₦airaland Forum

@DaviDylan: « #69 on: Today at 12:40:16 AM »

Quote from: mazaje on Yesterday at 11:55:41 PM
try again . . . where has it been established that tacitus did not declear authorship in the book? you are a stupid joke. . .


Its obvious u've never read or seen the book in question.
- There is NO mention of the name "tacitus" in the entire book.
- The earliest hint as to Tacitus being the author came a good 100 years after the book was written.

I repeat again, think before you post.

While you guys, are fighting on material issues which are different from the meat of the topic, I just can't but observe that David is nullifying the import of Tacitus, because his name is not directly link as the authorship of "the Book!"


David A_ _n_ _ _, of Ijebu Ode, please apply your mode of argument against Tacitus, exactly like that, to the Word "Trinity" in the Bible? It is not there. Hence it is a Fake!

If I answer yes, and you already agree that he killed innocent people, it is as if I say that Islam commands killing of innocents. And I do not know all his deeds intimately, except what the public provides. Therefore if I say know, it is as if I agree with the public image that is out there about him.

The truth is that I do not know. Only Allahs the truth about Osama's dealings. One thing I know is that there is no justification for taking innocent lives. And definitely no mass killings, either. Genocide is not allowed. Islam calls for mercy and forgiveness. Thats my Islam. Islam, even when political can not be radicalized. It does not call for destructions of lives. There is mercy and the least is justice or just dealing.

Before Osama bin Laden, there was Islam.

Now that we are talking bib Laden, Islam is still alive and well.

After bin Laden, Islam will be existing.

So it is peculiar that some people from your camp think Osama is makes or breaks Islam.

The idea is simply your fantasy that the success of Islam hinges on Osama. Islam is standing alone and does not depend on nobody.

Mosaic. Interesting.

You didn't say Jesus(aic). I guess there is no law, or disregarded, yet again by Pauline doctrine.


Mosaic law. Its sexual law will even be harsher than the muslims. The Mosaic has no flogging. Only stoning.

@Davidylan: « #30 on: Today at 04:26:18 AM » "Are you familiar with the Old Rocker Bob Dylan, and David Bowe?" Lol.

then how did Moses pray to "allah" who didnt even exist then?
Did he pray in coptic?

Since you guys say that Jesus is also the father and the spirit, in different parts, how did the nations of believers, even long time before prayed to "jesus (lol)" who didnt even exist then? Did the nation of believers led by say Noah, evn said Jehovah or Yahweh? Jesus must have been very very very very, remote to this people! I guess this will proof at least, that Jesus is no god! Isn't Arabic the language spoken in Ismailic Makka? Isn't Ismail the older brother of Isiaq? And isnt Ismail and isnt the younger brother Isiaq generation(s) very long before the Mosaic period?



I think that you should be smart enough to recognize that in every nation, there is a word in that language that can replace "Allah" of Islamic Arabic language usage. In Yoruba, it is Olorun. The Yorubas have even more that Olorun for Allah. They have, Oluwa, Eleda, Olodumare, etc! In each, it is clear to the Yorubas that this "entity" that they believe is the Creator is unlike anyone who has ever graced the earth, before. This simple fact will eliminate Jesus in the possibility of being that "entity" that the Yourubas call Eleda. Even the Osun worshippers of Orile Kingdom of "Hotfunmi" know that the Osun is not the Eleda, though they worship the same Osun. Its their belief that Osun will be the carrier as a small god and intercessor/conduit of their "total condition" to Olodumare.

The same concept that the Osun worshipper has is the same concept that the Christian has in their worship of Christ. The only difference is that Christ was a Messenger/Prophet of Allah, with a Book of revelation known as "Good News, New Testament, as its compared to the OT of Moses, an earlier Rvelation known as Torah.



While the Osun can't eat or defend itself, and the river can even be damed, or reshaped or wiped out by mega public project of land reclaiming effort, the same was the condition of Jesus. He was powerless at birth and in his youth as all youth are, depending solely on parentage care. In his later youth life, we read that he quipped to his parents that was he not supposed to be at "his father's house." But the Bible cleverly left the srory there, without telling us whether he was abandoned in Jerusalem without a "guardian!" A god needing guardian is no God of mine!


Davidylan, in his adult we read that he was hungry, that even the devil used this hunger to run him through some testing situations. He was wary, fatigued. Neither is a quality of my God!

And going back to your question; Allah is in Arabic, and every language has a word that they use for the "Entity" that Arab Muslim calls Allah. Until Islam was transferred to Makka for completion under the Prophethood of Muhammad (AS), whatever language that the most current Prophet used, that language has what means "Allah of Islamic Arabic Language!" So the language of Noah will be definitely different fom the language of say Daud. Haha.

Same way the catholics take you to be a fake Christian. Then you call them fakes, too. I have not even brough the Orthodox: Greeks, Coptics, Russians, East etc to the picture! I dont want to convolute your heart too much. Whats new about your Shia and other muslims group example?

I personally call myself Muslim. I am not an hyphinated muslim. Just Muslim. Thats what Allah says. And the way Muhammad (AS) instructed.

Open you eyes, aburo. For the humpty time, I never said that Egyptian during the time of Moses spoke Arabic! If you miss this very clear statement, how easy is for you to miss others? Think about it for a moment, there.

No place did I say that Coptic Egypt's language was Arabic. However, I made indication to the fact that Arabic as a language was already spoken by communities of people long time before Musa! The people of Yemen was speaking Arabic. Makkans were speaking Arabic, too. Now the poor liar is you, because of your poor insight and inability to process any religious data, other than what is in the Bible!

Age has nothing to do with it!

How could you have debunked a well established fact, about Kaaba and Ibrahim? Isiaqa came after Ibrahim. And the remembrance of the act of slaughter is what we are in, now. And interestingly, only the Muslims are observing this! It must be that the muslims finds it important to pay great attention to this great thing that happened to Ibrahim.

I guess its not Isiaqa (A), afterall. Otherwise the Muslims would have said so. And Kaaba was a structure in existence, long time before the first temple of the Children of Israel in Palestine.

@Kweenisha: « #3 on: Today at 03:04:32 AM »

so they are not Muslims?

What separate a Muslim from disbeliever is salah!

but you have no problem including all these folks including the bombers and would be bombers in all of middle east in the muslim count of 1.2 billion.They are part of you whether you like it or not
You can't deny them now

I guess the KKK, the Masonic, Skinheads, Rednecks, Ruffnecks, Arians, etc are all orthodox Christians then, uh!
No wonder your rank is greater than the muslims. lol.

When you see your tall and handsome husband, later, tell him his big brother is a man who has a response to everyone of your effort to casgate Islam. Go get a relief with him, before you get bruised up badly in my hand.



@davidylan (m): « #4 on: Today at 03:08:21 AM »

some people are in deep delusion.

That leader of delusion is David (A en a) of Ijebu Ode! lol. Eeso o, omo eni!

Anybody can shout as they wish. I heard a Christian this weekend talking to a a Muslim on the phone. He said Anabi wa Muhammad, SAW. I was making Dhur prayer, which comes in about midday now in New York. I was shocked. I knew he was not sincere, since he has his Big Cross on his chest!

The Nations of Islam and others shout Allah, yet they do not make Islamic Salah!

@DavidDylan: « #23 on: Yesterday at 09:22:36 PM »

where was his mosque?

Kaaba was built by Ibrahim and his son, Ismail (AS to both of them). Kaaba is part of "Masjid Haram" in Makka. I guess if Ibrahim and Ismail, prophets ho existed before Musa were associated with this great Masjid in Makka, it will not be impossible that where Musa worshipped was a Masjid, too. The only way you can argue against by statement then is that Musa had a different "religion" from the religion of Ibrahim and his son, Ismail. Remember that Ibrahim was referred as the "father of belief!" Anyone, therefore who has a diffrent belief from the belief of Ibrahim has to be concluded to be a disbeliever! You sir, David is therefore a disbeliever.

But wait, the whole earth is a Masjid, except the parts that are not fit to be Masjid based on the things that humans have erected on them. Masjid At-Taqwa's former bathroom was moved to the basement. Hence the place that used to be "bathroom" is now part of the mussala, where people pray, read Qur'an and dhikr!

Which direction did he face since there was no temple in Jerusalem neither a qibla in Mecca?

And Musa never lived in Jerusalem. And Allah chose the direction He pleased that a messenger lled his community in prayer! He also chose what amount to Islam for that community, since Islam was not completed on any prophet but Muhammad (AS), alone!

Did he perform ablution?

Ablution is purification of body with water. Yes Musa performed ablution. Afterall, he cleaned his private parts and also showered if there was any sexual emission and after meeting his wife in bed. Musa (AS) was an obedient prophet/Messenger of Allah.

Who did he cry unto since the name allah didnt even exist in his time?

Since he grew up in Coptic Egypt, in the powerful household of Pharaoh, we would expect him that his language, as a member of the elite is primarily Egyptian language! The lanuage of Arabia has been alive long time before Musa was born. Hence there is no doubt that the speaker of the Arabic language know that Allah is the God Who can not be represented by "Imagery, statue, etc". We must also know that tehere was no time you could claim that Musa cried to his Lord by calling him Jehovah, Yahweh, etc, while in the house of Pharaoh or while he escaped to the land of Medianites. Neither people, the Egyptian Coptics and Medianites would have called their God Yahweh, or Jehovah or Abba! lol. You will fail to proof me wrong, regardless of your effort, for a very simple reason; languages spoken in the locations we found Musa (AS). Hebrew was never spoken in either place.

Which quran did he read?

His book was not Qur'an. His book was not Injil either. His book was Torah. Qur'aan acknowledges that, already. I will stp for a moment to give you a few chances to escape. Then I will corner you and tighten up the noose. lol.

Best of all WHERE ARE THE WRITINGS OF THIS MOSES IN THE QURAN?

Musa didn't write anything. Musa's revelation, you meant, I suppose. If you read the Qur'aan, you will see the index pages where you can find the materials about Musa. Those were the revelations given to him. For example the Moses important law and commandment as a revelation is there is no god but Allah, the God who is Single Lord and deserves all worship! Read Qur'aan, David. You will even find that Sabur (Psalm) of Prophet King David is mentioned. Daud (AS) is mentioned in honoring manner. There is no acusation of him as an adulter or murderer. Both the Christian Bible, were not ashamed to tag him!

By the way, Wednesday is Ojude Oba in Ijebu Ode. I saw it once. It was amazing in those days. I hope you will have a chance of being in Ijebu Ode, on this ocassion.



@mazaje (m): « #24 on: Yesterday at 10:34:30 PM »

who is this deluded man?. . . . .

Where did you see delution? Whats delutional about my matter of fact statement? The man is dumbfounded, so he can only tag me as delutional. Of course you know that Musa (AS) was not a christian. My your christian definition, his condition is dire. But my Islamic definition, he was an obedient slave/servant of his Creator. Therefore he was a Muslim. A prophet, who was a messenger, with a revelation known as Torah!

Dauda. Nkon nie o. Omo obanta of Ijebuland. lol.

Islam comprises of the Qur'aan which is the "Words" of Allah, alone without a single word from other entity in it. Then the Ahadiths; Qursi from Allah and then the explanation of Qur'aan, the ahadith from Muhammad (AS). Then sunnah, the action of Muhammad or what he allows others to do. Then the Sirah (story of the life of Muhammad), and then the stories of the other prophets (AS). Moses is a prophet of Islam. And he was the one that dealth with the Pharaoh in question. Or was there a different Pharaoh or a different Prophet?

At least the Christians are head and shoulders better than you fellows who believe that there is no God or a need for Him to participate and direct the affairs of what He created. A man asked "How," you answered "Why!" If you had done that in a formal academic envirment, most professors will have no problem giving you a fat Zero, without a need further to check your writing.

How is a process. Why is reason. They are not the same. God in His infinite wisdom, by the answer of the chap who answered for the opponents of God, made him go at a tangent, raving on, on why, instead of on the How.

God (Allah) in creating man allows man to have freewill. So by this freewill that man possesses, he can take the path of righteousness, that is guidance. Or the path of evilness, that is disobedience, arrogance, etc. But when man's soul was removed from the back of our father Adam, man was made to swear about his acceptance of God as Creator, God and Lord who should be obeyed and worship.

By this recognization and God has demostrated His fairness towards man, in case on the day of Judgement, the guilty will be referred back to the fact that they had aforetime accepted the Lordship of God and committed to worship Him, alone without any partnership. But the freewill serves as a determining factor of obedience or disobedience.

Part of disobedience out of his freewill to choose his own preferred destination, is the injustices that Pharaoh exercised on the nations of Israel, by discriminating on them based on their race, alone. He oppressed them and made them slaves. It is in this state of injustice of Pharaoh that God raised up Moses (AS) to go and appeal to Pharaoh. To speak softly to Pharaoh and perchance, Pharaoh heart will be soft towards good speech and receive admonition, whereby realising that he had practiced injustice on the people who were brought to Egypt because of the nobility of Prophet Joseph, who had served as a minister of treasury and as a way to save Egypt from Starvation, in the past generations.

The many miracles performed by God through the hand of Moses, so that Pharaoh may know that Moses was not trying to extracate the children of Israel under his own interest, but by the command of the Creator, did not help the situation with Pharaoh. Instead of seeking counsel from the wisdom of the wise and few who fear God, he became arrogant. His arrogance became increased, to the point that he proclaimed that he himself was the authority that allows the Nile River to flow! At one time he asked his chief Engineer to build a tower because he would like to climb up to see the God that Moses was talking about.

His engieer (Haman) said that he should not mind Moses, since there is no one there to see up in heaven, even if it was built. But this engineer had become arrogant himself telling lies and not truthful that it is impossible to build to reach heavens, because he was a close inner circle person of Pharaoh. Now each miracle brings another layer of arrogance and hardness to the heart of Pharaoh. With all of these Pharaoh was still not destroyed because, he loved his mother very much. And God favors, women always, and those who love their mothers and don't severe relationship with the womb.

Moses told his Lord that he was unable to overcome the tyrannical Pharaoh, who has many tricks up his sleeves. Remember that he alsways asked Moses to make the plague, each time go away? You see the arrogance of a man who says that he is a "god", yet he still had to ask a "prophet", Moses to let the suffering, a miracle passaway on the People of Egypt. Arrogance had blind him so much that he was not able to reflect on his weaknesses; asking Moses for help.

In the state of distress that Moses told God his frustration, coupled with the fact that Pharaoh was always harsher than before, after every lift of a miracle, the Children of Israel began to blame Moses for everything wrong. God Almighty revealed to Moses that as long as Pharaoh is in good favor with his mother, God will not debase him, even though he is an evil man! This information from God, was a for Moses to achieve victory over Pharaoh. Moses was a prophet of God and he has wisdom from his Lord.

Moses knew that God will not let a prophet pray unless that the prayer is accepted by God. Immediately, Moses prayed to God to make Pharaoh fall out of his mother's favor. The prayer was accepted, and the dye was cast. The process of descrution was already in process, from that point on. The How has just began! (To those who mock God, your mockery could not even have effect on the belief system of anyone who has belief that there is God who is capable of all things).


Pharaoh, being a King in crisis because of Moses' presence in the land, performing miracles and to Pharaoh, competing with his authority, came in, one day, pass his mother's dinner time. He came in while still fuming with anger. He saw his mother sitting without eating the food set before her. He quipped why the mother have not eaten. The mother told him that he was waiting for him to feed her. The angry King responded with some unpleasantries to his mother, in the manner that his mother was very unhappy! For the first time, Pharaoh had angered his mother who disliked him, giving the opening for the impending process of the last chapter for the total destructions of Pharaoh, the mighty tyrant!

That is how the mighty arrogant fell! The end of it was that Pharaoh perished in the sea, in the long run.

FRom Yahoo. They are talking about "full moon." One is coming up on the 12th of December, 2008.


Popular Yahoo! PropertiesYahoo! Home My Yahoo!
Dec 7, 2008 Page Options Color:Ocean Tangerine Violet Oyster Grass Pink
Switch to narrow layout

More Yahoo! Services
Y! International
Featured NavigationFeatured Entertainment Sports Video Dec 7, 2008
Myths of the full moon
Learn some bizarre legends of the full moon as one approaches on Dec. 12. » Kleptomania, what else?

Find full moon time on Dec. 12 2009 meteor shower to be strong Learn lunar legends before next full moon

May Allah forgive all Muslims. And give the muslims leadership that has knowledge and wisdom. Hajj must be done before it. The day of Arafat is "Hajj" itself.

Thee is no Hajj except a person participate in the day of Arafat. Arafat is just in one place. Arafat is today. Even if the moon were to say that Arafat was yesterday, but humans are on Arafat, today. Therefore, Arafat is today, because the whole Jami'a of Ujaj are on Arafat now. No one was on Arafat, yesterday.

The above is a good and the only necessary proof for a person who has wisdom and knowledge. While knowledge is important, it could be based on structural process alone. But wisdom is more of what the heart will accept if thorough analysis of the strucyural process is carried out and examined.

Prophet Muhammad (AS) said that his nation will not collectively agree with something wrong. This means that they will collectively agree with something correct. This is Mercy from Allah.

Allah says in His Book that we should hold on "Collectively" to the rope of Allah, and do not be divided. While a local sighting of the moon maybe acceptably used in the month of ramadan, the singular "landmark or benchmark" for the slaughter Ed, is the day of Arafat itself. And today is that date. And therefore tomorrow should be, for all the muslims, based on the fact that the Ujaj are on arafat, the 10th of Dhul Hijjah.

Alhamdulillah, Islam is not a local religion, where something globally recognized like the day of Arafat is "ignored" for the purpose of keeping strictly with "moon sighting." Islam is a single community religion.


If I were living in a place where ed is taking place right now, I would have travelled out to a place nearby, where such celebration is not taking place. I will then celebrate Ed with them tomorrow, and return home immediately to do my own slaughter. Afterall, the slaughter is for 3 days; 10, 11, and 12 day of the month. The 13 day of the month, the moon is full through the 15.

Muslims the world over should always avoid to tear apart or separate themselves into fragmented smaller groups. If I live in a community that is not doing something opposing what the total muslim community is doing, as long as that thing is good and not against Islam, I will participate. Here is what i mean: many years ago, I made Isha prayer in a masjid that was closer to my home than the next one. But later on I heard that this second masjid began fasting. So I made Niyan to fast. In Salatul Subh, I asked the Imam of the same masjid where I prayed the last prayer if we were fasting and that if I am correct to start my fast? He responded no in both situations, because I am part of this jama ah, I just could not be all over the place. My masjid for that ramadam was the community tht I belonged to and not the other one, because of my previous Isha prayer and the following Subh prayers.

Our sigular masjid is Masjid Haram where the Kaaba is located. Our singular mount arafat is just that; Mount Arafat in Makka. What are they doing there, now? They are on MOunt Arafat, and not Musdalifah or Minna. Our leaders, while we should follow them, in what is good, we should encourage them that they should act with wisdom and nothing else, where the best action is to solidify for the whole world to see, the singular brotherhood and sisterhood of Islam. A nation that Allah describes as the best community raised up for mankind. It is supposed to be a moderate nation, not going into any extreme in all its conditions.

May Allah forgive us all. In the maintime: Id Kabir Karim to everyone.

@Bastage: To help you learn about those who are crusaders. I hope you will now know that Christian and crusade are two words that are siamese twins; the are One and the same thing. Just like you will say Jihad and people will know that you are going to talk about "muslims."

Yahoo! SearchWebImagesVideoLocalShopping
Y! International
Featured NavigationFeatured Entertainment Sports Video Dec 7, 2008
Pacquiao's stunning upset
Manny Pacquiao hammers Oscar De La Hoya for eight lopsided rounds. » World's 'finest fighter'

Fight highlights Hatton next? De La Hoya's plans, legacy Pacquiao hammers De La Hoya in lopsided bout Beyoncé is 'terrified of having a child' Geniuses like Einstein may be gone forever Big games turned films: Their chances of success » More:FeaturedBuzz
News NavigationNews World Local Finance In the NewsAs of 3:05 a.m. EST
• Indian official denies call to Pakistani president
• La. voters oust indicted Rep. William Jefferson
• Rumsfeld nemesis Shinseki to be named VA secretary
• Endeavour to begin return trip to Fla. on Monday
• Pearl Harbor commemoration to focus on U.S. response to attack
• Crusading Christians take battle against porn to Sin City
• Christmas tree sales are booming despite grim economy
• NCAA Football · NFL · NBA · NCAA Hoops · NHL · Boxing
» More:NewsPopularPolitics

@KunleOshob: « #35 on: Yesterday at 04:29:29 PM »

@auwal87
Why don't you address the issue of Jesus drinking alcohol instead of giving us your opinion.

That apart there are several food stuffs which we consume regulary that have health implications. For instance consumption of red meat and eggs (cholesterol) can lead to heart attack and the consumption of sugar can lead to diabetes. The key word is moderation. it is hypocritical to single out alcohol. If you choose not to drink for what ever reason no problem but it as no basis in christianity as the founder of the faith used to drink and share it with his disciples and tax collectors. Please note that you are bearing false witness when you say a good christian should not drink because you are just giving your own opinion by twisting scripture to support your views.

You may be doing exactly what you accused auwal87 on. You are giving opinion and twisting scripture to support your views. It is therefore that you are bearing false witness when you say that Jesus is the founder of the Christian faith.

Maybe you meant somebody else. But your reference to a leadership with "disciples" could not but refer to anyone in the bible but Jesus. Or are you truly correct in your statement? We know that Jesus is not the founder of Christianity. Rather the founder(s) named the religion after his title, the Christ.

@Bastage: « #14 on: December 04, 2008, 10:33 PM »

Yet another false assumption. I did not support the Trinity. I merely explained how it could be looked at. Explaining something has nothing to do with supporting something. One can still explain an idea even if one is opposed to it.

If you dont support it, as you have claimed, but merely explaining, which you did, it could be at least accepted that you lean towards it than the Islam that you outright oppose.



[Quote]
Either you're being misleading or just plain thick.
I'll ask the question again. Were the Crusaders Christians?[/quote]Yes. The Crusaders were Christians. Even President Bush used the word "crusade" to describe the idea of the effort to rid off the " Taliban regime and the Al Qaidah group out of Afghanistan.

If the Crusaders were not Christians, it will be just as safe to argue that all humans have not been living on planet earth.

When Bastage said is "not," as he has above, he is alluding to the fact that he knows everything. Even the past, the present and the future. Everything.

@Tru Brit:

How foolish can you be? You have ranted and ranted until you spewed forth trash.

I wonder whats foolish about my telling you that Allah is the Lord and God of Jesus. All you have to do is to disproof my statement wth verifiable statement. Your Bible even records that Jesus said "Eloi (Sounds like Allah and not father or Jehovah or Yahweh) on the cross.

Jesus Christ could not be a christian because the religion is modelled on him.

Whats his religion? Thats the question I have.

Thus christians are supposed to be Christ like and christianity is the art of being like Christ i.e. the practice of Jesus Christ's doctrines and principle (acting in a manner like Jesus Christ did).

So if I take you on about the things that you do that is against Jesus command, what will you say? Its eaither you are a deficient follower or you disregard Jesus, completely? Which one do you think you are? Finally, somebody other than Jesus made up the religion called Christianity, wont you say?

Did your Quran tell you that Jesus was a muslim?

Yes.

what a friggin joke. I guess your Mohammed came before Jesus to this world then huh? LMAO. . .

I guess the joke is on you. The science of DNA came after the knowledge of physiology. And that made Biology even better. I guess DNA is inferior because it came later, huh? Is Jesus then important than Moses, since he came later than Moses?

You guys forget that your Quran tells you that Jesus is actually the son of God (or rather, you always attempt to brush that very important fact under the carpet).

I want you to quote that very verse for me, from the Qur'aan. Oh, maybe the "furqan" that Shorish, the Palestian Christian made up, you will find such mad statement in. Not the Qur'aan that we Muslims read, unchanging right from the time of Muhammad.

@JJYOU: Where did I say prostitution is permissable in Islam?

@Tpia: « #88 on: Today at 05:40:50 PM »

elder is as elder does.




And how did islam tame you? You've always been Muslim, so what did you tame from?

If Islam did not tame me, I will wear my Pakulopa of Ijebuland breast plate, and wage war against you. And you will then know about my yorubaness. You wanna know? Now you know. From every part of my bloodline, they are warriors. But Alhamdulillah. In the same way I left the yoruba things that are not Islamic, while I retain what is Islamic of the yorubas; respect, softness and others, I left anger. Look again at my father's name; Pakulopa. And I do not even carry the attitude.

@KarmaMod: « #82 on: Today at 04:27:08 AM »

And you have the sidekick KarmaMod who is not even ashamed for her that she could say something to me, about my 80+ year old mother! The qualities of home training of some people. They refused the trainings from home. I would not go so far that the people at home did not try to teach.


Are you ok? Why are you such a dramatic LIAR like this? You act like a woman, are you aware of that? Making up stories to look like a *victim*

Show me where I said anything about your mother. I will be waiting for that quote or I want an apology. Oniro. Agbaya.

You see where home training has value, now? My son Olayiwola is probably older. And he dare not insult any older person. Ad just imagine him calling a person who is in his father's age period, Oniro and Agbaya! That will be the day. Yet he was raised here, in northeast. I also know many young adults who will not dare say a bad word to an elder; the Children of Rev. David Olajide kayode, my college roommate are example for one. They were also raised in Northeast. And Kayode is an Ijero man. Good home training shines while a child who refuses a good quality from the parents sometimes almost will make the possibility of dragging the parents in the gutter. Ewure ibiye le je ki won bu Ibiye.

I reserve my own personal opinion. Islam has tamed me to be so.

@Kweenisha: « #55 on: Yesterday at 01:30:51 AM »  

are you recounting  recorded Bible stories or are you telling me where fornication or adultery is esteemed?
You are yet to answer the question specifically show me  and all your readers where sex outside of marriage is condoned in the Bible by my Lord and God if you can't I call you yet a liar.

This is a challenge and you are yet to make a valid point.

Sisi Kweenisha, you can read. The Bible is Taurah, Sabur (Both the christians consider as OT), and the Gospel, post gospel starting from acts (both the Christians consider as NT). Now watch this; Jesus said that he did not come to "abolish the Laws and the prophets. But to fulfil them." That is making them valid by his rubberstamping them for future generations to come. And because of this rubberstamping, he emphasised by further stating that "whosoever (among people after me, or during my lifetime) do abolish them or encourage any to do so, (such a person and his follower) shall be the least (not the highest) in the Kingdom of God!"

Please know that God will punish in the day of Judgement, if you believe in Judgement day. Hence Paradise is the Highest of his Kingdom for human. Hell is the least in His Kingdom for human.

If Jesus was this careful to honor those Prophets before him, and Christians even call him son of "David, (the King David who killed Goliat, the giant warrior)," then at the same time accused the same David as an adulterer and a cold blooded killer, please know that all that we can conclude is this; either the Christians are disoriented in thoughts, or they just refuse to follow Jesus' instructions. Yet they claim that he is their god. And when you disobey your god, you truly don't pass as a true believer in that god. Or at least you don't have any knowledge of the law that you disobey him on. Either way, if we look again, we see that the Bible accuse Noah, Abraham, Lut, Isaac or Jacob with sexual impropriety, because they slept with some women who were not their wives. Some were harlots, at least one is a slave/servant girl, them others were their own daughters who got them drunk (I wonder where they got wine, just in a nick og time, at the crucial moment?), some male or sons, some a wife of subject, who was hurriedly thereafter sent to war so that he can die!

If you still dont believe that this is from your bible, then read the OT again. I am sure you will disregard it, of handedly, because Jesus' already by Paul's statement has made the laws useless, because they and the prophets were nailed to the cross!

If you believe that Jesus statement about the laws and the prophets are still valid, then, it is either that what these prophets did, when it comes to sleeping with those people I had mentioned above, are still valid, or that the actions of these men are wrongly recorded in the Bible. For example, will King David knowingly seek the wife of another, when women were throwing themselves at him, and he restrained himself? He was a king of modest means compared to Solomon. David's voice was beloved to his Creator. Wouldn't he be protected by his Creator who loved him so much from all kind of filths, including adultery? Abraham is known as friend of God. What less should a friend do for another friend, except to protect him from evil? God is th only One who could protect any and all from evil. Would it be impossible that Abraham did not commit a sexual act with a woman he did not married? If both of my statements are correct then, we are certain more than uncertain that the recorded stories in the Bible about these noble men are at least incorrect about their sexual history.

If I am incorrect, then we should ask, when did the punishment by stoning became a law among the nations of the Children of Israel, regarding adultery? I used Abraham's condition to illustrate the pre-Moses' OT era, while David for the era after Moses.  If Jesus was extracating the "adulteress woman" by his famous "throw the first stone," statement, we know that King David's era was before Jesus. David must have been under the condition of that sexual law. Or did the children of Israel feared his royalty and could not confront him, too? But wait, God would not be afraid of him. And I remember somebody (maybe Pilgrim1), said in the past that even God was "trying (trying?)" to kill Moses, whom He ha sent an errant. Yet he had not completed his mission. (How could you send somebody to deliver a message and you waylay him so that you can make it impossible for your own message to be delivered?).  The same God would have instituted a plan so that David could be stoned to death.

In view of the above, it is very clear to me that the Christians need to reexamine their Bible. If you don't follow the OT, then take it off. If there is a claim that the NT abrogates it, then I need explanation of the Jesus' "I do not come to abrogate the laws and the prophets, "!



[Quote]
FROM SAHIH MUSLIM, VOLUME 2, #3371

           Abu Sirma said to Abu Said al Khudri:  "O Abu Said, did you hear Allah's messenger mentioning about al-azl (coitus interruptus)?"  He said, "Yes", and added:  "We went out with Allah's messenger on the expedition to the Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them.  So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing azl" (withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception).  But we said:  "We are doing an act whereas Allah's messenger is amongst us; why not ask him?"  So we asked Allah's messenger and he said:  "It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born".[/quote]Aburo, Suraj, May Allah reward you for calling my attention to this post of Kweenisha.

Kweenisha, while the legislations of Islam was being carried out, many things now prohibited were permissable at one point or the other. First, even now, if an Igbo man becomes a muslim, I will not discourage him to stop wearing his wrapper. It happens to be Islamic. We call it Izar. I wear them, too. Yet, I will not tell him before he becomes a muslim not to be involved in his libation or drinking his Ogogoro/apeteshi. Please note that I am using a culture that you are familiar with. I could use Yoruba, but it will be not as intimate as Igbo to you.

While I will not allow him to take the declaration if I dictect the smell of palm wine in his breath, I will only encourage him to come to congregational prayers as often as he can. And cultivate new friends, who are muslims. In time we will begin to leave his Igbo culture parts that are unacceptable to Islam. This is the case with the ahadiths that you have quoted above. Before I talk about this ahadith, pay attention to the honesty of Islam. All events that occurred, even if they were abrogated, are still left in recorded history for later generations. Just imagine a tribe somewhee in the jungle who are fighting each other. Then one of them became muslim, and got hold of ahadith. As they read about earlier Islamic life, they may participate in this act, instead of killing the people, as they used to do.

They would have done a good act, because they now preserve lives. When they understand Islam better and become cultured people, full of piety, they will know that there is abrogation of "temporary marriage, or sex outside marriage."

Now to the ahadith: Allah commands muslims not to go "near" illicit sex. Further He commands by verse 25 of surah Nisaa, that even slave girl should be married in order to avoid any sexual illegality. Muhammad (AS), who is the prophet and messenger that knows the meaning of Qur'aan more than any human declares all kind of Muta; both that of home and journey illegal and not allowed. What then you do not understand?

Is it impossible for you to process the fact that "rome was not built in a day," hence the laws in Islam, like all its tenets came in piecemeal? In Makka, Muhammad (AS) and his companion used to pray. Then in Makka, the manners of prayer and how many prayers per day were given, including in the event of Isra wa Miraj (the Night journey to heaven).

Yet, in all of these, it was until they arrived in Madina that daily salah was made obligatory on them. Then later Fasting was made obligatory. Drinking was cancelled in statges until completely. Now apply the same system to "sex with captive women." Considering that these women, and girls probably would have lost eligible men and their husbands from their tribes because of the wars, should they also be deprieved of womanly need, too? doesit make any sense for a 30 year old woman who is a slave be deprieved of what they crave, like a thirsty person craves cold drink to quench the thirst?

Would captive of war stop having sexual urge, because of their status in the society? Would slave suddenly becomes a person who can feel any biological stimulus, like hunger, thirst, sexuality, etc? Have you forgotten the experience of White women towards their families' black male slaves? If these white women lust after them, and find ways of putting themselves under these men, can you imagine how previleged a captive women in the "early Islamic era" was that she was not "killed," or "raped" by these civilized men? Even in recent human history, American aristocrats, like Jefferson, even Washington, they all had their 'secret flings with black women.' You remember the late old as dirt "Thurmond", the senator from south carolina? Even as he fought against integration, he secretly had sex and fathered a "black daughter!" The early muslims did not do that!

Now Kweenisha, let just imagine that there is a war, Iraq, Afghanistan, and other places. These people lost the war. Obviously, there will be a lot of men killed, while the ratio of woman/men will now increase, significantly. You see how readily the women of Iraq marry American, etc men? You see that prostitution isnow common, which was at least under wrap, before?

Just imagine, if the igbos were to defeat the Yorubas. Would igbo men leave the yoruba women alone to rot without husband and oh, sex? Remember that you are christian, and for the most part, you have indicated that igbo people prided themselves in good quality. PLease tell me, the Igbo men will be blind, because of their Christianity wo the beautiful Iyabos, Shalewas, Abekes, etc, even Tpias and KarmoMods and Pilgrim1s? If you say yes, you do not know about igbo men. I mean it, in the religious and not the tribal sense. Nothing in the Bible will make them not refer to the OT when they see yoruba pretty women.

If its Islam, of today, all the marriage age women who desired to be married will be married. There will not be a single women, within sharia guideline that will be left to "fornicate."

FROM SAHIH MUSLIM, VOLUME 2, #3432

           Abu Said al-Khudri reported that at the Battle of Hunain Allah's messenger sent an army to Autas and encountered the enemy and fought with them.  Having overcome them and taken them captives, the Companions of Allah's messenger seemed to refrain from having intercourse with captive women because of their husbands being polytheists.  Then Allah, Most High, sent down regarding that:  "And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess (Quran - 4:24), (i.e. they were lawful for them when their Idda (menstrual) period came to an end).

Commandment from Allah. Maybe you will deny the commandment of God on Moses whereby the children of israel (the chosen people), because of their worship of the golden calf, were killed off. Think about that for a moment.

 

FROM THE HADITH OF THE SUNAN OF ABU DAWUD, VOLUME 2, # 2150:

           Abu Said al-Khudri said:  "The apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain.  They met their enemy and fought with them.  They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Quranic verse, "And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess".  That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period."  [The Quran verse is 4:24].

Rules and guidance! Doesn't a prisoner forfeited his rights? Does a marriage of an idol worshipper who is captured still valid? The answer is no. If he becomes a muslim, out of freewill, he will have to remarry, except if they were people of the Books, before they became muslims.

Or do you need Koran verses?
Oya here they are

FROM THE QURAN - 70:22-30



"Not so the worshippers, who are steadfast in prayer, who set aside a due portion of their wealth for the beggar and for the deprived, who truly believe in the Day of Reckoning and dread the punishment of their Lord (for none is secure from the punishment of their Lord);  who restrain their carnal desire (save with their wives and their slave girls, for these are lawful to them:  he that lusts after other than these is a transgressor, "

I lust after my wife. When I have four my lust will be on each of them. 100% when I am with her. Now tell me where do disagree with the verse? The "captives whom your right hand possess?" Then how do you reconcile tht fact it was not all of the men that had four wives or slept with those they are not legally married to? Would it have been that the verse was abrogated by "surah nisaa's dont come close to illegal sex?" Today, will anybody be able to claim this previlege in a proper sharia court?

By the way, I asked you if Muhammad (AS) slept with anyonewho he was not married to; slave or otherwise?

This verse shows that Muslim men were allowed to have sex with their wives (of course) and their slave girls.

FROM THE QURAN - 23:5,6

", who restrain their carnal desires (except with their wives and slave girls, for these are lawful to them, "



           Again, Muslim men were allowed to have sexual relations with their wives and slave girls.
FROM THE QURAN - 4:24

"And all married women are forbidden unto you save those captives whom your right hand possess. It is a decree of Allah for you. (Muhammad Pickthall's English translation of the Quran).

for more reading http://www.answeringislam.info/Silas/femalecaptives.htm

And thank Allah. Please read Verse 25 of the same surah to see that it cancelles out this very thing. The Shia use verse 24 as their proof of muta. But they fail to read verse 25, immediately below it. It is obvious that the two verses were not revealed at the same time. But their being arranged next to the other, emphasises the important of the message. While verse 24 was when the muslims were still developing. Verse 25 was when the muslims were already developed. Now, Kweenisha, (who is afraid of Virgina Wolf; wink wink), tell me which one is abrogating the other?

all scripture is given by inspiration and you already have the scripture you need revealed by the same Holy Spirit and the instruction is clear to all Christians.Your deception is not working.

This statement is made my Jesus, your lord? lol. You mke me laugh. I hope you heard my laughter all the way in "down south, " People say things they have no right saying. Look at the position of Paul. Compare that to Jesus'!

I laid a bait, made a comment on it and you bit.Oga you're so predictable.
You think of Christianity with the mindset of Islam and it's stonings and beheadiings.that's the problem and it's not your fault.
Christians understand that the Bible was talking about going an extra mile to avoid sin and not the literal chopping off of hands and plucking off of an eye, otherwise Christ would have asked the woman caught in adultery to cut off her "bermuda triangle"

So if Jesus statement was only figurative, people not tearing off their sinning hand.arm, even though he said so, I will like you to apply the same logic to "haven't you seen me, my father (a figurative statment, since many people are clamed to be his father, figuratively too; old man Joseph who did not disvirgin the pregnant Mary and King Prophet David who was already dead many centuries before) are one" and other verses that you are using to come up with a three god; part father, part human son and part ghost!

Now you're trying to be mischievious and childish.

Click on link I sent earlier and Mohammeds views about women fills pages.
Thanks but no thanks

Just imagine how the "Jewish learned men thought about the childish and mischievious ideas of the master himself, when he was preaching his good news. Calling them to his Lord, the Cherisher of all. While I am just a follower, I am speaking in the same line of truth as he and all the other prophets before him spoke. And yes, the successor, Muhammad spoke as well.

Yet Muhammad was not unmindful of Khadijah, his(S) first wife. He never stopped loving her! Now imagine tht in todays America, or Nigeria; choose your tribe. If an aged and already dead is replaced by a young virgin, how many husband will even remember this late "old woman?" Yet Muhammad (AS) was bold to talk about her to the face of the young wife (RA). Thats honesty.

If we therefore use what we see on nairaland as the microcosm of what happens in the macrosociety, we see that we have a woman who claims that she beats men for pleasure, and another one curses another person's mother's womb and yet another would not stop gossippng even if it would do her harm. Are these the quality of paradise? But we women as people of paradise; Khadijah and all the wives and daughters of Muhammad (AS) as the example, then Asia, the wife of Moses era's tyranical Pharaoh, then Mary mother of your human god.

Then we have men in hellfire; pharaoh, Abi Labab, Abu Jahal and Abi Talib (all of them uncles of the Prophet (AS) to seyidina Muhammad). So where do you get your warped knowledge of islam from? And many women were and still scholars of islam. Read the Qur'aan and theStories of the women around the prophet (AS), and learn about the honoring position of women.

Again show me one verse particularly in the NT where the Bible condones sexual immorality,I already gave you about 10 where it labelled it outrightly as sin.

The very statement of Jesus that brought the OT as relevance is an endictment and a proof. Did Jesus abrogate the OT? No. Did he say that anyone can? No. Did he talk about the great qualities of the laws and the prophets? Yes. You you christians lump this prophets as illigal sexual perveyors? Yes. Therefore illicit sex is acceptable, and was not cancelled, because Noah did it. Abraham did it. Lot did it. Isaac, or Jacob did it. Some other guys spilled their seeds so that their late brother's wife would not have a child for the dead brother! Terrible culture, if you ask me. How do you get somebody pregnant and they assign the baby to somebody else?

@KarmaMod: Dating is not allowed in Islam. Considering that Allah, the Almighty tell us not to go near "fornication." Dating is a certain step leading to it.

And by the way, Marriage is better than dating. Islam is not a religion that deals with man-made laws. Allah says what He commands, you keferi woman is bent-out-of-shape (lol) about it. You think we are like you change religious tenets as you go, along?

My women are my concerns, alone. My mother has no problem with whom am married to. I wonder what's the gymnastics are all about, from you and tpia. The last I check, I am a muslim and you are not. We have nothing in common, about religion which is what is most important to me. The tribe is important, but very secondary. Finally, I am a big boy. I don't answer to you and you. Rather, you should be answering to me, if we are from the same home. Thank God we are not. So you are free to do what you want, without any shame or remorse.

Aloy, thanks man. Tpia is definitely not my type. I think she is beefing because I make my choices, which she definitely does not fit in any of the moulds. She does not know that I base my interest on pleasing Allah. I want a woman who will keep me straight and will not make me do astray. For example, a woman who will wake me up for prayer, is more desired by the one that will encourage me to sleep up until the sun is up.

And more importantly, she is in new zealand. Its more likely she is all about white guy, while I am about muslim women. She complains about something that does not concern her.

Ewa womo yi o. Jeje mi ni mi nlo o. lol. People of ignorance are a laugh.

The girl who would cower up if "lion" is standing in front of her is saying that she is calling a real lion to order. And then the has no shame to abuse me, stating that I am abusing the womb that bore me. Would she have the strenght to mouth this out if she was in the same space with me? Wouldn't another yoruba woman say to her that such utterrances are too big for her mouth?

And you have the sidekick KarmaMod who is not even ashamed for her that she could say something to me, about my 80+ year old mother! The qualities of home training of some people. They refused the trainings from home. I would not go so far that the people at home did not try to teach.

@kweenisha:« #68 on: Yesterday at 05:57:49 PM »

Quote from: KarmaMod on Yesterday at 01:39:30 PM
Apparently his Igbo and Egyptian princesses arent enough for him

still would like an answer to my question, people: Open your eyes and read. The answer has been there for you many times.


when did he get an Egyptian princess?
I left Nairaland a while and already Olabs has a new wife that I don't know about

Don't mind this woman named KarmaMod. She runs my life for me. She knows what I just ate from her Westchester county village home. And I live in downstate and she is upstate.

There's a Yoruba senior wife
There's an Igbo one, Ndidi

Thats all I have. Whatever this people, KarmaMod and gang say about me, is mostly untrue, but they just do not know it. I will however let them run their mouth, all over the places. When karmaMod has the courage to big City, with the Noen Lights, and glits, then I will make her give me the Ikunle she has been promising in Orunkun mejeji. And I will then ask if she can yinmu, for real.

There was another Igbo girl Emeka, that he was eyeing
Now there's an Egyptian princess nerfetiti
and here he talks about another virgin
what else is he looking for?

olabs no be for 4 wives?
you don get 4 na, e never do?
Please I don't want all these girls to wound you abeg
take am easy
we only have one life.

Women they wound men? I don't deal with girls. By the way, I do not pay any mind to KarmaMOd. She is the ameebo of nairaland. Or at least she leads the gang of ameebos.

@Tpia: « #67 on: Today at 05:54:14 PM »

yes, I called you to order on your shameless statements about Yoruba women. Anyone with a minimum supply of manners would know that when you abuse Yoruba women, you are also abusing your own mother and the womb you came from.

First you could not call me to order if you try. Egbe isu ko ni iyon. No of my women is in your league. And it shows by your writing talking about the womb that bore me. First my dearest mother knows without any trace of a doubt that I adore her. I adore all my step mothers, too. And so are all my women folks.

My just saying yoruba women, did not imply, except in your mind, that I abuse yoruba women. There was the mother of my grown up boys, my senior wife now, both are Yoruba women. My sisters (and there are many of them), my aunts, nieces, cousins and other relatives. All of them are yorubas. I come from a royal blood, and you should know that there are many people in a household like that. At least 50% of them are women. None I will disrespect. Including those I am old enough to have as my own daughter.

I think you do not know how to talk. And a flippant woman like you will find it difficult in todays Nigeria, and other societies for that matter to have a true relationship. I need to tell you that not too many people will deal with "disrespectful woman", even if she was the most beautiful and successful in the bunch.

It is the love and respect that I have for my mother, that Allah soften her heart toward acceptance of Islam after 911, from my effort. I don't think you know anything about respect and until you are a mother, you will not know how much I love mine. And until you are a mother, you will not know how much my children respect me, because I never gave their mother, my ex, any hard time. Even now. I talk fondly about her because she is a good mother.

Shior to you. Thats for lacking respcet. I wonder how you behave at home, if you are this raw outside. The beauty of a woman is in her bashfulness. I know, I have good experience with good and quality from the feminine gender.

And your attitude here is entirely crass. You openly lust after various women and chase them everywhere in the name of religion, but you take it upon yourself to label Yoruba women for what you yourself display. ie wanton lust and loose sex.

And when you see me I do not display my family Jewels, like the women who says that she is boys crazy. You forgot that I am a muslim. I understand the sharia and sunnah that guides sexuality, romance and marriage. I do not approach a woman that is not mine. I hope you can say that you are involved in illicit sexuality. It is not my concern, but you can now see that between you and me, somebody is lacking sexual morals.

The OP had barely started the thread but you were already jumping her. You no get shame. fa?

I don't jump women. I live in New York City. You know how easy it is to have sex in this city of over 11 million potentially sexual stories? Yet, in it, I have been able to practice Islam, in relative ease, without any sexual tension or temptation. Let me tell you, all my friends can vouch for my sexual propriety. Not only the Muslims. But Jews and Christians among my associates and affiliates. Can your friends do the same for you?

polygamist dey make yanga. better stick to the ones who are actually returning your interest in them, instead of vainly wishing I'm in that group.

A Trinidadian friend of mine, about 6 years ago was going to marry a non muslim woman. So he bought for her as a gift, an estinger bottle. When I asked why this bottle. His response was that she needs to be cultured, first. For you Tpia, you are not in my league. You have to begin just like that person first. Learn culture first. Maybe then you may find some muslim man who wants you.

My taste in women is eclectic. You are not. Not from your speech and mannerism. And you are not a muslim, anyhow. What do I need from a disbelieving woman.

shior. I already said it to you.

@Tpia: Thank you. lol.
You a ton of laughs. My friends will have a laugh at your expenses, when they know your inference about me. My sisi will laugh too.

You the woman who got crazy because I spoke about "Yoruba" woman. I have more Yoruba women in my family than you could ever imagine. I come from avery large family. Yet, each woman in my family is respected by me. So your statement at that time is wrong. And your statement ow is wrong!

Se o loko? Lo fe oko. Ara a ro e, nigba yen!

First my woman have to be muslim. You are not, so you are out, not in!