastors are getting paid. Even visiting pastors from other churches are getting paid. Are you a mugu?

Abi oh!! don't mind him after all when he starts helping himself to all the tithes, offerings and gifts he would be collecting he won't solicit our advice on NL on how to jollof the money.

Beaf:

Another big up to our folk in the diaspora, sending home a cool [size=14pt]61%[/size] of the proposed N2.46 Trillion budget for 2010 is no joke!

Total federally collected revenue is actually in excess of N6 Trillion, although this revenue is shared btw federal, state and local goverments. The rest goes into our foreign reserves. So stop making a shallow comparision of just federal Goverment's share of it. The diaspora impact is actually very insignificant in the bigger economic picture. Nigerians actually remit more money abroad than comes into this country.

Pennywise:
You will be left with Lagos and Enugu. If you push 7 billion dollars in these two places, believe me you will know.

[size=24pt]^WORD!!!!!![/size]

RichyBlacK:
Nigeria's budget for 2009: N2.67 trillion
Remittance from Nigerians abroad: N1.53 trillion
And your point is?

Well it is not a good comparison to use federal budget to comapre remitances from abroad if you really want to know how much diaspora are contributing to the national economy. The ideal thing to use is a GDP comparision which i staed earlier. Our offical GDP currently stands at $180 billion. [GDP is total value of economic activity in the formal/legitimate ecomony] The truth is that our real GDP is at least double that cause a lot of economic activity in this counrty goes unrecorded. Our informal / illegitimate economy might actually be bigger than what formal / legitimate. in other wards our real GDP when our activities are factored in could be as much as $360 billion and that would make the $10 billion Diasopra are sending home to be a paltry 2.7% of out total economy. That to me is not capable of shaking the national economy

Well considering the fact that Nigeria's GDP is in excess of $180 billion [and that is taking into account only the legitimate and formal aspect of the economy which actually accounts for less than 50% of the National economy] one would realize that the so called $10 billion being sent home is peanuts. I would like a comparrison with how much is being siphoned out yearly, stashed away abroad by our politicians and sent to support our struggling brothers over there. I am sure this would be well in excess of the $10 billion our diaspora folks are getting excited about.

Nezan:
If the jets are needed for evangelism, why not?

How many of these criminals actually evangelize what they do is to jump from one existing church to the other with the aim of distorting scriptures to line their pockets. If they are truely interested in evangelizing why don't they start with the millions of lost souls in Nigerian villages and neighbouring countries who have not received the gospel? Rather they would rather go and preach in Nigerian churches abroad to people who have already received the gospel and milk them of their hard earned foreign exchange in the scam of contributing to "God's" work. If they are truely interested in evangelizing they should use the monies they are using to buy jets and finance their repulsive life style to build schools and hospitals were they would offer free services to people there as the early missionaries did. Through this show of unconditional love they would be able to win souls for christ and not by juncketing around the world with their ill gotten jets and oppressing the needy they have been mandated to take care of.

mavenbox:
@Aloy-Emeka: You're pointing fingers, and you're a believer? You don shit you no go fit pack am.

Being a beleiver as nothing to do with beleiving in scammers. A true christian should be able to discern a true man of God, unfortunately most of our brethen out there are being deceived. But in the case of you muslims, you guys have missed the plot entirely.

Wasn't it the same Orisetjafor that was involved in swindling Benny Hin[another crook] of $4 million along with his partner in crime Obembe? God is truely a patient God but we have aduty to expose these charlatans and robbers else they continue to destroy families with their greed.

Titus 1:11:
11 These false teachers must be silenced, because they are turning whole families away from the truth by their false teaching. And they do it only for money.

[quote author=Aloy~Emeka link=topic=350218.msg4905381#msg4905381 date=1257969251]Stop calling a man of God OLE, you sinner. Did he steal your money?. Don't let God trample you for abusing His righteous servant.[/quote]Righteous indeed i laugh in convoluted tongues, it is rogues like Oledepo that are giving chrisitanity a bad name. This is what the bible as in store for criminals like him.

2 Peter 2:1-3:
The Danger of False Teachers
1 But there were also[b] false prophets in Israel, just as there will be false teachers among you.[/b] They will cleverly teach destructive heresies and even deny the Master who bought them. In this way, they will bring sudden destruction on themselves. 2 Many[Aloy~emeka and Co] will follow their evil teaching and shameful immorality. And because of these teachers, the way of truth will be slandered. 3 In their greed they will make up clever lies to get hold of your money. But God condemned them long ago, and their destruction will not be delayed.

Gnike:
Men and brethren, there's no need to argue and point fingers. I totally understand where "dtruth" is coming from and we all should see it from his point of view. He never asked us to Worship the building, just to appreciate God's greatness in helping Africans, Nigerians to be exact to bring about something that has world recognition. I'm sure if any of us builds an ordinary house we thank God for it and give him the "glory" for helping us bring it to pass abi? So why is this now a thing that we should frown at. Some of us travel out of the country and go site seeing. When we see the sites we say "God is wonderful" is that not giving God the "glory"? Lets try not to be self righteous, and assume we know the scriptures too well. That was one of the mistakes of the Pharisees, they thought they knew and understood the scriptures more than anyone else. Let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he falls.

@ Dtruth, I give God the glory for the impartation of His Spirit that enabled the creation of such a wonderful edifice. To Him alone be the GLORY.

You must be on very cheap substances to think such a filthy building can glorify the almighty who created the heavens and the earth in the first instance. Did jesus ask us to be building monuments unto ourselves or did he ask us[christians] to use our resources to help the needy Here is what the bible as to say about so called "house of God" that our churches build to boost their egos.

Acts 17:24-25:

24 “He is the God who made the world and everything in it. Since he is Lord of heaven and earth, he doesn’t live in man-made temples, 25 and human hands can’t serve his needs—for he has no needs. He himself gives life and breath to everything, and he satisfies every need.

Acts 7:48-49:
48 However, the Most High doesn’t live in temples made by human hands. As the prophet says,
49 ‘Heaven is my throne,
and the earth is my footstool.
Could you build me a temple as good as that?’
asks the Lord.
‘Could you build me such a resting place?

[quote author=Aloy~Emeka link=topic=350218.msg4902493#msg4902493 date=1257945752]Oyedepo has no layoffs in his church and is not living in $4M home.[/quote]That is probabaly becos most of his church workers are not being paid in the first instatnce as they are being deceived that they are working for God and they would get their pay in heaven. That apart i am quite certain Oledepo's home must be worth at least $10 million as i am reliably informed that the crook has a private landing strip behind his house for his private Jets, that costs a lot to build. i don't even want to go into the cost of the jet or the several busin ess ventures he set up using money of deceived/gullible church memebers.

@Aloyemeka
What is the difference btw the crooks mentioned above and your bishop Oledepo?