₦airaland Forum

mavenbox:
@Topic: Jesus may not have been born on December 25th. Personally, I give God thanks for the birth of Christ each and every day.

Let me give you an illustration: when we celebrate the "dead soldier" on the Armed Forces Remembrance Day a.k.a Veterans day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remembrance_Day on November 11th, and old Mrs Adamson remembers her father that died bravely defending his country during World War I, does that mean the man died on November 11th? In his family, each and every day they remember him, but ON THAT PARTICULAR DAY, the programme of events have been set aside to honour him

@wirinet: I have read a lot about Easter and Christmas practices and pagan similitudes and origins thanks to the early Roman Catholic Church, but does it nullify the fact that Christ came? I guess if I was a historian in Christ's day, I may have taken extra effort to document the exact day but since I was not; I am content with the fact that he came. The date is rather trivial, sorry.

All these stories that Christ came is not correct. Are you aware that a personality with the name "Jesus Christ" had never existed in the history of the world?. The name Jesus Christ is just a title - a Roman title. The parents (supposing we believe the story in the Bible) could not have "Christened" him Jesus Christ at birth.

mavenbox:
[b]God does not kill. That is a dirty job that satan does, [/b]although God can use the circumstance of satan's killing to his own advantage.

Let me ask you, Ogaga, as I have done before although you skilfully evaded the question: Does darkness exist? Does cold exist?

The answer is no. Darkness is the result of the absence of light. Cold is a result of the absence of heat. We study light, we study heat. We can't study cold, we can't observe darkness.

Whenever man or any part of creation raises its head against God in rebellion, it is like a spiritual bloodless COUP: God's sovereignty is not acknowledged so the devil is allowed to claim it as his territory, and then he does whatever he wants there, which often involves killing. Then people will start screaming that God killed people. God does not kill people. Rather, God, in his love, has through time always showed men how to do things so that they don't fall on the wrong side (like the darkness side of light, or the cold side of heat) and get killed, oppressed or destroyed by the devil. Man never got it right, so God sent His OWN Son as a lasting solution to the problem.

Now you may make references to wars and Israel's conquests: but isn't it clear that it was necessary for Israel's survival in those early days? The devil was trying to snuff Israel using its enemies so that by the time Israel ceased to exist, the prophecy of Jesus' Birth would never come to pass. It was attack - the best form of defense. And God did not do any killing in that case. The Israelites did, and the devil allowed the killing of the israelites' enemies: all the people he was meant to be protecting: people that were serving him diligently. On the contrary, God protects His word above His own name: When he promises protection by His covenant and you stay in the Covenant, nothing will happen to you.

The bolded part are outright lies and not supported by the Bible. Read Gen 19:23-26, and you will see how God physically destroyed the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah without any help from Satan, even lot's wives was killed. I hope you do not tell us that it was the devil that killed lot's wife.

What about 1 Chronicles 13:9-11, where God killed a man called Uzza's, just because he touched the Ark of the Covenant while preventing it from falling down. what was devil's concern there in the whole episode.

Then there is Acts 5:1—11, where God killed Ananias and Sapphira just because they sold a piece of property and decided to keep back part of the proceeds (I wonder why "Nigerian men of God Had not used this example to have their followers sell all their properties and give everything to their church). Was Devil involved?

In fact there are to many stories where the God of the Bible due due its short temper, killed many people or whole communities directly, without the knowledge of Devil.

I honestly see the hands of IWU in this draws, because mere chance cannot explain the reason that Nigeria is always in the same group with Argentina in every world cup Nigeria qualifies for. Also how can our group be identical with that of USA 94 with the exception of Bulgaria. No wonder the same teams keep winning the world cup again and again. Watch our for INEC type refereeing at the world cup.

PapaBrowne:
@Wirinet

Let me give you a slight analogy.
Imagine for one moment a set of twins in their mother's womb.

One twin says : "Hey, we have a mother. She is responsible for all that we are. We exist because she allowed some guy somewhere between her legs.We are alive because she eats and drinks. She cares so much for us that she goes regularly to a guy called doctor for something called ante-natal".
"Sometimes I hear her speak to us. She calls us babies. She loves us so much that she would do anything for us.
She says we give her joy. I hear it. She keeps thinking about us every moment".

The other twin replies. "What are you talking about. You are just imagining things. There is nothing like Mother. Have you ever seen her? If you say she speaks to us, how come I never hear her? Hey fella, I am on the side of "what you see, is what you get" No hidden charges or bonuses. I wouldn't waste my time thinking about some Mother  that you've just imagined up".
"If truly we have a mother, why can't she come get us out of this blood soaked tight sac that we've been locked up in since conception".

Twin one says": If only you understood you wouldn't speak like this. She loves us so much that she is going to endure the most grueling pain of her life just to get us out of here. It won't be long, we would be out of here in her arms, free to move around and at the same time feel her love.
She would give us bosom to suck, food to eat, she would bathe us and put us to bed. So much love she would give to us.

The other twin: All this your talk looks too good to be true. However, I only believe in things I see. I don't see a mother, So I know I don't have one. I'll rather wait till that 9 months you keep talking about is over, then maybe I'll believe.


This analogy gives you a perfect picture on our relationship with God. You don't have to see to believe. The mere fact that a baby can't see or feel the presence of it's mother doesn't mean the mother doesn't exist.
For me, I know for sure that I didn't make my digestive system, neither did I do anything to ensure that my lungs process oxygen. I know for sure that it has all been regulated by my creator.

Hey Atheists, we all know atheism is a ruse and it exists solely because God exists. If believers in God are wrong, then there should be no need for such a thing as atheism.

That your analogy is very faulty.
First of all, the twin that can describe the exact circumstances of their conception and development must be a "Benni winsh" or is it Ijebu, How was the baby able to know that the woman carrying them is their real mother sharing their genes and not a surrogate rented womb or that their prospective mother is a teenager  tasting the forbidden fruit or a prostitute that got careless. Its is a super miracle for the twin to know that their prospective mother had not been taking "Alabukun and Schweppes" in an attempt to flush both twins down the toilet.

The doubting twin is right because until they are born and their mother is seen and suckled by her, they can never know their mother. The twins could be exchanged at birth and both including the all knowing twin would never know.

God does not create digestive systems, because without a digestive system no living thing would survive (or did you not take introductory Biology?). All living things must be able to eliminate waste from their system. Same with lungs, Animals need to get oxygen into the blood.

Your very last statement is warped beyond logic. Are you only applying that logic only to your God? or you apply it also to Zeus, Quetzalcoatl, Re, Santa, Gnomes, fairies, sphinxes, centaurs, UFOs, etc. Everything ever imagined by anybody must exist in reality because if beliefs in such things are wrong, then there would be no need for the thing itself.

Na wa o, See Banom has been thrown from relative obscurity to super stardom overnight just because of his declaration that he has denounced atheism and reconverted to born again Christianity. 8 pages and counting in less than 3 days. Banom, remember say na we be paddy paddy for religious section before you turn to super star, not forget us o, especially Tudor, because at this rate CNN and Fox will come calling for an exclusive interview soon.

ezan:
Who cares how you choose to poison your mind? ALL religions have caused more harm than good. It is a disease of the mind, not sure if I should feel sorry for you.

Let me also welcome you to Nairaland. The religion section is the war zone of Nairaland, so be prepared.

But introduce us your core beliefs, so that we can know your stand from the beginning, and also so that you will not generate as much controversy in future if you decide to change beliefs.

[quote author=mr.official link=topic=358975.msg5046795#msg5046795 date=1259917698]Which side are you on? Another atheist?[/quote]Yes o. I am on the side of "what you see, is what you get" No hidden charges or bonuses.

[quote author=mr.official link=topic=358975.msg5046601#msg5046601 date=1259915558][size=15pt]Now tell the rest Atheists you know. Being Atheists do not take them anywhere.

Since we humans make TV set with remote and control it with the remote, that's enough to tell that God exists.[/size][/quote]That is the point, atheists do not want to go anywhere, they just want to live out their lives and die, that is it.

So God remote control us, why do God not simply remote control his creations to achieve whatever aims he wants and save everybody all the troubles.

mazaje:
Can you show me one hateful post from any atheist towards banom? Since[b] hate is what drives your life[/b] you automatically think that every body is like you or should behave like you, So far mof the atheist here have wished him all the best and some even encouraged him. Where did you get this stupid and ridiculous assertion of yours that people are now hateful of him? I know you need to feel that other think and behave like you but some times you have to read what you type before sounding like senseless and ridiculous drunk.

Manmustwac said he was suprised at his conversion and asked why the change and all you did was tag it as hate? You are truly a deluded and hopeless bigot.

Thanks Mazaje, you have summed up my thought of David. Because, i have not seen any post by both Muslims and atheist displaying any form of hatred towards Banon, even Banom had not indicated so. I think he need to see a shrink in order to dissipate some of that hatred for people with opposing views - Muslims and Atheists. Maybe after then will he learn to take life easy and acquire some sense of humour. His hatred is beclouding his judgments and thoughts.

I know Mr. Sign Fireman well, About 6 years ago i was living at Orile-Iganmu.I was aware when he started his church, in fact his church was just behind my flat.

I can't remember the name of the street now but he was using one hall in a street adjacent to my street.The street is off Baale Street just before Coker bridge. It was the same street that has the charismatic Revival Church that Chosen broke away from.

He started like play, like play.He was very aggressive with posters and his poster were everywhere promoting one programme or the other. what caught our attention was his crazy name and unusual looks. He has a similar look with reverend King, beard and all. His constant night vigils keeps up awake all night. He claims to be able to raise the dead, cure AIDS and cancer, ensure financial turnaround - you know the usual claims. Small by small his congregation stated swelling and before you know it, he has become a popular man of God.

I hear his has been greatly blessed by God as he is said to be a very wealthy man today.

dplus:
@wirinet Please just an advice when you make an comment in public but very careful.

So Yar Adua , OBJ are Mentally, Politically and strategically strong enough to rule Nigeria, they are not  a political neophyte tied to the apron stings of Tinubu.  

I think you are one of those PDP people who does not see anything GOOD IN DOING GOOD   .

As for  Fashola let him keep up the GOOD work in Lagos and probably go for a second term, I see him getting there but he need to be careful and understand Nigeria at large . If Godluck can rise from deputy Governor to Vice President, them Fashola can get there its a matter of TIME and PERFORMANCE.

PDP will soon be feed up with all the ill gotten wealth and bunch of wrong people.

lets watch and see they will end up destroying each other watch ATIKU, BODE JUDGE etc the list is growing days by day. When a house is set up against itself then you know the end is near.

You are getting overly emotional over the issue in question. I am not a PDP member, and in fact did not vote for any PDP candidate during the last elections - i voted fashola. Also i had not argued about the performance of Fashola as far as Lagos is concerned, and i am not even arguing that Fashola cannot perform wonders if given Nigeria's presidency.

My point is that to be Nigeria's president requires so many extraneous factors.

First you have to have been part of the inner caucus of the ruling class made up of military and political elite, or at least be their nominee. this is crucial to command the loyalty of the Military and people that matters like Obas, Emirs, Sultan, etc.  Fashola does not belong or have the support of the "Mafias"

Secondly does not have any political clout, even in the AC, where every major decision has to be vetted by Tinubu. In Lagos the Lagos political elites are more loyal to Tinubu that Fashola. Fashola did not have any political structure before becoming governor and he had not built one yet. Remember OBJ had to dismantle Atiku's political structure before building his in order to take control of PDP. That was why i said Fashola is still tied to the apron strings of Tinubu.

The Goodluck Jonathan Example is a very good example of the kind of president Fashola would be under the present dispensation. Had Goodluck been allowed to exercise the powers of the vice president till date? the answer is no. Even if he were given the presidency he would only be a lame duck, he would be engineered out if he starts getting ambitious. He was just put there as a figure head and to placate the Niger delta since he perform creditably in his loyalty to Alams and then betrayal when it he was instructed to by OBJ.

Nigeria's political engineering has not changed in the Last 40 years.

chukwudi44:
It is a historical fact that Jesus was  not born on 25th december but that day was just set aside in the fourth century to celebrate the birth of our Lord.

25th of December had been celebrated for centuries before Christ in many European and eastern societies to commemorate the birth of the sun god. it was the day the sun is said to be reborn because the winter solstice is on December 24, that is when the sun stops dying (day stops getting shorter), and start its rebirth. So celebration starts on eve of 24th till the night of 25th, with wild jubilation, involving drinking, dancing and general merry making,

When Rome adopted Christianity, it incorporated most of its former rituals and celebrations into the new religion. which includes the worship and veneration of Venus and son Eros, as Infant Jesus and Mary, the adoption of patron saints from their past worship of numerous personal gods, and a host of others.

As the celebration of Christmas, spread through Norther Europe it acquired many other cultural practices, like Santa from the Nordic culture and Holly and mistletoe trees from England(not sure here). But the practice is still primary drinking, dancing and merrymaking as originally practiced by the Pagan Romans.

Can Banom help us understand the extent of his conversion by answering the following questions;

Now that you can see the light, are you taking back all those nasty things you said about "prophets of God"? especially Adeboye, Oyakhilome and T. B. Joshua.

If you have taking back your words, have you tendered an unreserved apology to the said prophets and their followers, some of whom are over the hill over your "reconversion"

Are you going to start attending a Bible believing church pastored by any of the Popular Men of God, complete with all obligations; Like Church on Sunday, Special fellowship on Monday, Bible study on Tuesday, mid week service on Wednesday, Another fellowship on Thursday, Night Vigil on Friday and special meetings on Saturday.

Are you going to start fulfilling your spiritual obligations of tithing, offerings, seed sowing, first fruits, etc as mandated by your new born again status.

Your honest response would be appreciated.

Do not mind him, knowall is living in Avalon. Is he trying to tell us that the Hausa/fulani, the Nupes and the Tivs are living in harmony in Nigeria today? I think he should also add, Jukun for president tiv for vice and Zango kataf for senate president, I am sure that would bring peace and harmony to the whole country.


We are all living the roots of the problem and worrying over the fruits, the major problem is the over centralization of power in the Federal Governments as represented solely by the president. If ever state and local government is allowed to exercise appropriate power and control its resources paying tax to the federal government, nobody would care If Presidency and all its ministers are from one family. People will be more interested in their local governments than to bother about Abuja.

Fashola is not Mentally, Politically and strategically strong enough to rule Nigeria, he is still a political neophyte tied to the apron stings of Tinubu

Chrisbenogor:
@wirinet
I read plenty nowadays not commenting much, most threads on here just bore me so I read and move on. I want to hear your own story as regards your religion, I sense that you are an advanced person living here in Nigeria, so if I am right when did you decide to drop religion and how do you play the politics of your family as regards your belief.

Same here too, i read plenty but comment little. My story as regards religion is a long one and i had provided snippets of it, now and then in some of my posts. I promise to furnish you with some details at some later date when i am up to it - its a promise.

Anyway have a nice day.

Sorry, i forgot to ask you this vital question.

Who will do the appointing?, members of the region the president and the vice comes from, members of the traditional king makers (Arewa), or we should waste time, money and energy organizing "an arrangee election" .

Chrisbenogor:
@Wirinet
I still think he is just seeking for attention. I would love to hear your own story some day, if you have it already kindly provide the links if not then would you mind telling?

Long time no see, where have you been? Talking about Banom? Whatever he is seeking is not my concern.

What story do you want to hear? because you did not specify what you want to know.

All those your political gymnastics and gimmicks cannot work. History has shown again and again that the only panacea for a stable society is Fairness, Justice and equity, any other thing will lead to instability and underdevelopment.

If the answer to a peaceful political arrangement is coming from the same region, why are governors and their deputies also at each other's throats, since our democratic experiment started in 1999, i cannot remember how times governors and their deputies parted ways, even in Lagos.

Maybe you should suggest President and vice president and Governors and deputy governors should be members of the same family to ensure trust; but will even that solve the problem? Imagine Andy Uba as Governor and Chris Uba as deputy Governor, that would be a good sequel to the film "Clash of the Titans".

[quote author=mama-gee link=topic=360203.msg5032380#msg5032380 date=1259714740]This video was made in 2007.
We are talking of 2009. [/quote]That was pure deceit, the person in the photos is not a Nigerian and definitely not Yara dua. If you enlarge the video clips you will clearly see that the person on the threadmill is an Arab man, speaking Arabic.

Why do some people tell lies just to support their positions

banom:
@ Mavenbox,

@ Wirinet,

You made mention of so many things which i will answer you one by one.

On the issue of Hammas/Israel Conflict.

If you can remember you will know that the conflict was going on when some Islamic Idiot were killing Igbos in the North, so when i saw that thread and how a northerner was against the heavy havoc Israel was wrecking on Lebanese  , i decided to reply that thread in a way i will uphold a mirror to the northerner for him to see  how they kill Igbos in their place.

2, On the issue of Not disclosing my religious belief Publicly .

Well, on that thread, i made a post that concerned our president ( a muslim) and christian pastors, while the discussion was going on, many wanted to figure out my religious belief but i decided not to say anything about my belief in other to be able to maintain my fluidity of conversation  in that thread, I knew that if i say that i am an atheist, many will ask me why do i ask for miracle when i dont believe there is a God, and that will put me on defensive.  ( I actually intended to use that thread to mock Christians and Muslim and to tell christians that their pastors are fakes and there is no God)

3, On the issue of Money.
That was a front page thread some one made and asked , "WHAT DOES MONEY MEAN TO YOU" Some moralist jumped in and started saying that money is the root of all evil, so i countered them with the words of the Bible letting them know that even the bible says that money answereth all things,

4, On the issue Forex Strategy Advert,
I am the owner of INTEGRATED SYSTEMS, An  IT and electronic trade service company  with head office here in Abuja and two branch offices in Lagos and Kano, I first registereted here in nairaland and other forums with the intention of giving  my firm some internet exposure and attention, after seeing the number of Nigerians on nairaland and the cost free advantage it will be to reach such audience with minimal effort, i decided to advertise our trades strategy here and other forums and we equally advertised it on major  Nigerian news papers . but after the advert here, i found out nairaland is a very fun place to be and due to the nature of my job i am always online, so i went on with my banom ID to contribute and have fun here.

5, On the Issue of the Authenticity of the Bible and Qu'ran .

I was actually trying to tell Christians and Muslims that both the Bible and the Qu'ran are all man made and that the both religions could be mistaking even if eventually there is a God.

Finally, On if i am a self identified Atheist here,
Honestly, i must tell you that since i was born, today is the day my eye opened, I now agree with Niccolo Machiavelli  that men would break faith when it is in their favor to do so or when they see some thing to gain from it , i am shocked at you for saying that i have never declared to be an Atheist. it is quite surprising to see how you were able to go to my first set of posts here and copy my post that may support your case against me denouncing atheism, and you forgot or neglect my recent post that clearly  stated my atheistic stand , Dude that was an Artful Omission and masterful Inclusion .

Anyway to make a long story short, follow this link to see if i have ever declared to be an atheist on nairaland or not.
https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-331016.0.html

Banom, I do not have any problems with explanations of your stand in your previous posts i quoted, it was your last response that disappointed me.

First let me explain that we all come here to have fun and in the process learn one new thing or two. What ever any other believes would not put food on my table or fuel my car, so i do not care if you are an atheist, Muslim or Shinto worshiper.

Having said that, i am an atheist because i regard my self a slave to rationality, i am obsessed with knowing how everything works. So when you made the claim that you had converted from atheism to Christianity, most people's  first reaction will naturally be, is he pulling our legs. So I decided to investigate by examining your immediate previous posts. There i discovered that by 1:00PM same day, you were still joking with Tudor on starting a church and by 4:00PM, you said you have converted after meditating through the night. I asked you, and you gave some explanations which i still do not understand and  did not bother further as i know that time will tell. After i few days we all realized you were serious and of course the born agains were ecstatic (apologies to david), so naturally wanted to know your views before the conversion, your views now and your views during the transition period.

The first  place to start investigation would naturally be your first few posts. On looking through i found that your religious views were not defined, I noticed you are very bitter with "men of God", especially Adeboye and Oyakhilome but you did not show disbelieve in God or the Bible. Now your posts were 40 pages long and i stopped at page 35 or So, because i am also very busy doing other things But from those 5 pages, i concluded that you had not claim to be an atheist and i asked you to point us to where you professed atheism at least to save me from going through the 40 pages.

So i think it is in bad faith accusing me of breaking faith when it is in my favor to do so or when i see some thing to gain from it, because i do not know what you expect me to gain from you conversion or deconversion.

Even the recent post you provided did not specifically say you were an atheist, you were only arguing with deep sight's definition of God and asking what his meaning of God, Existence, etc are.

The only thread you claimed atheism  is on the 3rd of october;

If i am asked to describe these guys, i will call them shameless people, as an atheist, if i am to go back to religion again, i will prefere Islam over Nigerian christianity,

What we see today is just too funy and a product of hunger, deciet, desire to dominate,rule, infleunce and excercise power over desperate Nigerians, by their so called pastors, they find it very easy and lucrative becsause ever before colonisation , our people are very superstitious people who believe that a key stroke, a word, a miracle, an annointing, a touch of hand on their heads will change their lives for better, our people dont want to confront the harsh truth of reality that for one to succeed, he/she must work very hard, instead they believe that they can manurver life reality by praying for divine favor and intervention, smart and con men took advantage of this guilibity in them to exploit them in the name of God,

The latest trend today is a word called Seed sowin for divine favor, a situation, where by a smart guy will put on his suit, come on the pulpit and lift the microphone, and start telling crowd of desperate church members how God will divinely motivate men and women to use their recources to favor them, if they sow seed in his life, he will go as far as telling lies of stories of places he went and people sowed seed and he prayed and God blessed them and their lives changed for good, he will tell them , how some body sowed a seed of 50,000naira in his life last year, and two months later, a white man saw the seed sower and gave him a contract that fetched him 50million naira, after hearing all these, the desperate crowed will start imagining a million naira life style they will lead if they sow their last 50,000naira into the life of the man of God, they will never ask themselves,  if this pastor has an annointing that can turn 50, 000naira into 50million naira, why is he still begging for ordinary 50,000naira,

the funniest thing about it, is that after sowing, their live remains the same and the pastors life will improve with monies he has conned from people in the name of God, and the people will not learn from it, next time another con man will come with the same strategy and loot them again,

Nigerians please learn. Nothing good comes easily, you must work for it, dont be decieved by people who promise you a sudden finanacial turn around, some of us have been there, there is nothing like an instant rise in life, before you achieve succes in life, you must break bones and wack joints.

Here you are pouring your usual anger and frustration at "men of God" and to some extent, you are considering going [b]back [/b]to religion.

So it was out of curiosity, that i wanted to know when you became an atheist, what were your core beliefs when you considered your self an atheist and what are your core beliefs now ( do you now agree with deep sight's definition of God?)

As i said, whatever you believe is your own cup of coffee and should not make anybody happy or sad.

davidylan:
Dont use words you have a tenuous grasp of. What do you mean by "ecstatic"?

Mr PHD, please educate us on the meaning of ecstatic.

Meanwhile this is the Oxford definition;

blissful, enraptured, rapturous, joyful, joyous, overjoyed, jumping for joy, jubilant, exultant, elated, in transports, rhapsodic, delirious with happiness/delight, in a frenzy of delight, orgasmic, on cloud nine, in seventh heaven.

---------------------------------------------------------
Excerpted from Oxford Talking Dictionary
Copyright © 1998 The Learning Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved.

Your tenuous grasp of the word would be appreciated.

Deep Sight:
I am happy to see that you have keyed into the sense in which i used the word gravity as being a sort of magnetism: because it has a similar force of attraction.

And do note that i did say that gravity is related to mass (which cannot be disputed), and not that magnetism is of mass. . .

Oh, heck with it, you scientist!

Now nonetheless, (and without spliiting hairs) we can still derive a general understanding of Karma from Gravity, in the sense that it acts similar to attractive magnetism. Indeed you are aware i am sure that scientist's are still trying to unravel possible direct links, and still appear at odds on the existence or non-existence of a direct co-relation between gravity and magnetism.

Now let me make a brief note on the fact that you mentioned: that magnetism may be repulsive: This is also true of Karma; It may repel certain things based on the inner state of the being concerned.

So it applies in many different ways, but the core principle remains the same.

My broda i feel you, I understand what you were trying to say. I love discussing pure science and Niraland does not provide a platform for that so sometimes i take up the opportunity when i can, especially if there are wrong or controversial notions.

But let me add, there is no possible link between gravity and magnetism. Gravity is turning out to be a property of space-time, while magnetism in undoubtedly a feature of particles, electrons and protons. A massive non magnetic object would still posses its gravitational properties.

Peace.

Noetic, you started again, arguing blindly and illogically just to justify your position. Someone says he sees blank, you insist he must mean black.

What is within the context of this thread that can equate renounce with denounce? I feel it is attitude like this that make so many people gullible and open to exploitation, reinterpreting other peoples writings.

I have asked some questions of Banom's atheist credentials, like when did he become an atheist how long.? So Let him answer for himself.

How have i shown that whatever Banom believes is my concern. Had i ever attempted to convert him into atheism? It is you people that is trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.

I had never known banom Atheist views, so questioning them with proofs of his previous posts now constitute a "big blow" to you

I do not know why some people here are ecstatic, even the heading of the topic did not suggest that Banom was ever an atheist. He said he denounce atheism, denounce means condemn, criticize, attack, censure, castigate, decry, rail/inveigh/fulminate against, declaim against, arraign, denunciate, revile.

He did not say he renounced atheism. renounce meaning give up, relinquish, resign, abdicate, abnegate, surrender, sign away, waive, forego.

I am sure the picture was taken off a creationist's site to poke fun at evolutionists. But i will tell you what is wrong and what is right with the picture.

What is wrong with the Picture;

1.The photo is a terrible photoshop job, Its is too blurry and the attachments of the heads are horrible, especially the one before the final man. Also some of the body proportions are off

The representation of the evolution of man is wrong. The first in line is clearly a modern day gorilla, and evolutionary theory never said that the modern day gorilla metamorphosed to man (apologies to david). It says we share the same ancestor with modern gorilla more than 6 million years ago.

What is Right;
The change of skin colour is correct. This is an attempt to represent the evolution of a white man. Since all men accept that their evolutionary migration started from Africa, it is logical for the skin to change from black (where there is ample sunlight) to white (where the sunlight is less). If the Mongoloids (chinese) also draw their evolutionary path, they would begin with the black ancestor.

Deep Sight:
^^^ No need to split hairs, i agree that magnetism and gravity are not strictly the same thing: BUT you will note i was describing THEIR effects: And in this they are very similar, and apt for the purpose of my example. And gravity also is related to mass. . .
Wikipedia:

From your wiki example, gravitation is no where described as being remotely similar to magnetism. Yes agreed the net effect of gravitation can be attraction, it can also be revolution of the smaller mass around the bigger mass. The effect of gravity being known as free fall.

Magnetism on the other hand can be attractive or repulsive depending on the direction of the magnetic field. Also a large mass can be magnetically positive, negative or neutral. Magnetism does not depend on mass, and magnetism does not have any relation to weight.

Deep Sight:
Gravity is simply the physical form of the law of Karma, and vice versa.

Gravity is magnetism towards a core, on account of mass. Thus anything projected away from the core, such as a person jumping upwards towards the sky on earth, will fall back towards the core - the earth. That's gravity.

In similar terms each being is like a small magnet and in accordance with the law of gravity, anything projected out from it, will fall back on it. This simply is the law of Karma. Whatsoever a man soweth, the same shall he reap.

Let us also note another interesting part to this. A cosmic body with great mass and great gravitational pull can attract things into its orbit that were not previously there. Thus people can attract things to themselves that were not previously there: simply on account of their inner magnetic state! At all events however - it is their own pull, that attracts those things to them.

I usually just enjoy reading posts from the side lines until someone makes a scientific harakiri.

Deep Sight your definition of gravity is way off. Gravity does not have any similarities with magnetism. A person that jumps to the earth is under free fall and is not attracted by any magnetic force towards the center of the earth.

Although the earth possesses it own magnetic field (and it is not a small magnet, it is a very huge magnet), the magnetic field do not behave in anyway like gravity.

Also the strength of a magnetic field does not depend on its mass.

I think every body in this thread is over reacting to Banoms purported conversion from atheism to born again Christianity.

First i could not remember Banom ever claiming to be an atheist, i have search his posts and have not come up with any atheist proclamation, maybe someone can refer us to such. All i see from his previous posts are anger directed at "men of God".

This is a post from Banom as far back as January 10, 2009

banom:
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha ,  i just can't stop laughing, HAMAS thought that ISRAELITES are IGBOS who can endure the killings of there people in Northern Nigeria that is why he stated  sending rockets to ISRAEl, Any way he got his bagains,

Well let me pray for Hamas

GOD in heaven, thanks for granting Hamas his heart desire through the military strentgh of ISRAEL, i pray you today to grant ISRAEL more militiary intelligence and power to supply Hamas his demand, Also GOD, about 600 persons dead is very small, please may the numbder drasticaly increase into hundreds of thousands  of persons in less than a week , Please GOD just like the way you swept away the Egyptian soldiers in the Red see when they were pursueing this same ISRAELITES, may you as well turn every see, ocean , rivers, schools, hospitals, resturants, mosques, terrorist centers, Hamas house , office, infact every where in Palestine with the blood of Palestenians in JESUS name , ?

Obviously he still proclaims belief in the Bible and Jesus, as uses to views to support Israel in the Hamas - Israeli conflict.

On february 12, Banom stated categorically that he does not intend to discuss his religious beliefs, and still went on to question "the men of God"

banom:
wth due respect to you, i do not intend to discuse my religious believe publicly. Thanks.

Meanwhile, are you trying to say that  our President may not belive in God and in Miracle ?

I just need to know why our so called powerful men of God have not done something to cure our president, or has it reached now  that we can see obvious miracle, excuses are now coming up?.

On the same february 12, he made reference to the Bible;

banom:
The bible itself made clear that money answereth all things,  actualy money is not everything but it can go a long way to compasate many things, it is an essential part of life, You have it you have power and respect , even if you didn't  go to school, get money

GET MONEY

But one of your post on the same January16 caught my attention;

banom:
Have you been trading forex and you keep loosing or you have not made any profit at all, you are just tired of all your losses , you are even afraid to trade again because of your previouse losses, Why were you loosing ? You were loosing becuase you dont know what you were doing , forex trading is very simple, what you should ask your self is , Is every other traders loosing  the way you are loosing ? all the money you lost, were did they go ? is there anything you can do to stop loosing ? if you can ask your self  the above questions and be honest enough and humble youself, i will show you a way you will trade and you will never loose again or at least you make 10 trades and win 8 GURRANTEED .

Last time i sold out my personal trading startegy to over hundred persons on this forum and all said it was incredible as many had though it was going to be one of those crabs you get online, the result spaned their highest expectation.
I am going to do it again, what i am going to give you will be morethan incredible this time, the news paper editor called me  the most sucesfull forex Trader in Nigeria, In real truth, all you need to be making money in the forex market is the knowlegde and the strategy used by succesful traders, since it made them succesful,  it will as well make you succesfull, If you can trade for just two hours in a day using what i will give you, you will make at least 500 dollars GUARRANTEED.

Now, you dont have anything to fear as you have little or nothing to risk here , with just a little start up fee, you can have a one full month trial of my strategy and and my trading software system that analyses the market for you using a micro- economic formular known only by profesional traders, it tells you when to buy and when to sell , it tells you where a trend will be ending and where another will be starting, it reveals to you if actualy a trend is a reversal or a retracement, With all these at your disposal why can't you be making at least 500 dollars in  single day, won't two or three well entered trade in  the right trend direction give you up to that, It is only after using it for  one  month that you will start paying me the mothly usage fee of $1000 ,

Now you can see that i am the one to be tested here not you, i am the one to run the risk here not you, i am the one to prove my self here not you, if you have been trading and you are not making it, dont worry or run out of the market, It is time you recover your money and start making additional profits, that is why you are in the market, it pains me when i see a Nigerian trader lossing money in the market just for other traders in the world to grab it as profit, Personaly, i have made over 332,000 dollars in the market for a year now, that is why i am regarded as  the most succesful forex trader in Nigeria and i still remain the highest trader who have helped  other traders to succeed , at least with over 100 persons from this forum and other persons who meet me one on one here in Abuja from all over Nigeria. i remain the best,
With what i will give you , i am too sure you must succeed except you are destined to be a fairlure, Even if you dont have money to start forex, i will show other things you can start doing online to make money so that you will use it to go into forex, i will eqaully give you a complete forex learning manual  in case you dont know about forex yet, As you can see, you won't risk much, Don't argue with me, dont challenge me, dont suspect me, don't ingnore me, JUST GIVE ME A TRIAL, Actions speak louder than words,  Lets get to try it out,

If you are Intrested Contact me on,
davidman4all@gmail.com.

Are you for real?

There is also this interesting comment you made on may 27th  on the topic atheists and Nigerians;

banom:
For all i care, God can deny both the Bible and Qu'ran without been guilty, for instance, when a christian and an islam dies, they go to God and ask him for a reward, God will tell them, I DONT KNOW YOU GUYS They will tell God ,we are christian and islam we lived our lives according to your words in the Bible and Qu'ran, God will say, I dont know any Bible and Qu'ran, they will tell God,but the bible and Qu'ran claimed you inspired them, and God will ask them, did i give you any Bible or Qu'ran ?, Did you see my signature on the Bible or Qu'ran ?, If i had wanted you to have Bible or Qu'ran i would have giving them to you just like the way i wanted you to have eyes, ears, legs,head,brain and i gave them to you,  Sorry i dont know you, go back to who ever that gave you the Bible and Qu'ran.

Here his belief in God was categorical, but he was questioning the veracity of the Bible and the Koran.

So in conclusion Barom did not convert from Atheism to Christianity as is being celebrated by born agains here, he was never an Atheist in the first place. He was a disappointed, disillusioned and disoriented theist.

Missy B:
This brings the story of 'Paul' to mind. Light will always subjugate.

One down . . . You're next? 

Comparing Banon's reconversion to Paul's conversion is like comparing oranges to blackberry cakes. Paul was alleged to be persecuting Christians and was on his way to persecuting more Christians when Jesus physically accosted him and stuck him blind and had to convert to regain his sight.

Banom was born a born again and a happy one at that, but was annoyed when his dad perished in a horrible way while doing the work of Jesus. So in frustration he God angry at Jesus and God. But after his anger had died down, he went back to the Jesus he had always believed after extensive meditation. He never said Jesus physically accosted him and punished him for his rebellion. I am sure the if jesus should repeat the paul experience with even Ogaga, he would abandon satan Immediately.

bawomolo:
I agree. 

i  have one problem with banom's conversion though, why does he believe in Christianity and not some other religion.   Is the church the only place to find faith?

Because he was born and bread into Christianity and never really stopped being a Christian, he was only angry and was getting back at God until he realized it was a fruitless exercise.

banom:
Ogaga you are sounding too funny today,  what confusion are you talking about ? and what pressure is it that  could be frustrating me to push me back to God,  perhaps that is yoUr own meaning to it , but not  realLy the truth,  It was actualLy confusion and anger of my fathers death that Pushed me into Atheism, but i regret it, i am back To God now and will not reverse till eternity , I am now a man of faith.

Banom, you reserve to the right to chose any faith or no faith at all, and you do not owe anybody any apology. People are only trying to understand why you flip - flop beliefs.  And to my understanding of your explanations, you flip to became a nominal atheist after a tragedy and after you realize that atheism does not provide succour, you flop back to Christ after the pain has eased. I hope you do not flip-flop again after another major tragedy because tragedies are sometimes an inevitable part of our existence. Our success depends on how we are able to handle them when they surface.

Banom, i do not understand your saul to paul transformation.

This was your post at 12:00PM today

banom:
Hababaa, wetin i do nah ? am i not the one who saw the gift of holy con in you and suggested that we do not allow it to waste , what have done now to be destroyed ? Ok tell me what is required of me to become the treasurer of this our new out fit.

And this was your Post at 1:18PM today

banom:
This Yoruba people una no go finish  my whole family oooo,  two years ago my elder sister finished her service and  left for Uk to do some shopping, while we were waiting for her to come back with enough goodies , she carry one bobo called Dayo come back say na him Fiance , like play like play the bobo say na marriage ,before we know the girl don carry belle, na so the drama continue until the two come marry and went back to Uk together,  Now the only remaining younger sister that i have is what you want to come and marry , any way sha you came late, I don carry am give Davidylan,  So you can work to depose davidylan before you can get her,

As for my wife, I am not married and as i have been saying it since i was born, I will Never marry,

As for my girl friend, here you passed with first class,  I have a very stubborn girl friend called Jessica, if it is that one you want, please come this afternoon and take her, please please and  please  , i take the lawd beg you.

may the lawd bless you for doing so.

You then Posted your conversion at 4:05PM

So please help me reconcile your transformation within the intervening  4 odd hours