₦airaland Forum

uchkochi: Mistakes in Giving

If you do not pay your tithe or give your offerings, if you do not sow seeds you are not permitted to prosper financially. Financial prosperity does not answer to prayer or fasting, it has nothing to do with your confession or assumptions. Financial prosperity only answer to giving, it respects seed sowing. Malachi 3:10.

You don’t claim prosperity by praying because it is not a promise, it is a covenant. Genesis 8:21-22 and Jeremiah 33:20-21. It is covenant practice that brings about prosperity. It is the blessing of the LORD that makes rich and adds no sorrow to it. Proverbs 10:22.

Can you pinpoint a bible verse that implies what you said above to a Christian? Particularly the bolded?

I hope you know the above either proves you're ignorant or a chronic liar and thief? You chose which category you fall into. However I want to believe a crook told you those lies so I'll assume you're simply ignorant of the scriptures below which directly counter your claims above.

Proverbs 10:4 KJV
He becometh poor that dealeth with a slack hand: but the hand of the diligent maketh rich.

Proverbs 12:24 KJV
The hand of the diligent shall bear rule: but the slothful shall be under tribute.

Proverbs 13:4 KJV
The soul of the sluggard desireth, and hath nothing: but the soul of the diligent shall be made fat.

Proverbs 22:29 KJV
Seest thou a man diligent in his business? he shall stand before kings; he shall not stand before mean men

I want to believe you know what ''being diligent" means? The bible respects diligence and hard work and I expect you to follow suit.

Pls Stop creating a false impression of God. He isn't a genie or a lottery machine. If you need money, go and work.

1 Corinthians 4:12 KJV
And labour, working with our own hands: being reviled, we bless; being persecuted, we suffer it:

Ephesians 4:28 KJV
Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.

Alwaystrue: @ Candour,
Thanks. It was God's grace that enabled me and many others to present as it is not an easy task. I would have rather preferred to look on but it is all about grace received.
Cheers.

Are u telling me Of course its not an easy task and that's why I appreciate all of you who presented. I remember how it was last year.

Thank God for his mercies

Thanks be to God almighty for his mercies and grace on the organisers, presenters and audience. I must admit this year's convention is an improvement on that of last year even though some longed for music, opening prayers etc (Christemmbassey, na u be dat ?), I will score this edition higher than last and pray next year would be greater.

Thanks to Mranony1, trustman, yooguyz, BabaGnoni, Ihedinobi2, Alwaystrue, PastorOluT, Striktlymi, MarkMiwerds. God bless you real good for your efforts and delivery. I will say special kudos to BabaGnoni and Ihedinobi2 who in my opinion got the trickiest topics and I'm grateful to God they navigated the minefield beautifully. May God bless you my brothers and sister very plentifully and megally.

I'm still enjoying myself going through all the presentations so I no get questions.

Cheers all as we bask in the wonderful and limitless grace of God

OLAADEGBU: It is either true or not true. The question was and still is: How did the Church function.

The below quote is true. Very true indeed.

chukwudi44: The bible was explicit enough about how the biblical church functioned .The was nothing like church denominations,no tithes,no Daddy and Mummy, Peter did not form his own church and Paul his own.The entire christiandom was one etc

The question you asked has been answered in the quotes from both of you reproduced below

OLAADEGBU: Question: "What was early Christianity like?"
Answer: Early Christianity began roughly 2,000 years ago, shortly after the death, resurrection, and ascension of Christ. Acts 11:26b says, “It was at Antioch that the believers were first called Christians.” “Christians” means “Christ’s people.” Early Christianity consisted of a group of loosely connected local bodies of believers who gathered together on a regular basis, usually in each other’s homes to fellowship and worship together (Acts 16:15; 18:7; 21:8; Romans 16:5; Colossians 4:15). These churches generally had the organization of pastors, elders, and deacons within each individual congregation.

This early New Testament church lived communally and often shared resources such as food and money (Acts 2:44-45 and Acts 4:32-36). Their services consisted mainly of preaching (during which time they might also read letters from missionaries such as Paul) and the singing of songs. They took offerings to support the journeys of their missionaries, and they performed baptisms. Also, they celebrated the Lord’s Supper each time they gathered together.

Because the early church was not focused on the maintenance of a church building, endless programs, and technology, they were able to concentrate on the study of God’s Word, service and dedication to one another, hospitality, benevolence, and missions (Romans 1:8; 15:19; 1 Thessalonians 1:7-8; Acts 13:1-26:32).

chukwudi44: The apostles, in their recollections, which are called gospels, handed down to us what Jesus commanded them to do. They tell us that he took bread, gave thanks and said: Do this in memory of me. This is my body. In the same way he took the cup, he gave thanks and said: This is my blood. The Lord gave this command to them alone. Ever since then we have constantly reminded one another of these things. The rich among us help the poor and we are always united. For all that we receive we praise the Creator of the universe through his Son Jesus Christ and through the Holy Spirit.

On Sunday we have a common assembly of all our members, whether they live in the city or the outlying districts. The recollections of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as there is time. When the reader has finished, the president of the assembly speaks to us; he urges everyone to imitate the examples of virtue we have heard in the readings. Then we all stand up together and pray.

On the conclusion of our prayer, bread and wine and water are brought forward. The president offers prayers and gives thanks to the best of his ability, and the people give assent by saying, “Amen”. The eucharist is distributed, everyone present communicates, and the deacons take it to those who are absent.

The wealthy, if they wish, may make a contribution, and they themselves decide the amount. The collection is placed in the custody of the president, who uses it to help the orphans and widows and all who for any reason are in distress, whether because they are sick, in prison, or away from home. In a word, he takes care of all who are in need.

We hold our common assembly on Sunday because it is the first day of the week, the day on which God put darkness and chaos to flight and created the world, and because on that same day our savior Jesus Christ rose from the dead. For he was crucified on Friday and on Sunday he appeared to his apostles and disciples and taught them the things that we have passed on for your consideration.

If the two of you think there's anything you left out, by all means, lay it out so we all can see and know

OLAADEGBU: Does that mean that remain perched on the fence?

Olaa, read my post which you quoted again. Focus on the last statement and tell if that sounds like perching on a fence

.......The bible was explicit enough about how the biblical church functioned .The was nothing like church denominations,no tithes,no Daddy and Mummy, Peter did not form his own church and Paul his own.The entire christiandom was one etc

The above is true. Very true indeed.

OLAADEGBU: Do I have a witness here?

you know I avoid getting involved in this particular debate about Israel, the church and end times because the schools of thought are so numerous and they all intersect on one or more points so much so that separating truth from fiction and conspiracy theory is made totally impossible.

As long as our eternal destination isn't dependent on our acceptance of Israel's unique position or not, then my philosophy on this subject is "to each his own belief".

Anyway, for the records, I'm in full agreement with your posts on this issue so far

I'd been studying the thread and believe it'll be a great one for learning and spiritual growth as long as we all cooperate to keep it 'clean'.

Been a bit busy with some domestic affairs but I'll find the time to contribute.

Cheers and God bless

Kudos DrummaBoy and Goshen360. Wish you guys more of God's grace and strength as you work towards a glorious convention and also manifold blessings and reward for the time and efforts you've put into organising this programme for this year. God will indeed bless you gentlemen greatly and overwhelmingly.

Also, best wishes to our presenters who have accepted to sacrifice time, resources and energy to teach us this year. May God in his infinite mercies bless and reward you many fold for your efforts to help build up the body of Christ on NL.

To the audience, I wish us all happy and fruitful learning.

AdimGreat: Leave them. Nigerians like to learn from experience.

But by then, their experience might have become some innocent people's reality e.g Sawyer running to Nigeria to share some 'love' before succumbing to the virus.

What will it cost to stay away from these delicacies for some time?

In speech, in comportment, in lifestyle let others see Jesus in you.

God bless us all

Indeed!!!

Christianity isn't a cakewalk neither is the path laid out with petals of roses. Its a call to battle and battles are fought by soldiers.

2 Timothy 2:3 KJV
Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.

More grace and strength to the members of the body of Christ.

nannymcphee: Firstly thanks, I'm grateful for all ur replies, they are rich & lengthy. I'm sure it took some of ur time

No wahala. It was the network problems that made it seem difficult.

pls can u throw more light on the above quote, if there are helpful links kindly provide them too

On a personal note, how do u pray?

I pray in line with the scripture below and trust God to do it.

Philippians 4:6 KJV
Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.

After this, my mind gets to rest on this scripture

Philippians 4:7 KJV
And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

Remembering this

Romans 8:26 KJV
Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

There are some requests we have that we might not know how to verbalise. As children of the most high, the holy spirit in us knows how to pray on our behalf according to the above scripture. Its pertinent also to know that prayer isn't about making requests all the time. Prayer is communication with God the same way we communicate with our earthly parents and we sure don't talk to them only when we need something.

If u found urself in the situations I gave in my post, how will u pray or go about

Simply cry out to God to effect a change in the situation and he will according to his love and will for us. Then i refuse to give in to fear because my whole being believe the scriptures below



Romans 8:31 KJV
What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

1 John 4:4 KJV
Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

I hand over to God like Moses and the Israelites at the red sea and trust him to take care of the rest.

Also if you're the one who needs to change and make adjustments, do not procrastinate, do it.

You said Gods word will not change ones reality but give someone confidence to face a situation? pls explain

Hmmm... I really don't know how to explain it but how will repeating Isaiah 43 change your situation? Prayer isnt about confessing positively or reciting scriptures. Praying with the promises in that chapter isn't the same as engaging in vain repetitions as Jesus described below

Matthew 6:7 KJV
But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do : for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.

We were asked to pray my sister, not confess scripture like using a talisman.

Phew!!! 9 solid years!! How do I begin the reconstructive surgery??

By intensive study of the word my sister. If I could become free, then so can you.

I have loads of questions

I can imagine but can we please take a break and allow the discussants continue? We could revisit after they're through.

Thanks a lot.

ambrosini593: I just received two calls now that I should put salt on water to bath before going out against ebola virus. Please do the same you may never can tell. Mod front page pls

I want to hazard a guess that call came from Benin city? My colleague and I just got separate calls from relatives in benin advising salt therapy too. How come all the advisories on Ebola in the public domain say nothing about this? I even asked my relative if the info came from a doctor or a shaman.

Pls let's be sure before setting folks into a state of paranoia.

DrummaBoy: One day, many years ago, I was reading Acts 15, the place were the apostles sent letters to the church in Antioch to tell them that they need not listen to the Judaizers about circumcision. They should follow a certain minimum and they were OK. scripture records somewhere there that the people were happy. I could see relief too in that passage, the very thing Candour is describing here. Acts 15:30-31 - " ... and when they had gathered the multitudes together, they delivered the epistle: which when they had read, they rejoiced for the consolation". God knows how much more he wants his people to rejoice over, which church leaders prefer to bind people up in misery instead.

One of the biggest disservice church leaders can do to a flock is, in their bid to protect the flock, to then begin to list out dos and donts for them. It leads to bondage. When eventually truth is pointed out, relief and joy comes.

Should God's people not have a right to relief, joy and freedom all the time? Should churches bind up people in a bid to protect them? Is God not sufficient to save and keep safe till the end?

Forgive my Lamentations. I cannot help it sometimes.

The natural man always wants to dominate and control others that's why. Its in us all and if its not curbed, it will find expression. I've always said there's something about starting a new denomination that turns men into monsters and control freaks. Check all denominations particularly those where the pastor, his wife and children are called at the same time to see how humans try to control and dominate another using christianity and the bible as tools.

Its scary and sad.

nannymcphee: Do negative confessions have effects on non Christians?

in my opinion YES


Does it matter that those God spoke about at Babel where immoral pagans? Or simply because the episode is in the bible, we can appropriate it as Christians?

in my opinion, it doesnt count in the sense that whether or not they were pagans, God spoke his observations and it was a generic one regardless of their state, so in today whether it is the bornagain or the unbeliever whatever he sets his mind to accomplish that he will accomplish(there are limitations though eg the sovereignty of God, the right to to use or appropriate what ever he wants to do eg the unbeliever has no business laying claims to the promises meant for the believer i.e put on the whole Armour of God-thats for the believer not the unbeliever)

proverbs 21:13

Whoso stoppeth his ears at the cry of the poor, he also shall cry himself, but shall not be heard

this is a generic word, it covers every man on earth, its not specific to the christian but to everybody, it is in this same light that i view the statement that God made with respect to the tower of babel

Gen11:6
And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.

is the above not a daily proof in the lives of men, any group, association that is united usually ends up achieving what they have set out to achieve!!

You're correct about the words of God at Babel being generic and that is why I wonder why we Christians seek to appropriate it exclusively to the christian experience. The episode at Babel was about fallen depraved man and God affirmed he still had enough inside him to perform wonders. Is there any wonder then that the atheists, Buddhists, etc in asia are leading the world in technological advancement today? Mankind was given the wherewithal to do things and that ability was never lost. What we lost in eden was immortality. What was cursed in eden was the earth and since our flesh is made from the earth, it will grow weak, die and decay. However as Christians, our souls are redeemed and we now have the spirit of God operating in us. We will get the incorruptible body that will never grow weak and die when Christ comes to take us home.

I agree with you on the other scriptures you quoted and i agree this one below too applies to all humans

Proverbs 10:4 KJV
He becometh poor that dealeth with a slack hand: but the hand of the diligent maketh rich.

Any diligent human being whether christian or not has the potential to make it in life unlike the way modern Christianity has made it look like only financial contributors to the church can succeed leading to superstitions about giving that holds God's children in bondage.

nannymcphee: Thanks, wonderful exposition, earnestly waiting for ur response to the answers(2posts) I provided for ur questions


Truth be told though, these are things I have believed in for a long time, it will take awhile before I readjust, but I'm up to it

I understand my sister. The Lord is your muscle and he has promised not to leave nor forsake you. Hold to that promise and continue your study in his word.

I'm working on the other posts.

nannymcphee: Do positive confessions have effects on Christians?

YES


if i might ask whats your definition of "positive confession"


Do they also have effect on non Christians


YES and NO


I dont know what you term as Positive confession, but to my understanding of this subject it is speaking forth Gods words, not in order for me to believe the word but an affirmation of what has been said concerning me as a child of God

hebrews13:5-6
Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.

so that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me




so my definition of positive confession is saying what God has said about me in his word, so based on the above verse, because he has said, i can now boldly say

how do you explain joel 3:10
Beat your plowshares into swords, and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong

whoever or whatever this situation was referring to: why should the weak say they are strong?

if i was traveling across the sea(should my boat capsize) or found myself in an inferno or robbery, as a christian i begin to speak forth

Isiah 43:2
When thou passest through the waters, I will be with thee; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow thee: when thou walkest through the fire, thou shalt not be burned; neither shall the flame kindle upon thee.

2timothy1:7
For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind



what do you think will happen, will my faith be built up or will fear well up in me?


the above is the reason i said they wont work for non-Christians because these promises weren't made for them but on the other hand, there is this generic law that seems to be working in the world/universe (this has been extensively captured on page 1 or so, napoleon hill and co on the power of positive thoughts), it is this one that will work for the non-christian

When I mentioned positive confessions, I was just looking at the opposite of the negative confessions that our brother therealmccain talked about. He gave the following examples of negative words

1. I'm no good
2. I'll never amount to anything
3. I'm barren
4. I'll never succeed in this business

The positive opposites will be

1. I'm very good
2. I'll amount to something
3. I'm fruitful not barren
4. I'll succeed in this business.

Well my sister, muttering these words alone have no effect on someone's life. If you refuse to go to school, work and get engaged in something productive, no matter how many times you confess positively, it will be an exercise in futility except of course you've veered into new thought and the metaphysical to utilize the energy in the universe to alter reality.

If you ask me if praying to God can change things, I'll say sure it can but just confessing won't change anything. My mum was shouting never never again will she enter the labour ward after my last sister. That was as negative a confession as any. Yet 5 years down the line, our last born, a boy popped out about 25 years ago. If confessions could do it, my naughty brother wouldn't be 419ing me today. If my mum didn't want another child, she should have done a good family planning or prayed (peradventure God would oblige).

Those scriptures you quoted have nothing to do with positive confessions. They're promises from God that held true whether the audience believed it, confessed it or not. Reading the scripture would boost your confidence to face the challenge and expect deliverance, not change your reality. Its the promise their in that has that capability.

The odd one is the words from prophet Joel which wasn't a promise and I'll advice that context matters a lot. Let's see it

Joel 3:9-10 KJV
Proclaim ye this among the Gentiles; Prepare war, wake up the mighty men, let all the men of war draw near; let them come up: [10] Beat your plowshares into swords, and your pruninghooks into spears: let the weak say, I am strong.

In verse 9, God had asked the men of war(soldiers) to get ready for battle. In verse 10 which you quoted, he obviously was talking to farmers hence asking them to convert their plowshares and pruning hooks into weapons. He was encouraging them to act like the soldiers and be numbered among the strong for battle. He wasn't talking about sick people confessing strength. The same way you'll encourage a lazy child to get up and be useful.

I'm glad you know of napoleon hill and his positive confession teachings. The world uses the techniques and it obviously works for them like you said but we should be honest enough to admit its not christian in origin or nature. God's promises are not subject to confessions for them to work and surely God didn't use this technique to create the universe.

nannymcphee: still on the negative confession

I'm from benin city and there are two common prefix to names here OSA(GOD) and OBA(THE OBA) and other local deities

names like igbinedion(i take refuge in edion[a local diety])

igineogun(i take refuge in ogun[a local diety])

ogunmwentin(ogun has power)

ogunkpolor(ogun is mighty)

you also have same variant but with osa(which means God) eg igbinosa or igbiniejusu(meaning i take refuge in God or jesus

now whenever anyone who bears this name is called, by answering to the call you are affirming what the name says, when a christain who professes that Jesus is lord of his life is called because he bears such name(either because thats his surname or his name or out of ignorance) whenever he answers to that name inst that confusion?

do you think his life will be straight?
James 1:8
A double minded man will be unstable in all his ways

one minute he professes that Jesus is lord of his life and the other minute he responds to his name being called which actually means "ogun has power"?

will the effect of such confusion be seen in his life?

Dear sister, for starters, that scripture you quoted has nothing to do with the issue at hand. A double minded man is a man incapable if making a firm decision because he's always caught in 2 or more alternatives. Such a person will experience instability in life. Its a moral lesson that holds true for all humans irrespective of their religious persuasion.

Coming to the matter at hand, I believe you've heard of pastor Kumuyi? He's one of the greatest pastors Nigeria has ever known and personally, I consider him the most respected. Do you know the meaning of his name?

Kumuyi in full is iku mu iyi meaning death has taken this. Do you think it has any effect on his life?

What about our Coza pastor? Biodun Fatoyinbo?

Fatoyinbo fully is ifa to oyinbo meaning the oracle of divination is equal to the white man. Do you think its the name that pushed him to try another level of grace with Ese Walters? Will the name eventually lead him to failure in life because as far as evidence of physical success go, he's a poster boy for it?

My sister, I've seen igbinosas that turned armed robbers and failures while I've seen successful igbinedions. I don't wish to offend your sensibilities or that of others but we Africans carried our fetish past and mixed it with Christianity. I have an idea of what you're talking about having spent 11 years in MFM myself. Pls let's stop gloryfying the devil. No matter how success driven your name sounds, if you refuse to work hard and smart, you'll fail in life. No amount of prayers or church going will help.

I'm surnamed after a big oracle where I come from and I grew up hearing how the name would limit me. After countless deliverances and prayers, I was advised to change the name. I was in the process when I got to studying my bible and reasoning with my brain. My younger brother of course has the same surname and if not that we look very alike, I was tempted to think he didn't share the same ancestors with me because he always succeeded in everything he did while I seemed to struggled. The difference was that he refused to allow the story behind our surname limit him while I sat in thought everyday explaining to myself why I'll always fall short because of my surname. My situation changed when I decided to change. There wasn't anything spiritual about it. It was purely psychological. I had allowed fear to cow my thought processes.

I'm Yoruba and I've seen and know plenty ogun-somethings that are very successful and live beautiful christian lives.

Pls forget the devil if you're a child of God, he doesn't count in the scheme of things.

therealMcCain: I hope this also extends to others that want to learn

pls could u explain these verses nannymcphee listed as to what they mean in life of a born again Christian

thanks

Hi my bro, before we lose track, let's recheck these scriptures you quoted earlier. One way to avoid making wrong conclusions from scripture is to look properly at the context in which words of scripture were spoken. Most of the verses you reproduced here do not mean what you thought they meant if you allow them remain in the context in which they were spoken.

proverbs 6:2
Thou art snared with the words of thy mouth, thou art taken with the words of thy mouth.

For the above scripture, you lose the context when read alone. Start from verse 1.

Proverbs 6:1-3 KJV
My son, if thou be surety for thy friend, if thou hast stricken thy hand with a stranger, [2] Thou art snared with the words of thy mouth, thou art taken with the words of thy mouth. [3] Do this now, my son, and deliver thyself, when thou art come into the hand of thy friend; go, humble thyself, and make sure thy friend.

Those 3 verses taken together make us realise its talking about standing as a guarantor or surety for someone. You snare yourself into a trap if you stand surety for somebody. The scripture you quoted has nothing to do with negative confession having a
spiritual effect on your life and destiny.

Proverbs15:4
A wholesome tongue is a tree of life: but perverseness therein is a breach in the spirit

Let's start from verse 1 again

Proverbs 15:1-4 KJV
A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger. [2] The tongue of the wise useth knowledge aright: but the mouth of fools poureth out foolishness. [3] The eyes of the Lord are in every place, beholding the evil and the good. [4] A wholesome tongue is a tree of life: but perverseness therein is a breach in the spirit.

Context shows that portion of scripture is advising us to have gracious words on our lips always. Words that promote peace, wisdom, goodwill etc. Check up the dictionary meanings of the 2 bolded key words in your quoted verse and you'll agree.

Proverbs18:21
Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

Let's start from 20

Proverbs 18:20-21 KJV
A man's belly shall be satisfied with the fruit of his mouth; and with the increase of his lips shall he be filled. [21] Death and life are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

This is the one that looks a bit like its in agreement with what you said but if you put it side by side with 1Peter 3:10 and the context in which it was spoken, you'll realise its in keeping with the overall theme of proverbs which is display of wisdom in all we do for peace and tranquility to be our reality. Avoid running your mouth to stay out of trouble and have a long peaceable life.

Proverbs 18:7
A fool's mouth is his destruction, and his lips are the snare of his soul

Let's start from 6

Proverbs 18:6-8 KJV
A fool's lips enter into contention, and his mouth calleth for strokes. [7] A fool's mouth is his destruction, and his lips are the snare of his soul. [8] The words of a talebearer are as wounds, and they go down into the innermost parts of the belly.

Context shows it's warning against foolish talking that lands us in trouble with seniors or those in authority. It warns against tale bearing which injure people and their feelings. A man who can't control his mouth is a fool who would sooner destroy and land himself in trouble

James3:4-5
Behold also the ships, which though they be so great, and are driven of fierce winds, yet are they turned about with a very small helm, whithersoever the governor listeth.
Even so the tongue is a little member, and boasteth great things. Behold, how great a matter a little fire kindleth!

Let's start from verse 2

James 3:2 KJV
For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

From the above, its clear the apostle was talking of controlling our tongue to avoid offending others and if you read it further into verse 3 which you quoted, to avoid using our tongue start issues, quarells etc that could rage like fire. The apostle is warning against the use of the tongue that leads to problems, infractions etc for example backbiting and tale bearing. The summary is not to offend people, curse people or start a matter that can rage like a fire.

James 1:26
If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

The above is very self explanatory and I believe it led to the statements in chapter 3. If you can't control your tongue from letting dirty words out, how do you show you're saved? It's another encouragement to sanctified talking.

1peter3:10
For he that will love life, and see good days, let him refrain his tongue from evil, and his lips that they speak no guile:

The keyword there is guile. See how the dictionary defines guile

: the use of clever and usually dishonest methods to achieve something

The advice there is that if you want to live long, avoid deceitful and cunning words coming out of your lips. Refrain your tongue from this evil. It has nothing to do with negative words having spiritual power over your life or destiny.

Negative speaking or confession isn't edifying to a christian but elevating it to having powers that it doesn't have belongs in the realm of the metaphysical. It isn't Christian. The counsel of God is independent of our thoughts. God isn't limited by our words.

therealMcCain: I think I'll go with McPhee's response but let me add

Number13:31-33
31 But the men that went up with him said, We be not able to go up against the people; for they are stronger than we.
32 And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, The land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature.
33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight

I believe it was called an evil report because it was contrary to what God had said?

how is it different from a Christian who speaks contrary to what God has said? Are there no consequences?

Job22:22-30
23 If thou return to the Almighty, thou shalt be built up, thou shalt put away iniquity far from thy tabernacles.
24 Then shalt thou lay up gold as dust, and the gold of Ophir as the stones of the brooks.
25 Yea, the Almighty shall be thy defence, and thou shalt have plenty of silver.
26 For then shalt thou have thy delight in the Almighty, and shalt lift up thy face unto God.
27 Thou shalt make thy prayer unto him, and he shall hear thee, and thou shalt pay thy vows.
28 Thou shalt also decree a thing, and it shall be established unto thee:and the light shall shine upon thy ways.
29 When men are cast down, then thou shalt say,There is lifting up and he shall save the humble person.
30 He shall deliver the island of the innocent: and it is delivered by the pureness of thine hands

Vs 29, when men are cast down, pls why should I say there is lifting up? Shouldn't I join them?

vs28 do u believe that can apply to a Christian?

Do u believe the Christian has power?
Do u believe the Christian words can be backed with power?

if yes, why then is it difficult to also believe that the Christian that speaks negatively will also get the results of those words

If no, I rest my case

Hebrew6:17
And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God

A sword is used to cut, how do I use the word which is the sword to cut?

If I then speak contrary to the word which is the sword, are u of the opinion that there will be no consequences?

Thanks for your reply my bro. This would be long but bear with me. Pls see the scriptures below

1 Samuel 24:14 KJV
After whom is the king of Israel come out? after whom dost thou pursue? after a dead dog, after a flea.

1 Samuel 26:20 KJV
Now therefore, let not my blood fall to the earth before the face of the Lord : for the king of Israel is come out to seek a flea, as when one doth hunt a partridge in the mountains.

In the above scriptures, David uttered some demeaning words about himself that I won't be caught dead muttering. He referred to himself as a dead dog and a flea. Do you think those words had any effect on his life? Of course they didn't because David is still the greatest king Israel ever had and I'm sure you know about Christ being hailed as the son of David. The negative words of David would have affected him if he decided to live like a dead dog or a flea. He accessed himself against Saul and truly, he was nothing in comparison.

You referenced the evil report of the spies but do you know it wasn't the evil report that finished them? It was the fact that they allowed the report to weaken their resolve. They were right those guys were intimidating but forgetting they had a God who was mighty in battle was their undoing. God didn't get angry with them for recognising they had big battles to fight, God got angry because they decided to go back to Egypt!! Even with Moses and Aaron falling on their faces before them in obvious plea.

Numbers 14:3-5 KJV
And wherefore hath the Lord brought us unto this land, to fall by the sword, that our wives and our children should be a prey? were it not better for us to return into Egypt? [4] And they said one to another, Let us make a captain, and let us return into Egypt. [5] Then Moses and Aaron fell on their faces before all the assembly of the congregation of the children of Israel.

Joshua and Caleb tried reasoning with the congregation to encourage them and if they had listened, of course it would have been happy ever after but what did they get?

Numbers 14:10a KJV
But all the congregation bade stone them with stones......

It was at this point God came in.

Numbers 14:10b-11 KJV
........And the glory of the Lord appeared in the tabernacle of the congregation before all the children of Israel. [11] And the Lord said unto Moses, How long will this people provoke me? and how long will it be ere they believe me, for all the signs which I have shewed among them?

Even after the evil report, if only they had listened to the pleas of Moses, Aaron, Joshua and Caleb, it would have been alright but they decided to go back. They looked back like Lot's wife and that ended whatever chance they had. Also remember this was the old testament. Now we are even under better conditions than them. See what a whole Paul said of himself

Romans 7:24 KJV
O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

He called himself a wretched man, do you think it had an effect on his life? See another

2 Timothy 4:20 KJV
Erastus abode at Corinth: but Trophimus have I left at Miletum sick.

Was he confessing negatively about trophimus or he was being honest about the condition of his friend? Do you think his words would increase the sickness of his friend? See Christ too

Luke 17:10 KJV
So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.

Was Christ encouraging negative confession by asking his disciples to refer to themselves as unprofitable servants?

I do not subscribe to negativity but it is a lazy and fearful man that blames his life's woes on some words he uttered.. What we should guard against is becoming despondent about our condition or lot in life that we refuse to take concrete steps to make a change.

Concerning Job 22:22-30 which you quoted, remember God didn't utter those words neither did Job. Eliphaz, one of Job's 3 friends, spoke there but see what God concluded about him and the other 2

Job 42:7-8 KJV
And it was so , that after the Lord had spoken these words unto Job, the Lord said to Eliphaz the Temanite, My wrath is kindled against thee, and against thy two friends: for ye have not spoken of me the thing that is right, as my servant Job hath . [8] Therefore take unto you now seven bullocks and seven rams, and go to my servant Job, and offer up for yourselves a burnt offering; and my servant Job shall pray for you: for him will I accept: lest I deal with you after your folly, in that ye have not spoken of me the thing which is right, like my servant Job.

They were not correct in their analysis of Job's situation and God's nature. Therefore that portion of scripture you quoted is in the bible but the speaker wasn't true in his submissions. That's what God concluded and I think we should agree with God.

In the new testament, we are enjoined to ask, not make decrees. If there's any scripture in the new testament supporting what Eliphaz said in Job 22:28, pls show me.

Cheers bro

ayoku777: Lol

I can relate too. Almost every christian who got born again around the 80s and 90s believed and practised this style of christianity to one degree or the other, for a while.

Mine was even worse, you didn't even need to perm your hair to be a sinner, you only needed to be beautiful. To me, every beautiful girl was a queen of the coast -whatever that means.

I remember one day in secondary school when I trekked the very long distance back home from school. I refused to take our school bus home coz they were playing a "worldly song" in the bus. Guess the song? I believe I can fly by R. Kelly. Lol, it was that bad.

But I must also admit, after God delivered me from that form of extreme legalism, I drifted to the other extreme -extreme liberalism.

I practised licentious grace for a while as well. I believed that no matter what you do wrong, God doesn't see it, coz you're robed in Christ's righteousness. That was another reckless phase of my christian walk.

Some of my old friends who knew my strict "holiness" in secondary school will try to talk to me, but I wouldn't listen. And they could not out-debate me, coz I knew the word -or should I say the letter.

Until I came under strong conviction and true repentance by the Holy Spirit.

With hind-sight now, I can say both extremes were wrong and don't truly or fully represent Christ or His gospel truth. Truth is usually (not always) found somewhere in between two doctrinal extremes.

My experience with God and His people have humbled me. That's why now I love to listen to other believers, even ones who disagree with me. Coz I now realise that even though they may not have THE TRUTH, they may have A TRUTH. And even though they may not make me cross over to their own extreme, they may deliver me from my own extreme.

Yeah my bro. I agree with you. Which is why my two guiding scriptures on this issue are below.

To check legalism

Galatians 5:1 KJV
Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

To check licentiousness disguised as grace

Galatians 5:13 KJV
For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

My belief has always been that the body of Christ is made up of believers from very different backgrounds. No denomination has the exclusive right or claim to truth. There'll be more harmony if we all realise this

alentyno: From what av deduced so far not just from what the op but the confirmation of alex and candour above makes me wonder why the catholic church is so so so criticized by pentecostals
Imagine telling someone it Is a sin to take pills...smh
No wonder the devil is succeedingly converting many people to atheism. There is just so much division in christianity!

Of course the pentecostals are as guilty as the roman catholics. There is no perfect church organisation anywhere. What remains true is the body of Christ and it has as members all who believe and accept the finished work of Christ irrespective of the name on the building where they congregate to worship God.

Christians need to be honest with themselves. Only then can we help ourselves make the necessary corrections that would make the church a beacon of light that it was meant to be. Our denominations are not perfect. It won't hurt to admit to this fact and make amends.

alexleo: You are right but that was an individual assumption among old members in those days when we were still growing up but in this our time, people of our generation have done away with such nonsense believe. (Tho its still very annoying when we hear some oldies make such statements in our time). Well, we can't do much to change them totally at this time of their lives since that is the mentality they ve had for decades now. Honestly it annoys me when they say it. It was a hectic task before I could get my parents to do away with such wrong notion.

I love your honesty alexleo. Your post here is very candid. This was the mentality I had too as a child growing up in deeperlife. We believed only deeperlife and apostolic faith folks were true Christians. In fact my elder sister who had rebelled and had started attending faith foundation church was despised by me as fit only for hell for having the audacity to perm her hair.

Like you opined, the mentality is changing among the new generation but public perception of these 2 churches will be difficult to change. Just as the oldies are rigid with their beliefs, so the public is rigid in their perception.

I don't know how true this is but I don't see anything wrong in Kumuyi trying to follow peace with all men(as the scripture instructed) by reaching out to a church he was part of before, especially if they had some frictions before he left. I think there was a time in the scripture that paul had to reconcile with an apostle or so. But I can tell you that the Apostolic Faith has a good relationship with Kumuyi.

I see nothing wrong too if Kumuyi decided of his own to restitute whatever. Maybe its the type of restitution or the content that troubled frosbel. We might never know.

This is just perculiar to the church in Nigeria. I think it just has to do with how they want church workers to appear. They just want a clean shave. They are not saying its a sin if you don't shave.

Actually, these type of lifestyles slowly become doctrine for members. I remember it took a Tuesday bible study tape by Kumuyi in 1989 or 1990 (cant remember for sure) to help us realise it wasn't a sin for a woman to leave her hair open in public. Folks saw Biodun Kumuyi's lifestyle and converted it to heavenly requirement. In fact when Kumuyi encouraged women to allow their hair get aerated when they're outside church, the auditorium erupted in applause and you could almost touch the relief all the women felt.

Let me state that most of the things you wrote about the church is perculiar to Nigeria branch and some west african countries too. The oyibo men that started the church are not as rigid as us here. Some other things you wrote are perculiar to our ibadan branch which is one of the most rigid branch. Some branches are much freer than the others depending on the level of exposure of their various leaders.
I ll respond to the other issues you raised in my next post. Thanks.

Yeah, some branches make it more difficult than others.on the issue of drugs, my MIL former colleague (AF member)almost died when she refused to take drugs to normalise her BP. I even think it was a stroke that brought her to her senses. She believed it was a sin to seek such help.

That said, no single church is perfect (though some are outrightly criminal). We all can only try as long as we are in this body of flesh and as such, church leaders need to learn to allow their members exercise liberty of the spirit to live their lives.

Godbless you once again alexleo for your honesty.

Deuteronomy 14:22-26 KJV
Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year. [23] And thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the Lord thy God always. [24] And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the Lord thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the Lord thy God hath blessed thee: [25] Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the Lord thy God shall choose: [26] And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the Lord thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household,

Ecclesiastes 10:19 KJV
A feast is made for laughter, and wine maketh merry: but money answereth all things .

1 Timothy 5:23 KJV
Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.

But read this too and take caution

Proverbs 20:1 KJV
Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.

Proverbs 23:29-30 KJV
Who hath woe? who hath sorrow? who hath contentions? who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? [30] They that tarry long at the wine; they that go to seek mixed wine.

nannymcphee: Thanks for the invite, count me in

Thanks sister, I still believe however that the discussion will be better suited for the end of this presentation so as not to stop the flow of this thread. It will be a discussion where we get to look at it from each other's perspective.

Also I would want to wet your appetite and that of therealMcCain by adding to his original focus. He wanted to know

If negative confessions, statements e.g I'm barren, I'm a failure etc have effects on Christians based on the scriptures you quoted.

I'll add the following

Do negative confessions have effects on non Christians?

Do positive confessions have effects on Christians? Do they also have effect on non Christians

Does it matter that those God spoke about at Babel where immoral pagans? Or simply because the episode is in the bible, we can appropriate it as Christians?

Its a discussion brethren. Pls think about them and let's discuss them together.

Cheers

therealMcCain: pls i have stated it that my intention is to learn, so pls address my question from the angle of a christian wanting to know the meaning/application of those verses in his or her life. disregard the wof stand or any other impression you have of me

this is me asking you brother drummaboy, please what do these verses mean?

thanks

Hi bro, would you mind if I offer to discuss your question and share some insight with you? Also I wouldn't want to usurp the position of the lead discussants or derail the thread so would you accept if we can schedule our discourse till after the presentation?

I'm a learner too and believe we could sharpen each other's spiritual knowledge and christian life.

@nannymcphee, sister, pls you're included in my offer to our brother

Cheers

DrummaBoy: Truth is that subjects like sabbath and circumcision have greater argument running for them than the tithes in the bible. We need to listen to the argument of an adventist on sabbath to appreciate this.

Candour, I found your interaction with the OP of this thread on his other thread on Sabbath, I mean OLAADEGBU, very interesting. How he was able to come to the conclusion on sabbath but could not make the same for tithes, beats me.

I don't know, but do we realize that it was a bondage to the sabbath that Jesus contended the pharisees with; while Paul contended the religious leaders of his day on circumcision? Why do we then find it surprising that Satan would ruse up another Jewish religious practice to blind God's people from true devotion to God like he did in the past?

There are no new tricks in the devil's bag.

Actually, tithe for christians is the easiest to debunk among the three for the simple fact that it was a specific people that had the privilege to receive it. I've heard some new arguments on NL that the apostles didn't request tithes from the early church because that church gave up all they had. That is a lie and could only have emanated from an ignorant person or the heart of a thief and a criminal who benefits from tithe collections.

The Jerusalem church was birthed when the temple and its levitical functions were still in full swing. How can any honest human being claim that the exclusive preserve of the levites and priests would be usurped by the apostles and there wouldn't be dire repercussions? Woe betide any apostle that was criminal enough to mention payment of tithes to the early Christians, the Jews around would have stoned him to death.

It was bad enough that they were preaching a gospel that usurped the authority of the religious rulers of the day, they'll now be corrupt and bold enough to appropriate the source of sustenance of the corrupt and vindictive priests? Those cruel people would have ensured that whoever tried it paid with his life. Its like a Jew loathed in Hitler's Germany now trying to steal from a German, what do you think would have been his fate? When even honest Jews were being gassed to death? Any wonder then that it only crept into the christian church over 700 years after the destruction of the temple and dispersal of Jews and their priesthood from Jerusalem?

Whether the Jerusalem church gave 100% or 0%, the apostles had no right in heaven or on earth to ask tithes from the flock. If they did, death was sure and I'm sure God would ask them to tell when he gave them that right and privilege. They preached freewill giving. Simple and short.

We see king Hezekiah come in with reforms because Israel had abandoned the law of Moses (including tithing). He gave them no new tithe laws but commanded them to go back to obeying the law of tithing which Moses gave and which I reproduced in the previous posts.

2 Chronicles 31:5-7 KJV
And as soon as the commandment came abroad, the children of Israel brought in abundance the firstfruits of corn, wine, and oil, and honey, and of all the increase of the field; and the tithe of all things brought they in abundantly. [6] And concerning the children of Israel and Judah, that dwelt in the cities of Judah, they also brought in the tithe of oxen and sheep, and the tithe of holy things which were consecrated unto the Lord their God, and laid them by heaps. [7] In the third month they began to lay the foundation of the heaps, and finished them in the seventh month.

We see Hezekiah command storehouses to be made in the temple for purpose of storing the tithes and other things that had been offered to God. This is the same storehouse Malachi mentioned.

2 Chronicles 31:11-12 KJV
Then Hezekiah commanded to prepare chambers in the house of the Lord ; and they prepared them , [12] And brought in the offerings and the tithes and the dedicated things faithfully: over which Cononiah the Levite was ruler, and Shimei his brother was the next.

After the Israelites came back from a 70yr captivity in Babylon, the people had forgotten much of the law including that of tithes so Nehemiah reminded them and they obeyed. Note the difference in the tithes to the levites and the tithe of tithes to the priest which was taken into the storehouse mentioned by Malachi.

Nehemiah 10:37-38 KJV
And that we should bring the firstfruits of our dough, and our offerings, and the fruit of all manner of trees, of wine and of oil, unto the priests, to the chambers of the house of our God; and the tithes of our ground unto the Levites, that the same Levites might have the tithes in all the cities of our tillage. [38] And the priest the son of Aaron shall be with the Levites, when the Levites take tithes: and the Levites shall bring up the tithe of the tithes unto the house of our God, to the chambers, into the treasure house.

And here too

Nehemiah 12:44 KJV
And at that time were some appointed over the chambers for the treasures, for the offerings, for the firstfruits, and for the tithes, to gather into them out of the fields of the cities the portions of the law for the priests and Levites: for Judah rejoiced for the priests and for the Levites that waited.

And here too. Note that its still strictly agric produce

Nehemiah 13:5, 12 KJV
And he had prepared for him a great chamber, where aforetime they laid the meat offerings, the frankincense, and the vessels, and the tithes of the corn, the new wine, and the oil, which was commanded to be given to the Levites, and the singers, and the porters; and the offerings of the priests. [12] Then brought all Judah the tithe of the corn and the new wine and the oil unto the treasuries.

Going on to Amos, we see another mention of the third year tithe in his castigation of the false piety of Isreal. Something which the lord also did in the new testament.

Amos 4:4 KJV
Come to Beth-el, and transgress; at Gilgal multiply transgression; and bring your sacrifices every morning, and your tithes after three years:

When last did you hear a message on these portions of scripture from the pulpit?

As can be seen from Hezekiah command and Nehemiah's actions, the storehouse was a place situated in the temple of Solomon at Jerusalem for the purpose of storing hallowed items including tithes. Every believer knows he's now the temple of God, so what's all the noise about Malachi and the storehouse if the believer is now the temple where God dwells?

We see God ask the israelites to tithe the increase of their farm and animal produce. If any Israelite was involved in any of these trades, then they had to obey this injunction. The command was for them to EAT their tithe at a feast at the temple.

Deuteronomy 14:22-23 KJV
Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year. [23] And thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the Lord thy God always.

If the temple was too far to carry the tithe of that years increase, then and only then could they monetise it on the condition that they buy back edibles when they got to the holy city. The tithe was strictly for eating. Nothing more, nothing less.

Deuteronomy 14:24-26 KJV
And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the Lord thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the Lord thy God hath blessed thee: [25] Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the Lord thy God shall choose: [26] And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the Lord thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household,

Every three years, ALL THE TITHES of that year (including the one tithe merchants have cunningly appropriated to themselves) were to be strored in the towns by the tither and used purely for the purposes of charity. If they didn't do this, obviously God would withhold his blessings from them according to the bolded portion.

Deuteronomy 14:28-29 KJV
At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates: [29] And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the Lord thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest.

We see God repeat the instruction of this third year tithe to the Jews and it could only be because it was extremely important to him. ALL THE TITHES OF THE THIRD YEAR WAS FOR THE LESS PRIVILEGED.

Deuteronomy 26:12 KJV
When thou hast made an end of tithing all the tithes of thine increase the third year, which is the year of tithing, and hast given it unto the Levite, the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, that they may eat within thy gates, and be filled;

It was so important that they could use it to remind God of his promises and even ask for more

Deuteronomy 26:13-15 KJV
Then thou shalt say before the Lord thy God, I have brought away the hallowed things out of mine house, and also have given them unto the Levite, and unto the stranger, to the fatherless, and to the widow, according to all thy commandments which thou hast commanded me: I have not transgressed thy commandments, neither have I forgotten them : [14] I have not eaten thereof in my mourning, neither have I taken away ought thereof for any unclean use , nor given ought thereof for the dead: but I have hearkened to the voice of the Lord my God, and have done according to all that thou hast commanded me. [15] Look down from thy holy habitation, from heaven, and bless thy people Israel, and the land which thou hast given us, as thou swarest unto our fathers, a land that floweth with milk and honey.

When last did you hear a sermon on these portions of scripture from your pulpits? Don't you think its beautiful when we allow the bible speak for itself?

You know Malachi doesn't have the monopoly of blessings associated with tithes so why don't pastors preach the third year tithe like they do the Malachi tithe which they've even twisted out of shape? Is it that they don't want their members to get the blessings of this third year tithe? Is it not robbery to deny the poor of this third year tithe? Is it not disobedience to the clear commandments of God to ignore the third year tithe?

I leave you to think and decide while I post some more

Some verses in the bible having something to do with tithes

Genesis 14:20 KJV
And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all.

The below tell us what Abraham tithed from. No ambiguity.

Hebrews 7:4 KJV
Now consider how great this man was , unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.

Below is the second place in scripture where we encounter tithe even if it was simply called a tenth. Jacob made a vow to give a tenth to God if God fulfills a request he made. He was obeying no law because no law was given. He made a voluntary vow which wasn't binding on even his immediate children. It was a strictly personal decision.

Genesis 28:20-22 KJV
And Jacob vowed a vow, saying, If God will be with me, and will keep me in this way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and raiment to put on, [21] So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the Lord be my God: [22] And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee.

Here's the third place where tithe was mentioned and we see it made an inviolable law for Isreal and clearly from farm and animal produce.

Leviticus 27:30-34 KJV
And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's : it is holy unto the Lord . [31] And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, he shall add thereto the fifth part thereof. [32] And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the Lord . [33] He shall not search whether it be good or bad, neither shall he change it: and if he change it at all, then both it and the change thereof shall be holy; it shall not be redeemed. [34] These are the commandments, which the Lord commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai.

Below is the fourth place tithe is mentioned in scripture and we see God transfer the tithes to the levites who had the sacred charge of the temple and served the Aaronic priesthood. The caveat: relinquishing their rights to any inheritance in Isreal

Numbers 18:24 KJV
But the tithes of the children of Israel, which they offer as an heave offering unto the Lord , I have given to the Levites to inherit: therefore I have said unto them, Among the children of Israel they shall have no inheritance.

Below God further shared the tithes between the levites and the priests. The priests (Aaron and his descendants) got a tenth of the tithes while the levites kept nine-tenth of the tithe

Numbers 18:26-28 KJV
Thus speak unto the Levites, and say unto them, When ye take of the children of Israel the tithes which I have given you from them for your inheritance, then ye shall offer up an heave offering of it for the Lord , even a tenth part of the tithe. [27] And this your heave offering shall be reckoned unto you, as though it were the corn of the threshingfloor, and as the fulness of the winepress. [28] Thus ye also shall offer an heave offering unto the Lord of all your tithes, which ye receive of the children of Israel; and ye shall give thereof the Lord's heave offering to Aaron the priest.

We see another mention of tithes below where the Israelites are clearly asked to bring their tithes, burnt offerings etc to eat before the Lord (obviously at the temple in Jerusalem). Once again clearly edibles.

Deuteronomy 12:6-7 KJV
And thither ye shall bring your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, and your tithes, and heave offerings of your hand, and your vows, and your freewill offerings, and the firstlings of your herds and of your flocks: [7] And there ye shall eat before the Lord your God, and ye shall rejoice in all that ye put your hand unto, ye and your households, wherein the Lord thy God hath blessed thee.

In the same chapter as above, we see God continue with instructions on the tithe to the Israelites. We see him command that they MUST eat their tithes in the place designated. Once again clearly food items.

Deuteronomy 12:11-12, 17-18 KJV
Then there shall be a place which the Lord your God shall choose to cause his name to dwell there; thither shall ye bring all that I command you; your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, your tithes, and the heave offering of your hand, and all your choice vows which ye vow unto the Lord : [12] And ye shall rejoice before the Lord your God, ye, and your sons, and your daughters, and your menservants, and your maidservants, and the Levite that is within your gates; forasmuch as he hath no part nor inheritance with you. [17] Thou mayest not eat within thy gates the tithe of thy corn, or of thy wine, or of thy oil, or the firstlings of thy herds or of thy flock, nor any of thy vows which thou vowest, nor thy freewill offerings, or heave offering of thine hand: [18] But thou must eat them before the Lord thy God in the place which the Lord thy God shall choose, thou, and thy son, and thy daughter, and thy manservant, and thy maidservant, and the Levite that is within thy gates: and thou shalt rejoice before the Lord thy God in all that thou puttest thine hands unto.

When last did you hear a message from these portions of scripture in your church?

striktlymi: I thank everyone for the nomination. Though I would have preferred we keep to the time line (8a.m) already decided on but since I have the said number of nominations, I accept and confirm it tentatively.

If someone else gets a higher number of nominations before 8a.m then I would have no choice but to step down for the individual. The others can go ahead and pick their topics. I don't have an issue with it.

I nominate striktlymi