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But why would i comply to a negro gentile request to use an ambiguous name from a foreign language which even the gentile do not know and he has to circumlocute profusely when asked how his fellow gentiles view that name.

WHξξ∟s:
The Quran distinguish btwn Ilah & Allah[Surah at tur 43], both Ubangiji & Chineke refer to Ilah which can be a god or God but the word in the Quran Allah is the appropriate word denoting His name. Many Muslims strive to unsterstand Islam arming themselves with knowledge of both the Arabic text & its meaning/translation, but Hebrew knowledge was rare amongst the gentile, it is possible my friend desika do not know AKBAR in hebrew but Many 9ja Muslims are fluent in Arabic & those Muslims prefer to use Allah, a Hausa man doesnt recognise Ubangiji as a name to the supreme God cos he knows the Quran & he is fully convinced that Allah is the appropriate name.



I will end up making things worse to myself, if you can hold a koboko and ask me to say Akbar in Hebrew, unless the holy spirit intervened i wont be able to, but Alhamdulillah, English & Arabic are foreign to me but this task wont be huge.



Chaii, Dj desika, this one no be disco hall oo. Use paraphrase next time. Lemme give an example of remixing, Dj moses in exodus say God gave his name as He is/i am, Dj jesus in matt call him [b]Ela/Eloi/Eli], my negro gentiles use Jehovah, adonai,yhwh,jhvh,ehyeh,yehvah, yahuwa e.t.c but the original track is THE SUPREME GOD.



Why wouldn't i? I will be a cornered mouse if i try to rebel, Ubangiji is same as Ilah, i wont object to use Allah since i am a Muslim & the Quran deliniate his name vividly. But why would i comply to a negro gentile request to use an ambiguous name from a foreign language which even the gentile do not know and he has to circumlocute profusely when asked how his fellow gentiles view that name.

Your folks say no Elohim but Yahweh, Muslims say there is no Ilah but Allah. Elohim & Ilah stands for god, the jews call the supreme God Yahweh while the muslims call him Allah. A non Muslim Arab & a Muslim Jew knows it is a name of their Ilah or Elohim. MY POSITION IS, I THINK THEY ARE BOTH RIGHT since they rely on the scripture. But if a gentile negro can object as you do i will just let him be.

So i concur with your arabic scholars who agree to translate Yahweh as Allah not Ilah

i then went on to say wil u agree to use Yahweh in ur prayers, write ups, only for one week. (if u use Yahweh u wud not be refering to another God). #its just to prove that deep inside u, u agree to wat u r saying.

The likeness of your request is like that of an Igbo man who ask a non Igbo speaking Hausa to use Chineke instead of Ubangiji in the North.. Irrational, isnt it?

Chaii, Dj desika, this one no be disco hall oo. Use paraphrase next time. Lemme give an example of remixing, Dj moses in exodus say God gave his name as He is/i am , Dj jesus in matt call him [b]Ela/Eloi/Eli], my negro gentiles use Jehovah, adonai,yhwh,jhvh,ehyeh,yehvah, yahuwa e.t.c but the original track is THE SUPREME GOD.

italo: So the body of Jesus Christ can be confused about its head - Jesus himself? For some "Christians" say Jesus is God, other "Christians" say he is man. Is it possible for the body of Christ to teach millions of contradictory doctrines as we have among "christians" today?

Chukskalidon: Okay, it was written in d bible dat every one shall call mary blessed. Seeing ur position wit d bible hav u and ur pentecostal brodas and pastors fulfilled dat or Was it nt in d bible? Have for a day called her blessed.

italo: Seeing the important position that "the Bible" takes in your creed, should the Bible not have been mentioned at least once?

Mary is alive. Jesus said "he who believes in me will never die." That is why Jesus resurrected, so that we who live and believe in him will resurrect too.

But the Holy Spirit gave her a special status when he filled Elizabeth to say "blessed are you among women." Who is Jesus and Who is The Holy Spirit? The same God.

And, like you rightly pointed out, Jesus - God has a mother. Her name is Mary.

It wasnt Catholics that made it so, it was God.

italo: How do you know that we were not told to ask for Mary's intercession, seeing that there are teachings that are not written in the Bible?

italo: 2 Thess 2:15:So then, brothers and sisters, stand firm and hold fast to the traditions we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter.

This shows that not every teaching that Christians should hold on to is in the Bible. The question for you is, do you obey St Paul? Do you stand firm and hold fast to the traditions that were passed by word of mouth?

mumumugu: mediator is christ. Mary is intercesor

mumumugu: is what christ asked us to do written only in bible?

LagosShia: "Jehovah"/"Yahweh" is a pressumption from the tetgrammaton or "four letters" (YHWH) by injecting vowels.those
four letters are not articulated.also,if you search deep you will
know that the tetgrammaton (YHWH) is not a word but an adjective phrase refering/describing the uniqueness to/of the One
Almighty God who is Unseen.YHWH refers to "He that is Present"
or "Oh He (who is)" in literal arabic and hebrew.the
tetragrammaton can also be found in the Holy Quran in several
places by the phrase "Qul HoWaH Allahu" which means "Say He is Allahu"!
the prefix, "YA" is an exclamation in semitic languages meaning "Oh".if you add "Ya" to "HoWaH" it becomes "YaHoWaH" (YHWH). "HoWaH"="He is"! so YaHoWah = "Oh He (who is)". what hapens is simply injecting vowels into the letters (YHWH) in
order to make the letters pronounceable

if Allah (arabic) is same as Yahweh(hebrew) u guys should be able to
pronounce them alongside or interchangeably without stress [a situation where u cant do this means that they are not the same]d
proof is on u guys. just prove it

f you cant do this, then in yur subconsious mind both words are not
same meaning that both Gods are not the same.
therefore no muslim should say Yahweh is the same as Allah. no
muslim should say the prophet Jesus, Moses and the rest worshiped
Allah by prostrating or facing their jewish temple in prayers to
Yahweh. #the ball is in your court

WHξξ∟s:
Muslims use Allah while referring to God Almighty, a perfect word generally accepted by us, unlike the tetragrammaton that upto these days some xtians pronounce differently, when the Holy Quran addresses an account vividly i wont rebel to accept an ambiguous tale, just let the Hebrews hebrew their God my gentile friend.



The likeness of your request is like that of an Igbo man who ask a non Igbo speaking Hausa to use Chineke instead of Ubangiji in the North.. Irrational, isnt it?

LagosShia: ^
I have made two posts in this thread already,and this is my third.and in this you should know i'm not running away and didn't run away from your "comforter" thread.these are old topics that have been discussed previously.they are now boring and a waste of time when discussed with someone who's arguing over nothing! i have convincingly to the best of my knowledge contributed in your threads.if you like what ive said,good.if you don't like my contributions,then suit yourself.those with sound minds will read and understand what ive already said.

Salam,Shalom,Peace!!!

PS: you can ask also if "shalom" and "salam" refers to the samething.

LagosShia: we cannot use "Yahweh" at all because "Yahweh" is the speculative name used by Christians referring to God,and derived from the Tetragrammaton (YHWH)

.the Jehovah's witnesses have rendered the four letters (YHWH) into a different pronunciation in every language and attributed it as the correct form in referring to God.in Arabic Jehovah's witnesses call Him "yahwah".in Japanese,its "ehoba".in English its "Jehovah".so which is correct? which is the one Jesus (as) used? God has a name in every language based on the tetragrammaton for Jehovah's witnesses.

we as muslims thank God that the name we use is clearly spelled out in the Quran as "Allah",from the same root word that Jesus (as) is recorded to have called God: Elah.

here is the confession of a Jehovah's witness after debate with him:



if Jesus (as) used the word "Elah",and the word have the same root as "Al-Lah",then why do you insist on using what is doubtful and you are not sure of? where did Jesus (as) pronounce God's name as "Jehovah" or "Yahweh"? in fact not once does the tetragrammaton appear in the New Testament.did God forget to include His name in the new testament? to this fact,when you go through the New World Translation of the Bible,which is the official version used by Jehovah's witnesses,you see that in the new testament they have replaced anywhere "lord" appears with "Jehovah".

so try and drop this your meaningless and boring topic.this is no sense and cannot help your situation either.it will only cause you more harm than good,and you'd surely end up envying the muslims.anywhere you go in the world,the muslims refer to God as "Allah".but Jehovah's witnesses alone have over a hundred word derived from the tetragrammaton to refer to God.

LagosShia: @Ayomivic

please stop regurgitating the same topics which you previously have opened threads on.i don't think people have the time to keep explaining the same thing over and over.and I don't really care whether you think "Yahweh" and Allah (swt) are the same God.if they are not the same then "Yahweh" is not Allah (swt),and to us Allah (swt) refers to the Unseen Almighty Creator of all,who is One and Unique without a son or partner,and without a beginning and an end.

this is the thread you previously started:

"Christians God (yaweh) ,is He The Same With Muslims Allah?"
https://www.nairaland.com/993524/christians-god-yaweh-he-same

WHξξ∟s:
Ilah was used when translating Elohim & Allah was used while refering to Yahweh, Something your scholars prefer, maybe presenting your stand on this might likely convince them to correct this error. Arabs & Hebrews doesn't use g or G that is why the unique Ilah /elohim is called Allah/Yahweh.



Your folks say no Elohim but Yahweh, Muslims say there is no Ilah but Allah. Elohim & Ilah stands for god, the jews call the supreme God Yahweh while the muslims call him Allah. A non Muslim Arab & a Muslim Jew knows it is a name of their Ilah or Elohim. My position is, i think they are both right since they rely on the scripture. But if a gentile negro can object as you do i will just let him be.



The Quran teaches who Allah was in Surah Ikhlas & numerous ayas conveyed same theme regarding his uniqueness which some verses in your bible also agree with denoting his oneness. So i concur with your arabic scholars who agree to translate Yahweh as Allah not Ilah. A hebrew who embraces Islam would glorify his Rabb[surah A'ala: 1] in his dialect if he wishes, no problem with that.

alexleo: Drop all those emotional displays. Lets face bible. If you are serving God based on condition, i.e. to say that if you agree in eternal torment it means God is wicked and should not be served, then you need to check your christianity. For me, I am not serving God on conditionalities. ETERNAL TORMENT OR NOT, I WILL SERVE GOD. ETERNAL TORMENT OR NOT, GOD IS NEVER WICKED IN MY VIEW. Its just like when i hear some of this penticostals give testimonies that they refused to serve God because they believe they ll be wretched when serving him but when they saw those who are serving him doing well they now accepted Christ. IS THAT THE BEST? TOO BAD. Serving God on conditionalities is NOT IT O MY DEAR. Job said in the scriptures, though he slay me, yet will i trust him. Thats the real serving God. Forget about wicked God emotions and lets talk bible.

vedaxcool: Yeah but u forgot to add he tells lies to!

vedaxcool: TRUTH has arrived and Falsehood has fled!

It is always a pleasure! One more thing, where is the holy spirit?

Did he die in the corpses of the disiciples?

¤ Food for thought, since the disciples died one after the other, the holy spirit which u call the comforter must have died in them hence failing to abide forever, once again falsifying Jesus statement twice, the first being in the same statement Jesus promises his diciples he would come back to the them (in the verse)

Wow the bible have undergone severe alteration that it makes all sort of contradictory claims!

Muhamad being the comforter has been proven clearly, Jesus says he would be a man like him, the holy spirit isn't,

u hv not yet bin able to tell me wheda Jesus and Mohamed are similar or not based on Deut 18 and John 14

the holy ghost did not bring one teaching that we can compare to Jesus, the holy spirit is not a man yet Jesus promises a man that is another of the same kind!

Fr0sbel: The Meaning of this Parable to the Jews living in the first century

The Jewish nation, (especially the Scribes and Pharisees) were about to die as a power, as a church, as a controlling influence in the world; while the common people among them, and the Gentiles, were to be exalted in the new order of things. The details of the parable shows: "There was a certain rich man clothed in purple and fine linen." In these first words, by describing their very costume, the Savior fixed attention on the Jewish priesthood. They were, emphatically, the rich men of that nation. His description of the beggar was equally graphic. He lay at the gate of the rich, only asking to be fed with the crumbs that fell from the table. Thus dependent were the common people, and the Gentiles, on the scribes and Pharisees.

We remember how Christ once rebuked them for shutting up the kingdom of heaven against those entering. They lay at the gates of the Jewish hierarchy, for the Gentiles were literally restricted to the outer court of the temple. Hence in Revelation 11:2, we read; "But the court, which is without the temple, leave out, and measure it not, for it is given unto the Gentiles." They could only stand at the outer court, or lie at the gate. The brief, graphic descriptions given by our Savior, at once showed his hearers that he was describing those two classes, the Jewish priesthood and nation, on the one hand, and the common people, Jews and Gentiles, on the other.

The rich man died and was buried. This class died officially, nationally, and its power departed. The kingdom of God was taken from them & conferred on others (Matthew 21:43). The beggar died. The Gentiles, publicans and sinners were translated into the kingdom of God's dear Son, where is neither Jew nor Greek, but where all are one in Christ Jesus (Galatians 3:28 ).

This is the meaning of "Abraham's bosom." They accepted the true faith and so became one with faithful Abraham. Abraham is called the father of the faithful, and the beggar is represented to have gone to Abraham's bosom, to denote the fact, which is now history, that the common people and Gentiles accepted Christ, enjoying the blessings of the faith.

What is meant by the torment of the rich man? The misery of those proud men, when, soon after, their land was captured, and their city and temple possessed by barbarians, and they scattered like chaff before the wind--a condition in which they have continued from that day (70 A.D.) to this. All efforts to bless them with the teachings of Christ have proved unavailing. At this very moment there is a great gulf fixed so that there is no passing to and fro. And observe, the Jews do not desire the gospel. Nor did the rich man ask to enter Abraham's bosom with Lazarus. He only wished Lazarus to alleviate his sufferings by dipping his finger in water and cooling his tongue. It is so with the Jews today. They do not desire the gospel; they only ask those among whom they sojourn to tolerate them and soften the hardships that accompany their wanderings.

The Jewish church and nation are now dead. Once they were exalted to heaven, but now they are thrust down to Hades, the kingdom of death. Jesus knew the Pharisees believed this and used it in a parable. Of the Pharisees, Josephus says: "They also believe that souls have an immortal vigor in them, and that, under the earth, there will be rewards and punishments, according as they lived virtuously or viciously in this life; and the latter are to be detained in an everlasting prison, but that the former shall have power to revive and live again." (Antiquities, B. 18,Ch. 1, ß3. Whiston's Tr.).

The Lessons for us that Jesus was seeking to teach in this Parable


In this life is the time when decisions for salvation are irrevocably made. There will be no future opportunity to change.

A contrast is being drawn between those who, in this life, make wealth their dependence and the poor who have depended upon Christ. A man's value is not in his possessions; for all that he has belongs to him only as lent by the Lord. A misuse of these gifts will place him below the poorest and most afflicted man who loves God and trusts in Him.

The law and the prophets are God's appointed agencies for the salvation of men. Christ was telling His hearers to give heed to these evidences. If they do not listen to the voice of God in His Word, the testimony of a witness raised from the dead would not be heeded. This literally happened in the resurrection of Lazarus, just shortly before Christ's death. (See John 11.) Those who had rejected previous evidence as to His messiahship were so hardened, however, by their rejection of the evidence already available to them, that this crowning miracle of Jesus' ministry did not change their course toward Him.


Conclusion

Clearly, this story is a parable, and doctrines cannot to be built upon parables or allegories. A parable, like other illustrations, is generally used to make clear one particular point. To try to build doctrines on every part of the story would generally result in a completely unreasonable conclusion, if not utter contradiction. Certainly, we would not expect to find in the illustration a proof for a belief the very opposite of that held by the speaker or writer of the scriptures.

http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/lazarus.html

vedaxcool: Clearly Jesus says the disciples cannot bear, twisting and swerving does not change that fact!

No apologies for falsely accusing me, and it shows clerarly u went and lift an entire quote from a website . . . Only to forget and start making. Allegation even at that . . . U simply made Another babble, keep it up! gringrin now u indicate Jesus lied that for the same comforter to come Jesus must go only to turn around and say Jesus the comforter was always around in small quantities gringrin truly this is hilarious!

Jesus the comforter was always around in small quantities

vedaxcool: like I said replace it, then recovert, it do what u like, it still boils down to praised one! Another poorly reasoned question!

u really crack me up, the same u said another comforter means another of the same kind only to turn around, meaning Jesus is the first, now did Jesus abide forever, since him and the comforter are suppose to be the same? Nope, so what did he mean by abide with you forever? - teachings of the next comforter wud stay with u forever! QED!

first, now did Jesus abide forever, since him and the comforter are suppose to be the same?

so what did he mean by abide with you forever? - teachings of the next comforter wud stay with u forever! QED!

Lol gringrin the same Jesus said to the same people he was addressing he will be back, what happens? He never returns to them, according to the bible the hallmark of a false prophet is false teachings . . .

U do the maths, it is clear in the verse Jesus refered to a person like him who would come to guide his followers to all truth! The Holy ghost is not a person! And in essence ur argue the comforter was meant only for the diciples, hence the comforter lay in the graves of the disciple right? Please make u use ur sense! According to desika; The Comforter only came for the disciples, and hence ever since they died, the comforter is also dead! Again this falsifies Jesus statement

smoy: Quran 14:5-6
And We certainly sent Moses with Our signs, [saying], "Bring out your people from darknesses into the light and remind them of the days of Allah ." Indeed in that are signs for everyone patient and grateful.
And [recall, O Children of Israel], when Moses said to His people, "Remember the favor of Allah upon you when He saved you from the people of Pharaoh, who were afflicting you with the worst torment and were slaughtering your [newborn] sons and keeping your females alive. And in that was a great trial from your Lord.

(More ref Quran 20:9-14)


These are Quran view and Muslims have no objection to that, you see for the Jews or Christians their evidence is bible and several name was mention by the Greek bible including Yahweh as u mentioned and u asked how comes that name? the historian let us know that the most ancient scriptures were lost to the conquer of Jerusalem and Hebrew of stone age consider calling the name of God (Allah) serious offence then, which result to the total lost of spelling and pronunciation of this unique name hence the suggestion and research to adopt the (Yod Heh Vav Heh) by Hebrew and translated to (YHWH) by the Greeks. Furthermore, some historian believed that Yahweh was a name of great ancestor (god) of Hebrew who led a war for Israelite and conquered their enemy. Also Jehovah was caved from this name. Allah Know best.