₦airaland Forum

honesttalk21:
Your vehemence in constantly using Didache as a credible historical report is strongly rejected. You should bring up another.

The Didache, aka The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles, is an ancient Christian text believed to have been written in the first or early second century. While it offers valuable insights into the beliefs and practices of the early Christian community, it is important to recognize its limitations as a historically valid collection due to the presence of bias within its content.

It cannot be considered a wholly unbiased and historically valid collection due to its inherent theological bias, selective representation of early Christian communities, intentional selectivity, lack of historical context, and the subjective nature of interpretation. Historians, require other reliable historical sources to supplement Didache's contents for it to gain the reputation of a true historical bo ok.

Historically was there a Jesus? How will this be when at the time of his existence there wasn't a J in the semantic language of Aramaic. What is the name of Jesus in Aramaic language?

The name Jesus was called when he was alive was ‘Isho’.The language he spoke is called ‘Aramaic’. More precisely, he spoke a dialect of Aramaic called the Jewish Palestinian Aramaic.
In Aramaic, there is nothing like ‘Joshua’, ‘Yeshua’, ‘Jesus’, ‘Yahoshua’ etc.

His name ‘isho’ became spelt as ‘Yeshu’ (same pronunciation) when the Hebrew language was used to write about him.

And where is your evidence for this. That historians reject Didache as a reliable source.
U just making bogus claim that cannot be backed by any scholarly or expert evidence.
These are extant from works of scholars on the book. If U cannot produced evidence then I suggest U desist from making unsound and unproven arguments here.

U already made such careless utterances in the fetal position debate and U are repeating it here again.

Anyway I already gave u other sources of books confirming Jesus called father. U are simply desperately hiding behind a finger.

honesttalk21:
Your vehemence in constantly using Didache as a credible historical report is strongly rejected. You should bring up another.

The Didache, aka The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles, is an ancient Christian text believed to have been written in the first or early second century. While it offers valuable insights into the beliefs and practices of the early Christian community, it is important to recognize its limitations as a historically valid collection due to the presence of bias within its content.

It cannot be considered a wholly unbiased and historically valid collection due to its inherent theological bias, selective representation of early Christian communities, intentional selectivity, lack of historical context, and the subjective nature of interpretation. Historians, require other reliable historical sources to supplement Didache's contents for it to gain the reputation of a true historical book.

Historically was there a Jesus? How will this be when at the time of his existence there wasn't a J in the semantic language of Aramaic. What is the name of Jesus in Aramaic language?

The name Jesus was called when he was alive was ‘Isho’.The language he spoke is called ‘Aramaic’. More precisely, he spoke a dialect of Aramaic called the Jewish Palestinian Aramaic.
In Aramaic, there is nothing like ‘Joshua’, ‘Yeshua’, ‘Jesus’, ‘Yahoshua’ etc.

His name ‘isho’ became spelt as ‘Yeshu’ (same pronunciation) when the Hebrew language was used to write about him.

This is Sophia of jesus
Mishnah
Eugnostos the blessed

honesttalk21:
The sevenfold manifestation of the spirit of God mentioned in Isaiah provides a descriptive framework for understanding various aspects of divine attributes. It does not directly relate to the manifestation of the Holy Spirit within man.

The holy spirit has been present far before the coming of Jesus.The claim that the Holy Spirit's existence and influence began with the coming of Jesus is an oversimplification that overlooks the profound presence of the Spirit in human history. By examining the narratives and teachings of the Old Testament, it becomes evident that the Holy Spirit was actively at work even before the advent of Jesus

Did I argue with you that holy spirit wasn't manifesting prior to Jesus?
How was the holy spirit at work b4 coming of Jesus? are u saying the holy spirit wasnt manifesitng in man b4 Jesus?
so why did David say to God 'Do not take the holy spirit from me'
Why did Job say 'There's a spirit in Man and the spirit of God giveth it understanding'
Why did the Israelites say the spirit of God is upon Saul.

I will suggest u study and understand the function of the holy spirit in the old testament. Your write up shows u have no knowledge of the manifestation of the spirit of God in the old testament.
That was why I was asking antichristian to explain to me what he understands by the function of the holy spirit in the old testament.

Expanse2020:
Where are the Sunni killing shiati in Nigeria
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Ask ibraheem zakzaki, the Shia head in Nigeria. He will tell U his ordeal in the hand of Sunni Muslim buhari and how his 7 sons were killed.

Expanse2020:
Yasu 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 this guy can lie

Jésùs was called YEHESUA becau the name was to long the called the shot on ISSAU
Maybe you should checked Jews pronunciation for it and
On the other hand Hebrew and Aramaic didn't have J in their alphabet I wonder who invented the J to make it Jesus 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Show me any historical evidence Jesus was ever called Issa or ussau by any tribe b4 Muhammed came on stage with his fabricated story.
What were Arabs calling jesus b4 Muhammed appeared with his fabu. What do Arab Christians call Jesus today- Issa or Yasu?
That's all I'm asking.

Expanse2020:
So you want me to believe articles you can easily write and upload to Google just like Nairaland
MUMU

U guys are one but busy killing one another. U all worship one kabba but u kill one another.

Have U seen a pentecostal burning the church of a catholic.
Have U seen a CAC killing an Anglican because he's not CAC.
Even synagogue that most Nigerian Christians do not recognize, have U ever seen Christians attacking the members and killing them.
Mumu following a religion borne out of violence and intolerance even to themselves.

Expanse2020:
So you want me to believe articles you can easily write and upload to Google just like Nairaland
MUMU

Let's hear from ahmadiya themselves. Otondo. I won't hide behind one finger today.

https://appg-ahmadiyyamuslim.org.uk/briefings/persecution-ahmadis/

Answer the other questions, if Shia and Sunni are one, why are U guys killing shia in the north.

Kobojunkie:
STop yammering! Are the Fulani's in your backyard and front yard too stopping you from even attempting to garden(farm) some of the vegetables and foods you eat?

Na the food went u dey grow for your small background go feed the nation?

honesttalk21:
Just reproduce here and incorporate all please. Nairaland is too wide and navigating it isn't exactly easy for me.

Evidence of historical Jesus calling God father.
ISA in the Koran is fake, he's a fictitious imagination of Muhammed. This makes Muhammed a false prophet.

Infact the name ISA is not historical, the Arabs called Jesus Yasu b4 Muhammed was even born.

Everything about Qur'an cannot survive historical scrutiny.

Once again I bring u evidence Jesus called God father. All books were written b4 50ad.

Sophia of Jesus Christ
Didache
The Jewish Mishnah.

honesttalk21:
Nature of Allah
Allah, is beyond human comprehension, thus making it challenging to capture the essence of Allah as a spirit with the limitations of language. The Quranic view portrays Allah as transcendent and immanent simultaneously, reflecting the infinite nature of the Divine. It posits the belief that Allah is not confined to a material or physical body as humans, but is a boundless spiritual entity that surpasses human comprehension.


Consideration of Allah as a spirit is a matter beyond human comprehension. Unlike any physical embodiment, Allah is believed to transcend the boundaries of space, time, and matter, existing in a realm beyond human perception. This essence is described as Qudrah, the divine power that encompasses all things in creation and beyond.

Qudrah encompasses the belief that Allah has complete control over all things and possesses the ultimate power to create, sustain, and govern the universe.

The spirit breath given to Adam symbolizes the special connection between humanity and Allah. It is through this divine breath that humans possess a spiritual dimension, enabling them to seek and comprehend the higher realms of existence. Islam posits that this connection can be deepened through sincere worship, contemplation, and adherence to moral principles.

Islam asserts that humans possess tremendous spiritual potential and the ability to reflect Allah's attributes. Remember Allah said to the angels that he was going to create a representative on earth. A vicergent. Quran 2:30.

Even the Bible has some fluid definition of God's spirit. The book of Isaiah talks about 7 spirits. The Spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the Spirit of wisdom and understanding, the Spirit of counsel and might, t I'mhe Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD.

Wisdom,Understanding,Counsel,Might,Knowledge,fear and Spirit of the Lord.

Could there be more?

Isaiah mentioned the sevenfold manifestation of the spirit of God.
He mentions the spirit of the Lord resting on him and manifesting as wisdom, fear of God, counsel etc

The Holy Spirit manifests in humankind through these graces, reflecting the spirit of God. The seven graces are: insight (prophecy), helpfulness (service or ministry), instruction (teaching), encouragement;, generosity (giving), guidance (leadership); and
compassion.

AntiChristian:
Verses in Question


The Spirit of the Lord helped Samson here indeed! But I think the Philistine's Delilah has more strength than a Lion! And where was the Spirit when Delilah came to cuddle Samson?



Wait? Where did the anger come from? Did the spirit of the Lord inspire the killing?
Samson still had many failings being tempted by a women and ended up committing suicide with his enemies according to the Biblical Narrations! I still can't explain why God helped Samson marry a Philistine wife that won't be loyal to him! And why kill people to satisfy someone's useless riddle? O God!

So why do I need this Spirit to understand the Bible?

The Spirit of the Lord can still enter someone today and that person will still kill others like Samson!

Sirtee15
honesttalk21
TenQ
Expanse2020

Samson was a judge whose mandate was to defend the Israelites against the philistine by virtue of his superhuman strength.
B4 he was born a covenant was established by God that Samson will be used to deliver his people from the philistine.
A sign of the covenant was Samson would be a Nazarite for life. In old testament, God establish his covenant to the people via physical vow that the people must keep as a way of keeping faith with the covenant.
For Samson he was to be a Nazarite for life. On return God will reward him with superhuman strength via the power of the holy spirit at work in him.

What he choose it to do and whatever way he decides to defend the Israelites or defeat the philistine is left to him.

It's obvious Samson wasn't a wise person and didn't seek the face of God in all his actions. He allowed his desires to have his way instead of waiting upon the Lord at all time.
He married a philistine despite wise counsel from his parents.
He continued to have affairs with philistine women despite God's warning to Israelites not to associate with them because the women will lure the Israelites away from God's commandment.
Samson was very much aware of his power and his source thus he kept the Nazarite vow, but he cares less for other sacred commitments to God.

He fornicates, didn't seek wisdom or guidance. He makes irrational decision borne out of ego which sometimes put his kinmen in trouble. His uncontrolled anger led the philistine to murder his wife and father in law as punishment for Samson burning their field.

Samson led Israel for 20 yrs but couldn't get the yoke of the philistine off his people. The philistine firmly ruled Israel while Samson ran a one man show killing inconsequential number of philistines here and there.

Samson couldn't use his super human strength to galvanise and motivate the men of Israel and lead a successful rebellion against the philistine.
It was obvious his downfall was only a matter of time.

The lesson is clear. Having the spirit and power of God isn't enough.
U need grace, divine wisdom, holiness and righteousness to fulfil the mandate of God.

Expanse2020:
Haba stop the lie which Ahmadiya believed Jesus has returned....Kai
Haba we have shiate in Nigeria we pray together stop lie
Which Shai to you that holy spirit in the bible is in Islam kaiii bobo u be No 2 lie propaganda machine after the west

Kaiii
How can Christian be doin what Jesus didn't do
Dancing,belling, singing, whistling, in the act of worship God
Did Jesus did these too
Did he go to church on either Saturday or Sunday too
Did he build his own church too
Atleast Solomon building a temple for worship
Chai Christianity na wash
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣💀

If U are one why are Sunni killing Shia in northern Nigeria.
Why are Sunni Muslims demolishing ahmadiya mosques.
I thought U all one why the killing and destruction.

Expanse2020:
OWhh if the church is the body of the Christ then your pastor didn't need to build a church to hold a Sunday service because it's not in the record of Jesus...
He only gather people and preach to them wherevere there is opportunity, he didn't construct a single block call it church.. he didn't use bible preached, he didn't where suite like west and your pastor, no tie🤣🤣🤣
And you claimed it's not westernized...
Everyone know that Christianity is the religion of Paul 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Them why is zaii Naik preaching with suit and tie.

Expanse2020:
Slavery has a long history in Nigeria, predating European colonization. Prior to the arrival of Europeans, slavery existed in various forms among different ethnic groups. With the transatlantic slave trade, Nigeria became a significant source of slaves, with millions captured and sold to European traders. [b]The abolition of the transatlantic slave trade in the 19th century led[b/] to a decline in the slave trade.
Lord Lugard played a significant role in the colonization(slavery they called colonization) of Nigeria as the British colonial administrator. The British colonization of Nigeria involved the exploitation of its resources, slavery and the imposition of colonial rule, which had profound effects on the country's social, political, and economic landscape.
MUMU you you said slavery was abolished in 1807 can you see fact..

Mumu define slavery...define colonization.
So the ummayid caliphate that conquered the whole of north Africa and Spain for over 700yrs also enslaved the people.
The ottoman empire that colonised Greece for 500 yrs also enslaved Greeks abi.
I swear u be mumu....

Expanse2020:
Whenever you see any of these sect we pray behind each other and we go the same Makkah for pilgrim
Tell me if redeem can go to celestial to worship
Tell me if C A.C can worship in the Jehovah witnesses church
Tell me if Winner can worship in the church of Roman Catholic
Stop bluffing get Good knowledge into that your 💀

Any Christian can worship in any bible believing church. Doctrines may differ but we all believe in Jesus Christ as the saviour of the world and redemption for mankind.

Tis the same way...
Ahmadiya believe in Jesus the Messiah has returned back to earth.
Qur'anist rejects all hadiths as fake.
Shia rejects holy spirit as angel Michael and believe the bible description of holy spirit is correct.
Do U agree with them, even though U all worship
Allah will U sit under a Shia imam to listen to his sermon.

Same way doctrine differs in islam sect happens among Christian sect.

Expanse2020:
Don't mind him he will asked stupid questions from you according to bible Satan always exist in plural form

Tell me the name of Islam Muhammad created.
Shia
Ahmdiaya
Sufi
Sunni
Qur'anisy
Ibadi

Which one of the Islam above was founded by Muhammed?

Expanse2020:
You adopted Christianity not westernization 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 show me where Jesus wore suite and tie they preach or go church
Some church that the Jesus founded
Tell me what your culture is then tell me the culture of Jesus and explain the westernization where...open mouth here and start the bloof 😱😱

For slavery
I don't need to go far Nigeria herself is a case how luggard and the order guy and those other came before him enslave the forefather to England in the name of missionary

As I said U are a poor student of history.
I repeat show me who Lord Lugard took as slave to England.

England banned slavery in 1807, Lord Lugard came to Nigeria 100 years yet to took slaves to England where slavery was illegal
U are very dumb, I bet your iq is below the average of Nigerian. No offense.

What's your point about Jesus wearing shirt and tie.
Another dumb comment.

So then tell me why Zaki Naik and these imams are wearing suit and shirt in mosque or preaching when neither Jesus nor Muhammad wore shirt or suit.

U are just too dumb, asking stu.pid questions.

confusing modernization with Christianity.

Why are U not travelling on donkey and camel when going to mosque since Muhammed never rode a car instead rode on camel. Mumu

[quote author=Expanse2020 post=128368725][/quote]What is the church? The church is the body of Christ and those who believe in him are members.

Don't confuse denomination with church.
Orthodox, pentecostal, unitarian, white garment, catholic are all denomination not church.

Expanse2020:
You adopted Christianity not westernization 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 show me where Jesus wore suite and tie they preach or go church
Some church that the Jesus founded
Tell me what your culture is then tell me the culture of Jesus and explain the westernization where...open mouth here and start the bloof 😱😱

For slavery
I don't need to go far Nigeria herself is a case how luggard and the order guy and those other came before him enslave the forefather to England in the name of missionary

As I said U are a poor student of history.
I repeat show me who Lord Lugard took as slave to England.

England banned slavery in 1807, Lord Lugard came to Nigeria 100 years yet to took slaves to England where slavery was illegal
U are very dumb, I bet your iq is below the average of Nigerian. No offense.

What's your point about Jesus wearing shirt and tie.
Another dumb comment.

So then tell me why Zaki Naik and these imams are wearing suit and shirt in mosque or preaching when neither Jesus nor Muhammad wore shirt or suit.

U are just too dumb, asking stu.pid questions.

confusing modernization with Christianity.

Why are U not travelling on donkey and camel when going to mosque since Muhammed never rode a car instead rode on camel. Ode.

honesttalk21:
Is this to depict how low mankind is in comparison to Allah. A means to show humility?

Linguistic and Semantic Considerations:
Translating the Qur'an involves striking a balance between accurately reflecting the original text's meaning and catering to the target language's cultural and linguistic norms. In Arabic, the term "Abdullah" carries a wider range of meanings than can be encapsulated by any single English word. It generally encompasses the notions of servitude, devotion, and submission to Allah. The English word "slave" adheres closely to the broad semantic range of "Abdullah" and effectively conveys the required level of submission and dependence, which is a central concept in Islam.


Islam emphasizes the absolute servitude of humans to Allah, emphasizing the notion of total dependency on the Divine. While "servant" or "worshipper" may be seen as viable alternatives, these terms can be interpreted in a narrower sense that falls short of capturing the depth of submission required by the term "Abdullah.

a baby is totally dependent on the mother/adults 100% for survival. without adults in the life of a baby- the chance of survival is zero.
does that make a baby slave to the mother or adults. do we call baby slaves?
most employee are dependent on monthly/weekly wages for survival. does that make them slaves to the employer?
How can u say total dependence is synonymous to slavery. what kain of argument is that!!!
abeg this one no follow...

AntiChristian:
You are not making any sense!

Continue in your stupidity. When U done with Samson, look for Gideon or Joshua. They were also killing machine in the old testament.

AntiChristian:
I don't know there are two Holy Spirit aka Spirit of the Lord!

One in the OT!
Another in the NT!

Na me ask you question not vice versa!

What is the holy spirit. You depiction of holy spirit as killing machine showers u dont know what I talking about.

I asked for old testament because I don't want u to start shouting trinity up and down.
Tell me what's the old testament.

honesttalk21:
Are Tenq and SirTee15 the same person? A question directed at the latter was jumped at by the former.

Who is slaving to serve who?

Don't be too forward

😅😅😅😅😅
Why can't my fellow Christian brother help out.
He's well verses in the Koranic theology and that's very important in what we discussing here.

AntiChristian:
When you have nothing to say!

Just keep mute!

Holy Spirit descended on Samson to kill Lion and 30 people to steal their linen garments and cloths!

What is the holy spirit. According to the old testament what is the holy spirit?

Let's start from there, then we move to Samson.
If U don't understand what's holy spirit, it's useless discussing the topic with U.

Expanse2020:
Who brought religion to enslave African Christianity
Bible or Gun
Forcing thousands of people to Atlantic ocean
Taking people as slavery objects to England as a way of colonizing in the name of your religion

You can read more how your religion enslave ppl...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/christianity/history/slavery_1.shtml

Show any country in Africa that was forced to become Christian. Just one.
Why did the north Nigeria remain Muslim after colonisation and slavery by the British.
Why did most french colonies in Africa remain Muslim during slavery and after colonialism and slavery- mali, Senegal, guinea.
Why didn't the French forced them to become Christian.

This guy didn't even read what he brought here olodo
The article said people who ended slavery were CHRISTIANS. THE ABOLITION MOVEMENT TO END SLAVERY WAS LED BY CHRISTIANS.
read the article, it's there. And I hope u won't shout BBC propaganda since U brought it here.

Muslims invaders forced the north African population into islam. First they used the sword, if that didn't work next was the jizah tax on non Muslims, the burden of the tax forced a lot of Christians to become Muslims to avoid paying the tax.

In case I don't know, the forceful spread of islam in the north African region led to the 2nd migration of people deep into sub Sahara Africa in the 9th and 10th century AD.
That's where people like oduduwa and his entourage to ife, bilikisu sungbo of ijebu ode all came from. They were people who were forced to migrate into forest Africa to avoid the oppression of the islamic caliphate.

Learn your history boy. Learn. Don't come to me with some fake history and think it will pass. I will chew and roast u.
The problem with U black African Muslim is that U are so enmeshed into islamic culture I don't even acknowledge your own indigenous culture anymore. All native cultures and history b4 Islam was evil and should not be learnt. That's how u think.

I'm a proud black African Christian. I know my history and culture b4 Christianity. I know what my ancestors did, what they believed and why they believed in it.
I'm not enmeshed in any western propaganda or ideology.

I adopted Christianity not westernisation. It's u guys that don't know the difference.

Expanse2020:
You Come with propaganda bring history down even your so call BBC acknowledge that Christianity came through slavery to African while Islam came through trading

Yeah after wiping off the Christian Berber indigenes of the north Africa.
And using jihad to force Islam down the throats of the indigenes. It's either the sword or islam.

Show me any African country that became Christianity thru the gun or slavery.
I can tell U scores of African country that were forced into islam thru jihad starting with Ilorin emirate.

AntiChristian:
This thread is about the holy spirit entering Samson turning him to killing machines!

Open your eyes.

This is a waste of time. Look for something better to debate.

honesttalk21:
www.sunnah.com is the best source of translations? Really now!

The English translation of the Arabic phrase “عَبْدُ ٱللَّهِ” can be understood in various ways depending on the context it is used in. However, the most common meanings are:

Servant of Allah: This is the most direct translation of the phrase. It refers to a person who dedicates their life to serving and worshipping Allah, the one and only God in Islam.

Slave of Allah: Similar to the first meaning, this translation also emphasizes the complete submission and devotion of an individual to Allah.

Devoted to Allah: This translation highlights the strong emotional connection and commitment a person has towards Allah, indicating that their life revolves around their faith and devotion.


Worshiper of Allah: This meaning focuses on the act of worshipping Allah, implying that the person is constantly engaged in practices and rituals that honor and revere God.


God-fearing person: This translation emphasizes the fear and respect a person has for Allah, which leads them to live a righteous and virtuous life.

Is it better to be a slave of Allah or a slave of a man or any other thing he created.

In hindsight now it seems I missed one reply.

So why did the English translators of the Qur'an chose slave of Allah rather than the other ones here.
That's the question we have Ben asking and U ignored.

honesttalk21:
Please share. I really want to know who the different persons are.

I already gave the multiple evidence. Check your previous mention from me.

AntiChristian:
See how your holy Spirit is misfiring again?
How does this correlate to what we are saying?

The Qur'an and the hadiths complements each other and they never go against one another!

They'll that to expanse2020. He's the one who denied the verse of divorcing little kids because it's not in the hadith.

honesttalk21:
Imagine my forgetting the simplest example when Isa a.s (Jesus) which I am sure you will counter that Isa is not Jesus.
Maryam 19:30

قَالَ إِنِّى عَبْدُ ٱللَّهِ ءَاتَىٰنِىَ ٱلْكِتَـٰبَ وَجَعَلَنِى نَبِيًّۭا ٣٠

[Jesus] said, "Indeed, I am the servant of Allāh. He has given me the Scripture and made me a prophet.

Abdullahi عَبْدُ ٱللَّهِ

What my own with what Isa said in your Qur'an.
All historical evidence proves Jesus Christ is not ISA. That's done and dusted.

honesttalk21:
Is the Arab not an abd? Or you are bothered by what people call you and don't know who you are?

So black Muslim should smile n rejoice when thy are called abdi?