₦airaland Forum

kobosmalls:
If Noah's ark really saved every animal on earth today, how come kangaroos are mostly if not only found in Australia. To be precise, Noah's ark stopped at mount Ararat located at eastern turkey. How did the kangaroos get to Australia a continent surrounded by the pacific and Atlantic oceans? How come no trace of kangaroos have been found around turkey not even their remains nor signs of their migration from Ararat to Australia? Did they fly across the oceans? OK maybe it was a miracle like Mary the virgin conceiving Jesus without sex. How funny ...... Really how can anyone believe these trash?

The Biblical account of creation and the Great Dispersion gives us enough reason to believe that initially, the earth (ground) was a lump rising out of and separated from the water bodies. Hence we may safely say that the separation of continents by ocean etc took place much later.

There is an aspect of Geography that also establishes this position. Hence the animals did not need to 'fly across the ocean'.

For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and [b]the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
[/b]2 Peter 3:5

Lilbrown007:
[size=19pt]
P.S Am Still An Atheist!![/size]

Thanks for that info. It explains the state of mind that informed your lop-sidedness and assures us that this thread is not a report of an unbiased study but a search for more grounds to remain a theophobe!

Jozzy4:
What about inner woman? You guys like to deceive yourselfs.


Animals have spirit , also breath of life. That's the point

Here are some of the passages you just mocked:

16 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day
2 Corinthians 4:16

16 that he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man
Ephesians 3:16

So, it's a BIBLICAL term!

Now would you be kind enough to address the other post?

Jozzy4:
Having spirit has nothing to do with ressurection bro, for the record animals have same spirit with man ( Ecc 3:19-21)

Can you show me just ONE passage in the Bible where an animal is said to yield up the ghost? or where animals were said to have an inner self? If yes, pls go ahead.

If no, then I go along with the contextual usage that shows the usage of spirit in that passage relates to breath, not the inner man!

mustymatic:
No slowing down
It could also mean a religious community or its site, regarded as chosen by God and under his special protection
Zi·on (zī′ən) also Si·on (sī′ən)
n.
1.
a. The historic land of Israel as a symbol of the Jewish people.
b. The Jewish people; Israel.
2. A place or religious community regarded as sacredly devoted to God.
3. An idealized, harmonious community; utopia.


b. a religious community or its site, regarded as chosen by God and under his special protection
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Zion

And this definition does not fit into that Psalm. Baca is a place of the many places passed by those on pilgrimage to Jerusalem, not a destination for worship.
When you come to the Psalms, the reference is the Temple at Jerusalem!

KingEbukaNaija:
cc : winner01 , ireorony , UyiIredia , Ishilove , Scholar8200


Winner01 , we joked about this yesterday and this man said he'll allow his kid to go sleep with animals because the Canadian law says so .

Well i am not surprised! Anything against God or His Word is fair for the theophobe!

This is insightful! Especially when you consider the fact that God told Moses that no man can see Him(not the Similitudes Moses had seen ) and live, how then would JESUS (if He wasnt crucified and resurrected) be stationed near that same God?

mustymatic:
There is no valley on earth called Baca (or Bakkah) that contains a house of worship and a spring of water (Zamzam), in which one prayer is better than a thousand prayers offered anywhere else, other than Makkah al-Mukarramah.

Baca (Bakkah) is one of the names of Makkah. This name is mentioned in the Holy Qur’an, where Allah, may He be exalted, says (interpretation of the meaning)”

“Verily, the first House (of worship) appointed for mankind was that at Bakkah (Makkah), full of blessing, and a guidance for Al-Alameen (the mankind and jinns)”

[Aal ‘Imraan 3:96].

But the translators and commentators of the Old Testament distorted the word Baca to buka’ [weeping or crying; the Hebrew cognate denotes the same meaning], even though the meanings of place names should not be translated; rather the name should be transliterated, and even though the meaning of the (original) name has nothing to do with crying or weeping, as a result of their desire to eliminate all references to anything that is proven in the Holy Qur’an, such distortions occurred.

The following verses are from The Bible's book of Psalms, Chapter 84.

Pslams is believed to be revealed to Prophet David (Dawood) (peace be on him). The Holy Quran refers to the book as Zabur, which is not extant in its original form.
The text below is taken from the NIV version of The Bible (http://bible.gospelcom.net )
Psalm 84 :: New International Version (NIV)


1 How lovely is your dwelling place,
O LORD Almighty!
2 My soul yearns, even faints,
for the courts of the LORD ;
my heart and my flesh cry out
for the living God.

3 Even the sparrow has found a home,
and the swallow a nest for herself,
where she may have her young-
a place near your altar,
O LORD Almighty, my King and my God.
4 Blessed are those who dwell in your house;
they are ever praising you.
Selah

5 Blessed are those whose strength is in you,
who have set their hearts on pilgrimage.
6 As they pass through the Valley of Baca,
they make it a place of springs;
the autumn rains also cover it with pools.
7 They go from strength to strength,
till each appears before God in Zion.

8 Hear my prayer, O LORD God Almighty;
listen to me, O God of Jacob.
Selah
9 Look upon our shield, O God;
look with favor on your anointed one.

10 Better is one day in your courts
than a thousand elsewhere;
I would rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God
than dwell in the tents of the wicked.
11 For the LORD God is a sun and shield;
the LORD bestows favor and honor;
no good thing does he withhold
from those whose walk is blameless.

12 O LORD Almighty,
blessed is the man who trusts in you.

BACA IS MECCA: the holy Ka'ba built by the prophet Abraham (PBUH) and his son Ishmael (PBUH) is in Mecca.

The name Mecca (Makkah) is mentioned in the Holy Qur'an in 48:24. Another name for Mecca is Bakka, depending on the dialect of the tribe: this is also mentioned once, in Sura 3:96

"Verily, the first house (of worship) appointed for mankind was that in Bakka (Mecca), full of blessing, and guidance for all people." Amazingly enough, this word Bakka is mentioned by the prophet David (PBUH) in the Bible:

"Who passing through the valley of Baca make it a well, the rain also filleth the pools." (Psalm 84:6)

The well here is the well known well of Zam-Zam, still present now, close to the Ka'bah; after thousands of years.

Let's slow down here!

ANY reference to the House of God/courts of God etc by the psalmist refers to the Temple where the Ark was placed!

That Temple was located in Jerusalem/Zion Pslam 84Vs 7, not Mecca or Baca!

Besides, that verse 6 mentions Baca not as a destination but one of the many places they pass through on their way to Zion/Jerusalem

Rilwon:
well, Islam don't recognize neither Catholic nor their profession.



If the son meant in that verse is Jesus, then you are wrong, because Islam recognizes him.

Derek Prince, a foremost Bible teacher said and I paraphrase:

The spirit of antichrist will acknowledge God and Jesus but deny the relationship described (in that passage)"

https://www.facebook.com/sermonindex/videos/10155084030574199/

Presbulg:
You guys always seems to amaze me. Muslims acknowledge Jesus as he brought the same message as Abraham,Moses. Or can show me any proof of where Jesus is being abused by muslims ?

Do they believe Him for Who that passage says He is - the Son of God?

petra1:
I don't think he is still a Christian . No child of God want to live in sin. Such as you mentioned already has his conscience seared . He no longer has conscience towards God. It's a man who has lost his salvation that can be like that.

Thank you very much sir!

Excellent one op!!! Stay blessed

This confirms that there is somebody somewhere trying to upgrade LIES as TRUTH unfolds. The first TRUTH they (through Semiramis) stole was God's promise that the seed of the woman will bruise the serpent. They thought it will end there but they were mistaken!

Some even do theirs in retrospect eg '' gospel of Barnabas''

They have FAILED. This ignoble act of theirs only confirms that
Jesus is The Way, the Truth and the Life.

Op,Watch as the theophobes prove to be better than all the scholars mentioned above!

Goshen360:
Scholar8200,

Na wha for you o...somethings you said I completely agree with and some, we'll disagree but you're throwing too much out of context scriptures in the discussion. If I was to respond, we'll derail this thread. I guess I'll respond when I have time.

Looking forward to your response and do highlight the passages thrown out of context and their proper meanings.

tens4real:
that is wat I cal an intelligent comment thanks bro ur he'd dey dia...jah bless

Thanks and God bless.

If you ask, "Is religion a scam?" ( I speak for the faith of Christ that is called Christianity)

1. It will be a scam for those who resorted thereto hoping the God it sets forth will be an ATM to satisfy all your wants.

2. It should be a scam for those who had (1) in mind, saw that the Bible teaches contrary but still held to (1) due to covetousness!

3. It surely is a scam, for those who believed and esteemed the words of their leader more than the Word of God since the former agrees more with their emotions (hate, malice and anger{enemy die crew}) and covetousness (prosperity crew).

4. Some look at the leaders who emphasized (1) only, saw how they were fleecing the sheep and unwisely generalized that religion is a a scam!

But
It never was a scam,
1. To those, who sought for God realizing that in Him they have their being and the void that nought but He can satisfy was satisfied!

2. To those who desired to live as He wanted them to.

3. To those who realized that God was Lord to be submitted to and obeyed, not a familiar spirit to be ordered around!!!

NO man ever resorted to the God set forth by religion (using the Bible) in sincerity and came out to say, it was a scam!

Goshen360:
There's absolutely no reason for a christian to "continue or live a lifestyle" of sin. That's not what we're talking about. You can mention so called big and deadly sins but sin is sin. You don't commit murder but you lie, doubt and some very little sins, does that make you less a sinner?

you assume I hold a position and give a rhetoric thereon! I did not hint at these you have written.

So, we're not promoting a continuous lifestyle of sin here but as long as we live in this body, sin abound but where sin abound, Grace abound much more. Is Paul therefore promoting sin because grace abound much more? Certainly not!

Is your definition of Grace the same as Titus 2:11-12?

For the grace of God (His unmerited favor and blessing) has come forward (appeared) for the deliverance from sin and the eternal salvation for all mankind.
12 It has trained us to reject and renounce all ungodliness (irreligion) and worldly (passionate) desires, to live discreet (temperate, self-controlled), upright, devout (spiritually whole) lives in this present world,


IT GOES BEYOND FORGIVENESS BUT INCLUDES POWER FOR A LIFE OF VICTORY

Any baby Christian such as the corinthians will definitely fall into sins but the mature ones like Paul will correct them but not condemn them to hell.

Bro, if our converts are not manifesting newness of life, let's not allow them to die on our hands. It will be wrong to measure the effect of the new life using the Corinthians. How about the Thessalonians (whose light shone even to far places?) or Saul of Tarsus? or Zaccheus?

They are to receive a New Life, not a gradual proselytizing after yielding a mental assent to the Gospel!

Goshen360:
In one place, he said, it is by Grace you are saved through faith and not of your own self, it is the GIFT of God.

In another place, he said, the GIFT and calling of God are without repentance.

Perhaps you are thinking GIFT is only used as regards ministry gift or spiritual gifts. He said the GIFT AND CALLING of God, telling you the nature of the Gift and calling of God.

Perhaps, the above doesn't suit the discussion, let's see what he said here:

Berean Study Bible
"Blessed are those whose iniquities are forgiven, whose sins are covered; Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him."
Romans 4:7-8

In the verse above, there's 2 kinds of men therein if you can spot the difference and what is what.

2. Why will the Lord do this or give this blessedness to these 2 kinds of men?

Why? Because of their receiving the Gift He offers by faith!

Let's see this:

3 according as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
2 Peter 1:3,4


It says HE has given us not just forgiveness. However, see the below:



For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
2 Peter 1:8,9

Yes the Gift is given, and we access same by faith however there are evidences of the manifestation of that we received. The absence of these fruit/continual wallowing in sins after 'believing' attracts the rebuke in 9b.


Finally:

For if [b]after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
2 Peter 2:20
[/b]

They had escaped, they partook of the Divine Nature, but they fell - not by openly or covertly renouncing Jesus - but by yielding to the pollutions of the world. It says this of them:

For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire."2 Peter 2:21,22

Bro, Christ is coming for a glorious Church without spot or wrinkle (Ephesians 5:26-27). A forum like this should be used to promote that Divine goal!!! Saying 'Christians' can wallow in sin, sear conscience with a hot iron (the more you stiffle it , the quieter it becomes) and make Heaven is shocking!

In summary:

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27 but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

28 He that despised Moses’ law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

29 of how much [size=15pt]sorer punishment[/size], suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Hebrews 12:26-29

P.S.: he that continue sinning wilfully is actually fulfilling the blue highlighted!

nairalandbuzz:
Guys,

I have tried my possible best to upload the links here but nairaland is always blocking my posts. Even short urls are being scrambled. you know what, go to arsenal.forumup.com and there you will get numerous books.

You can search for frames69 there... I have gotten over 15000 ebooks from there...

Way to go bro! Stay blessed!!!

Goshen360:
Yes! He or she remain saved. The GIFTS and CALLING of God are irreversible/irrevocable.

That passage where you got that from was not about Salvation as it concerns the gentiles. Would you mind quoting something more applicable?

2. The verse you quoted has nothing to do with being saved now, because the same corinthians ARE ALREADY SAVED but was wallowing in sin because of their background and environment.

and Paul told them in 1 Corinth 6 that those who continued in sin would not inherit the kingdom. He further told them in 2 Corinth 11 that he was labouring to protect them from deception so as to be presentable to Christ.

3. The only thing that can make a christian loose his or her salvation is by denouncing the one he or she is in, that is THE LORD.

bro, by this claim Demas, Ananias, Sapphira died in the Lord, is that correct? ettc

4. Sins doesn't UNBORN AGAIN a Christian. Sin and sacrifice for sins had been dealt with and paid once and for all times. When Christ returns, he's not returning to come deal with sins or sacrifice for sins no more....SAYS THE WORD OF GOD.

5. Ask yourself, does every sin or sins you committed but didn't even know it was a sin UNBORN AGAIN you?

6. Paul, didn't pamper the sins of the corinthians and we are not supposed to pamper sins in the church of Christ but Paul NEVER implied the Corinthians loose their salvation because of sin and later regained it back, rather he was hard on them and they REPENTED....that's what the verse you quoted is talking about.

Now bro, how would you reconcile your response with:

If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death,he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it
1 John 5:16


He was a brother and had life, he sinned (not the unpardonable sin) and needs someone's intercession that he may have LIFE again.(meaning he lost it else why ask for him to have what he had already?).


Also see:
19Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
20 let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
James 5:19,20



A brother erred and needed to be converted again! In fact vs 20 calls him a sinner headed to perdition!
In the mouth of 2 or 3 witnesses this fact has been established

petra1:
A man is saved only once . The Adamic sin nature is replaced with the nature of righteousness . This experience is a once and for all experience . Which Goshen360 calls OSAS. there is difference between sin and sins. Sin (nature) is remitted but sins are forgiven . The new nature of righteousness which was imputed at salvation does not get taken away when a christian commit a sin. He didn't get saved by his perfection and he can't lose it by his imperfections. If he commits a sin , he still retain his nature of righteousness and it's by that nature he receives forguvesnes . None of us is perfect after the flesh . We do err by omission or commission . Judgementalisim is sin , malice is sin , wrong assumption is sin. Gossip is sin .

1 John 1:10
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

But none of this will take away the nature of God which came as a gift through faith . When a christian admits his sin he recieves forgiveness.

1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

But what if the 'christian refuses to admit his sin or does so with no purpose of heart to avoid same (2 Corinth 7: 11,10)? Does he remain saved?

We encounter God not with the head but the heart.

When the heart is satisfied by Him, the head may multiply words to express what the heart feels but words will always be incompetent! (this is why no amount of words used to describe things spiritual can accurately convey it except there is a personal experience)

Hence, wanting God or His Word to satisfy your very limited intellect before you believe may NEVER happen!

CAPSLOCKED:

WHAT ARE YOU SAYING BRO, NOT A SINGLE PERSON IN THE UNIVERSE HAS ENCOUNTERED GOD, NON EVER WILL.

You lack proof for this claim sir! You are not the single person in the Universe hence speak for yourself!

cescky:
U have a point though.....but don't forget we re made "in his likeness" or like him i.e. God so the real man which leaves inside the body is a small God and has the capabilities of God. However demons have power because they are ex angels....

And that likeness was lost after the fall. It is only regained when we come to Christ. Even at that, we remain under His Lordship meaning we dont attempt to 'use' Him, He uses us.

Therefore mans power can be used for both good and evil .....because one man can use his faith powers to attract another mans wife

That's not faith power but psychic energy!

,but then that's why the bible is the Christians guide on earth here ...so any voice or act that doesn't conform with what is written is another spirit.... But I remind I again Jesus said WHO so ever shall........and shall not DOUBT in his HEART ....shall HAVE WHATSOEVER....like some one said man is God afraid....

And just before He said that He said, "Have faith In GOD"!

Byikson:
It is my joy to stay righteous and Holy. But sometimes I see myself going back to the sins I have rejected. I [size=15pt]have tried everything possible [/size]to stop it for life but it has not been working for me.
What should I do please?

Are you born again (with the witness of the Spirit within you?

Then it appears there lies your problem-trying sans depending on His Power. (Of course you must resist temptation and abstain from all appearances of evil but these do not replace the role of faith in victorious Christian living.

Are you abiding in Him? Do you realise and know Him not as a historic Saviour but an ever Present Deliverer from the power of sin?Have you claimed His victory over sin as yours and by faith and in the Spirit's power expect it to be your daily experience?

You may enjoy this:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_i7a5EpqML6MmVxNkhJTVVmckE/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_i7a5EpqML6dkxLTjZvWnRDYlE/view?usp=sharing

cescky:
I've watched and listen to some of his shows ......he a magician and only talked about BELIEF... Which is what the bible also talks about. Note that belief of faith as mentioned in the bible is believing you have what your eyes can't see, simply put a thought in your mind or just a picture in ur mind .

Ur capable of what he does if only u believe you c an do it... What U imagine is more real than what u can see....for the things that are seen are made from things that can't be seen i.e. Ur imagination.

But what power he's aided to these I don't know, but Jesus said all things are possible to him that BELIEVEs

But we dont believe in a void there must be a basis! Jesus taught and exemplified belief in God, that was what informed all the whole nights in prayer to God and commitment to Scriptures!

However what does this man believe in? If he never specifies then remove God from the list of possible options open to him.

What I see him doing is similar to what many has been doing viz levitation: an act they accomplish using a passive mind and familiar spirits(who take advantage of the willing passivity and the latent powers of the soul!

Now op, why would an atheist open a thread in the Religious section and expect no comments from those who believe in God? Read the intro and see that you are in the wrong place!

Religion: Share [size=15pt]your faith and belief [/size]in God or higher powers here.

You do not believe then you have NOTHING to share!

Hence your threads and topics are MAJOR trolls to this section!

If your complaint was that it was happening in the Science section, we would understand!

In any case it is a free world!(we understand the void within still yearns and denial demands you fight it and this section allows you to do just that)

[size=14pt]If any man see his brother sin a sin[/size] which is not unto death,[size=14pt] he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin[/size] not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it
1 John 5:16

He was a brother and had life, he sinned (not the unpardonable sin) and needs someone's intercession that he may have LIFE again.(meaning he lost it else why ask for him to have what he had already?).



Also see:
19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
20 let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
James 5:19,20

A brother erred and needed to be converted again! In fact vs 20 calls him a sinner headed to perdition!

In the mouth of 2 or 3 witnesses this fact has been established

lordnicklaus:
I am almost done with religion. I feel like I have been robbed or possibly duped of my freedom.
My sense of reasoning is beginning to tingle, even the thought of the so-called hell fire doesn't scare me.

It should not be the rationale for believing in God in the first place!

I have considered some things that are impossible in the nature of things and which betray the thinking power of a rational mind.

I have also considered the possibility that God allows sufferings just to prove Himself

Where did you get this idea from?

. Even the design of certain creatures shows that things including suffering and chaos were planned from the onset (speaking with the probability that God exists). Seriously, if you wanted a peaceful world, why would you give the scorpion a sting or give the eagle a claw?

But were these or any other used against ANY living being before the fall? Why is it that the Bible talks of a time when Lions will eat grass and not flesh? Obviously, God designed that all animals will eat the producers - plants alone!

This actually proves that God knew that peace wasn't gonna last and that one day, the scorpion would need its sting to defend itself.

I dont think so! For example, till date, the male mosquito does not suck blood though it has a proboscis! That tells you that part was not designed to suck blood.

If God exists, He should reveal Himself through easily grasped means and not revealing Himself to a set and leaving the others in doubt. I am not in the position to disprove God's existence neither am I sure of His existence. Theists would jump in now and say I do not have a relationship with the creator.

As regards the highlighted, what do you mean by easily grasped means? Many have sought Him and found Him, what then? Even when Jesus came and did a lot of miracles those who refused to believe did not, what then?

A creator who plays deaf to prayers or blind to sufferings is not worth having a relationship with.

Well, you have a right to make a choice! Accusing God of being deaf to prayers and blind to sufferings is surprising!!!

Man was made to dominate the earth, God gave Him that dominion and has not retrieved same from man. It was an order that He established which He will NEVER change or over-ride. When Adam fell and the dominion was lost, God would not suspend that order to save man, except He changed! I believe that order is the rationale behind prayer- unlike when God saw what needed to be done and did it, now God will only interfere when man wants Him to and calls Him to.
Hence, blaming God for sufferings on earth leaves much to be desired! Even when God became Man to redeem man, was HE exempted from these sufferings? Did He not die as a result of them?

Like I said, the choice is yours. However, it seems you are taking this decision due to a delay in a prayer request.Am I right?

Now the just shall live by faith: [size=14pt]but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him[/size]. 39 But we are not of them who [size=14pt]draw back unto perdition[/size]; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul
Hebrews 10:38,39

Here we see that a person who once believed and backslides to his life of sin, wallowing in its mire shall perish.




20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
( MEANING THEY WERE ACTUALLY SAVED!!!)

21[b] For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them[/b]
(THEY FAILED, BY GRACE, TO WALK IN HOLINESS OF LIFE!!!)
2 Peter 2:20,21




Cease, my son, to hear the instruction
that causeth to err from the words of knowledge.
[/b]Proverbs 19:27

There are doctrines/instructions that causes people to err!!! Christ died to make us a Glorious Church not having spot nor wrinkle, This should be our pursuit!!!





If the lady called Jezebel was never at a time a true believer as one here claims what should be said about Demas, that he never believed?

Consider:
24 Marcus, Aristarchus, [size=14pt]Demas... my fellow labourers[/size]. Philemon 1:24

Afterwards:

[b]for Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world,
2 Timothy 4:10a

Once a fellow-labourer with no less than Paul but later backslid and became an enemy of God! Why? he loved the world and Bible plainly says:

Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
James 4:4

Now, did Demas retain his salvation?

Remember Jesus Words:

But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

49 and shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

50 [size=14pt]the lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

51 and shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
[/size]
Matthew 24:48 - 51


Concerning being saved by faith and losing salvation these words are apposite for consideration:

19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.

20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

21 [size=14pt]for if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee[/size].

22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
Roman 11:19-23

If we do not abide in the True Vine and instead of bearing fruit of the Spirit, are bearing the works of the flesh, the Husbandman will definitely cut us off! He is able to graft us in if we repent and return!

petra1:
Eagerly waiting . You're one of our major contributors to this thread . I will want your opinion on the issues below:?

Does a christian lose salvation when he sin .

How many times can one lose salvation .

How many times can a man be saved

Can a christian commit a sin . If he does , what happens to him .

Here Christ speaks to His church:

Revalation 2:14-16
But I have a few things against thee,... 15 So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate. 16 Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.

[size=14pt]He commanded the peddlers of false doctrine in the church (yes they were part of the church) to repent else they will suffer the same judgement as would be meted on the antichrist and false prophet!
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Revelation 2:20-23

Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. 21 And[b] I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not[/b]. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, [size=16pt]except they repent of their deeds[/size]. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

1. Just like Simon the sorcerer who believed and was baptized but had issues needing cleansing, there was a woman who was part of the church and had even began to express the teaching gift but was, before the Judge, a jezebel who was guilty of fornication and causing others to commit same (perhaps her dressing caused men to lust after her remember Matthew 5: 28) and she taught other false doctrines.

2. The Lord gave her space to repent. Exactly what happens when a believer sins- he/she is given space to repent and amend his/her ways at whatever cost. If such refuses to then it means he/she is a reprobate.

3. Recalcitrance and failure to repent brings us under God's judgment. I believe God uses the same measure with us as HE expects of us. How do I mean? If your brother trespass against you tell him and if he repents forgive him. Likewise when we trespass against Him He , by His Spirit/Word shows us, our response would be to repent. If we refuse to repent we are no different from a heathen and will be judged as such Matthew 18:17.

4. If our Advocate is here commanding certain believers to repent, how then do some say we dont need same IF we trespass or sin?

Now consider :
7 Little children, [size=13pt]let no man deceive you:[/size] he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

1 John 3:7,8

Let's not be deceived, we are saved by faith. If we sin against Him and refuse to make our way right, anyone who tells us all is well is a deceiver!

mcyemite:
baba please leave the spiritual aspect out of it.let talk about calculatable fact.

Okay, well we are talking of One Who Himself said He was before Abraham!