₦airaland Forum

coogar: what haven't they spewed with their snouts? however, men take these things on the chin. we are not supposed to moan, whinge or complain.....



oh please.....
there's no kind feminist anywhere - kind and nice to who? the opposite sex? hell no.

this is y'all's favourite slogan - "A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle"




hahahaha - see cop out!
come on bukatino........feminism fights for the interest of women and more often than not, it's at the expense of the men!

The expectations of the society has been hard on us but harder on women. I wonder where we got the belief that men are emotionless beings. I guess it's really from fact that men were seen superior to women and therefore should be without emotions.

As for your slogan, I have not heard it before. That sounds like what a lesbian would say. Who would she marry? Would she not need the help of her male colleagues/neighbors? We were created to help and complement each other esp in marriage so I really do not understand the origin of the slogan. Even if a woman decides to use a sper.m donor, it's still from a man.

I think it's unfair to stereotype all men as bad till they prove it just as it is unfair to stereotype all women as empty-headed because they are ... Women.

Our society fights for men; feminism fights for women, it's balanced! Lol! I think the problem is that a lot of men are not willing to come to terms that women van be whatever they choose to be.

People exhibition is bases on their values, mindset etc.

It's a fallacy to say there are no kind feminists how it would be a fallacy to say there are no wicked/mean/bitter feminists.

coogar: so you agree with a movement that says "all men are räpists"?? you actually believe all the men close to you are räpists? dad, brothers, uncles, etc are all räpists?



i answered - all i need to see are the prices of all your packages.

I thought you called me one of the leading feminists on NL?

Did feminism really say that all men are rapists? Lol!

You all make it seem that all anti-feminists are excellent women. You should realize that feminism forms part of one's mindset; if I am a bitter person, I will be a bitter feminist/anti-feminist etc. Same applies if I an rude, kind, polite etc.

See feminism as head/heart knowledge; it is how the knowledge is put to use that matters. It's the feminism that spurs one woman to be the best in her field that will spur another to disregard men or undermine their importance.

ileobatojo: Bunch of ignoramuses and numskulls!

Lol!

How are you and family?

luvmijeje: It's not just you o, I even read that feminism is about female supremacy. The one that shocked me most was a supposed female writing crap about feminism.
As far as I'm concerned, they won't just have e-heart attack, they will also have e-collapse and if they are not careful it may lead to e-death cos we are just starting.

Lol!

Luvmijeje, let's treat them jeje so that there is no e-death o!

I believe with time, more people would come around to understand what feminism means and that people's personality plays a part in their outlook to all things in life : feminism included.

It would be easier if we express our views with civility and courtesy.

It is well

coogar: what has lesbianism gotta do with feminism? do you think we are illiterates here? what has intimate relationship between 2 women got to do with feminism?

bukatyne - you are by far the worst customer service agent from the coast of nigeria. all my enquiries just got swept under the carpet - well done!!!

You should ask the posters that think so!

As for your inquiries, they were not swept under the carpet, they were packed on a shelf! You did not answer my questions na...

I can only proceed if you do so and if you feel it's still in the start up and do not want to disclose much info, I can follow up with you still you are ready.

DarryOsh: I like to think that i stil hav time on my side (early twenties) but i try to prepare. This marriage of a thing is a big deal! Sometimes it seems that one can never prepare enough. I have seen circumstances turn great marrriages into something else.

Because i believe that i am a very good man and whoever gets me is favoured, i have set high standards. A friend tells me my standards are unrelistic. Yet another friend (who is just like me in many regards) says otherwise. He believes that since i meet up with those high standard i deserve someone who also does. But its confusing......i believe in compromise but there are many things i dont want to compromise on. Lord help us all.

Dear DarryOsh,

Early 20's ain't too young to marry if you have the right person

Never believe that the standards you set for your wife to be are unrealistic if you can achieve them yourself.

You will be expected to compromise but never do on core values.

Feminists don suffer!

Imagine that a poster telling me that kindness and feminism does not jell! Seriously? All feminists must be rude etc. Once the word feminism is written, a lot of posters' have an e-heart attack!

Feminists do not want to marry!
Men are always in the wrong to them!

I wonder if most posters can differentiate between Feminists and Lesbians.

It's well

CNN80: Marriage is a covenant instituted by God. What is with all these weird definitions of feminism? According to Wikipedia "Feminism is a collection of movements and ideologies aimed at defining, establishing, and defending equal political, economic, and social rights for women. This includes seeking to establish equal opportunities for women in education and employment. A feminist advocates or supports the rights and equality of women." Wanting a different type of wedding is not the end of the world. I'm married and let me say
1) I bought all the rings. It was easier for me to take care of that.
2) My father didn't walk me down the aisle. I don't think they do that in the Catholic Church.
3) I wore white just because my husband pointed out that I had earned the right to do so.
4) I got rid of that part of the reception where the cake maker describes the cake and people observing us cutting the cake and making comments on what they saw. I never understood the point.
5) I had a reception breakfast. The world didn't end.

It was our wedding ceremony. We were allowed to make it whatever we wanted it to be within reason. An elaborate ceremony is not the foundation of a stable and Godly home. And I really don't know why not wearing white should be considered feminist.

In face eh, I have really been learning!

LoveAmaka88: Why wed at all if you are a feminist? Marriages are patriarchal institutions perpetuated and sanctioned by male dominated governmental and religious institutions. A true feminist wouldn't want her legal identity to be compromised by attaching herself to a man. I want my damn ring, dress, friends, family, and institution that serves as the foundation of a stable and Godly home. I don't blame them for wanting something different, but don't try to label it as feminist when you are still subscribing to the institution in the first place.

I have been silently following this thread by yo brought moi out!

Care to explain the bolded?

this thread is so funny!

About 200 ladies talked of how they want their wedding to be and we are all jumping up and down.

As far as your lady is not amongst them, what is the problem?

What happened to live and let's live?

Pataki: Sorry to refer you back from page 3 with your conversation with Aluta, but is this your own definition of equality?

That was not a definition of equality; I was stating the 'roles' in marriage if you want to call them roles.

I believe Aluta was referring to marriage that's why I added that line.

TV01: GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Philippians 2:6 - Although he was in the form of God and equal with God, he did not take advantage of this equality.

The above is Christian equality in a nutshell.

_{And no philosophy or ideology can - or is required to - embellish Christianity. Attempting to do so will give you "another gospel". Let no one be deceived by reasoning and smooth words. I speak to those who may be unwittingly taken in by them.}

TV

I don not think your posts are in sync with the subject matter

You first said there is nothing like equality in Christianity now you are talking of Christian equality?

I think it's best everyone run their homes as they deem fit.

biolabee: Ive read ur posts

I asked u a real q

If by age or experience or any other factor, ur man always has the better points, would you not feel resentful after a while

And why should I feel resentful if he does it with love?

He has an idea, I bring my input and after discussion as lovers, his own is better. Is it not for our good?

I have an idea, he sees through it and polishes it or brings a better one, is it to our good?

It takes a confident person to learn from others...
I do not have a victim mentality and see shadows where there are none.

Let me indulge you

It's is best you read my posts and understand what I am trying to say. It is very obvious there is lack of communication. You are reading my posts but you are not listening to what ia saying.

The issue is that you have a preconceived notion about feminists and that is all you are hearing even when I am saying something else. Learning The art of listening is not easy but very benefial.

You keep hammering on my implying that white marriages are better even when I was not the one that added white into the mix.

You cannot wrap your head round me been a Christian or nice because I believe that men and women are equal.

If guess this same belief is what makes women sleep around, splendid! So what do the men that sleep around believe in? That men and women are equal?

Stop mixing issues here. I can be a medical doctor, a choister in Church and a cook. I can be a professor and still be very lousy.

I am bukatyne consisting of different parts or segments. I am a christian therefore I strive to develops the fruits of the Holy Spirit. I believe men and women are equal and strive to treat them as I want them to treat me. I am a fiancee and I strive to be the best lover. I have siblings and I try to be there for them. I have parents and I try to make them proud and happy. I am a neighbour to people and I try to have good relations with them. I am an employee and I try to give my employer my best. One aspect of my life doesn't define me; I define all the aspects of my life.

biolabee: It will not be so bad
Granted there is an innate power struggle between the sexes from time immemorial but it will not be as bad
All they do in the west is serial marriages


 
Thanks for the response but i really hope buka can answer too
If whites are the model of good marriages, their statistics will be better than our own
 
 
Feminism at its core is rebellion against the status quo// how can that gel with a religion that advocates forgiveness, kindness and humility
 
Funny to me....
 
The funniest thing is that these same feminism, after they got the empowerment, they just hustle for settlement up and down, leave their partners houses to be phocking around, kill babies up n down instead of closing their legs...
 
The matter tire me sef

jidegirl12: WOW!!

My parents divorced and shared assets tho ( both educated) and that was decades ago in court.... @Mordern concept you implied , are we moving forward or backwards??

Believe me, it's an extreme case...

I know a lot of people separated... nothing like court o!

We like to pretend too much for Naija.

A woman her husband finished beating thoroughly will still be insulting a 30 year old for been single

jidegirl12: Had that ^^ argument with hubby for a whole day and it nearly spoilt my vaca.

I don't know! You'll need married white folks to do that research.

The truth is that Nigerian marriages are not better...

If all the women who complained their hubby was cheating on NL divorced, The stats will climb real high. Besides, divorce is a modern concept in Nigeria; it's throwing of the wife's load or marrying no 2 to displace her that reigns.

biolabee: very good example.... so the man won the argument

Lets assume it goes on like that for two years... what next

how does that gel with your equality beliefs

Say you have to resign due to high costs of childcare as it occurs in the West or you DO NOT want a househelp

How is this feminism compatible with your religion that says there shall be a head in marriage

This is where your problem is...

It's not a win or lose situation, we are not in competition. It is choosing what is best for the both of us.

So we are not equal because he has a better idea than mine? I laugh in Spanish! Common sense and wisdom is extremely important in life. If a 2yr old gives me an idea that will better my life, I will grab it fast. If that makes her superior to me, fine

I don't want to go back and forth oga.

A husband being the head depends on what you both understand headship to mean.

Uruguay's Presido is the head.... he donates 90% of his salary to Charity
Nigerian's Presido is the head... He uses N1 billion for food allowance

It is all perception dear!

TV01: Can one be a "Christian first" and then something that is contrary to Christianity second? That makes you neither fish nor fowl. Please think about that.

Indeed, your writing betrays the fact that you adopt procrustean means to make your Christianity fit your feminism.

You never actually answered Aluta' question on what equality meant. Further you are unable to decouple "equality" and "submission". Evidenced by your last quote below and a clear pointer of your supposed faith warring - and perhaps losing - to your ideology



What is it that warrants rudeness however you define equality?



And here is the rub. Submission is not in view here is it? What's the tie-braker. Any power of veto by the male head



Again you hit a brick wall trying to reconcile two disparate concepts, one of which you have been unable to define, the other that is anathema to your feminist ideolgy.

And finally you conclude. You are equal (whatever equality mean). All Christians submit to one another, ergo you submit to no one.

I am not sure what faith or ideology Aluta subscribes to, but imho she is certainly closer to the Christian truth here, and rightly rested her case.

TV

Oga Tv,

In summary, what is your post about?

biolabee: Interesting comments

on the african male, if the western men are so perfect and share tasks 50/50, how come the divorce rate is so high

remember i asked you on the pro/con debate,.. if only one idea is more sound, will there not be resentment from the other party

It was Aluta that brought African men into the jist.

She said a true feminist should not marry an African man

As for the pro/con debate, I will give a recent example...

We are planning where to live after marriage...

I so wanted Agungi bços it is relatively near my office. He said Sango tedo that houses are cheaper bla bla... I said no way! It would mean waking up so early to work and coming back very late every day.

He later said Ajah and I still wanted Agungi. We started scouting for houses and oh boy! it is expensive. I was like we would run a very tight saving plan till marriage but it would still not work. I had to see from his eyes and understand that it would make no sense getting such an expensive apartment since we both just started working. We have settled for Ajah (his decision) after viewing all sides and picking the best irrespective of whose idea it is

alutacontinua: I rest my case!

Why na?

coogar: how do people talk? you don't have a number?

Send me a PM

ileobatojo: And on what basis do you make this ridiculous claim? Can you not understand the simple differences between that thread and a thread where for instance a man orders his wife to kneel for him every time she serves him food?

I am wondering o!

The thing tire me. Too many mind readers here.

alutacontinua: That's the point, you see that submission, sometimes, it won't be the easiest of tasks but you still have to do it. Mind you, it's not all the time that the man asks you to do something that he doesn't love you, sometimes, they're just tryna prove a point to you. Take for instance, the thread where the man said his wife should kneel to apologize, i'm very sure if it were you feminists that got to that thread first, you could have filled her head with all forms of 'ish' on how he wouldn't do same if roles were reversed, you shouldn't kneel for a mortal man, it's even wrong of him to insist that the wife does what she doesn't want to do and all of that. But alas, that man just needed to prove a point to that woman and he still remains the same loving man that she married in the first instance.

My point: Submission is not just in words and sometimes, it goes against the stance of feminism...it wouldn't always be fun submitting but if you say you're a Christian first, you have to shelve aside your feminism views and build your home the way Christ wants you to. I wouldn't be saying all of these if i've not seen the way you seem to uphold your religious views, there are many feminists on here and I sincerely don't have anything against any of them.

Aluta, you are mixing so many issues here.

Don't assume what 'feminists' will tell someone to do until they do so. I read that tread and was smiling especially when she was referring to the after fight love making and where the hubby told her to repeat the apology after him... so sweet

One thing I always say is : Do unto others as you want others to do unto you.

Common sense would dictate that a wife who wronged her hubby would apologize not so?

You don't even know what submission means. I get your view is that a woman is slightly below a man because she submits, innit? Then I guess all Christians are slightly below each other as they are to submit to each other.

The thing is that most of us mix Christianity and culture. A husband is called to love as Christ did. Read 1 cor 13:1 - 8 and tell me what you feel about it. That is what your husband should be like.

The key is to meet a person who thinks like you and you build your home together.

Trust me, the things I do for my darling , you might not be able to do for yours.

P.S.: A bitter person would be a bitter, feminist or not.

biolabee: i have to give it to kulyie.. she keeps it real

i think buka is tryin to merge religion with her values of equality..

submission as defined in the bible at times run counter to equality FACT!

For your desire shall be to the man and he shall RULE over you... Na Bible talk am oooo

ish

I am a Christian first and it should reflect in my outlook to life. The fact I am equal to a man does not mean I should be rude or maltreat him. Before doing anything to someone, I try to put myself in the shoes of that person. Infact, knowing that we are equal has helped me a lot. I know that this person feels pain the way I do, would appreciate things like I would etc. Before, I do things to/for my fiancée, I try to imagine 'if it were the other way round, would he do this? handle the situation like this? etc.' and I try to emulate where I am lacking. I am not a person to counter one's views because they are not from me. If he brings an idea/suggestion and I have no differing opinion, the decision flies. If I do, we table it and discuss the pros and cons of each suggestion and pick the best for us. It might be his, it might be mine.

Submission as defined in the Bible has never ran counter to equality. It's submission as defined by man (African since Aluta feels that the African male understands submission differently). Do you know that all Christians are expected to submit to one another? Does it mean that all Christians are not equal?

alutacontinua: Equality: state of being equal. In this context, i'll say same level of authority.

Define your own equality.

I know that a man and woman are equal.

I also want to believe that you are talking in context of marriage.

A husband is to love his wife and a wife is to submit

coogar: in your heart? ehn, i still want to beat it out of your belly.



i am very serious - i have followed the progress of mainonecable for the past 3-4 years. biko, let's talk, i want to be a billionaire in the next 2 years...

Lol!

How can we talk?

coogar: my x-ray machine tells me that is where your feminism lives.

do you work with mainonecable? i have a huge business that i intend taking to nigeria but the success of the business depends largely on the availability of a super-fast broadband internet..... can you provide such?

You x-ray machine ain't working!

It lives in my heart; it is a part of who I am

Are you serious @ the bolded

alutacontinua: @bukatyne, sometimes, you know you need to come down from this your whole equality ladder, right
And by that, I mean in the real deal of when you get married.
For now, you can keep publishing it, it's all well and good!
The truth remains there would be moments when you just have to do it, not because you want to but because he wants you to. Apparently, that wouldn't be an everyday occurrence since you're not into a slave-trade thingy but it would definitely happen. If you expect a man to always share it with you in love and take your views into consideration, you might be on a long thing. There are times when you just have to be the one to swallow your views and follow his. If that is in anyway against your feminism views, I'm sorry but it's the truth.


That's why I love kulyie, a real feminist is not supposed to bother to marry an African man.

Disclaimer: All ye Feminists, I hail all of una and you all know I love you, the above is not to undermine your authority, just wanted to point something out quickly to Sis. Bukatyne. Abeg, una shld not open fire on top my head, na beg I dey. THANKS FOR THE USUAL CO-OPERATION!

Hi Aluta,

Everything in life does not point to feminism.

I am a Christian first before being a lady/feminist/whatever and I believe so much in 'Do unto others as you want others to do unto you' as it is the golden rule.

It also depends on how you interpret equality. Can you please define what you mean by equality so that we are on the same page?

Thanks

damiso: Ok guys, I just need to know that I am not giving biased advise cos as I have said before I am always not too comfortable giving marital advice cos really I might looking at the issue from my POV.I would appreciate other views so as to know what next to say.

We have this family friends who got married around the same time as us.The only difference is in this case the hubby joined wife here in the uk while I joined my husband.We have same no of kids (2), almost same ages(between 1&4) and I am close to the wife.She is British and has lived here most of her life.She works for a local authority as a social worker and I must say she is quite passionate about what she does.The husband before coming over, had quite a good job in Nigeria and was already in management in a very good international company. I guess they must have reached some kind of compromise for it to be the man that relocated.

[b]Since he got here, he has been finding difficult to actually get a job that fits his skill set.He actually got a couple of contracts in project management but they are often short term.[size=10pt]It seems the guy is not really that crazy on continuing living here I the uk (cant say I blame him)[/b. So he started applying for jobs in Nigeria (the wife told me that he told her he was just trying his luck and was not really serious about it).Apparently he has a vast network in Nigeria and voila this week he was offered a very good well paying offer in Nigeria. He got back from Nigeria like a month ago so he was able to go for the interview.

Sorry for my long story but I had to give a background. Now wifey sought my advice cos she is mad at him for the following reasons

~She says before they got married they agreed the uk would be their home

~He was on holiday in Nigeria how did holiday turn to going for interview

~She said she cant see herself living in Nigeria for now

~She said she does not like the idea of him living in Nigeria and she living here that the kids are still young and she cant be a married single mother as such there is no more marriage

~She said infidelity is a deal breaker for her

My intial reaction was o gal how does living in Nigeria translate to infidelity
She was like Dami are you being naive or you are playing your usual annoying devils advocate?
I said no but you said yourself that you trust him and you have never had any reason to doubt him.Her response was she does not trust Naija gals .

They have a house in Naija already so its not like there would be an additional expense for new accommodation and he said money will not be an issue he could be flying down every 2 to 3 months.
Ok my advise(as I said maybe biased cos if na me in 2 yrs max after I finish my programme I for don dey lagos dey do madam for owner's corner ) was this; You can't just give him ultimatum and say if he moves to Naija the marriage is over.Its obvious he is not happy here as his career is not progressing so dont let him resent you for tying him down.You guys talk.What do you have against Nigeria after all you are Nigerian(she went to later pry and sec school in Naija)? She said what job will she do.I said am not too sure but there are social workers in Nigeria.She kinda got upset I kept mentioning she should consider maybe moving to naija. Ok I said if you hate the Naija idea, maybe his coming every 2 months might be a compromise. She no wan hear that one too.Ok I said so what do you want.She said he should keep looking for a job here as they agreed before they married.I told her ohan you are being selfish, you cant just be rigid. Things change, you cant just say its your way or no way. You have to reach a compromise.She is not too happy with me at the mo but I dont care.


So guys could I have advised her differently?

Trying to analyze the post again esp the bolded.

Nashville: On average Social workers earn £35k per annum. If they live in London and with a family of 4, they will be struggling very hard. I mean very very hard. And that is what the husband must have seen and that's what he wants to relocate. Poster says the wife is passionate about her career not earning a huge sum. And this is a man that should be at the peak of his career and you want him to sit down idle so that she can be controlling him.

So you want her to sit down idle so that he can be controlling her!

Nashville, don't bring Nigerianism into this. I do not agree with all your views but I like your general e-outlook to things.

Like I said (wrote) in my earlier post, they should sit long and hard to reach a decision that will sit well with both parties.

Nashville: What comfort zone? Working as a social worker with a jobless husband and you call that comfort? Marriage is about compromise. They have tried London for at least four years and it doesnt seem to be working out. Why not try Nigeria. The man already now has a good job. She may come to Nigeria and find a much better life but she is being too rigit and selfish. The alternative is for them to live apart for a while.

I will put the husband around 35 yrs old. If he stays idle for another 5 years, he can as well forget about any headway in life because his time will have passed. Some people have been saying he should look for other sectors for employment. You folks dont know how tough the UK especially coming with a 9ja degree. I am sure the guy don apply tire without any luck.

According to the OP, the wife has a good career going for her.

My post below refers...

bukatyne: Perfect.

They would really have to think long and hard to reach a compromise that will sit well with both of them

Ujujoan: Is the man uncomfortable in the UK? It think the issue here is their careers. The man might make all the money in the world to give them the best here but will the woman find any job at all? Let's face it, Nigeria is not exactly a land of opportunities. For someone already used to a career, being Idle will drive her nuts!

She will suffer psychologically because she's being forced to live and raise her children in an environment she never thought she would.

I mean they already discussed this and made a decision. She'll be forced into giving it all up. that will also make her resentful. So I guess they have to decide who gets the right to be resentful and who gets the right to be happy . . .

Perfect.

They would really have to think long and hard to reach a compromise that will sit well with both of them