₦airaland Forum

Workch:
if I offer your God 100000 amputees to heal and he can't then he's fraud. It's all lies.

you have already said that before, nothing changed

Read my response again concerning that

Your excuses are too much for this God that never shows up

you have been dumbfounded. Simply give up

You don't have any excuse

Workch:
If your God cannot heal

if he doesn't want to heal. No one can force him to do what he doesn't want to do.

There is time for everything!
If we have read in the past that he healed, that was then and the miracles were for a purpose which has been achieved then, not now again.

[
then he cannot be omnipotent.

the fact that he chooses to do what he want to do and when to it and when to stop doing it without the influence of man makes him omnipotent.
You can't force him by your emotions

It's the description he was given by Christians.

and you are depending on what Christians are saying without reading for yourself ?
Are these same Christians not mere humans?
They will always deceive you now

It means than the miracles are fake hence all the miracles performed by your God in the Bible is fake.

you know how you sound?
Your father fended for at the time you were little. Now you're grown up and he decided that you should be on your own that you are capable. Then the next thing, you start calling him fake

It goes a lot to dent the description of the God character.

that isn't the description of God's character.
From the beginning God created man, he charged him to replenish the earth because man was capable.
Man will do anything without God because he was capable

It also means that this God is incapable of creating anything via miracles

keep telling yourself lies

meaning genesis creation story is fake,

Jesus virgin will also be fake. This makes the whole Christianirt fake if prove miracles to be false

see, no matter what you think about the stories it's of no significance.

You have been created that's all.
Whatever you choose to do with your life is at your disposal, not God.

Stop feeding yourself with lies or hope for miracles that will never come

Workch:
If you claim that your God can heal people.

is this the description of God in the bible you were talking about ?

How did you arive the notion that God is in the business of healing people?

You see why i say atheists don't read bible?

I will provide 1000 amputees, if you cannot heal one then its a lie.

Me, heal ke?
As if i even have time for misplaced priorities

So, in your mind Christianity is about healing? D

After, some folks will keep saying atheists were once Christians they know bible.

See am now

Workch:
Looking at the description given by the Bible of this God, we can treat that he doesn't exist.

can you point out the exact description in the bible?

Also, when we subject many of the claims of the supernatural intervention that was claimed by Christians that he did in Bible, they usually prove negative.

you will do well to also point out one supernatural claim and the method you use to subject the said claim let's see

Wilgrea7:
This statement doesn't follow.. at all.

you mean the logical law of identity does not follow what are you sayin?

By this logic i can say that Harry Potter exists because i have read the books.

you will also say Socrates and Aristotle did not exist and they were fictional

Reading about something is not evidence for its existence.

true,
But not in this case.

In this case, we have seen the evidence in what was written, that the evidence points to today's reality.

A lot of atheists and agnostics are former theists.. people who actually read the alleged holy books for a fair portion of their life

unfortunately for them, they didn't see the evidence while reading, but it was staring at them.
Now whose fault is that?

will they now channel their inability to read and understand to disturb those who have read and understood?
We have billions of theists worldwide which translates that they have largely understood the contents of their holy books that's why they will remain theists

1. Most atheists are former theists. I've already addressed that.

they were confused at some point.

Even on NL, every atheists who claimed to practice my religion always failed the exam each time i question them about my holy book.
This is poof that they never understood anything in the theism before they left

2. Your logic is also off here. If someone or some book said matter was anything that had mass, it would be up to the maker of the statement to prove it. You are then free to scrutinize the "proof" presented to you. This is exactly what we're doing in regard to god.

no!

what you people usually do is, each time theists mentioned that the evidence is right inside their holy book, you reject using the holy book as the evidence, yet you are always demanding for the evidence.

The evidence isn't a pick and take that one can just give it to you like that. It is a lengthy but logical explanation that requires your sincere interest to read.
A previous knowledge of other parts of the book will make it easier to understand.
But if you don't have any knowledge at all, i doubt if you will understand

You believe a god exists, and have given insufficient/ logically faulty proof, which we've simply pointed out.

the truth is!
If you really want a sufficient and logical proof, then you will proof to be teachable or you don't demand any proof at all

Once again. Atheists don't say God does not exist. While some atheists say that, that's not the default position in atheism. Atheism is simply the lack of belief in a god

lack of belief or not believing, it's still the same thing.
It's like you are saying i lack money, because of that i can't purchase, and someone has money and he doesn't want to purchase.
The bottom-line is, the both did not aquire

.. not a statement that it does not exist.. please understand the difference

atheists don't need to make the statement, we already know

Workch:
the Christian God does not exist. I'm very certain about that

can you explain your better?

Maynman:
Theism is more related to all deities, not just only one.
Theist, How come you are worshipping one deity?

it is related to any of the deities being worshipped.

That means a Christian is theist worshipping his own God or Deity
a Muslim is another theist worshipping his own deity
a Buddhist is a theist having his own deity
an hinduist is a thieist having his own deity
a Babalawoist is a theist having his own deity
etc

all these theists worshipped their different gods or deities each. So i don't have any priority reading all their holy books but to focus on the one that is concerned with me.

But you atheists, you can't just focus on one theism since it is your priority to debunk the deity idea.
You will have to go through all their books for you to even stand a chance, otherwise you will break the ldentity logical law of thoughts when presenting your arguments .
An a reasonable person listening to your argument will say, what is this one talking?

Maynman:
Theists have a greater deal, after reading all hundreds of existing holy books, they have to believe and worship all the gods and not just one dummy isrealite god called yahweh.
You have to worship allah too as a theist.

is that what they told you or you are just assuming? 😀

Maynman:
You are supposed to read hundreds of books before you conclude on which one is the correct one.

No!
I don't need to conclude which one is the correct one.
When apply the one i read to reality and i see that it is applicable, then I'm ok and satisfied
But you atheists have a great deal.
You will have to read all the hundreds of the existing holy books for you to be able to debunk the deity idea.

Remember, the word deity as it relate to atheism implies all the dieties, not just only one

Maynman:
Why do you conclude on only the one you read out of hundreds?
Listen to your advice na, is it not more reasonable to remain neutral To all deities?
You haven’t read all books but you think the one you have read is the correct one?

I did not read to contest whether the one i have read is the correct one as much as others did not read to contest whether their own is the correct one.

We know only what is correct by how it apply to reality

I have also read about greek gods.

why do you choose to read about Greek gods, is it to affirm superiority of atheism over Greek deities?

Maynman:
How many books did you read before you picked one deity?
is it not more reasonable to remain neutral To all deities?

because i didn't read all books, then i should drop the one i have read?

It does not follow now.

You have not read any one so you don't have any comment on anyone.
But me, i have read one, so i can comment on the one i have read

You see?

Workch:
1. The Most hilarious one is trying to say that God exist because I exist.

what is more hilarious is when you fail to understand that if theists are talking about God, they see him as a spirit and nothing more.
So if you say spirits don't exist because you don't see them, that doesn't mean that spirits are not real in their minds.so long their minds exist.

Remember, it is their minds we are talking about here, not your own mind. I see no reason why you are killing yourself over the thoughts of another person's mind as if you are sharing his mind with him, why not face yours?

The word spirit can also be defined in dictionary as a vital principle(not necessarily a body form) that supports life functions and events such aa karma.

For the fact that one has experience the statement YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW that it is real, is enough reason to have it in his mind that there is spirit being behind this principles. Then there are books in support of their thoughts from other people who experience the same thing, so you don't blame people for thinking what they think by countering their thoughts through being an atheists, you will only end up loosing woefully.

I used to ask some atheists, since they started countering theists on NL, how many theists have they succeeded in converting into atheism?
You will see that there is no such thing.

If truly anyone will be converted from one idea to another, he will not need to be countered or bashed. He will convert on his own having seeing reasons by himself

Maynman:
If all you need to know a deity exist is by reading books, how many theistic gods are you worshipping then, Because We have hundreds of “holy books”.
Quran
Bhagavad Gita
Tanakh
New Testament
Theogony
Etc

therefore you have hundreds of books to read before you can debunk the idea of a deity, and you have not even started reading one.
With that, is it not more reasonable to remain neutral focusing on your atheism or agnostism and stop bothering theists about their beliefs in their deities and let them be, since it is not possible for you to read all their holy books?

The last time i check, theists don't really bother you atheists or agnostics about your beliefs, they allow you be, because they know nothing about what books have inspired you people into atheisms or agnotism

Terrible arguments put foward by atheists against the existence of God lies in breaking the logical law of identity which states that if you do not know the identity of a thing you can't say anything categorically about it.

Theists argue that God exist because they have read their holy books which helps them affirm that.
Atheists on the orher hand have refused to read the same holy books how will they possibly know what theists know?
Yet they categorically argue that God do not exist thereby breaking the simple logical law of identity. Hence, their arguments are always terribly bad.

If a science book teaches me that matter is anything that has mass, i will have to read the same science book first, in order to aquire the prerequisite knowledge to counter the argument, or i can't say anything categorically about whether matter has mass or not.
But atheists arguments aren't so.
Yet they come out boldly to say what they don't know thereby not being sincere to themselves.

As for agnostics who claim to steak to the law of logical thought, you will soon notice that they usually deviates from their point of view at the end of their argument and ended up with the same fallacious conclusion with atheists that there is no God, and you begin to wonder, are they spirits too like atheists?

Only reasonable Christians pls

I will not respond to conclusions without premise with sound reasoning

constancefriday:
Where is the Kingdom of God that Christ promised us his Saints?

Many of us often feel disappointed by a lot of things happening around us.
  Many things are not going the way we want them to go. Why?
  But we often wonder why?

Where is the Kingdom of God that Christ promised us his Saints? Or Did Christ give us a false promise or wrong information?

The problem with life is not the existence of principles but the perversion or abuse of principles.
  In Motivational talk we tend to overemphasize the big things a lot.
  You hear "the big dreams", " the big picture" ... Big this, big that and we talk so much about big things such that the things that really matter tend to get easily ignored.

When a Child turns into an adult, his perception of life often tends to shift a lot to big things which are only designed to massage our mountain sized ego which is actually the big mountain blocking us from manifesting God's Kingdom in our lives.

Jesus said "The Little things are the keys that unlock God's Kingdom in our lives."
  People who easily ignore the little things or little details of life hardly manifest the Kingdom of God in their lives.

As Jesus says:

A little Faith is what's needed to move the big mountain obstructing the manifestation of God's Kingdom in one's life.

Christ also said "The Kingdom of God is like A MUSTARD SEED which is the smallest of all seeds yet it grows up to become a very large tree, where all kinds of BIRDS and ANIMALS can come and take some shade.

  The Kingdom of God is not as large as a Mango seed, it's not as large as a coconut seed or even a maize or corn seed.
  It's " as little as a mustard seed".

A Mustard seed is so little that you can't see it easily if it's on the ground but when it grows it becomes a gigantic tree, bigger that the maize plant that dries up after one harvest.


So do not ignore the littlest things in life for the Kingdom of God is found more in the little things of life than they are in the big things.

So be the best as you manifest God's Kingdom in your life for you are a channel of manifestation of God's Kingdom here on earth as it is in heaven.

Bible Citations for this article:
Matthew 22:37-40, John 16:33, Romans 8:8, 8:34-39, Matthew 6:10, 2 Corinthians 5:14-17.



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Remain Blessed.
Yours Sincerely;
Apostle Constance C. Friday Ani

Apostle Constance o, sorry to draw your attention to this sir

You started by asking an important question "Where is the kingdom of God that Christ promised'? But ended up by saying the kingdom of God is found more in the little things of life.
Does that also suggest that a Muslim or Atheist who do not ignore little details in his life as a result, he becomes successful, have the kingdom of God?

I know you want people to see that you are a Christian, there is nothing wrong about that. But also know that
CHRISTIANITY IS A THING OF THE MIND AND NOT A THING OF THE SIGHT. BECAUSE GOD IS A SPIRIT WHO DESERVES TO BE WORSHIPPED MORE SINCERELY IN SPIRIT, NOT NECESSARILY DOING RELIGION FOR HUMANS TO SEE

A scripture says "with the heart man believeth unto righteousness..."
CHRISTIANITY IS BEST PRACTICED IN THE HEART WHERE EVERY ACTIONS COMES FROM
You are only righteous all because you believed in Christ in the heart.
Your belief in pastors sermons can never make you righteous, they can only make you a good person only if the pastor is preaching the truth.

Being a good person is one thing, but being righteous is a total different thing entirely. It only comes with Grace.
You already have that Grace to be righteous by virtue of your belief in Christ, but some of you Christians don't know.

As a Christian, do you ever feel that you are unreasonably committed to religion?
What that means is that, are you giving your time and resources to your local church without the church management fully explaining with facts to you, as to how these resources are being used, or are you still saying to yourself why should i question God?
Or do you feel cajoled to give to the church on controversial reasons like tithing?

Then certainly, you are in bondage

The only way you can Emancipate yourself is to read and understand your bible on your own without the influence of your church.
That means, don't allow the church to interprete certain verses of the bible to you, they will only do that at their own advantage while you are the one loosing. But you will never be aware of this because, some scriptures requires intelligence to understand, couple with how much time you have given yourself to read the bible.
And since pastors have given their time to read the bible than you, it follows that you can't beat them in the game.
They will become wealthier while some of you will remain poorer

For those who can't read and write, you are doomed into religious bondage, no one can help you.

Your ignorance of scriptures or illiteracy or inability to read have absolutely nothing to do with your salvation in Christ, because the gift of salvation is absolutely free irrespective of who you are, so long you believe in Christ you are justified into heaven.

But while you are here on earth you will certainly be exploited by pastors and religion if you don't have wisdom and understanding. It is for this reason that many Christians have resolved into atheism when they were halfway realizing themselves without having the full knowledge of scriptures, I'm saying this so that you do not fall into that trap.

The bible is a complete book, it educates with wisdom.
The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom
Christianity is knowledge and power. It will crush any opposition or Antichrist that surfaces in your life only if you practice it with LOVE AND JUSTICE and not with the mind to exploit

Workch:
Using scientific methods.
We can test if Noah's flood really happened, we have done it and it never did.
We can test Virgin unfertilized conception mammals, all evidence suggests that Mary's vrigin birth is most likely a lie.

have you ever seen a sick man healed miraculously before?

Workch:
No, religion claims should also be tested. Alot of fraudulent claims are in religion and one needs to test them.

how do you test religious claims?

Workch:
anything that cannot be tested is prone to fraud.

in that case, agnotism should only exist in the rhelm of science and should not have any opinion in religion since religion is strictly theoretical and does not require scientific apparatus

Workch:
Science involves disciplines that use the scientific method to determine the most probable explanation for what we observe in the physical universe, and this method involves observation of the available evidence, experimentation, presenting results, peer review, further observation and experimentation, etc. Scientists examine the evidence before arriving at a conclusion. If new evidence is presented, scientists consider it and revise their views if warranted.

Thomas H. Huxley, who coined the term agnostic, was a scientist. He found it puzzling that many people spoke with certainty about things which could not be verified by any known methodology (this is what atheists and theists do) . Huxley believed that to claim to have "knowledge" (in Greek, gnosis) that a belief or claim is true or lie, one must have verifiable evidence to support to disprove the claim. To Huxley, to present a claim as certain without evidence was ethically wrong and intellectually dishonest. He stated that claims of certainty in any matter, whether science or religion, should be backed by evidence, and proposed the agnostic method to examine claims based on evidence. If there was no justifiable evidence, one was "without knowledge" of the certainty of the claim or belief, or agnostic. He called practice of using such a method agnosticism

Agnosticism is not about belief, it is about using a method to verify the probability that a claim is true or factual by examining the evidence. A person is free to believe or not believe the claim, and may choose to believe a claim without evidence, based on philosophical reasons or personal preference.

So, according to Huxley's definition of agnostic and agnosticism, those who practice the scientific method are indeed agnostic in the sense that they use a method to examine the evidence for a claim before determining the probability that the claim is true or factual.

In Huxley's words:
“Agnosticism is not a… creed of any kind, but the validity of a principle, which is as much ethical as intellectual. This principle may be stated in various ways, but they all amount to this: it is wrong for a man to say that he is certain of the objective truth of any proposition unless he can produce evidence which logically justifies that certainty.”
T. H. Huxley. Essays, Volume V, IX

LordReed KnownUnknown

what if the logical evidence of the said certainty isn't science methodogically based but a conclusion derived from reading about consistencies like miracles and prophecies written in a holy book in relation to what is obtainable to today's reality?

IhateYouMan:
A pagan man has 3 wives. The first wife has 4 children, the second wife has 2 children and the third wife has only one child. They all live together in a common compound where each wife and her children dwell in separate small houses. The man lives in the main house and each wife visits him and cooks for him once a week.

This pagan man then gets to know Jesus Christ and becomes BORN AGAIN.

What should he do with his marriages ? Keep the first wife and send the other two packing or leave things as they are ?

If he leaves things as they are, would church members not think that it is a good thing to marry more than one wife ?

Please help me here.

church members cannot decide how he is going to live his life. If he is born again he is born again for God, not for church members.

If polygamy is what he has decided, no church member has any right to oppose his decision.

FRANCISTOWN:
Look at you! Who told you I'm not interested in the analysis. How could I have taken out time to write something I was not interested in.

you took time to write about a religion you never bothered to make reference their holy book which is the fundermental of the said religion.
Obviously, you are not intested. That's why i said you are not sincere to yourself

My goal is to emancipate people from their delusions. Before I die, i will make sure at least 100 people will be emancipated from religion and the God delusion.

your target is 100 people out of billions?

Omo!


you want to emancipate them with what historical references or book?

With the book of atheist containing human history?
I'm yet to see any such reference

Do you realize that you are dealing with humans who have intelligence?

That is my goal. Anyone can hit their head on the ground. It has nothing to do with me. Imma fact, you ain't seen nothing yet

This is the evangelism of atheism and I am one of the evangelists.

you are joking

FRANCISTOWN:
Maybe you do not know but lemme tell you.

Many atheists have read the Bible

Lies!

Just like me who doesn't read the Quran and is not interested in Islam, that's how atheists are with the bible.

Do you know what it means to read a book?
It also implies to comprehend what you are reading

more than your pastors,

very possible they had attempted to glance through the bible several times more than pastors, but that doesn't equate to reading

therefore going to any church will be useless,

therefore making enquiry about whether God answers prayers or not should also be useless and therefore you should remain a spectector and not to conclude what you don't know

funny and annoying at the same time, why? Because you can see thru the deceit and the perception engineering that the pastor is using on his herds.

you are very right that most pastors are deceptive. Obviously that is so because they also lack understanding of what the bible stand for

Christianity is useless. Religion is irrelevant. Stop wasting people's time.

jumping to conclusion is a fallacy commonly found among atheists and that isn't wisdom. Rather, it shows how vulnerable you people are when it comes to sound arguments.
You don't conclude that Christianity is useless simply because there are deceptive pastors.

Do you know that there are also ignorant and deceptive atheists everywhere too?

Deception is a thing of the human mind that cut across every religion or Non religion

Instead of investing 10hrs every week(including Sunday and midweek services) into that social gathering called church services, instead invest that 10hrs into taking a new course and see how your life turns out a year after.

it is your personal choice.

Another person will do otherwise and that's the reality you can never change

Religion, especially Christianity is a waste of time, waste of life and a waste of existence.

For how long will you keep treating life as a joke?

for your information, there are billions people worldwide practicing the same Christianity and atheists worldwide who have been in existence long before the on-set of Christianity some 2000 years ago are currently not matching that number and are very few.

This tells you that Christianity is far more reasonable than atheism in all ramification. It's obvious that people will rather remain deceived in Christianity than to port to one nonsensical ideology called atheism.

By the way, you atheists, do you care for yourselves?
I mean, especially in this harsh Nigeria economy, how many atheists do render help to another atheist for the sake of the group?

I saw one suffering the other day, it was Christians that came to his rescue

Busybrain2233:
How do I judge for my self when I don't know the battle God and man is fighting.🤷

then you should let the op speak for himself since he is very sure that God do not exist

Please kindly edify me by telling me the battle God is fighting with man?

there is a church close to you.
You can always visit one of their services just to aquire little knowledge atlesst, of what Christianity stands for

Busybrain2233:
Sir FRANCISTOWN said during the just concluded election, Xtians prayed but what they are getting in return is dismal, instead of some folks to analyze what he said they are quoting and will continue to quote the bible.

Can't you guys reason logically, or is the veil covering ur eyes made of steel

of what use is someone who is desperately in need of the analysis but is pretending not to be interested in the analysis?
To the analyzer,is it not waste of time and energy to do the analysis like that ?

He is not sincere to himself, let him pack into his atheism and remain there jo, who cares?

But trust me, billions of Nigerians will still practice the Christianity and more are still converted and there is nothing he can do about it but remain confused why is it so?

For Jesus says, my kingdom is not of this world.
So, whatsoever people are suffering or enjoying on this earth have absolutely nothing to do with God's kingdom his tiny atheistic brain can't get that.

With that, between God and man who is actually winning the battle?

Now you judge for yourself

end time my foot

Yes

Yes, Jesus teaches love for mankind and creation. The aim is to make the world a better place and not for destruction as purported by people who wishes destruction of the world because their souls are troubled by ignorance and religion.

Such people may possibly have the tendency of extremism

vdestro:
Earth remains forever also means that one earth be destroyed and a new one made to replace it.

You mean Revelation 21:1 ?

The new earth in Revelation 21:1 is a figure of speech which implies that the first covenant was passed away and there is a new covenant.

The new covenant in Christ represent heaven on this same earth we are living.

When you relate it with other scripture, Jesus told his disciples in Luke 13:24

Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.
Luke 13:24 when once THE MASTER OF THE HOUSE IS RISEN...

So, the resurrection of Christ marks the beginning of heaven on this earth that the disciples needed to strive to enter, which is the new covenant. Or call it new heaven on this earth as indicated in Revelation 21:1


so there is nothing like destruction of this earth to pave way for a new earth

Or if the earth were destroyed like you said, where then do the kings of the earth come from, can you explain it?

Revelation 21:24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and THE KINGS OF THE EARTH do bring their glory and honour into it.

So, signs of the end means signs of the destruction of this earth for the new one to come.

Man, you are far gone.

destruction is a fictional religious doctrine that arises from inability to properly interprete figure of speeches in the bible, it isn't real

Yes