₦airaland Forum

want2knowben:
Ever wondered what informed the need for 'Yoruba Ajumolo'? Clue: A good number of Yoruba dialects. An Egba man will read what an Ijesha man wrote and understand it clearly.

A part of the Yoruba people have a speech defect that makes them unable to say 'sh', like the OT Ephraimites. Doesn't mean you will eradicate the 'sh' sound from the Hebrew or Yoruba language especially since the majority don't have the speech defect.
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Lmao.. this one is just a joke of a post.

That is not a speech defect but dialect. But this is just hiarious. So the Ibadan people who say 'si' when Oyo say 'shi' is a result of Ibadan being descended from Ephramites? oh jeez, are you sure you went to school at all?
Do you know how many subgroups have dialects that eliminate certain sounds that exist in the high/standard dialect of the language?
So you mean to tell me now that each yoruba subgroups descended from a different hebrew clan, and Ibadan's ancestors were Ehphramites because they have a 's' 'sh' factor?

Ah! yoruba, we still have a long way to go, too much of our people are too uneducated and moronic, its a disappointment

You mean the same linguists who included Arabic as a Semitic language but classified similar Yoruba as Niger-Congo? Besides, this is the same attitude killing academia and development in Nigeria; the requirement that one must be queue up behind the dead and tired ones!

....and Eisu Odaara (Jesus the miracle worker) is not foreign to the Yoruba people! Our ancestors knew him but many didn't believe him or accept him. The real Judaism that Christianity and Islam came out from is a Yoruba religion. Esu/Eshu/Yesu/Yeshua/Yesua/Eisu/Eyisu/Isu/Jesus are all variations of the same name.

Is arabic not a semitic language, sharing the most similarities with hebrew, aramaic, amharic and maltese?
Is yoruba not a niger-congo language, sharing the most similarities with other Volta-niger languages like Igbo, Edo and Gbe languages(Fon, Ewe)?

Esu is now your Jesus i thought you christians said Esu is your Satan
Its wonderful how you think Esu is jesus but you wouldn't get initiated into Esu cult
You still run away from involvement in Isese...very wondeful
You still worship jesus but will never worship Esu

want2knowben:
1. said 'proof of virginity'. There is a particular method to that done by the Yoruba like the OT Hebrews.
2. Not supposed to eat of the new yam until the feast has been done. Mirrors the first-fruit.
3. Address your number 3 earlier.
4. 8 days naming ceremony for Hebrews, same for Yoruba.

Why you arguing points I didn't make?

5. Did I add that Omi Ayelala is a mirror of the 'Bitter Water' administered by the OT priests to establish guilt or innocence?
6. Did I mention that when you insert vowels into pre 585 BCE Paleo-Hebrew you get perfect Yoruba words that match the accounts in today's Bible?
7. Too many coincidences to make the Claim untrue.

Like i have said, anybody who wants to be anything than what he really is will look for something and find something.
if you wanted to be Chinese, you will find Chinese connection , if you wanted to be native american you will find a connection

1. provide evidence that the same method of proving virginity is used only by the hebrews and Yoruba and no other people
2. i already made clear that the reason for new yam festivals in west africa (not just yorubaland) is different from the idea of first fruits.
Let me explain more.
New yam festivals are purely a celebration of a succesful harvest, in many towns this signifies the beginning of the year as the ifa festival signifies the beginning of the year in Ile-ife.
first fruits are however a lot more than mere harvest celebrations but payments to the priests and sacrifice to the isreali deity, the first fruit has no calendar significance and is not an elaborate celebration, it is a sacrificial event.

but because you want to be hebrew so bad, you see connection where there is none, assuming you wanted to be chinese you would talk about the Mid-Autumn festival which is also an harvest festival that takes place around the same time as new yam festivals in west africa.


4. i would like to see a detailed account of Jewish naming ceremony with its source being a renowned Rabbi stating it must be 8 days after birth.
Because as far as i know, hebrew traditions have always left naming a baby to be free choice of the parents, babies can be named the day they are born with no ceremony at all...its not even a part of hebrew traditions

5. Omi Ayelal is for crimes different crimes, hebrew bitter water is specifically for women accused of adultery. the process of making Omi ayelala is also diferent from that of the Bitter water.

6. any evidence?

7. good thing you called it 'coincidence'. because that is just what they are. Have you tried looking for such coincidences in other people? Have you tried yoruba connection with the japanese, or yoruba connection with egypt, or yoruba connection with germans?
You will find many, especially when you are willing to twisting some facts a little towards your argument

What you lack however is evidence

here it says 'imadoduwa'
in another story they will say 'izoduwa'

but in bini itself during their traditional rites they say 'ododua'. there is even a festival in honor of oduduwa called Ugie-ododua or Aguosa

Lies will always have loopholes

want2knowben:
One tribe in Ancient Israel was recorded as not being able to say 'sh'. I did not say that all Yoruba cannot say 'sh'. Read my post again.

God doesn't need linguists to reveal hidden matters! He is quite happy with 'babes', stutterers and those looked down on. That's his MO!

lmao. funny how the hebrew word for catastrophe is "shoah" (שואה) a clear usage of the "sh" sound.
rather than make ridiculous claims, why not post a semitic linguists report on hebrew language not having the feature you say. Because so far you have no sources

lmao God has nothing to do with linguistics and history. leave religion out of those..its apparent that you are one of those whose brain has been fried by foreign religions.
Another example of the destructive nature of these religions in africa

Olu317:
You are quite funny because you and I know, we aren't in a classroom. So, what if part of the accented was wrong? Despite your view,you couldn't even detect the slight error . Anyway , let me make you learn something new because when you come across two vowel letters ,in which both follows each other simultaneously, then you have to contract both to one. This is the reason, you saw how it was done,with the punctuation that I applied i. e

T'ibi( tí + ìbí = t'ìbí ),which is a contraction.

macof interpretation :-

Ayé = (life) x

Àyè= (Space)'.

And I disagree with you because you took the saying with levity. Yoruba proverbs-Idioms- figurative speech interpretation is always deeper than from surface form you see it /them.

Áàyè— space

Àayè—world

Áàyè/ Àyè—alive, living,

Émí(noun)—life

Àyè :- This is referring to the ‘world of humanity' and not just mere, ‘ SPACE', because without human beings born on earth, the eminating forces that govern the positive and negative won't contest on the mind of human being i.e birth of mankind. So, learn from the storeroom of àrúgbo ìlè as I am.


Ìbì— negative force

Ìrè— Positive force

Meanwhile, stop this ego Mr.,because, learning is the key to wisdom. The saying was referring to human's world.

Bí— to born/ give birth.

ÌBí— child's cord that she/he was born with, which must be severed after being born.

Àyè- This is a fusion of two things into one because it's the world of humans that invloves challenges.


3. Your number ‘3' is without disagreement because there replication of Èshù or Èsù.

Kindly try study French, from neighbouring Bénin Republic, Mali, Senegal,etc so as to know more and learn accent because English has some challenges, as it regards accent. You doubt? For example:

Read( PR.T)

Reading (PP)

Read (PA T)

The ‘Read' (PA. T ) does not match its Pronunciation. Do you know why?

(b) There is no ‘A' in Yoruba alphabet but ‘À', and other form that has accent, which is the first letter. For example : À— ‘Àjà'

Instead of your ‘A' :

The English ‘A' version

The Yoruba is ‘è' version

This does not mean, English don't use ‘À' ,when they pronounce some words but not seen in written form . For example :

À— Adult
À— After
À— Arise

How are you an expert when , English language does not place accent on all their modern words? Afterall, your knowledge on Yoruba isn't strong because,you were taught in English language from your primary school days till date. . So, learn a little accents formation from French language to aid your Yoruba language's accent. It does help.

. . I can't believe this guy...Guy just shut up and learn Yoruba properly...more importantly stop lying to yourself.

It is T'ibì T'ire ni à da ilẹ̀ Ayé you made a mistake due to your lack of fluency, deal with it and learn how it is written

Your French is not my business as I can't verify that. French is not Yoruba, accent marks are totally different in both languages and that you are using French accents in Yoruba writing just confirms that you don't know Yoruba

MetaPhysical:
Sir,
We have said several times on different topics that tie into the quest and they are all consistent with same theme, that this should be an open inquiry liberated from the formalities of academic and empirical proofing. Free-flow intellect and knowledge is what we need on this exploration, not conforming to some standards of academic rigour.

Since food has been introduced into discussion, let me use an illustration of my experience at a fastfood restaurant where I went for breakfast many months ago. I ordered sausage, egg and cheese on croissant from the menu and asked what the sausage meat was made from. She said it's pork sausage. I told I don't eat pork but would appreciate my order does not come with the sausage. She had to call the manager to ask how to enter that order and ring up my meal ticket. The manager instructed on what to do and turned around to tell me they just have to make the meal as it is on menu and when it is served to me I can throw the sausage away. Even when i insisted that I would pay the full price with the sausage but would prefer pork meat is not served with my breakfast, she did not know how not to serve the order without a pork sausage.
Both of them had been trained to follow process and regimen of their trade.....they do not know how to deviate from it. Their ingenuity had been silenced by the rigours of production.

This is an illustration of what I see in you guys. When asked to bring ingenuity into discussion you default to academic standards and tools of trade.

There are many ways I could address this but let me ask you a question..

What are the disadvantages of not having a standard in a given discipline?

MetaPhysical:
Macof,
You said Ibi is Evil. No, Ibi is not Evil. Ibi is Harzard. I'm going to share somethings with you that Olu has already communicated severally but does not appear to be sinking in.

Do you know what "IPARADA" is? Iparada is the transition from one manifest to the other, the contradiction of self. The phenomenon of Iparada is deeper than words can express in native Yoruba, much more in a foreign language full of ambigous sense and meanings like English language. Yet, the English word for it is PARADOX. It is more than a physical transformation, it is native to the spirit, it is a phenomenon.

Look at these two words my brother...
1 - Ibi - Harzard
2 - Ibi - Birth

E ku "ewu" Omo o! Ewu is the post-state of the harzardous (Ibi) transition from foetus to baby (Ibi). The two processes are anchored in the word IBI. The root word I-B-I manifested here through a paradox or Iparada.


We can do the same for the word you threw out ...Evil. Evil and Live are paradox. One is negative, the other is positive, yet both are exact reverse of the other in spelling. You cannot have one without the other, they are interwoven and co-exist.

There are many examples like this in Yoruba, no need to stretch the imagination here.

Ibì actually is anything bad.. Not specifically "Hazard"
The "Ewu" you mentioned is the yoruba word that best fit "Hazard"
The word "ibì" (Bad things) is opposite of "ire" (good things), and the saying = T'ibì T'ire ni à da ilẹ̀ Ayé (life is made in the bad things and good things) does justice to this

So while you are not wrong you don't do enough justice to the word "ibì"

You don't have to go out of your way to help Olu save face, because his blunder is not just about the meaning of the words, but not knowing which words exactly..."ibì" and "ibí" are not interchangeable synonyms

want2knowben:
Yoruba share culture with the Ancient Israelites:
1. 8th day baby-naming
2. Male circumcision
3. Proof of virginity on wedding day
4. Levirate marriage (restoring a widow into marriage by a relative of the deceased) aka 'su li opo', meant to produce offspring for the childless deceased and/or sustenance of the widow, as seen in the case of Ruth and Boaz but corrupted by greedy people for taking over the deceased's 'non-ancestral' property and wealth.
5. New Yam festival is a mirror of the Biblical First fruits feast. Not supposed to eat of the new yam until the festival has been conducted, as with the First fruits'feast where the priest offers the grain etc offering to God first. See Yoruba proverb 'Aj'egbodo ti n wa enu kun ra';
6. Omi Ayelala is a 'version' of the 'bitter water' administered by the Biblical priests in cases of suspected adultery.

to mention but a few.

1. Not being able to get rid of the 'h' sound, e.g saying 'hindomie' instead of 'indomie', is an Hebraic 'marker'. See Modern Hebrew words.
2. Not being able to say 'sh', e.g saying 'cusin siar' instead 'cushion chair' is another Hebraic 'marker' in the form of a 'speech defect'. This is a characteristic of the Ephraimites who were slaughtered in Ancient Israel when they could not pass the 'Shibboleth' pronunciation test.

These markers are widespread amongst people who speak various Yoruba dialects from OYO, OSUN, EKITI, ONDO and some parts of KWARA and possibly Kogi. Some people have been able to override the 'markers'.

It is very possible that we have 'arabs' among us in yoruba land, given that Islamic persecution led to many black arabs/edomites leaving their homelands. They would settle easily with the Yoruba given similarities in language and 'non-islamic' culture, since the Edomites lived close and in cases side by side with Israelites in ancient times. Many Jews had arabic names before Islam came to be at all. Many Yoruba Muslims today are actually descendants of Israel who converted to Islam voluntarily or under force. The Islamic hatred for the 'people of promise' is evident in the treatment of black slaves in the Arab Slave trade, and in today's treatment of black domestic workers in the hands of 'modern arabs'.

Many tribes surrounding the Yoruba people of Nigeria, Togo and Benin in these countries and in Ghana are also descendants of other Israelite tribes. It was the colonial masters who set up artificial boundaries between the ISRAELITE nation in West Africa.

Research by Prince O Jejelola has revealed the Yoruba language to be the Ancient Hebrew tongue, with his Paleo-Hebrew translation work of the Torah yielding information missing from current Bible translations. His work has also looked at many Biblical names, and they are yielding Yoruba words when the correct vowels are inserted.

lmao.

If you believe you are Hebrew you will find what you will use to hold on to that belief, similarly if you believe you are Chinese, you will find what to hold on to

All those things you listed are not peculiar to yoruba and Hebrews
1. most old cultures of the world circumcise and expect virginity on wedding day
2. The core principle of the new Yam Festival is to mark the beginning of a new agricultural year, different from the principle of the Hebrew first fruit
3. Yoruba can say "Sh".. There are names like Shola, words like Ìṣe (Act) Ìṣẹ́(work)
4. Hebrew culture isn't specific on how many days it takes to name a child, and the culture certainly doesn't require an elaborate celebration unlike the Yoruba culture


Prince O. Jejeloba? Never heard of him... Is he a linguist? And what institution did he publish under?

Olu317:
T('i)b(ì) T('i)r(e) n(i) à d(a) ilẹ̀ (A)y(é)-è

The letters in bracket aren't accented properly. accents on Yoruba languagewere shaped through French pronunciation. Though, it doesn't mean Yoruba language aren't filled with accents when pronounced.
And trust me, I have idea on French words and her pronunciation form. So, don't dare me.


2. Bárá l’ àb'élékún súnkún kí érú o bá élékún . Bí élékún bá n súnkún, Láàroyé à mà sún éjé' .(*edited*)

* I had edited it earlier but anti-spam Bot on NL can be a bit challenging *

3. Èsù Oníbodè, I know isn't from Kètú. Can you give, how that came to be? Although, ancient Yoruba names had Èsù, as a prefix to their names.

1. Mr. Olu, stop lying.. If you don't know something there is no shame in admitting you don't know.
Let me (attempt) to translate the gibberish you wrote
". t' ìbí t'íré ní Àdà ìlè Àyè"
To Birth, to *gibberish * at *gibberish* *gibberish* of Space

And you are still trying to defend this nonsense Yoruba you wrote?

There is a clear difference between "Ibì" (Evil) and "Ibí"(Birth). Ayé(life) and Àyè(Space)

2. Accent marks there again are wrong. Guy just stop using accents marks if you don't know how to use it, even I don't use it when I'm not sure of which goes with certain words

3. Well, just as it is suspected that there are more than one Ogun in history, maybe there are more than one historical Esu (Esu is not looked at much by historians)
So I don't know what Esu you are familiar with but it is essential to keep in mind that Esu has spiritual and historical sides

You did not even address up to half of the points raised nor attempt most of the questions for 2 weeks

Olu317:
3. The 'aleph' ‘Ah' and 'mem' letters of the Hebrew alphabets which is equivalent to 'A' and 'M' in English so how does 'a,m' evolve to 'i,y,e' in yoruba language?

Answer:
1. Prior to the ,‘Aramaic' Era, in ancient Hebrew, each letter represents a sound and a concept. The first letter, (Note that Hebrew is read from right to left), is the aleph (pronounced ah-leph) and represents the "Ah" and "Eh" sounds. Aleph is a Hebrew word meaning "ox," and this letter is a picture of an ox head and represents the concept of "strength," from the strength of the ox. 2. So contrary to your approach, several of the letter in the alphabet are very similar and can easily be confused with other letters'. So know that learning ancient Hebrew language is not like the way you source information via ‘pealim.com'.Below alphabet were how ancient Hebrew's word for ‘mother' was formed by a Rabbi and researcher;
Aleph: a, e
Yud : y, i
Mem: m

1. That is all very correct.
2. There is no confusion, Hebrew word for mother simply has two alphabets 'Aleph' and 'mem' which is transliterated to english as "Ema" or "Ama"
How does this show any form of connection to "I-Y-E" that was the real question which you have not answered.
3. What is the name of this Rabbi? You should have known i would ask

4. what is the yoruba name for Hebrews? and what part of Yoruba traditions, in what specific towns is it implied that Yoruba are Hebrews? You said yoruba have oral accounts of migration? migration from where?

Answer:
(a)There was nothing like Yoruba name for Hebrew neither did Hebrew names was their uniform name but 1. a name of one of their ancestors known as ‘eber'


(b) I am sure you known comparative study have been done on Yoruba ethnicity and Hebrew - meditterean .So, no need to ask me for more info. After all, you are a Historian.

(c) Same as answer ‘b'
Hebrew as a name was derived from name, ‘eber'

you did not even remotely answer the qestions

1. This is just a hypothesis that has been trashed. You like to talk about hebrew all the time, but still maintain an european medieval idea that has been trashed by improved studies of the modern era. 'Hebrew' is "Ibri/Ivri" in Hebrew language

Since you inability to answer this question establishes that you do not know of the yoruba word for Hebrew, or any yoruba town that has has a tradition of descending from hebrews...so what exactly is your source? can you see that you are exposing yourself to making shit up from your ass?

[
5. Kindly direct me to a link or at least a name, lets identify where you got the information from
I know you still have questions i asked above, but because you wont let us deal with points one step at a time i have to ask more questions

Answer
(a)I have given you authors books to enhance your study. Try do that to understanding what you dont know

you gave no books that correspond with what you have been claiming

6. Who are the other groups the Yoruba met as they were migrating down to Nigeria?

And what part of Yoruba accounts confirm those foreign accounts, it is after all the yoruba that is being talked about, surely the yoruba accounts must give legitimacy to what ever foreign accounts

Answer
(a)In Yoruba(ILEIFE) oral history, there is an account in Ikedu king list which has accout that there were two kings during the 46th kings list which appeared to be the period when Odua & his group were acknowledged to have emigrated from somewhere through oke ora to Ileife . Below screenshot from, ART in ILEIFE,The Birth Place of Yoruba,acknowledged it. Perhaps it will refreshen your memory.

(b) In as much oral account, has acknowledged it,and all Yoruba were linked together as a family, then they have nearly unified identity. The only difference was that they arrived differently to their first place of abode at different times before Odua and his group arrived later.

"Who are the other groups the Yoruba met as they were migrating down to Nigeria? And what part of Yoruba accounts confirm those foreign accounts, it is after all the yoruba that is being talked about, surely the yoruba accounts must give legitimacy to what ever foreign accounts"

^^^^this was my question, a very straight forward question.. you have not answered it

Ikedu king list! have you come across this list? or have you come across anyone who has? ^Lets deal with what you really know about

But actually what part of this your post here do you think addressing my question? how does Ikedu list have anything to do with People yoruba met before reaching Nigeria?

7. I have never heard of Ibn Battuta mentioning Yoruba in his Rihla account, unless you are referring to the baseless claim that he mentioned Ife as 'Yufi', in which case is completely off. So in what context and to what purpose did Battuta mention Yoruba?
Because even Ahmed Baba is regarded as the first to mention yoruba in a written work

(a)ohún tí édà o bá mó o sè'gbà é .So he Ibn Battusa made a baseless claim around 12th century? Very funny. And every Yoruba scholars that cited western resesrchers work of about 3000-4000 years ago of language divergence of Ibo and Yoruba is correct? I can see your view

(a)Youfi was IFE and IFE is Yoruba

I never said Ibn Battuta made a baseless claim, he was not a claimant of anything, his writting was simply about the things he saw and experienced as a traveller and explorer not historian, he was no historian

I was saying the people who claim he mentioned Ife as 'Yufi' are wrong because Ibn Battuta never came near Yorubaland, his 'Yufi' was in east africa not west africa

I have read two reviews of his Rihla

8. so what part of Ahmed Baba's mention of Yoruba is evidence of a Hebrew origin for Yorubas?

Answer

(b) Canaan was acknowledged as the ancient home of Yoruba in Ahmed Baba's account through Captain Clapperton's account, even if there was nothing concrete to proof it.

Ahan! oga, why lie? Where did Ahmed Baba put 'canaan' and 'yoruba' in the same sentence? Ahmed Baba was not trying to be an historian like Clapperton
Ahmed Baba was simply describing some West African people the Malians(in by extension his native Songhai) have significant trade with
i know you do not know the context of which Ahmed Baba mentioned the Yoruba...so you can go find that out, take your time to be involved in actual fact finding with guidiance from those before you

#

9. What names, people and towns outside yorubaland are the Yoruba linked to? asides maybe places in Igalaland with Ife-prefixes

Answer
(a) Yoruba in Bénin,Togo,Ghana,south America etc,tally through oral account, 1. Sudan(bodily mark seen as same with a Yoruba group of Ijebu etc ), Ethiopia (circumcission of both male and female was and found in Yoruba land), North Africa's Morroco etc had a footprint of IFA/IFA practice but dissapeared from North Africa around 9th century and Egypt had an account of ‘Ilu',a town in lower Egypt.

*facepalm* https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3b/Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg/800px-Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg

Yoruba in Benin, Togo, Ghana, South America? dude are you a dunce? I thought you were claiming yoruba migrated to Yorubaland from Israel.
We all know how Yorubas got to South America...*coughs* slave trade..
Historians know how Yorubas got to Benin, Togo and built few communities in Ghana...Wars and Expansion ambition. These have nothing to do with Yoruba origin

I'm so lost with the beginning of this part of your post.

1. What are the names of these ethnicities in Sudan, ethiopia and morrocco that are connected to Yoruba
ps. There are countless african people who have body scarification that can be linked to Yoruba, as well as circumcision of girls and boys.. Speaking of which, if you were not trying so hard to push a claim that you yourself are not convinced of(just too ashamed to say you have no proper backings), you would know that Hebrew tradition forbids female circumcision as such the Yoruba who do practice a totally different tradition

10. what are these traces of non aboriginal narration in Ifa and who are these researchers?

(a) Names of towns and period of formation of towns in the present day Yoruba history in Nigeria,such as ancient Àdo, Ìkólè,Ógbón,Orú etc are recorded in Ifa corpus account but didnt fit in toYoruba land narrative in Nigeria's because Orunmila existed before 11th-12th century.Infact, some scholar's account claim Orunmila lived 4000 years ago.

I asked what are the race of non-aboriginal narration in Ifa
Please ask if you do not understand my english sir, instead of all this posting of things that have nothing to do with my question.

i expected you to mention a place outside Nigeria that features in ifa as the place of origin for Yoruba, not mentioning places within Yorubaland
This only shows that Ifa establishes an aboriginal status for Yoruba

11. So are you saying Yoruba oral accounts are not authentic?

Answer
(a) As it is a normal with every migration of people,there are part of Yoruba account that were narrated but seen as a not too long ago ,which was due to gap in the history ( Dierk Lange,Bowen,Cotton etc). The first half of yoruba is lost,which what we are trying to unravel the same way the ancient Hebrew were lost and being searched for . So as you can see, the yoruba history in Nigeria, is the concluding part of ancient people who came from the land of ‘ORÚ' in Middle East. After all, Obatala's father,Olofin's ,Obawinrin's,Obalara's ancestors are not known.

but how can you say you are trying to unravel this 'missing history' when you already have your conclusion before evidence?
its like in mathematics, you already have your answer without showing how you got to the answer... wuruwuru

You let evidence convince you, not you twist things to appear as what you already want to believe

There are much parts of yoruba oral history that is rightly said, missing, but it takes dedicated study and initiation in the traditions to know enough to build the bridges and seal the gaps

12. what do you know about the ways of Yoruba ancestors?
you are not even involved in Isese so what ways do you think you know and how did you come about knowing them?

Answer
. okay oooo iseserimi, I hear you. But please dont say this to me again because people like you kept claiming isese but you are boastful and betray the dont of our ancestors way of life. Plainly, you use negative word on people too often.Such as you can't be a role model in encouraging people into isese.So repent Sir.I was born into Isese.....So once you e engage me on issue,dont ever refer such to me again..

negative words? like i call out stupid things when i see it? i laugh, you think Isese is a tradition of roses and back massages?
Isese is harsh and straight... No Isese person will try to make you feel as if you are more than what you are

You are just lying now you this church boy claiming isese online.. ok ni bo lo gba ikin e? abi se o ti gbe Igba odu?

Obalufon:
Do you know the significant of Esu in yoruba tradition? atleast you would have seen sacrifices at T junction before ..Esu convey any ritual or prayers to God..Esu is the driving force of our tradition

Yes, I'm well aware of Esu and his significance in areas where he is significant.. Not the entire length and breath of Yorubaland
In Ifè, Esu's role is mainly taken up by Oluorogbo

Obalufon:
All the irumoles (Angels) landed in ile -IFE they all lived in IFE before creation of man

Yes all the Irunmole did land in Ifè..that's part of Yoruba traditions as regards Spirituality

But I'm talking History, that is why I said Esu - the man

If you read my post to @hayoholla you will say how I explained the duality of Characters in Yoruba traditions, each Orisa is both spiritual/mythical and Historical/physical.. They have two sides
Same Esu who was the 9th Alaketu of Ketu(historically) is said to be a son of Osun and Orunmila(mythically /spiritually)

Btw Irunmole are not Angels, very different concepts, let's leave Asian concepts to the Asians

Obalufon:
what are you saying macof Esu had no presence in Ile ife

. Like I said, Esu - the man
Historically, at least not that I know of, Esu did not live in Ife

And you are still going back to posts you've already replied before without addressing the points raised twice.. I've told you to get help, you are not mentally stable @absolutesuccess. Address my post if you want to, or ignore the post. Not mentioning me every 3 days to get my attention


running around trolling again, still nothing better to do with your life? @MayorofLagos?
You should be learning Yoruba history from my posts

Olu317:
No.... And I had answered you in my previous post on the work of Èsù from my understanding as regards his duty .But I have some questions. So please,answer the following questions.


1.Who exactly is Èsù?

2. Yoruba elders says, 1. t' ìbí t'íré ní Àdà ìlè Àyè. Whose saying was it in IFA corpus ?

3. This saying came forth in 1st plural pronoun ‘À' ,which is,‘WE' in English translation,so who were creators of Àyè that mention, the ‘good' and ‘bad' forces ?

4. As you have seen me done, I want you to explain what this saying 2. on Èsù, ; ‘À l'omi nílè f'èjè wè'

5. 3. Do you know Èsù, Eksum, Heasu(Easu) appeared in some other people's culture in Middle East and European culture?

As you know, we are sharing knowledge,so as to understand some aspects of our darling YORUBA culture, which has a vacuum, that needed to be filled.But as it seems, thw shocking CONSERVATIVE, especially the ones that lack the pedigree to cohabit with other people's different views that's based on research work can't tolerate the truth. Yet these set of people can't defend Our ancestors very well when EDO CLAIM ODU'A AS their own Igodo descendant? *What an Irony*

ONLY SONS WILL DEFEND HIS FATHER'S RIGHT. AS YOU HAD SEEN OTHERS AND I have done so vividly.





lastly I wait to read from your depth .

1. Wrong accents marks for most of what is written there. You don't seem to speak Yoruba fluently? As I still remember you couldn't tell the difference between "ìlú" and "ìlù"

T'ibì T'ire ni à da ilẹ̀ Ayé
That is the right way to write what you were trying to say.

2. "Àlominílé f'ẹjẹ wẹ" is an oriki of Ogun not Esu

3. Esu - the man - was from Ketu. All traditions around Esu revolves around Ketu, with Oyo recording his presence among them at some time
He had no presence in places like Ife, reason Esu has no signicant following in central and Eastern Yoruba towns
If Esu traveled as far as the middle east, I think Yorubas would know that

EzeIgboNwaChukwu:
I remember this man.
you're a 40 year old pagan that rejected the gospel that prophetudeme preached to u and macof but it all fell on deaf ears.
God is Still merciful to you by keeping you alive.
I pray you repent before it's too late

prophetudeme, i know that must have been one crazy psychotic nairalander
You should repent and beg your ancestors for forgiveness for all the insults you have dealt on them.

Olu317:
Please go to all my posts because I have answered your questions.

I just did and i saw no answers.

you can repost them here maybe they didn't get posted as you think

absoluteSuccess:
i believe you have copied this line from the mail you send to your brother.

We are no blood relation.

You can't give what you don't have.

sorry i don't have any brothers with mental issues
Go seek help, you can't differentiate what is real from what is not and you are too emotional...because if at least 10 years of pursuing Yoruba-hebrew connection hasn't yielded any evidence i wonder what time it will

Olu317 these are all the questions you ignored
These questions are not random questions, they are necessarily response to your post...I asked each based on something you said and only want you to go further and explain

:You can click on the 'macof' links below to go back to the original posts

macof:
1. Can you narrate to me the yoruba oral account of migration and what towns speak of these migrations? by 'migration' i am sure you know i mean migration from outside Nigeria

2. (mother) iye = eym. you need to explain how 'Iye' evolved from 'eym'. ( a tip; you will need to provide some other examples that follow the same pattern of Iye = eym. p.s https://www.pealim.com/dict/2664-em/pic.png according to Hebrew dictionaries everywhere 'mother' is 'em(a)' or 'im(a)' https://www.pealim.com/dict/2664-em/

3. 'אֵם' has the 'aleph' and 'mem' letters of the Hebrew alphabeth which is equivalent to 'A' and 'M' in English so how does 'a,m' evolve to 'i,y,e' in yoruba language?

macof:
So if Yoruba knew of the hebrews and knew we were hebrews before christianity was introduced

4. what is the yoruba name for Hebrews? and what part of Yoruba traditions, in what specific towns is it implied that Yoruba are Hebrews? You said yoruba have oral accounts of migration? migration from where?

surely for you to know these remnant traditions that i and many others do not know, you must have your sources?
5. Kindly direct me to a link or at least a name, lets identify where you got the information from





I know you still have questions i asked above, but because you wont let us deal with points one step at a time i have to ask more questions
6. Who are the other groups the Yoruba met as they were migrating down to Nigeria? and what part of Yoruba accounts confirm those foreign accounts, it is after all the yoruba that is being talked about, surely the yoruba accounts must give legitimacy to what ever foreign accounts

7. I have never heard of Ibn Battuta mentioning Yoruba in his Rihla account, unless you are referring to the baseless claim that he mentioned Ife as 'Yufi', in which case is completely off. So in what context and to what purpose did Battuta mention Yoruba?
Because even Ahmed Baba is regarded as the first to mention yoruba in a written work

8. so what part of Ahmed Baba's mention of Yoruba is evidence of a Hebrew origin for Yorubas?

9. What names, people and towns outside yorubaland are the Yoruba linked to? asides maybe places in Igalaland with Ife-prefixes

10. what are these traces of non aboriginal narration in Ifa and who are these researchers?

11. So are you saying Yoruba oral accounts are not authentic?

12. what do you know about the ways of Yoruba ancestors? you are not even involved in Isese so what ways do you think you know and how did you come about knowing them?

macof:
13. How does Yoruba greatness mean Hebrew origin

macof:
14. Eda means 'Humanity' and yoruba use the word only to refer to themselves? so Yoruba are the only humans on earth? did you think before you posted this?


15. How does yoruba feeling of cultural superiority oppose the common origin of yoruba with her neighbors? the Edo also have a feeling of cultural superiority, even higher than the Yorubas...feeling of cultural superiority is relative to how well organized and prosperous a people perceive themselves above their neighbors. Egyptians had a feeling of cultural superiority , Greeks had a feeling of cultural superiority, the british had a feeling of cultural superiority, the mongols had a feelings of cultural superiority, the Persians had a feeling of that same cultural superiority...all of them have a common origin with their neighbors, same neighbors they felt superior to
I'm pretty sure the Ibos had a feeling of cultural superiority too



16. can we have a list of the cognates between Hebrew and Yoruba? (actually to use the term 'cognates' is wrong, i was just using your words. reason why is because 'cognates' is the term used to describe two words that have a common origin, blood relation if i may say. So I think what you are on to is rather 'borrowed words'. Because Yoruba language is not a blood relative to Hebrew... even if Yorubas came from Hebrews, Yoruba people must have adopted a new language, and borrowed hebrew words into the language.
but even at borrowed words from hebrew, you still follow the same method as cognates...you need a methodology, either by giving the etymology of the individual words not just 'x' means 'ex' you need to explain how 'ex' became 'x' or at least find a pattern using other examples like i did when i compared some Yoruba-Igala words, and Yoruba-Igbo words

if you can prove that yoruba language has some hebrew words that already shows Hebrew connection, then we can go further to investigating how and when these words could have entered Yoruba lexicon.

macof:
17. Nobody is sure about how many times Ife has been moved, or if it has ever been moved...People just suggest and throw out the possibility that current Ile-ife wasnt the site of the first Ife.. Personality, I am of that opinion too..but that leaves us with a question? ; Where were the previous Ife? And how many previous Ife existed?
Now I don't have the answer but feel free to tell us...with evidence



18. How is Moba related to Hebrew?

If you are trying to suggest that not all Yoruba towns originated from modern ile-ife...that bit is already recognized by historians...so yes, according to Atolagbe(although himself not an actual historian, but his book is so far the best we have on Otun history) the Otun Oore emerged from the water at Moba in Lagos state...it is explicit in the citations made by Atolagbe "okun moba lehin eko"

But how does this connect to hebrews?

macof:
19. I did not see any etymology... Giving etymologies are good.. The only screenshot i saw was that 'Addereth' picture which had no etymology, neither did any thing in the picture show how 'addereth' is related to 'adire' www.nairaland.com/attachments/7756639_img20180912115448_jpege95c8072c008a4994f791743530d7678

Adi - Tie. Re - dye what is the etymology of 'Addereth'?



20. And what part of Whorf's work did he imply a connection between Yoruba and Hebrew? that is the point you should be making..because all well known linguists have long finished research as to Yoruba's place in the Niger-congo group of languages and hebrew's place in Afro-Asiatic
so where is the correlation?



21 And what "higher college in the western world"(your own words) did you attend/attending? What country? France?

Is it your western world higher college that told you Oduduwa did not come from Oke-ora?... So have you checked with your university history professor and discussed about Oduduwa coming from Israel? I guess you are the custodian of Oduduwa secrets...the Obadio of Ife must be a learner where you are for you to know the bithplace of oduduwa..yet you are not a traditionalist or an Ife indigene ...better don't insult the priest of oduduwa by trying to claim what you dont know because of christianity and hebrew sentiment that you want to push...church work


22. not one of your claims has been proven...stop lying
show use one confirmation by one renowned researcher that actually agrees with you while providing evidence.... the only person you mentioned was Dierk Lange who doesnt agree with you

23. If connection to Eledumare and your ancestors is so important to you, why not dump christianity and enter Isese? or is christianity your ancestral religion?

macof:
24.
www.nairaland.com/attachments/7782794_img20180915115237_jpeg3a3eefc25dab5ae83ebefeb30bbdad3f

in this same picture you posted, Egyptian language is being compared to Bantu languages as well as Yoruba and Fulani(pulaar)...not yoruba alone, so even the person who did this doesnt agree with you that Yoruba are separate from other africans

Also some of the yoruba words are wrong
1. bọse is not secretly... I mean i have never heard that word.. unless you know something i don't know . Yoruba for secretly is 'nikoko'
2. busa is not 'to honor/respect' ...also nevr heard that word... to respect - bọwọ
3. bọti is also wrong.. it is ọti

as for 'ba' which your picture says 'germinate'..i am unsure of the yoruba word for germinate that is why i wont say much.. maybe 0balufonlll knows..egbon?

as for the remaining 4 words can you explain how these words are borrowed from egyptian language? what methodology did you use to arrive at this conclusion?

So here we are. This is how scholars do it, so don't be afraid, I'm sure you can defend your theories

please we already have many questions, make me understand these 24 first before adding more to it..so just straight to it and no more bold claims

Olu317:
I have answered you all and even went further to post books that can help understand word list of ancient Hebrews.

And, if you don't understand the oral account,kindly visit Moba Town or google Otun Ore history.
And on Igala history, I have answered you because Attah Igala also claimed that Yoruba also settled down in their midst.

no olu, you answered only 3 questions out of 17...after that your questions piled up again to over 20 unanswered questions altogether

I will create a separate thread just for you and me

you must either answer my questions or come out clean....because these questions were created out of your own claims..they are not random questions that i just made up...you make a bold claim and i ask you what are your sources or something along that line but you never respond
I'm giving you so much patience here and a big chance to convince me that proto-proto-yoruba people were hebrew

what oral account? narrate the oral account here and give your source.... I already told you that according to Atolagbe Moba in Lagos is the original homeland of Otun moba in Ekiti... and there is nothing that is above Atolagbe so far when it comes to Moba history

Where did Attah Igala claim he is descended from a mix of Nupe and Yoruba?

dont worry I am preparing a juicy thread for you to answer all your questions

RedboneSmith:
Please, pay this guy no heed. Anytime I am trying to have a serious discussion about Igbo or West African history with people and they mention Catherine Acholonu's works, I just stop responding to them because it would just be time-wasting and painful to me.

Catherine was neither a historian nor an archaeologist nor a linguist. The woman read literature, and then decided that what she wanted to do with her life was history, archaeology and historical linguistics. Someone who was serious would have at least tried to educate themselves a little about their chosen 'hobby', but not Catherine.

If you read this woman's work you will wonder whether she was on some kind of perpetual high. She claimed the city of Heliopolis in Ancient Egypt was actually in Igbo-Ukwu. There was literally no depth of ridiculosity that Catherine Acholonu did not sink to in her 'scholarship'. It is no wonder that none of her works appear in peer-reviewed journals and none of her books was published by a university press. Scholars do not quote her work; many scholars in fact completely ignore her works. Only amateurs on the internet and people with no historical training reference her.

She was fond of doing collaborations with people whose discipline have nothing to do with history, because she could not get actual historians to collaborate with her. For instance her book "They came Before Adam" (Where she claimed the Igbo language is the oldest language in the world) was written with an Indian computer scientist! A computer scientist of all people!

Another thing you should know: Catherine Acholonu mastered the art of quoting people out of context. Dr Quentin Atkinson, the biologist being mentioned here, had his work completely misquoted by Catherine.

Thanks alot, I had never even taken notice of her until now

@bold. and this is the problem actual historians have to deal with, you have pseudohistorians coming in to mess up the field and actual historians have to clean it up. The fact that many Africans aren't studying history makes it even more problematic
This was one of the biggest motivations for my decision to study history

Olu317:
Dem dem Ibo apologists continue in their ignorance...split kó ,divide ní . If Ibo split from Yoruba, why did Catherine Acholonu thesis counter it ? The same manner Atkinson said about language in west Africa as the place of its origin. Funny enough yoruba language was already in existence 3000 years ago. And this language was spoken in Egypt. Infact 3000 years ago was less 700 years before Jesus christ. . Kikikiki

Who is Catherine Acholonu? a linguist? And are you trying to say that Igbo language is the mother of Yoruba language now? if you know the woman's work is a sham why refer to it at all?

Confuse set of people,who are bent in lumping my yoruba ancestors with Ibos' ancestors. As usual,they are here with incoherent statement of denying their claim that, ‘Ibos splitted from Yoruba and Yoruba are not Ibos'. . Confusion grandeur.

your yoruba ancestors? same yoruba ancestors that you refused to follow?
if yoruba ancestors are so important to you, why not dump christianity and enter Isese? or is chrisitianity your ancestral religion?
you are not more yoruba than me so all this my ancestors nkankan is sentimental play which has no role in historical studies

I will tell you that Suzanne Blier - an American art historian knows your ancestors more than you

There is no confusion in that Yoruba and Igbo split, yet Yoruba are not Igbo...it is common sense.. If yoruba were igbo no one will talk about a split...Yoruba and Igbo have been different people for 3000 years..that is what it means...3000 years is more than enough for these people to create a very unique identity different from that of the proto-culture they came from

To be honest, i am doing you a great service educating you like this but just because you are yoruba, eventually i will leave you to your delusions but not until you understand basic things like "split people doesn't mean same people"...i mean you cant be that stupid ..can you?

Below is a screenshot of kemet word present in Yoruba word list over 3000 years ago..........

www.nairaland.com/attachments/7782794_img20180915115237_jpeg3a3eefc25dab5ae83ebefeb30bbdad3f

in this same picture you posted, Egyptian language is being compared to Bantu languages as well as Yoruba and Fulani(pulaar).
Also some of the yoruba words are wrong
1. bọse is not secretly... I mean i have never heard that word.. unless you know something i don't know . Yoruba for secretly is 'nikoko'
2. busa is not 'to honor/respect' ...also nevr heard that word... to respect - bọwọ
3. bọti is also wrong.. it is ọti

as for 'ba' which your picture says 'germinate'..i am unsure of the yoruba word for germinate that is why i wont say much.. maybe 0balufonlll knows..egbon?

as for the remaining 4 words can you explain how these words are borrowed from egyptian language? what methodology did you use to arrive at this conclusion?

Olu317:
As usual with flimsy excuses. If you dont know much on something,kindly do research instead of unnecessary and unbacked theories. Ibo kó yánmírín ní.





You better click on the above link to see your Ibo language being dissected through phonomes. Atkinson research team posited that language originated in the Western part of Sub-Saharan Africa and supports Acholonu Catherine thesis of an Igbo origin of languages because Igbo language is based in the Western part of Sub-Saharan Africa. Also the conclusion that this ancient mother-language left Africa during the earliest ‘Out of Africa’ migrations is the same as our own conclusions that Homo Erectus left Africa with a Language and a Culture intact, and not, as animal-like ‘primitive man’. The thesis is that the San (Khoisan) Bushmen of the Kalahari were among the earliest carriers of this Proto-Proto-Igbo mother tongue, was also confirmed in the Atkinson research findings.
Therefore, Igbo scholars worldwide ought to seize upon this added scientific evidence provided by Dr. Atkinson’s research but instead ,they deny as usual. Kindly do the needful by listing the coganate of Ibo words with the above yorubas,if you are sure. Ko má wáà fíìfíì ìdí koko kírí.

Are you mad or something? the person you say doesnt know something is obviously well educated.. and must have taken the subject of West African history seriously for some years in an academic environment

What's up with this total disregard for what people study?

btw, I asked you before what 'western world higher college'(your words) did you attend? what country?

The New York Times (Apr. 2011) has published an article by Nicholas Wade, reviewing a new research, which maintains that all languages developed from a common mother-language from Sub-Saharan Africa that was carried to other parts of the world by Homo erectus African migrants over 100,000 years ago during the Out of Africa migrations. The linguistic research was said to have been conducted by Dr Quentin Atkinson, a biologist. Though I find it hard understand the practice of linguistics by a Biologist, yet this research supports our thesis, nevertheless.

This is what I got out of a quick search of Atkinson research
It's interesting how a biologist and a science journalist are experts on African languages while the actual linguists are overlooked
its no wonder that most of what the article says comes without any evidence

Then again, when we look at the so called research it claims Igbo is the mother of all languages...what point does this make to prove your stance?
How does this play on to Yoruba having Hebrew origin?

Obalufon:
ibos are bantu their lineage can be traced back to south Africa region

smh. I had wanted to ignore this trolling but some stupid talk cannot be left without being called out lest it spreads


http://www.cbold.ish-lyon.cnrs.fr/Lgs/LgXRefs.html
here is a complete list of all Bantu languages... most of them i had no idea even existed

Clearly there is no Ibo there

https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/41880586_1596675163811978_4168943111470317568_n.png?_nc_cat=0&oh=dfbe349768a6617ff0a49d3a937fe0c3&oe=5C18888A
Here is Igbo being placed with Yoruba as a Volta-Niger language

https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/41854589_1596675253811969_5868000781851951104_n.png?_nc_cat=0&oh=e4aac23ccf636972e57e3946708ee32d&oe=5C26DB72
here are Bantu languages(Bantoid) placed in Benue-congo group of language - a separate group from Volta-Niger

in case that is still too complicated for you.. here is a picture in colours clearly differentiating Igbo from the Bantu languages https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/35/African_language_families.png


stop making a mess of yourself.. faceless forum or not it is utterly stupid to go around trolling
so stop trolling and go get a life..you are obviously still very young

p.s I will not reply you again.. I hate trolls

Olu317:
Yes Sir.I hear you. But macof ,do the field work and come nullify my stance . Kikikiki

you have not even proven your stance... Your entire stance is shaky.. You have not provided one evidence.. Just one
have you forgotten you have not answered my questions?

Should I repost them so you can answer?

Or you don't have answers?

Olu317:
So Ō and e are the same thing in lexicology? I hear you Sir. Enjoy yourself macof!

Let me use examples from other languages maybe your brain will start working

English - 'day' is cognate of 'tag' in German

You see how they don't look alike but linguists have studied the change pattern and various dialects of both languages

This is so well studied that sometimes you can look at an English word and know it's German cognate by just using the pattern


So change from 'ọ' to 'e' is not a special thing.. Languages evolve

Let me blow your mind
Yoruba - owó is cognate to ''ego' in igbo

They don't look or sound alike but evolved from the same word in the proto-Yoruba-Edo-Igbo language

One way to prove this is looking at Yoruba dialects and other languages in the family
Ọwọ - Ogho
Edo - Igho

RedboneSmith:
It might be instructive to note that in Ekpeye (which is an Igboid language), Elu is Olu. They retain the initial 'o' as in Yoruba. Linguists believe Ekpeye hived off from Proto-Igboid at an early age and has as a result retained archaic forms that mainstream Igbo has lost. It is probable, based on the Ekpeye evidence, that ancient Igbo used to have an 'o' at the beginning of 'elu', just like Yoruba but subsequently shifted to 'e'.

Quite fascinating, Ekpeye of all people have the variant closer to Yorubas
That goes further to prove that it is never a matter of proximity

Olu317:
what is this? Elù or Ìlù in Yoruba is ‘Town'. The same way ,a variant pronounciation became ‘Ìlù',which mean ‘drum'. How are they related to Ibos, ‘up' and ‘drum'? Stop this bro.

Because of you I had to use my phone just to teach you small Yoruba Language, since you obviously don't speak good Yoruba

Ìlú might have been derived from the word Èlú... Èlú is actually possibly a forgotten deity in Ifè
Èlú also means Community or village or even hamlet
Ìlú means a City or a State or you could best say a City-state

A little history for you.. In pre-oduduwa Ìfẹ̀, the people were organized into 13 Elu

PS. It is 'Ìlú' not 'ìlù'...

Ìlú(City) and ìlù(Drum) have nothing to do with each other, these are two different words far apart
(note the accent marks)

Then both these words are different from "ọrùn" (sky) which is cognate to Igbo "Elu" meaning up


You have just embarrassed yourself, you think ìlú and ìlù are related because they have the same letters but can't comprehend how Ọrùn is related to Elu

Linguistics will confuse you my man, don't argue what you don't know


This is so hilarious my man got so confused

Olu317:
. I have never referred to Igala as non Yoruboid,at anytime ( please verify).

But you have been arguing against Yoruba's relationship with her neighbors ever since...you cannot deny Yoruba relationship with Igbo and Edo and say you are ok with Igala. Yoruba-Igala connection is not complete without the full spectrum of Yoruba-Edo-Igbo. the same way linguists determined the connection of Yoruba and Igala is same way Yoruba-Edo-Igbo was dertermined...a relationship that is already an established fact...as you see the sky as blue so do all Historians/Anthropologists see the yoruba as a native west african civilization

that said, if you want to suggest that sometime before yoruba civilization kicked off, hebrews mixed in to the proto-yoruba population...you will need to provide evidence to that...that is why i have been asking you questions since...but it appears you only hold this hebrew claim due to emotional attachment to the hebrews you worship in church...if that is the case you have already made up your mind to see yourself as a child of the hebrews rather than letting evidence convince you of it...

let me tell you, I am not a particular fan of Igbo, or Edo, or anybody..I couldn't care less if Yoruba are from China..or from Koma people of Adamawa..but it is a stupid person that argues against facts...don't be a stupid person

Despite the difference of origin but I submitted 1. my views based on àróbá and that the language developed through Yoruba's migration, and 2. intermarriage with Nupe-Atta's descendants,which helped shaped the basis for the language of Igala


. How do I mean? In every Yoruba town,the leader must either be a prince or a chosen leader ,who is related to Noble home,directly or indirectly. Then IFA is foundational religion. 3. Attah and their ancient group didnt have link to IFA nor know anything about Eledaa who is Ori's creator . Even ‘Gun'-Ajah has close proximity with Yoruba clans in Bénin Republic and do have share infiltrated words but the ethnologue of these two language have been dissected and they differ. You can lay your hand on the ‘Ethnologue of Bénin Republique'.

1. you are addicted to making baseless claims..You want your questions to keep piling?.. What aroba are your views based on? narrate them
2. Can you provide your sources for this creation of the Igala?
3. https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/41719323_1596161110530050_359050130550161408_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=bdb50b14697de9b4cc602be156f7684c&oe=5C3B7B31

2. It was supposed to be less than 4000 which was intended to be conveyed. ‘4000,000', was a mere typo error because there is no previous posts of mine that didnt support the less than 4000 years.

ok..much better.. but when are you going to be honest with yourself that you cannot answer my questions?

3. Bolaji Aremu said such in his work but I am sure you know 1. there was a research that showed Ibo is said to be the oldest language on earth . Does this not nullied Bolaji Aremu's claim? 2.This was proved through cognate words of more ancient Kemet,which was the name of Horus,that was presence in Ibo's language .Depsite the Ibo alphabets being shaped by some missionary and Rev.Samuel Ajayi Crowther didnt acknowledge the insibidi lettering in Iboland? 3. And the Yorubas were a developed group over a thousand year ago and didn't know this Ibo lettering?. After all, Yoruba prince made his presence known in Edoland,over 1000 years ago where some Ibo scholars claimed Ibos had once lived. This also support my nos 1 answer

1. who were those involved in this research? provide their names please
2. there are no cognates between two unrelated languages... for cognates to exist, the languages must belong to the same language group. ..therefore if your 'researchers' told you cognate words in ancient egyptian and igbo exist, they must have not been researchers at all
3. What significant contact did Yorubas have with Igbos to have known of Nsibidi? Nsibidi was a very secret knowledge not known by most Igbos...it wasn't even an Igbo writting to begin with ..it was originally Ekoi..Igbos lernt it from the Ibibio less than a thousand years ago...long after the Proto-Igbo had separated from the Proto-Yoruba-Edo-Igbo

Any Igbo tradition that is older than the Proto-Igbo must still have traces in the modern Edo or Yoruba or both

How does this support your claim of Yoruba oral account of migration?

4. Élu is up iin Ibo and does not in any way relate, with Oorún( sun) of Yoruba's and ancient Hebrew's ‘or'(sun) In fact Yoruba's Orán (light of sun ) do have same cognate with Hebrew's ‘or'( sun light).

Yoruba - Orun(Sky). Igbo - Elu (Up above)...it follows the 'r' - 'h' - 'l' pattern between Igbo and Yoruba.

Mr. man your use of the term 'cognate' is very abusive... that is how one mad man said 'ebora' is 'deborah'
to claim two words are etymologically cognates you need to first establish that they are words from two related languages....borrowed words are disqualified... so at this point we have already established that Yoruba and Hebrew can never have cognates...what you should be doing is trying to find borrowed words because cognates do not exist.

5. You call me a liar on ‘eym' of Ancient Hebrew as having cognate Yoruba word? Didnt I post the ancient Hebrew with it before the English alphabets' interpretation ? Well pealim.com is not among at all,if you sesrch for the earliest ancient Hebrew and has never been useful to me before or now.So get this off your mind. I surpas that site.

yes..read my last statement and understand the meaning of cognate

You gave me pealim.com...so now when the website disagrees with your claim you dump the website in the trash..same website you were praising yesterday?
give me a dictionary that surpasses you

6. Moba descendants have account ,of their migration the same way the Odua descendants have account of descending from Oke - Ora ( Hil - mountain of Ora ), in the same way Ancient Kemet's ‘ke' –hill and ‘Ra'( Pharaoh-turned god)

Yes..Migration within Yorubaland...not from outside yorubaland.. Moba came from Lagos not Jerusalem

Please, I'm still waiting for the oral account of migration of any yoruba town. and when i say 'migration' i mean from outside yorubaland
highest you can probably do is name some towns that were founded by Bini princes and nobles

7. Rethink? Hmmmm, you are funny . Have you not seen that I screenshot some words- etymological appendix?

Lemme recommend the following books if you want to quash my research but I know, you will be humbled tthrough the shocking revelation you will see.They are:

Lexicons
The Analytical Hebrew and Chaldee Lexicon

Dictionaries
Etymological Dictionary of Biblical Hebrew

The Word: The Dictionary That Reveals The Hebrew Source of English

I will give another Jáàrá

Hebrew: ikkar
Meaning: in servitude

Aramaic: kr
Meaning: cultivate

Yoruba : Kó(r)
Meaning: cultivate

so why haven't you post some of the things these books say? shock me here with the revelation... i have wasted enough money buying books you ill-informed hebrew slaves recommend, give me a review then i see if it is worth buying


yoruba word for cultivate is 'roko'.. pronounced 'rohkoh' not 'Kor'

If you cant speak good yoruba you can at least use dictionary

0balufonlll:
LOL bro, aku ijo meta. It is good to see your posts again. Solid as always.

These modern religions have done serious damage to the mental state of many with regards to how they see themselves. The thoughts of these people are very funny to say the least.

Apart from their poor knowledge of Yoruba history, they also enjoy stretching or distorting words as well as grafting meanings to create issues despite the literal meanings of a word being straight to the point.

I just pity those around them, they would have done a great disservice to the minds of these people to think along the lines of the abracadabra.

egbon. era o... you were the pioneer historian here now that goes Isese and goes academics, before you, we just had sit at home self acclaimed historians passing speculations as facts.

I have never seen stubborn people like this..ans so unwilling to learn... but the good thing is I am here for them

Olu317:
As usual, they will always be antagonising without evidence to counter ,the etymology I have given, the screenshots ,

How am I antagonizing you? you said you have knowledge and want to teach it
So if your audience in a lecture ask you questions, you will call it antagonizing? This is one reason i believe you are a church man...used to talking and making all sorts of pronouncements unquestioned... not an academian that loves questions but you said you are not a pastor

I did not see any etymology... Giving etymologies are good.. The only screenshot i saw was that Addereth picture which had no etymology, neither did any thing in the picture show how 'addereth' is related to 'adire' www.nairaland.com/attachments/7756639_img20180912115448_jpege95c8072c008a4994f791743530d7678

Adi - Tie. Re - dye what is the etymology of 'Addereth'?

But the majority of the Yorubas dont identify themselves with any group but Yorubas. Where then,do these Ogas in the past and present got their own clue about Yoruba being related to Fon, Ibo, Nupe, etc? Anyway, I expect these people to be bold enough to come pinned their family to IleIfe Ijébu'Rémó did. . Let these people that you have mentioned point to any group in Ileife as their ancestral home as other yorubas did. Or sè ómó má fí òwó osì júwè ìlè Bàbà rè ? Anyway, I am 100% sure you dont have such understanding as regard the ancient ways of Yoruba ancestors to know what made them unique. Plainly,you cant understand what you dont know.

You don't understand that the split between Yoruba and her major closest neighbors - the Igbo and Edo happened about 3000 years ago, this means that for all the generations of Yorubas, Edos and Ibos for centuries lived speaking already different languages...coupled with the fact that these people organized themselves into different settlements that little or no contact with each other for a long time. The Yoruba, Edo and Igbo civilizations only kicked off after the split, all the myths and peculiar/unique traditions came up after the split. The only thing that we can look to as a connection goes back to the myth of creation of all 3 civilizations - The creation of the world by a spiritual figure ...in the case of the Yoruba, that is Oduduwa who created civilization over a flooded area...the Ibos have Eri who created civilization over a flooded area...the Edos have Idu who created civilization over a flooded area... I like to use this to conclude that since we have already pin pointed the split to have happened in the Niger-Benue confluence, the river must have flooded chasing these 3 groups to various directions

Edos and Igbos cannot claim Ife origin because they are not Yoruba, heck! not all Yoruba claim Ife origin. Ife is the begining of Yoruba civilization

saying why do Edo and Igbo not claim Ife is stupid to be frank

In his book,Understanding the whole student, Benjamin Lee Whorf stated, in what has become known as the Whorf hypothesis, that; "language is not simply a way of voicing ideas, but is the very thing which shapes those ideas." As you can see an hypothesis was propounded by a well known scholar in the western world who understand how language is a way of people's life and its connection to her tradition, to understanding what make such ethnic group,behaves the way they do.

And what part of Whorf's work did he imply a connection between Yoruba and Hebrew? that is the point you should be making..because all well known linguists have long finished research as to Yoruba's place in the Niger-congo group of languages and hebrew's place in Afro-Asiatic
so where is the correlation?

As you can see macof,your view is shallow on your claim as I had said on the usage of peculiar word as solely used in Yoruba cosmology and spiritualism because each ethnic group's language is the basis for their spiritual connection to metaphysics....Édà is a spiritual word that became popular because, Yoruba traditional system acknowledged through Onifà, who tell the Yoruba seeker what to do so as to appease his/her creator called, Élédáà . And on Ènian/Èniyàn, the hypothesis also counter your opinion.

you said 'eda' is used to refer only to a yoruba person, meaning non-yorubas are not Eda...therefore they have no creator. I will show you video of Babalawo telling a white man to appease his Eleda...meaning that white man is an Eda...because to have an Eleda is to be an Eda..

I have to question your intelligence to argue the meaning and use of Eda when every dictionary in the world agrees with me...even if your command of yoruba language is poor... a sensible human being should have used a dictionary and save himself embarrassment

https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/41702113_1595546270591534_7422269985084407808_n.png?_nc_cat=0&oh=14757961ef249887b1ddc7cae4969f24&oe=5C1B0E3B

As many who enjoy being relevant to claiming a field so eminent in human history from.Yoruba perspective should go back to Western world's higher college to learn more about humanity as a whole. Oke Ora in Yoruba land was ne'er the birth place of Odua ,jn the same manner the hierology and adimula or Adimunia meaning is shrewded in mystery's.

And what higher college in the western world did you attend/attending? What country? France?

Is it your western world higher college that told you Oduduwa did not come from Oke-ora?... So have you checked with your university history professor and discussed about Oduduwa coming from Israel? I guess you are the custodian of Oduduwa secrets...the Obadio of Ife must be a learner where you are for you to know the bithplace of oduduwa..yet you are not a traditionalist or an Ife indigene ...better don't insult the priest of oduduwa by trying to claim what you dont know because of christianity and hebrew sentiment that you want to push...church work

On a last note, stop crying over spilled milk because my information has been proven with citations from western researched work,who have being busy deciphering Ancient Hebrew, Greek,Persian,Assyian, Egyptian's ancient form of writing. Kindly move along the jet age to solve the hidden riddle so as to bring the glory of Yorubas being Yorubas. A people with their great religiousness and spiritual connection to Èlèdúmárè

not one of your claims has been proven...stop lying
show use one confirmation by one renowned researcher that actually agrees with you while providing evidence.... the only person who mentioned was Dierk Lange who doesnt agree with you

If connection to Eledumare is so important to you, why not dump christianity and enter Isese?

But you have not answered even close to half my questions

most of what you wrote here are just more claims which will just bring more questions...why not try to not make any claims at all or go off topic until you have answered me

Olu317:
Lemme clearly state here as the following:
1.16. I am not a pastor ooo nor has christianity being the basis for my field work nor my discipline.

Field work? Discipline? do you know what these terms mean?
well, Lets not argue this one...main thing is that you have clarified that you are not a pastor

2.3. Pealim is one of the site, to verify information but trust me,there are other site that will help you on it. Do you want to study ancient Hebrew? I shall be willing to be of a help. Beside,‘em',‘e'em',‘eym' are closely linked.

Pealim.com https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/41654924_1595333913946103_8883794854232981504_n.png?_nc_cat=0&oh=88518e8f9d9a117a906f54212f72624f&oe=5C291979

Your dictionary link proves my earlier statement that 'iye'(mother) is 'ima' or 'ema' in Hebrew and disproves yours vehemently. Mr. Olu, did you lie when you said 'mother' is 'eym' in hebrew?

Why would you want to resort to lies?

3.ILEIFE that was termed as the ancestral home of Olofin Ooni, or yoruna has even be claimed to have being relocated more than 7 times. And th forebearers remembered didnt have ancestors.....who were their ancestors? Furthermore, I expect you to know the history of Yorubas ,according to documented acount. So, no need to drag me backward.Even when one visits an Onifa, an account testify to this; in the corpus of IFA, there are account which reference an account of when Orunmila is travelling .


For instance, when orunmila was said to be coming from Orú to Ikolè Àyè.......Did Ikolè existed in Yoruba land during Orunmila's time?

I think you were trying to answer question no. 1 here... I'm not sure but i'll take it as such

Nobody is sure about how many times Ife has been moved, or if it has ever been moved...People just suggest and throw out the possibility that current Ile-ife wasnt the site of the first Ife.. Personality, I am of that opinion too..but that leaves us with a question? ; Where were the previous Ife? And how many previous Ife existed?
Now I don't have the answer but feel free to tell us...with evidence


there are too many stories of Orunmila coming to Ikole-Aye from Orun.. but I hope you know 'orun' means 'spiritual realm' and its not an actual place where one can "migrate" from

Ikole is not Ikole-aye. Ikole was an Ekiti kingdom, and Ikole-aye is Earth itself

4.In the history of Otun Ooré,their account acknowledged migration through the sea and moved through Lagos before they settled down in Ileife and further emigration outside Ileife. Where did Otun and his people came from?

How is Moba related to Hebrew?

If you are trying to suggest that not all Yoruba towns originated from modern ile-ife...that bit is already recognized by historians...so yes, according to Atolagbe(although himself not an actual historian, but his book is so far the best we have on Otun history) the Otun Oore emerged from the water at Moba in Lagos state...it is explicit in the citations made by Atolagbe "okun moba lehin eko"

But how does this connect to hebrews?

5.‘ ke',after decoded means,‘mountain', in ancient Egyptian language and there is a land of ,‘Ra' and there is ‘ mountain Ra' which literarily mean (Ke'Ra).

This was my no.5 question

macof:
surely for you to know these remnant traditions of hebrews in yoruba that i and many others do not know, you must have your sources?
5. Kindly direct me to a link or at least a name, lets identify where you got the information from

rather than claim 'ke' means mountain in ancient egyptian language, you should have directed me to your sources on remnant hebrew traditions in yoruba

Like i said before, just saying this means this, that means that is not the way to show connection between two different languages, you need to bring a lot of examples and identify a pattern of change. for example.. In Yoruba 'sh' becomes 'ch' in Igala eg. Isu - Ichu. Ose - Oche. Osu - Ochu. esisi - echichi. 'r' in Yoruba becomes 'l' in Igala eg. Irawo - Ilawo. Oruka - Elika. etc like 'g' and 'w' are usually rendered into 'gw' in Igala eg. Ewa -Egwa, Ogun -Ogwu
You can then use the pattern to reconstructed a little bit of the proto-yoruba-igala language.

there is also a 'r' 'h' 'l' romance between Yoruba and Igbo eg. 'Ohun' - 'olu'. 'orun'(neck) - 'olu' . 'ara' - 'ahu'. 'orun'(sky) - 'Elu' (this one actually can help understand what the yoruba 'orun' etymology is because 'elu' is still used among igbos to be 'high above')

which brings me to one interesting point that an OAU linguist Bolaji Aremo wrote in his book 'How Yoruba and Igbo became different languages'
Yoruba - Irunmu (pubic hair) = Irun amu. Igbo - Amu(Peniss)


ps. if you want to claim egyptian or hebrew words mean anything please post a link to a dictionary or a picture, because the 'eym' lie you told is still fresh...your words cannot be trusted (especially as no dictionary i could get my hand on says so)
you can also always ask me of the same, should you look my words up and find no dictionary

6. I know Oke Taase is the home of Araba and the lineage has been from Orunmila descendants even till now. Why is Ado claiming Home of IFA? Addo-Iddo-Haddad was an ancient home of some Hebrew priests

This was my question

6. Who are the other groups the Yoruba met as they were migrating down to Nigeria? and what part of Yoruba accounts confirm those foreign accounts, it is after all the yoruba that is being talked about, surely the yoruba accounts must give legitimacy to what ever foreign accounts

As you can see, Yoruba land in Nigeria is a reflection of where they came through to remembering and naming every abode that they settled down in, with their ancestral names. As you can see there's more to what you don't know that you need to know about Yoruba that some of us are already exploring.

Sorry, you have failed to make me see what you are seeing. Maybe you should look at my questions again and if you cant find answers maybe you should start rethinking your claims first

My postulation is ; Yoruba language is less than 4000,000 years because, it was derivative of ancient Egypt(kemet) during hieroglyphs period+ancient Hebrew = Yoruba.

Henceforth, I will be economical and won't share my work anymore but my opinion.

4million years? human ability to communicate is barely 40thousand years and baba is calling out 4 million years for one single language

So far You haven't even shared your work, my questions was all about getting you to show a bit of your work...cause baseless claims do us no good


you only addressed 2 or 3 of my questions...which if i wanted to be serious would only generate more questions..because with each post you make, you make new claims without any explanation, talkless of evidence