₦airaland Forum

Mudley313:
the most appalling thing is dat these hero-worshipped so-called annointed men of god in nigeria actually called n annointed themselves n placed titles upon themselves as well. so sad how my people fall for these celebrity false teachers of today, milking the masses in d name of the lawd

Very true.

Enigma:
Instead of worshiping the Almighty God, many people have made gods and false idols for themselves in their "men (women) of God"!!! As someone said some time ago, many people have turned the G.O. of their church into G.O.D.!

A very sad fact.

davidylan:
I guess a lot of folks forget that the verse in particular was reserved for heathen kings and nations through which the Israelites passed on the way to the promised land. Some of the nations who dared disobey this command (the amalekites) payed dearly for it. However it is instructive to note that no such commandment was given to Israelites themselves concerning their prophets. Elijah had a good time slaughtering the "prophets" of Baal on mount carmel.

Hmmm. . . very good observation there

nuclearboy:
Jesoul,

is this a joke?

Please God, let her reply "yes"

Of course the answer's a "no"! Things are really happening out there o!

I'm not surprised. . . The Bishop at Ota already called church a business so. . .

VALIDATOR:
He wants to be sure he is the first person to plug his flash drive into the girls usb port.

OMG!!!!!!! Nairalanders! Una no go kill me o!!!!

I was just about turning in when I saw this thread and now I'm glad I did! I'm sure I'm going to have really sweet dreams 2nite! 

I'm happy because more and more people are beginning to realise the truth about these men and live up to their call to judge, as believers. I'm currently studying to do one or two writeups about this very topic & share it on facebook.

All the problems of false gospels and doctrines, false teachers/prophets etc. will continue so long as people think they're told to "judge not" and "touch not mine anointed".

It is well.  .  .

Kudos to nuclearboy & ogajim. Love your inputs 

Bastage:
And I thought I'd read all the craziness here on nairaland.

And there's more to come. . .

mazaje:
. . .I know that no body will ever provide such evidence, but I wonder why people keep yapping that their own version of God alone must have been the one that created the universe. . . .

Whoever said atheists do not have faith!

mazaje:
DNA is now god right?. . . .

And where did I say that??

mazaje:
As for Perry Marshall his arguments were completely destroyed on the infidels website. . . .

That is not true, sir. It is yet to be refuted after over 300 replies on that thread 

mazaje:
What is funny is the way modern day christians have now reduced their god and have almost stripped him of all his traditional powers and attributes. The god that is now talked about is the subtle god that seems to manifest himself in things that people do not know or things that look or sound mysterious. . . .

Dunno about others, but I started this thread to show that there are really are plenty of scientific pointers that indicate that there really is a creator.

mazaje:
The god the bible talks about is no longer the image some christians are now portraying. . . .They are now portraying a picture of a completely detached, god who only evidence is "his creation". . . .The all powerful, all knowing, all good, omnipresent, o-mini what ever concept has now been dropped. . .The christian god is now the singularity, DNA, interpreter of dreams etc. . . .He has been completely stripped of his traditional attributes and has now been relegated to the status of the deist god. . . .God is no longer this mysterious being that heals the blind, heal amputees or performs wonders for all to "see and believe". . . .

Oh, don;t get us wrong.  .  . God still has all of his powers and attributes and I would've gone on to present some of them here for you to comment on refute but with all your responses so far, that would be a complete waste of time, as its clear you have your mind made up and will not even make the effort to see things objectively, even for a minute. And don;t get me wrong.  .  . I think thats cool 

nice one there @largerwhenindoubt

aletheia:
Take it easy. I only pointed out that he wasn't following the teaching on tithes as taught by majority of tithe teachers today. Why does that anger you?

P.S. In giving to those who are poor and in need, one is following the command to love. It is your affair entirely if you choose to call it tithe or some other name. What I am against is the twisting of scriptures to suggest that those redeemed by Christ are under a curse just because they do not remit a tenth of their income to some man-made organization or self-acclaimed MOG.

So on point!

No controversy - When you are mine!

Mazaje,

Thought you might be interested in these -

Darwin: Brilliantly Half-Right; Tragically Half-Wrong - http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/blog/darwin-half-right/

“If you can read this sentence, I can prove God exists” - http://www.cosmicfingerprints.com/blog/prove-god-exists/

Below are 2 links to webpages where I think they did a good job in straightening this issue out -

Is Jesus Christ the created archangel Michael? - http://www.letusreason.org/jw22.htm


Archangel Michael.:IS JESUS CHRIST THE ARCHANGEL MICHAEL? - http://www.4jehovah.org/jehovahs-witness-archangel.php

Nimshi:
petres_007: you're yet to summon the scriptures Jehovah's Witnesses point to speaking to Michael as Archangel . . .

In any case, when will the leaders of the Jehovah's Witnesses make public apologies for making their congregations a safe haven for peadophiles? When will they apologise for those doctrines that continue to victimise children and make heroes of child rapists?

@Nimshi,

I just did a quick search and found out the main verse they seem to get the idea from is 1 Thess 4:16 

16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.

Maybe the Lord is both "a shout" as he descends heaven with a "shout" and he's also the "trumpet of God" since he's also descending heaven with it 

Another.  .  .

15 He is a visible image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;

16 for in him was the universe created, things in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen, thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers; by him and for him all have been created;

17 and HE IS before all, and in him all things subsist.

18 He is the head of his Body, the Church. He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, in order that in all things he may become preeminent.

19 For in him all the divine fullness chose to dwell;

Col 1:15-19 (MNT)

And another.  .  .

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 He was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

John 1:1-3 (RSV)

@Poster,

It is one of the major wrong doctrines of the Jehovah's witnesses. You need to see the skill with which they twist the scriptures to teach this their hell-spawn theory.

Anyway, here's what the scriptures say:

1 God, who in ancient days spoke to our ancestors in the prophets, at many different times and by various methods,

2 has at the end of these days spoken to us in a Son whom he appointed heir of all things; through whom also he made the universe.

3 He being an emanation of God's glory and stamp of his substance, and upholding the universe by the utterances of his power, after by himself making purification of our sins, has taken his seat on the right hand of the Majesty on High.

4 [color=#990000]He is as much superior to the angels as the name that he has inherited surpasses theirs.

5 For to what angel did God ever say, Thou art my son; this day have I become thy Father? [/b]and again, I will be a father to him, and he shall be to me a son?

6 And further, when he brought the firstborn into the habitable world, he said, [b]Let all the angels of God worship him.

7 While of the angels he said, He makes his angels into winds, His ministering servants into flames of fire.

8 But to the Son he says: Thy throne, O God, is forever and ever, And the scepter of thy kingdom is the scepter of justice.

- Hebrews 1:1-8 (Montgomery's New Testament, MNT)[/color]

That is one portion of scripture that I believe does justice to the issue in that it shows that the Son is not only superior to & separate from the angels, but that he is God himself. 

Ah! You came online again. My eyes are getting sticky now o.  .  . 

You're the only atheist who's taken time to watch this video and discuss it with me and I'm thankful you did. But just so we don't go on and on in this thread and never get to accomplish anything.  .  . except waste our time 

I'd like to know what you think about DNA and its "code". Do YOU think there's a mind behind it or not??

Open idolatry. . .

mazaje:
Pls watch the video again. . . .That was what William Craig and the other guy said. . . .Whats the purpose of the universe?. . . . .Whats the purpose of the gazillions of stars, asteriods, comets and galaxies out there?

You keep asking this question and here's my answer -  I don't know. To the best of my knowledge, science is still looking for answers.

But hey.  .  . thats the way its always been. So much of what we know today about creation with the help of science were not known to our forbears.  .  . Would they have been wise to dismiss the unknown & "not yet understood" as meaningless and without purpose?? 

What about what we do know about creation? What about the 4-character DNA code talked about in the video (and plenty of other online sources)? What do you make of that? Did a code appear in every one of our cells by blind chance too?

Or is there a mind behind it?

P.S. I hope to start another thread with a riddle presented by a Christian scientist to the atheists on infidels.org which no one has been able to answer after over 300 replies on that thread. But I'm sure you guys here won't let me down 

You still didn't answer my question, but I'll let it pass and address this:

mazaje:
^^^^^

Whats the purpose of all the endless explosion of stars and other cosmic bodies?. . .In the video, some of the people in it suggested that the universe was designed for life. . .How so?. . .How is the universe designed for life when MOST of it does not support life?. . . .Life does not even survive in space on its own, so how is the universe created/designed for life when all of the parts of the universe that we know is incapable of sustaining life?. . . . .

Thats not what was said in the video. I guess you misunderstood them. They did say that most of the universe doesn't have whats needed to support life and the study of science/the universe, like earth does - indicating that the earth must've been designed to support life.

Re: Was Jesus A Character Invented By The Gospel Writers?

NO!

Do some real, objective research into the issue and stop your wishful thinking. . .

mazaje1:
https://i.huffpost.com/gen/160192/CARINA-NEBULA-PHOTO.jpg


What is the purpose of this endless explosion and destruction captured by the hubble space telescope?

@Mazaje,

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think you're insinuating that there's no purpose behind this, no? And maybe none at all in all of creation - no purpose, right?

@poster,

Please accept my heartfelt condolences! I know what its like to lose a loved one.

It is well enh?  

lagerwhenindoubt:
he. he heeeh he the only ones that cannot be judged by man or angels are pastor chris, daddy GO, Pa TB and Mr Laz

Tehehehe

by the way, who's "Mr Laz"??

Enigma:
@ D.A.V.E.

Read the below from Mark 2:

Nice one there. . . but I think what folks like him want is a no-brainer - some verse where Jesus said "I am God". . . as if thats not what he said here (by implication)

OLAADEGBU:
Some cults argue that because Jesus prayed to the Father that He could not truly be God. Biblically, however, it was in His humanity that Christ prayed to the Father. Since Christ came as a man, and since one of the proper duties of man is to worship, pray to and adore God -- it was perfectly proper for Jesus to address the Father in prayer.

Positionally speaking as a man, as a Jew and as our High Priest -- "in all things He had to be made like His brethren" (Hebrews 2:7) -- Jesus could pray to the Father. But this in no way detracts from His intrinsic deity.

Correct!

[quote author=D.A.V.E link=topic=434315.msg5938540#msg5938540 date=1271978972]@OLAADEGBU,i dont like arguements please ,so i pray u get inspired by the word.it is clear that Jesus is not God.
Matthew 3:17 says n i quote "and suddenly a voice came from heaven,saying,this is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased"
so was the father in heaven n earth at the same time.[/quote]And why do you find it had to believe God is was in more than one place at the same time? Who do you think he is?

@mazaje,

One question for you, since you've seen the video: do you still think there's no intelligence behind the creation/existence of the universe? Did nothing in the video sound credible enough to at least make you look into the possibility that the universe really was created?

mazaje1:
I have watched the video and here are my thoughts on the video. . . .Lee Stroble is a journalist who knows how to cook a story. His idea of investigation is very one sided. Whereas the first rule of journalism is present both sides of the issue without choosing a side. It shouldn't matter if one is an atheist or christian, if you are a journalist the storyline should be neutral. He did not interview any atheist or non christian scientist, I saw him interview Christian scientist from the discovery institute and William Craig who was telling outright lies and saying things that scientist and cosmologist NEVER said. He began by first trying to say that atheist are bad people as usual . . .He claimed that his wife became a good person and started living a good life when she became a christian. . . . . . . . .

To the video and what it talks about. . . .This video is just a video that tries to discredit the scientific explanation for the origin of the universe and species with out providing any counter evidence to show that the god of the bible created the universe, It just says that the universe was created and god of the bible did it with out explaining how or why?. . . .The first 10 minutes focuses on one of science's greatest strengths. The undoing of a very suggestive experiment by continued experimentation.

I'm talking about the Miller-Urey experiments of the 1950's that developed amino acids by sparking chemicals in a closed environment based on the atmosphere then thought to be the atmosphere of the early earth. Later, scientists changed their minds, based on further work, and posited that there wasn't near the hydrogen in the atmosphere of the early earth as originally thought (and which Miller-Urey was based on). . . . . .

The video suggests, Miller-Urey prove nothing and "god exists." Instead of going forward into the latest theories about how life developed on earth, that developed after Miller-Urey, the video goes backward to Oparin and the 1920s. Lovely. . . . . .What the video ignores is that as experiments continued into the 1970s and 80s, a whole new theory of life developed based on anaerobic life around ocean vents possibly being the spark of life. The ocean vent theory is by now fairly advanced, but, of course is ignored in the video. . . . . .

Then the video criticizes Darwin because Darwin had a little drawing in origin showing a tree of life. The video then says the fossil record does not show transitional forms, emphasizing particularly the cambrian era. . . . Criticizing the fossil record is an old tried and true creationist tactic. What the video doesn't tell the viewer is that, in fact, significant numbers of transitional fossils have been found (for example, the whale, birds, humans). I mean, fossil science has really only been around in a serious way for about 200 years now. The video completely ignores the fact that new, hitherto unknown fossils are found literally every 3 or 4 months. . . . . .

Then the video spins off on the big bang, suggesting that the idea that the universe popped out of nowhere implies it was created. The sophist William Craig came on and started lying about what science did NOT even say. . . He said that according to modern day cosmology the universe came into existence out of nothing . . .Science does NOT say that the universe came out of nothing it says that the universe started expanding from a singularity. . . .Was the Big Bang dependent on something else? Maybe on the original singularity. But is there anybody who knows what the singularity is dependent on? The singularity might have been dependent on something else. . . . No body knows. . . .

ol boy ehhhhh. . . see enuf acrobatics

I know say you no go disappoint me

mantraa:
As a christian, do you still believe that the earth is literally 6000 years old or 4.5 billion years old?
And do you really believe that a talking snake deceived a unclothed woman in a perfect garden as told in the book of genesis?

@mantraa,

Like David pointed out, there's no where in the bible where it says the earth is just 6000 years old. Its true there are a lot of things Christians get wrong, the bible doesn't contain all there is to know about God, the unviese, the earth etc.

I'm still expecting responses from all the other athiests in the house; Mazaje (who's been here), Tudor, Huxley, Wirinet & co. Please take sometime out and watch the video, carefully. And then bring your refutation here (trusting that you won't believe whats presented in the video).

Thanx

P.S. Like daviddylan mentioned, I think Christians need to watch the video too. . . so please.

davidylan:
Actually nowhere in the bible did it claim that the earth is 6000 yrs old. Search the bible, that figure is NOT bandied anywhere. Infact the books of Genesis and Jeremiah make a clear case for a world that was definitely much much older than we think and was clearly inhabited by other organism before the creation of man.

I'm not sure you clearly understood what conclusions the scientists in that video were making. They were not declaring God to be the creator of the earth BECAUSE they had no other evidence for anything else. Actually they reached their conclusions for divine providence BASED on scientific evidence showing the earth CANNOT have appeared by chance and MUST have been the handiwork of some intelligent force and for a particular purpose.

Again you seem not to have watched the same video i did. Firstly the analogy of the iphone is totally wrong. The iphone is itself composed of several stand-alone parts. The cell is the single-smallest unit of life . . . it is the building blocks for every complex organism on earth. One of the scientists makes a salient point . . . if you put acell in a dish containing every condition for its survival . . . that cell thrives. However if you puncture this cell such that its contents leak out into the surrounding liquid, that liquid will still contain EVERY condition conducive for the existence of a cell, it will also contain EVERY component for a cell but it CANNOT on its own generate a new living cell.

The cell (unlike the iphone) isnt evolving into anything new. The same cell that cannot be created will still NOT be created in 2000 yrs of trying.

That is flat out WRONG. The scientist there was explaining the cambrian explosion . . . according to this theory, simple single-celled organisms were around for millions of yrs until all of a sudden you get a huge bunch of highly complex organisms. If (as you claim) cells were evolving until they mutated into complex organisms there SHOULD BE intermediate life forms present in the fossil record. This absence of intermediates is what condemns Darwin's theory of evolution as a farce.

We still wont discover any new answers . . . because there really are none.

No christian with a good grasp of his bible will tell you the earth is only 6000 yrs old.

[b]It takes more faith to believe that the earth appeared by chance than to believe a snake spoke in a garden. [/b]Besides the bible records that a SERPENT spoke to eve, NOT a snake as is erroneously claimed.

Respects to you too bro.

God bless you for this excellent response bro!

davidylan:
pardon me petres007

You're pardoned! At least you did it without any sarcasm or stuff like that

mantraa:
I just finished watching the video.

Its good to see christians embracing science in the video with the big bang theory explained and the timeline of billions of years of evolution on this planet. They even acknowledge the fact that the cambrian explosion happened 530 million years ago. This contradicts the 6000 year old earth from the bible creation story in genesis.
As an atheist, I and other scientists do not claim to have all the answers. I think that this is the misunderstanding that theists have about science. Scientists are searching for answers, nobody knows yet what caused the big bang or the first micro organisms to form on this planet.
I think it is arrogant and intellectually dishonest to conclude that because the answer has not yet been discovered that a god must have done it. And that that god is yehweh as opposed to all the other gods that people have believed in. There are thousands of different faith based supernatural creation stories all over the world.
The analagy in the video that a cell is an irreducibly complex machine is a good one. However, machines evolve. For instance, an iphone would be an irreducibly complex machine to the most intelligent brains 200 years ago. Even if they took it apart, they still would not understand how it works until they had discovered the laws of electromagnetism, semiconductors, microprocessors, chemistry etc. The iphone has evolved from a simple telegram system 150 years ago into a machine that would be seen as irreducibly complex and impossible to understand back then.

As shown by the 24 hour timeline in the video, simple cells were evolving for billions of years up to the 21st hour before one finally mutated into the right complex combination to flourish on this planet.
We are the end product of billions of years of evolution and have not yet discovered all the answers. Only in the last hundred years have we just discovered our own biology and our place in this vast cosmos. There is so much more to be discovered. Lets not jump to premature conclusions based on our own ignorance.

As a christian, do you still believe that the earth is literally 6000 years old or 4.5 billion years old?
And do you really believe that a talking snake deceived a unclothed woman in a perfect garden as told in the book of genesis?

Respects

@Mantraa,

Thanks a bunch for your input! But I'd like for us to take it one step at a time, please. One step at a time.

The scientists (except for Strobel himself) in the video (which I urge you to watch one more time) were simply drawing their conclusions based on scientific evidence that point powerfully toward the fact that some intelligence of some sort must have been involved in the creation/existence of the universe. Not that Yahweh or anyone else did it.

Its true Strobel is a Christian now and so the video has a Christian "flavour" to it but I implore you guys to please ignore that for now and lets focus on the fact there is overwhelming evidence that there certainly was some kind of intelligence & purpose involved in creation.

I hope to start other threads about which "god" or "gods" (as mazaje insinuated in anothe thread) did create the universe or which one is most likely to have done it.

bgees:
What a life. Life is not fair at all. And I wonder why . Things like these push me towards atheism.

dey go na!  

Eyaa, Kai, just when I thought someone was going to put Meiran on the map of lagos,


Remeber seeing him around years ago, RIP