₦airaland Forum

David and Havila. Are you there?

I think Havila as a person is a nice guy. But i dont think any one else is bad too. we are all cool. You know why i came to the conclusion that Christians hang so much on Jesus rather than on his message?. For an average christian, its always the verbal proclamation of the aceptance that gives him satisfaction but the booze, fornications, crimes and endulgence are just part of life. i believe an armed robber would gladly tell you he accept jesus as his lord and saviour and still feel cool.

In Islam it doesnt matter how long you keep repeating the testimony as long as you didnt do the good works, show love to your neighbour, stay away from troubles you may just end up in greater anger of going to the fire of hell. The Holy Quran says in Suratul Asr ;

1. Wal Asr - Swear with Asr
2. Inna insana lafi Husr - Verily Human beings are in a state of loss
3. Illal lathina amanu wa amilu salihati - Except those who believed and did the good works
4. Wata wasau bil haqq wata wa sau bissabri - Those that were truthful and those that were patient

But how comes you guys seem to know the menu on my dining mat? its always Fura de Nono and Tuwon Shinkafa. But no to alcohol and never Insha Allah.

You all seem to be in some kind of celebration mood. i think instead we should be sadden by the brickwall we all seem to be hitting anytime we try to explain our unwaivering faith in our respective deities. No one is winning here, noone even seem to be making any headway. we just keep going in cycles.Jesus is this or is that, Islam is this or is that, the Bible is superior No the Quran is. At the end of all this crazy exercise, Babyosisi, Havila and David will still come out as christians as ever while definitely Bro. olabowale and Belloti will forever remain as devoted and as commited muslims as has always being.

I think what we should try to achieve here is that, despite our seeming hatred for each other we can still talk on common platform and express our spiritual sentiments and feel good about it. My prayer has always being for guidance for myself and the rest of humanity. May the Lord Almighty Allah continue to guide all of us to be a better human beings. Amen

Sometimes i really cant see what we are achieving here. we dont seem to want to talk to each other or even try to understand. its so sad. i only take solace in the fact that Allahu Subhanahu wa Taala has stated in the Holy Quran that guidance is His. If myself and bro. Olabowale spend the whole season trying to make you atleast hear our Nasiha, you were always determined to resist and object. May Almighty Allah continue to guide us all to the straight path. Amen. The truth shall prevail one day. Islam is peace

Baby, your religious emphasis is so much on personality than on the real message. sometimes i feel christianity is only about acceptance of christ and trinity, everything else can go to blazes. thats where you missed the point.

In Naija, nowhere is safe. make you kuku siddon at home. you may end up at a greater risk. make we just pray. e go better

You guys should give Ibb a chance. we are all bunch of unfortunate tribalist. the poll should show you that 99% of people condemning IBB are southerners and vice versa. we are not talking about the evils that IBB did but we are only concern about where he comes from. Have you ever asked yourselves about the Southern cronies of IBB that assisted him in looting our resources? Lets just allow him to meet his fate at the poll. May 2007, May Almighty God provide us with the messiah that will take us out of the woods.

Babyosisi, i laughed when i read you calling me a firecracker but am glad you seem to agree that i ve calmed down. The fact is that no matter how much we muslims extend our hands of friendship and understanding, you guys always come out with a mindset. We might belong to different faith but our coming together on nairaland is a symbol of our internal harmony. You and very many like you always hit so hard on Islam and muslims. Terrorism and violence is not a sole preserve of muslims, it is infact a sign of an anomaly in the world we live. No one is safe from terrorist not even Bin laden if he is to move around freely. I dont understand why you guys feel the muslims are supporting this evil action that knows no bound.

Lets unite in our quest to solve the debilitating impact of terrorism by understanding the motives and the mechanics but definitely not by condemning Islam.

Babyosisi, i expect you to attack the issue, not the man.

Nice talk, David. we are finally closing in. our next challenge is to come up with a workable blueprint that will incorporate all these diversities for the collective good of our country. Nigeria can be great once again. Gamaliel Onosode once said, Nigeria is a country with lot of potentials for greatness, unfortunately we may only continue to be great only in the potentials. i think he is right

@olabowale, Jazakallah

David, you said it with so much finality. I dont think you will be surprise if no one agree with you. Its rather hash to hastely call northerners your incompatible aliens. i dont agree we have had such a bad companionship in all spheres of our daily interractions. i can agree politically, it has always bing somehow skewed in favour of the so-called majorities but then no matter how much influence our corrupt brothers wielded in the past, they were never able to break the southern monopoly in legal, oil and gas, accounting, medicine, etc. To be frank we ve always being fringe players despite our wealth of talents, brains and brawns. We never complaint because of our patience and perseverance. we all know politics has created so much negative notions about our so called regional inequalities but the truth remains we can always sort out our differences and move forward. And David, do not underestimate our generation of northerners.

Babyosisi, i can understand why you hit so much on the issue of sex and polygamy. you are only exhibiting the weaker side of yourself. you may probably be wondering why there are so much western muslim women who see our holy prophet as their hero. They dont share your weak and spitefull excesses.

Babyosisi, am amused by your ignorance call for bro. Olabowale and your subsequent betrayal of your own ignorance about Islam.

The basic and plain understanding of the death of Jesus (for your Sins    ) is probably the same context you also understood the tenets of Islam and our Lord Almighty, Ever living and Ever presence. If you call someone nailed to the cross and hopelessly bleeding to death as your God, it can never make sense to any muslim the world over just like some of our religious teachings do not appeal to the skeptic infidels (who most times deliberately confuse the iisues). The fact is we interprete each other just to suits our sensibilities inline with our disbelieve.

But i also come to realise that Christians uses religion just the way a drunken man uses lamp post, for support rather than for illumination. May Allah continue to guide and protect us. Amen.

David, That sound like giving up.

I have said it time and time again. You guys justify terrorism more than me and Bro. Olabowale, who indeed should know better. Babyosisi, you are very wrong to expect any muslim anywhere on the face of earth to be embrassed by Quranic verses. That can never be a trait of a practising muslim.

When the name was chosen for our Religion it was carefully coined to emphasis Peace. The word Islam is literally translated to mean Peace. That alone is a pointer to the mission of the religion. But if it makes you more comfortable to link Islam with violence and terrorism, then i can only say its a free world.

Havila, the similarities are not from the king. His visitors actually quoted Suratul Maryam to explain the birth of Jesus and then he asked them about Islamic rulings about some aspect of life. When they answered him, he then told them he believe the two religions are very close.

I can see you guys have gone on a familiar road too. you seem to be wallowing in ego and pride about your so called superior religion. i am greatly amused. i deliberately made up the similarities to test your reactions and i was not disappointed.

What makes you feel christianity is right i cant really fathom. But i just  accept it as individual differences. Because Islam is the only true religion and whosoever does not believe in one God is doomed. That is what i believe in.

Odeku

you are not my mate

Odeku and people of like minds, please when you post here put it at the back of your head that you are only stressing your own views because you are representing no one but yourself. so the issue of IBB or anyone else is to be determined at the polls not by shouting loudest on nairaland. Some of us are willing to accept candidates like IBB, Duke, Yarima or any eligible person as long as its the popular choice.

I guess you are right Lafile, Its basically a matter of interpretation. I dont think we are in a war time now. But that may also depend on my location. We all need to be cautious and avoid giving wrong signals where there is none. Religion is guidance and destructions and Killings are definitely not right and cant be justified anytime.

Enugu, Read my post very well and objectively

David, i think you better listen to Havila and stop all these apportioning of blames. It doesnt potray you in good stand. If we found ourselves in a situation, we dont just sit down crying foul while we can as well offer some reasonable way out. Nigerian crisis is multi-facetted and ofcourse structurally based. But then here we are, knowing this much about it but wasting precious time arguing blindly.

Elections are back, if leadership is the bane of our problems, this is the time to fix it. If knowledge is our problem, we are getting more informed now. if we cant refocused our country now then we may as well keep our traps shuts and allow others who think differently.

Lafile,

You know i dont trust Babyosisi with a 100 meter stick. She almost always quotes The Holy book from God knows where. I dont know what she intend to achieve. Below is the correct Quranic verses.

48 : 25 They are the ones who denied Revelation and hindered you from the Sacred Mosque and the sacrificial animals, detained from reaching their place of sacrifice. Had there not been believing men and believing women whom ye did not know that ye were trampling down and on whose account a crime would have accrued to you without (your) knowledge, ((Allah) would have allowed you to force your way, but He held back your hands) that He may admit to His Mercy whom He will. If they had been apart, We should certainly have punished the Unbelievers among them with a grievous Punishment.  

48 : 29 Muhammad is the apostle of Allah. and those who are with him are strong against Unbelievers, (but) compassionate amongst each other. Thou wilt see them bow and prostrate themselves (in prayer), seeking Grace from Allah and (His) Good Pleasure. On their faces are their marks, (being) the traces of their prostration. This is their similitude in the Taurat; and their similitude in the Gospel is: like a seed which sends forth its blade, then makes it strong; it then becomes thick, and it stands on its own stem, (filling) the sowers with wonder and delight. As a result, it fills the Unbelievers with rage at them. Allah has promised those among them who believe and do righteous deeds forgiveness, and a great Reward.  

The Holy Book is the Book of guidance and verses were revealed in their relevant contexts. You cant say when you ve got headache you just go for amoxycillin because its a Beecham's product. Quran 47 : 4 was referring to the war period and has no direct relevance to our current situation. But if indeed there is a religious war i believe The Holy Book comes handy in ethical rules of engagement.

47 :4 Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks; At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them): thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom: Until the war lays down its burdens. Thus (are ye commanded): but if it had been Allah.s Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost.  

47 :5 Soon will He guide them and improve their condition,  

If you want authentic quotations from the Holy Quran just go to www.searchtruth.com.

Let me flow then

1. Christian actually believe in the existence of God. They only added some few more membership to it

2. The Stories about the holy prophets Adam, Abraham, David, Solomon, Lot etc up to the Virgin mary are basically the same

3. Christians believe in Heaven and Hell, Life after Death, Reward and Punishment, Angels, etc

4. Christians do have some Moral codes, Ethical conducts, etc

5. Christians also have a devine guidance in the Book of Injeel (Bible), thought later was adulterated

6. Christians do believe in the sanctity of human life like their muslims brethren.

etc There are a lot many

You see David, whenever you argue with so much sentiments you always miss the point. your arguement hinges so much on the north being the loser in the event of secession. you so much emphasised on it as if you were passing a death sentence on the region. Oil, Oil, Oil. You know the discovery of oil in oloibokri and the okitipupa plains in 1958 and 1908 basically marked the begining of Nigerias woes and political instability. Northern Nigerians were bunch of hardworking farmers that build groundnut pyramid with passion while the yorubas bask on their cocoa and pal oil elsewhere in the east. Nigerians were never short of sustenable agricultural employments.

The yakubu Gowon era of oil wealth and subsequent mismanagement and corruptions led to the shift of emphasis from our economic mainstay to make foray into the new found goldmine. You thought we are extremely scared of reverting to status quo ante or probably we may not even survive the breakage. Nah, thats where you got it all wrong. But then i dont want to dwell so much on this issue because it was never a reasonable idea of a way forward. It was where we had being.

Whenever we argue issues like these we always come up with our different versions of our "different truth or facts". Its quite obvious we can never share the same source of the reported history. i dont expect you to totally agree with me but i believe in my source and i expect you to stick to yours. The bottom line is that i cant blow myself off just because someone refuse to believe in Islam, thats not what Islam says.  There is more to terrorism than just faith and belief.

Holy Qur'an, Surah #109  The Disbelievers    سورة الكافرون  

1 Say : O ye that reject Faith!  
2 I worship not that which ye worship,  
3 Nor will ye worship that which I worship.  
4 And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship,  
5 Nor will ye worship that which I worship.  
6 To you be your Way, and to me mine.

oh dear. Am sure everything will be just fine. We shall include you in our prayers too.

Almighty God will surely judge everyone regardless of your degree of hatred towards Islam. But let me give you a glimpse of the special relationship we enjoyed with the christendom in the past. In the early days of Islam, When our Holy prophet was persecuted by the pagans of Mecca, he sent his followers to a Christian King in Ethopia who, he told them, would surely protect them. The king welcomed them and explained the similarities between the two religions to them after hearing their Islamic concept.

The Christians of today, more especially in the African countries, seem to grew up hating Islam, even while knowing next to nothing about it. Mostly out of fear and apprehension than out of reasons. May Almighty Allah guide all of us to the right path, Amen

You guys seem to forget that the union recognises these facts and sought to address them as well. We cant change what north was or is, but we can move forward by accepting our structural superiority or inferiority without emphasis on making someone pays. the north as a region is different with the few lucky northerners that failed the nation. You only seem to be bent on making the whole of north suffer the brunt. We only need to come up with a working blueprint that recognises where the lapses are and who fits the round wholes irrespective of background. Am not really frighten by the threat of seccession but i dont think it would augur well for any of the factions.

Havila, you cant tell me the sunni and shiites are fighting the infidels. they are fighting for regional supremacy and control. its all political. The Israel issue is about occupation and invasions. They dont care if the jews decide to be pagans or whatever, but give them their land and all goes well. I tell you nobody will just slaughter an innocent unbeliever just because he is not a muslim. The Holy Quran says

And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #46)

This is the guidance of Allah. He giveth that guidance to whom He pleaseth, of His worshippers. If they were to join other gods with Him, all that they did would be vain for them.
( سورة الأنعام , Al-Anaam, Chapter #6, Verse #88)

Thy Lord knoweth best who strayeth from His way: He knoweth best who they are that receive His guidance.
( سورة الأنعام , Al-Anaam, Chapter #6, Verse #117)

Say: "O ye men! Now Truth hath reached you from your Lord! those who receive guidance, do so for the good of their own souls; those who stray, do so to their own loss: and I am not (set) over you to arrange your affairs."
( سورة يونس , Yunus, Chapter #10, Verse #108)

Thats not true. Does the sunnis or shiites in Iraq uses religion as their justification? Does the Palestinians uses Islam as their justification or Does Bin laden totally used Islam as his Justification. You only see terrorism where there is invasions and injustice. Thats why you dont see terrorism in UAE, Qatar, Kuwait or the rest of the peaceful world. Then who do you think hold the solutions? Thats my own question