Olu317: You see, it is hard for you to comprehend because you do not have Omoluabi bloodline in you,which is the reason you use vulgar word so cheaply. In ILE IFE , Adimula is pronounced as in the form of Adimunia . In fact so many words were interchange in yoruba Braille,because Oyo descendants and apologists were the first set of educated Yorubas. Do you have no knowledge that Èri was changed to Ori,Eledumare was changed to Olodumare,Edumare was changed to Odumare,Umolé( Umalé being used by itsekiri) was changed to Imolé, Alujonu was changed to Anjonu? What's your point? I had mentioned ‘logical'explanation with my analysis as regard names of Odua descendants as it regard their sojourn in different places. So ,you can see,you are the one that need learn. And specifically when I mentioned Oranmiyan ,Sango,are only meant to testify to the manner , these descendants excelled,to justify their ancestor's territory conquest and name. If you don't understand what Ram sacrifice to Odua,then practically you have no knowledge of Odua apart from the books you read. Let me be plain, the Oranmiyan form of sacrifical worship is to who if not to ancestors ? Who told you I accepted the theory of Mecca nor did I accept ILE IFE Nigeria? Even archeology has just subdued Yoruba's claim even by Israel being more than 190,000 years older than human fossil discovery. Honestly, Eledumare is too awesome. Macof ,go and do more research and stop being hateful. In as much that Odua came from somewhere as a migrant,then he could have come from the set of people that uses Ram as sacrifice . Be mindful, that your Egypt didnt kill Ram but worship Ram .However, I can inform you that no one within ancient Africa , sacrifice Ram likened to Odua and Yoruba except Hebrew . Or did you know any yoruba history that mentioned, Ram sacrifice to Obatala ? Amother interesting is the similarity in names of certain things. Take for instance, Yoruba IFA( Oracle) is similar to Hebrew Ephod ( Oracle). If IFE can be on Togo,then ILE IFE could have been anywhere because there is NINEVEH in Middle East . What about ONIAS in Egypt? or The Yeb( dont even go far to Israel to look for Jebusites) in Egypt's which similar to Jebus of Yorubas. I have studied and did comparison. You will remain like some Yorubas that knows Odu IFA ,especially the one that talked about Eledumare and his Creation power (exactly like the hebrew's God account of Creation) that had existed uncountable years which ILE IFE Nigeria can't defend.
Oga go and study like a scholar which must be outside your Yoruba own's account.
Olu317: Well,there is no known history that didn't mentioned Adimula/Adimunia as an aborigine of the ILE IFE that Odua and his group surfaced. I mentioned his group because , there is no way Odua would have been able to subdued everyone under his feet if he had no supporters outside the ones that will naturally be his supporters within the location he resided. Yeah,the Oral history mentioned a coming King , but from where? And if logical is applied , then it is obvious, they must have camped at a place within Oke Ora before emergence and reestablishment of his monarchial system, which he knew about . I infer on this because the period between Obatala and Adimunia(Odua/ Olofin) was the greatest in terms of rivalry either spiritually or physical prowess. The ritual that is attached to the house of Odua involves Ram's sacrifice etc . Do you know that Obatala worshippers are not the only one that uses white ? Do think the uses of white by Oonis is by fashion or Ogboni association ? Am sure, you know these things. If Odua worshipped God with white Ram( what is associated to ancestors) and used white Cockerel, doves, pigeon etc, do you not see reason to compare with other people with such tradition? Well, you wont really understand, except you feel his descendants feel ,that challenges whoever insult their ancestor. I am sure you heard why Shango went to fight and search for the people that insulted his ancestor. I am sure you know Oranmiyan came back to take back the throne. This is always the driving force for inquisitiveness and research. Many books were written but a lot only did surface research and generalisation. This is because the secrecy in ILE IFE allowed many information to be swept away because both men ancestors are not even identifiable. Perhaps, you can share your knowledge on it if you know.
What is all this? ram sacrifice, sango, oranmiyan went back to take the throne, obatala wearing white.. What do these have to do with Oduduwa coming from Mecca you are just saying things that do not concern the topic. And WTF is Adimunia?...it is Adimula
You are not normal o, something is really wrong in your head
Olu317: Run from who or what? My pyganeric is all about seeing challenges and facing it. We do subdue challenges and dont fear no man. You better be weary of me . No wonder it seems you have been brainwashed by Samuel Ajayi Crowther's book. A great man, he was, but there were too many conspicous mistakes in this book. Better read other books or at best go on investigative mission to ILE IFE and all the location the descendants of the Odua lives(laughing hysterically) . A real big work(research) for you......
And where in Ife did you get that oduduwa is from Mecca or anywhere outside Africa?
Olu317: @macof ,you must learn to be humble. Humility showcase the strength of a real conqueror. And if you want to be one,learn the strength and weakness of your enemy (ies) . I inferred not as your enemy but as someone who think outside the box.
Mr. man provide evidence for your claims and stop lecturing somebody who doesn't need lectures. did i tell you i need to be a nairaland conqueror
The ILE IFE tradition and oral account in Nigeria does not have a strong evidence for your assertion. ILE IFE glory didn't start before AD, but around 1000AD—1100 AD with heavy evidence
This is just plain silly. let me tell you simply - any story about the Yorubas claiming to be Historical that is not recorded in the traditions of any part of Yorubaland is not history at all but pseudo-history. Our traditions are not perfectly detailed but fine enough to keep the knowledge of our history spanning over 800 years intact, without written historical documents this is an incredible feat.
So Yoruba traditions do not need an overbearing outside "evidence" when we say Oduduwa came from Oke-ora. What you might demand is evidence that such a claim is traditional, anything outside that is a wild goose chase. There are things that would need such evidence not this, you can then choose to take it or leave, afterall some people do not believe oduduwa existed at all, but what you have no right to do is to make a claim that has no basis in our tradition and try to sell it as History
And this Support is all over Ife, unlike Bini, who would just say Oduduwa came from Bini without that being visibly part of Bini traditions, Ile-ife and other Yoruba towns have traditional practices that support their claim - Oke-ora and Ido feature too prominently in the coronation of the Ooni, Oke-ora is where the Ooni has his ancestral shrine, it is here he collects the Ade oduduwa(different from Aare), the foot of Oke-ora is where Ido begins, it is at Ido Oduduwa planned all his attacks against Obatala etc. All these age long traditional practices coupled with oral history can stand firm enough
Controversy
1.The ILE IFE in Nigeria is not known to be older than the account adduced to more than 45,000 years 2. The Yoruba calender is 10,062 year(2017) 3. The oldest human fossil in Yoruba land ( Iwo Eleru) is 9000+ years ( No account in the study of the skull in Germany ever claimed the skull was Yoruba ancestor) 4. Oke Ora is not older than 300BC(with only evidence of animal husbandry) 5. Odu IFA mentioned Orun —Aiyè migration ( Journey from Orun by Orunméla)
Counter 1. The oldest bone was found in Morocco(approximately 300,000 years) 2. The older discovery of another fossil in China( 260,000-year-old Chinese skull ) 3. The Older bone was found in Ethiopia(approximately 200,000 years old) 4 . The Old one bone was just found in one cave in Israel(197,000—200,000)
With such investigation, how can you claim ILE IFE of Nigeria is the oldest on planet earth? Maybe ILE IFE is the NiNEVEH of the old mesopotemia?
Learn from others and add to your knowldge.No man knows it all. The reason Almighty God remain Almighty
The tradition of Ife being the oldest city on the planet is quite understandable considering it is the oldest city in the ancient world of the Yoruba ancestors, they with limited knowledge of the world's geography would of course have believed Ife to be the oldest city in the world, more proof that we Yorubas did not come from Mesopotamia or Middle east, if we did we would have had better knowledge of the "outside world"
It does not matter how old Ife is, I am not talking about the myth of creation or Ife's beginning here but King Oduduwa's possible origin. King Oduduwa did not exist before Ife, Ife was already a booming center, that is what attracted oduduwa to go as far as he went to be King
Note: I say 'King oduduwa' to separate him from the creation myth
Olu317: Now, look at your rigidity in not studying? Either you like it or not ,the Fact remain largest percentage of Yorubas are non Hamitic. The place you got your info from is archaic. Go learn about Focusing on ancient population genomics research; Ancient genomes from Neolithic North Africa (Fregel et al. 2017 preprinNeolithization of North Africa involved the migration of people from both the Levant and Europe , bioRxiv , Posted September 21, 2017, doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/191569. The better for you to follow the path of truth and let go off ego, the better for you. It doesn't matter if you don't care about who I am in modern day Yoruba land but in the olden days ,you would have paid dearly for any unwarranted insult on my personality and others you have no known knowledge of their ancestry. It is obvious, you are not a good Yoruba man because ancient Yoruba men chose wisdom as their path and are always slow to anger and firm to taking action when necessary. But instead you use vulgar words on people you had not seen. See what science has done to identify humanity. I don't even think you know how proud I am being a descendant of Yoruba? I leave you to your fate.
Please what do you wven mean by large percentage of yorubas are non-hamitic ? Although the term "hamitic" is archaic and obsolete I still understand what you mean by that but answer my question in bold
If Yorubas had some significant "non African population " years of living together and intermarriage would show in the DNA analyses You cannot say the foreigners have remained "unmixed" with the others ...oh wait...maybe you can sef. Cus you have a reputation for thinking upside down
So please...ebe no o ikunle ni mo wa. Answer the question
And the please I got my information is archaic right? Ok please provide the recent study...
Ogbeni keep quiet with this blab about truth. Which truth without common sense or evidence?
isalegan2: I enjoy Olu317"s posts o! The more Yoruba traditionalists the better. I have to admit, I also wonder about the Sudanese and Arabia connection to Yoruba. Maybe science can refute or confirm them in the near future.
Science has already confirmed an African origin for Yorubas, therefore cancelling out any Arabia connection. Yorubas have over 90% of the E-V38 DNA, more than most African ethnicities, which is an important gene maker for "Africanness"
Olu317: Well, confirmation does not lie in Nigeria alone but in places like Egypt and other part in middle East . However, it is important here to emphasise that a very dominant name name such as Aki( Akin—when pronounced in a nassal way) is very rampant in Yoruba land which is used for Hero . And this name Aki/ Achi is also of Chaldean Origin which occur in chaldean Legend as a name of a hero who rescued Shargani Shar Ali ,i.e Sargon the elder from being drowned . Funny enough Hebrew king bore that Name too Joachin( Joakin/Joakim). Are the names coincidental ? "Si" means “ life "in Sumerian Ancient language and means the same in Yoruba Olu “si", Ko ma “si"( he/she is dead). Hannon is merciful in Hebrew so also Anu is mercy in Yoruba. Are this coincidental? May be I dont know my history so much and someone like macof ,who claimed to be a descendant of Odua cant defend the exact place of Odua origin before some aborigine in Edo that claimed Odua despite the fact their claim are false. He clamied expertise on Odua history but when others attack Yoruba tradition ,he weakly tuned to insulting them . The same macof once claimed his ancestor was one of the ancient Pharaoh but Yoruba tradition uses ram as sacrifice. In fact it is a Yoruba tradition to kill ram for feast and sacrifices but Egyptian worship ram . Who is the inconsistent here ? Does a true son of yoruba need behave in such manner? I know about Oranmiyan ancestral worship and Té'Fa. Furthermore, someone like Modupe, Oduoye ,who is an ethnologist,philologist,Multilinguist,Author whose book is well enrich in Yoruba language and relationship with middle east and Egypt language can't be bias. What I seemingly conclude about some lovers of Yoruba culture is that they were non conformists and this is their problem. If as far as 1914, an enquiry was made about people of West Africa, including Yoruba. I quote,“Sir Harry Johnston write as follows: The more one inquires into intricate religion of West Africa, especially in the whole region of Niger the more we come irresistibly to the conclusion that they are founded on ideas which have traveled all the way from Egypt or from southern mediterean shore". From S.G.C JOURNAL 27TH APRIL 1914.Journal of the Institute of African language and culture . Vol II No 4 page 411. History of Nigeria by A.C BURNS page 32 ,Mr millison Account declared that Yoruba had been a fully clothed mortal . Do Yoruba begun Cloth making in South west Nigeria? Of course not because Odu IFa corpuse mentioned yoruba wearing clothes and excavation at ILE IFE hasnt proven Yoruba to had made clothing since 305BC . Another Journal written by Dr. Westerman described Yoruba as well organised people and having a highly developed religion and mythology and have knowledge about their history . Some of them have over read the books written by some people that they cant understand that there is only one indivisble God who is the same God of hebrew and Arab who had no known form or shape or seen is the same God of the Yorubas but specifically referred to in the bible and Ifa corpus as ancient one . I cant truly understand these set of people that have wisdom and understand it not. The ancient Yoruba adage say, "A ki ra omo ni oja ; Olorun ni fun ni " ( Children cant be bought at places ; but are gift from God ( Olorun). is this not the believe of Hebrews? Are this also coincindental? Well, confirmation does not lie in Nigeria alone but in places like Egypt and other part in middle East . However, it is important here to emphasise that a very dominant name name such as Aki( Akin—when pronounced in a nassal way) is very rampant in Yoruba land which is used for Hero . And this name Aki/ Achi is also of Chaldean Origin which occur in chaldean Legend as a name of a hero who rescued Shargani Shar Ali ,i.e Sargon the elder from being drowned . Funny enough Hebrew king bore that Name too Joachin( Joakin/Joakim). Are the names coincidental ? "Si" means “ life "in Sumerian Ancient language and means the same in Yoruba Olu “si", Ko ma “si"( he/she is dead). Hannon is merciful in Hebrew so also Anu is mercy in Yoruba. Are this coincidental? May be I dont know my history so much and someone like macof ,who claimed to be a descendant of Odua cant defend the exact place of Odua origin before some aborigine in Edo that claimed Odua despite the fact their claim are false. He clamied expertise on Odua history but when others attack Yoruba tradition ,he weakly turned to insulting them . The same macof once claimed his ancestor was one of the ancient Pharaoh but Yoruba tradition uses ram as sacrifice . In fact , it is a yoruba tradition to kill ram for feast and sacrifice but Egytpian worship ram .Who is the inconsistent here ? Does a true son of yoruba need behave in such manner? I know about Oranmiyan ancestral worship and Té'Fa etc . Furthermore, someone like Modupe, Oduoye ,who is an ethnologist,philologist,Multilinguist,Author whose book is well enrich in Yoruba language and relationship with middle east and Egypt language can't be bias. What I seemingly conclude about some lovers of Yoruba culture is that they were non conformists and this is their problem. If as far as 1914, an enquiry was made about people of West Africa, including Yoruba. I quote,“Sir Harry Johnston write as follows: The more one inquires into intricate religion of West Africa, especially in the whole region of Niger the more we come irresistibly to the conclusion that they are founded on ideas which have traveled all the way from Egypt or from southern mediterean shore". From S.G.C JOURNAL 27TH APRIL 1914.Journal of the Institute of African language and culture . Vol II No 4 page 411. History of Nigeria by A.C BURNS page 32 ,Mr millison Account declared that Yoruba had been a fully clothed mortal . Do Yoruba begun Cloth making in South west Nigeria? Of course not because Odu IFa corpuse mentioned yoruba wearing clothes and excavation at ILE IFE hasnt proven Yoruba to had made clothing since 305BC . Another Journal written by Dr. Westerman described Yoruba as well organised people and having a highly developed religion and mythology and have knowledge about their history . Some of them have over read the books written by some people that they cant understand that there is only one indivisble God who is the same God of hebrew and Arab who had no known form or shape or seen is the same God of the Yorubas but specifically referred to in the bible and Ifa corpus as ancient one . I cant truly understand these set of people that have wisdom and understand it not. The ancient Yoruba adage say, "A ki ra omo ni oja ; Olorun ni fun ni " ( Children cant be bought at places ; but are gift from God ( Olorun). is this not the believe of Hebrews? Are this also coincindental?
Lastly, I mentioned macof because he could hardly differentiate between Prefix and body(root) of word in this one because of his biasness . Èl ( used to connote all lord in one big incomparable) + Èdumare becomes Èlèdumare (LordAlmighty God /Lord God Almighty ). Perhaps his bitterness toward other people's opinion has made him not to understand this simple terminology.
What is all this jargons
I couldn't even read til the end with all this nonsense in one post, so I'll address the few that caught my attention...
You said hannon means mercy in Hebrew, prove that please because according to this (picture below) Chacad means Mercy. Nobody here speaks hebrew so quickly provide how you came about this Hebrew knowledge Joachim - Yahoyaqim - Lifted by Yah ... Yaqim has nothing to do with Yoruba 'Akin'
"Semetic connection" will end up running you mad, seeing connection in unrelated things is a problem i tell you
Where did I ever claim to be descended from Pharoahs? abi you are high?What nonsense Pharoahs Do you think I need to be descended from Pharoahs to be comfortable with my identity?
È mi gan gan ni Omo arogun màsà Omo ari oté mà bée ru Omo Afi idi pa oté molée/b][
nobody cares who you are please, o ba fe, ko je omo olori mewa, facts are facts. I am not your enemy, so stop trying to throw cheap silly jams.
I will continue to defend yoruba nation from madness like this, from both internal and external threats to Yoruba Identity
DevdanSanguine: And i'm sure igbos (and others) will provide other reasons as to why they have a better case than yorubas. If races came out from africa then how are you lot trying to claim that you came into africa even when all evidences show otherwise? Why is it so important to you to try to prove that you werent originally african?
I wonder. It is really sad that Africans hate their identity so much..
Imagine Eledumare is now El edumare. When it comes to this madness of linking Yorubas to outside Africa they lose all senses and connect the unrelated
bignigerian: Hi guys I have to open an account to let out this story.
My girlfriend of 5 years, she was 18 and I was 23 both students when we met. We have shared everything together, I mean everything u can possibly think of. She told me she can't continue the relationship. That we can't marry each other.
Her reasons She met 2 pastors who told her we are not compatible with each other. One told her in 2014 and the other in 2016 of which she told me about both of them. But last 3 weeks she broke the ice on the grounds that 1. she needs to choose her husband with all diligence. That her grandmother has 2 husbands, her mum has 2 husbands and she can't thread that path because those pastors told her we shall split if she marries me. 2. She doesn't want me to hear that she got married to someone else.
Her mum doesn't like me and doesn't want me to marry her and recently she is pestering her to marry another man, her Pastor. This man talks with her every time, calls her, gives her and her mother gifts. Well I give them gifts to my capacity too. But pastor is playing son-in-law game well because he (pastor) said God told him that she is his wife. The pastor anyway happened to be a real pastor, I can attest to that, but I can't vouch if his vision is from God or self induced.
But babe told me she has not made up her mind yet and that she didn't break up with me to marry that man. That she will take her time to decide what she will do and maintaining a single status.
We all stay in the same neighborhood, bae is a nairalander too. She will see this and get angry but... I need matured views on this issue...
Something is wrong with you. the intelligent conman of a pastor is using brain for all of you and you are still saying he is a real pastor.
Efewestern: How re you sure non of them happened?, because it didn't suit your own narrative?, The person who wrote this is an itsekiri man, and you can see how be broke everything down. Agreed he over exaggerated the strength of his people, and also the part where he said Urhobo was under itsekiri tutelage was never true. The urhobos already existed before the itsekiri was founded.
I concur with the Oba title, only top monarch like oba of Benin, oni of ife etc can be called oba, the rest are olu.
The op also gave some proof, you can ask the epe people of Lagos if they weren't conquered by the itsekiris.
Olu is a generic term for a person in a position of highest authority in a large settlement, similar to Oloja for a leader of a small settlement. Oba is a title for an Olu
The first use of the tile was at Ife, where most of the 13 Ife leaders used the title, ie. Oba Iwinrin, Oba Ijio, Oba Ilejugbe etc Oduduwa himself never went by 'Oba' because it was a title for those chiefs who he claimed to head. it was later princes from Ife who went around founding kingdoms that popularized the tilte 'Oba'.
geosegun: This is how information nay knowledge should be shared and corrections made if any, and not like @macof using repulsive words/sentences.
Excellent discussions going on here...
It was a thing of stupidity to insult the entire yoruba nation by calling our tradition idol worship.. That is what is repulsive. If people do not step up to challenge this abusive tag, it will go on forever
And there is no knowledge passing from the person you are quoting. There is no non-indigenous african element in Yoruba, this is fact
It is not every senseless post I reply these days, I'm too busy for that
geosegun: I am highly disappointed to read such uncouth sentences from you, a so called learned traditionalist? Gosh! who could not decipher between hear says and what someone believes. For the records, as much as I love history. I personally never believed in the Mecca Nimrod story. I was only emphasising on someone's claim of never heard of Lamurudu and nothing more. Idol Worshipping takes different form you can be a traditionalist and ever have idol but people do. Sorry what do you call someone who worship Sigidi?
If you think I would descend so low to engage in such abusive banter. Sorry to disappointed you. I do know such.
If you have a contrary opinion please share the knowledge or evidence rather than use of abusive language. I believe you are a bona-fide and well brought up Yoruba man.
I appreciate your understanding.
Oh Woah! Are you really playing the victim right now? You insulting a people by calling them derogatory terms like idol worshippers is stupid... more so for claiming to be Yoruba yourself... It is no abuse it is simply a description of your distorted perception... If you don't want to be stupid maybe you should learn basic things about your ancestors before calling them idol worshippers
So I am the one who is really disappointed
Your last post was not simply "emphasising on someone's claim of never hearing of Lamurudu"
This is from your last post
So it seemed. They actually left due to religious uprising, the oracle has been with the Yoruba from inception. It was even mensioned in some Islamic Hadith. Yoruba used to be idol worshippers even up to this day. Which other tribe have the knowledge of the oracle and uses it like the Yoruba up to this day?
You obviously supported the Mecca claim
Do you even know what shigidi is? Go and learn and stop ignorantly tagging Yoruba traditions idol worship That is an intended insult
geosegun: There was Lamurudu, I heard about this story from my grandmother, whom if she were to be alive today would have been more than 100 yrs old.. The journey from Mecca via Egypt down to Sudan then Bornu and then to Ile ife seemed logical to me.. They follow the river down... So it seemed. They actually left due to religious uprising, the oracle has been with the Yoruba from inception. It was even mensioned in some Islamic Hadith. Yoruba used to be idol worshippers even up to this day. Which other tribe have the knowledge of the oracle and uses it like the Yoruba up to this day?
We used to be Idol worshippers until now. Thanks k God for his grace.
1. Your grandmother was a Muslim was she not? Even if she were not to be... it is a Wide spread claim Any gullible person who doesn't know how to study history would think because some people say it it will be true. The Mecca claim had existed before your great grandmother was born talkless of your grandmother.
2. The claim itself turns history on it's head. You claim. Lamurudu is Nimrod. There is no evidence that Nimrod ever existed. The Hebrews and Arabs made up legends of a Nimrod from ideas they had about some cities in Mesopotamia. Nimrod was not an actual person and he certainly wasn't king of Mecca
Strange how Lamurudu is a typical Yoruba transliteration of Namrud(arabic) ... Namurudu
How this so called Yoruba ancestor has no orisha status, how this so called father of Oduduwa has no oriki
3. Oduduwa did not come from Mecca, this is known to people who actually care to learn Yoruba history.. Go to Ife... go to any ile-orisa. There is no connection between oduduwa and Mecca I am well aware of oduduwa's origin and it is not Mecca or anywhere outside yorubaland
4. I am a traditionalist and you are very stupidd to call Yoruba tradition idol worship. It is the foreign religious cancer that is eating Yorubas like you and your grandmother that prevents you lot from taking appropriate steps to learn Yoruba history
Imagine your ignorance calling Yorubas idol worshipers...
Prechbills: THE YORUBA KINGDOM The yorubas today occupy the land to the south and west of the lower niger. They form one of the leading tribes in Nigeria. Their neighbours are the Hausas And fulanis to the north, the dahomeyans to the west and the Binis or Edos to the east. There is no evidence to show that they, like the Hausas or the Kanuris, had any access to the barber cultures. Origins Like other west African tribes, the origins of the yorubas are still wrapped in myth and mystery. Some of the available evidences show that they arrived at their present homes either in the 10th or 11th century. One of the legends show that they migrated from the east. It is also suggested that their fore fathers were either Berbers or Hamites who migrated to the south from areas around the River Nile. But the most popular and dependable legend says that their ancestors belonged to the Quresh tribe of Mecca in Saudi Arabia. Their first father, according to this legend, was Lamrud or Namrud. He had an idol priest called 'Ya-Harba' from where the tribe got its name. The word 'Ya-Harba' is an Arabic word meaning 'warrior' or 'army - general'. Ya-Harba was the son of Lamrud. When Islam was introduced in Mecca in the 7th century, Lamrud, Ya-Harba and their supporters refused to embrace the religion. Soon, the newly converted muslims were forced to take arms against Lamrud and his pagan supporters. The pagans were defeated after which they fled the city, crossing the red sea to Africa. They got to Egypt in 648 A. D . Soon they moved to Tripoli ,Algeria and Morocco. During this journey the idol priest, Ya-Harba, consulted his oracle ,and he was told that he and his people should go to wherever the Oracle directed them. They followed the oracle's direction until they eventually arrived at Ile-Ife. This was around 900 A. D. Or 1000 A. D. The exact time is not yet known, however. According to the same legend, Lamrud and his idol-priest, Ya-Harba, died on the way. It was therefore Oduduwa who led the Yorubas to Ile-Ife. This is why Oduduwa, and not Lamrud or Ya-Harba, is referred to today as the 'Father of the Yorubas. But even though Ya-Harba could not reach Ile-Ife his people decided to immotalise his name by calling their settlement 'Ya-Harba, ' which was later converted to 'Yoruba'. There we're some who left Mecca with the Yorubas but who did not get to Ile-Ife. Some stopped at the bank of the Red Sea. These now form part of the ethnic groups of the eastern provinces of the Republic of the Sudan. They are known as the Bejas And the Adandawa in Eritrea and Ethiopia. They have the same figure as the Yorubas Of Nigeria. Others are the Shajia( also in the Sudan) . They ,like the Yorubas, carry tribal Marks. In the Chad Republic, there is also another group called the Wadai, who claimed the same historical background as the Yorubas.
PLEASE POST TO FRONT PAGE SO THAT THE YORUBAS IN NAIRALAND WOULD KNOW THEIR HISTORY.
Source; The History of Africa by A. J Wills(P. hD) 1962
CC; Seun Mynd44 Ishilove Lalasticalla
Lamurudu is not known in our traditions. Nowhere in Yorubaland is anything like Lamurudu traditional, this was a muslim attempt to attach yoruba to arabs
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Deadlytruth: This Ife guy again. So you want to say that one single Ibillo man's opinion supersedes that of at least three here which are to the contrary? Keep up the delusion of Yoruba founded Akoko-Edo towns and villages. Only idiotic simpletons who are hell bent on imposing themselves on others would assume that the opinion of a single person could count more than those of several others. I recall how your likes ask for Oba Akiolu's head and tell him he is on a person opinion each time he claims Binis founded and actually own Lagos. Deluded punk!
I'm Ekiti. Everything else doesn't deserve my read
Larooye: If it is the same Ile-Ife that I am from, then as a son of 3 major compounds in Ife I can authoritatively tell you the emboldened is wrong.
An Ooni only become vastly spiritual AFTER becoming an Ooni and you derive this spirituality from Ogboni Obatala, Are, Ogboni Iledi Ooni and each temple of the 201 deities in Ile-Ife.
That applies in every Yoruba kingdom to every Oba
Well, one can argue there is little to nothing "vastly spiritual" anymore...coronations are even rushed now
OrisaEsu: Yes Ugbo group existed, their section was/is Iwinrin in the ancient 13 communities. This Iwinrin clan was in existence as at the time Obatala’s Iranje-Ideta was in existence. So I can’t speak on him being born at Ugbo except it is a figurative expression of his pact with Ugbo when they moved from Iwinrin to Igbo-Ugbo in protest against being ruled by an usurper [also still in existene].
They [Ilaje] call him Oronmakin, it may have been him or another person who became the first Olugbo when they got to their present site.
Why do I say this? After Oduduwa was taken out, Osangangan became king in Ile-Ife. How could he have been an Olugbo at the same time? Except he was the Obawinrin while they were In Igbo-Ugbo because as told to me by uncle, Obatala went to meet Obamakin at Igbo-Ugbo and the latter stepped down from his throne for Obatala to become king - hence ‘Obatala Oba Ugbo’, ‘Obatala Oseremagbo’.
Obatala’s side practically customized the crown — this is making me theorize it may have been the reason all of his children both male & female left Ife. If it was not for Oranmiyan who came back to wage another war, Oduduwa’s connection to ife throne may not have been prominent.
I think we are saying the same thing; lemme try to rephrase if i understand you correctly...Ugbo used to be part of/or the general name for Obawinrin's land but Obatala supporters moved futher to Igbo-Ugbo(modern Mokuro area) where they were led by Obamakin who later stepped down for Obatala? Is that it? Cus that is my thought
As to Ilaje, the fact that Ugbo kept raiding Ile-ife long after the death of Oduduwa from their base in the forest, shows that Obamakin didn't lead them to modern Ondo state (either Ogun or Oranmiyan was Ooni at this time). His status as the king before he stepped down for Obatala is probably what makes him recognized as the first Olugbo
Iranje us in Ile-Ife, the entirety of Iranje Ile & Iranje Oko is called Idita-Iranje.
Quite a tricky question because there were different groups & Obawinrin was the head of Ugbo. Obatala was forced out of town but was invited over to stay with Obawinrin at Igbo-Ugbo [Ugbo Forest is still in Ife], it was from here attacks were launched into Ife till Moremi stepped in. Obatala reluctantly went to join Obawinrin who stepped down from his throne and crowned Obatala King [Obatala Oba Ugbo or Oserema’gbo]. He noved to Iranje oko from here and continued to rule as king till he was appeased back to his palace at Iranje Ile.
Ugbo was one of the 16 groups in Ife. They are still there today and their king remains Obawinrin.
Why do you ask these questions?
Eni ti a bi ni Ugbo to lo joba lode Iranje... here meaning Born in Ugbo, became king at Iranje
Seems to imply Ugbo had always existed, not created due to opposition against Oduduwa and is the birthplace of Obatala
Also Ugbo(Ilaje) recognize Obamakin Osangangan as first Olugbo
Above is the data attached with the document in my possession.
See the dates & put your publications experience to use.
Bini scholar
I've engaged that buffoon on occasion
It seems bini people today have no interest for history or anthropologic knowledge so they just take everything with a mind for local politics and ethnic bigotry Their young are seriously lacking in intellectualism
Y0ruba: I don’t know what you’re on about with this post but it apppears you’re a proponent and a pursuer of the hamitic hypothesis.
Also, I do not know where you got the information listed as your item 5 from but I can bet you do not know the importance & reason for it. Let me also remind you that Oranmiyan is also fed the same thing, a white ram.
To cut the whole thing short, Oduduwa was from Ife and there are families apart from his [Idio] who know his background, identity & exploits.
Some of these families are;
- Ijio family; they received or met with Oduduwa when he left Oke Ora [which was excavated by Eluyemi, an Ife man who was Apena of Ogboni Ife at the time];
- Odin clan of Obameri; they share a very strong affinity with Idio clan of Oduduwa. This stemmed from the bond Oduduwa and Obameri shared. Obameri followed Oduduwa everywhere; this is done today, Lokore [Obameri] follows Odadio [Oduduwa] and play important roles in Oduduwa’s festival.
- Baba Sigidi clan; this group have a close affinity with Oduduwa too. The family shared very historical exploits with the man back in the day. They possess vital information on the man.
There are a number of other houses loyal to Oduduwa and have information on him.
It will interest you to know the man’s cognomen is Oduduwa but his real name was Osin Ora.
He didnnot migrate from anywhere, he was a thorough Ife man who was nothing more than a smart usurper. According him outside source is an unnecessary stretch serving no purpose but for baseless arguments and falsified narratives that are imaginative at best as we have seen with Egypt, Mecca, Benin & Heaven narratives.
To put your number 1 to 6 items to good use, go to Ile-Ife.
1. Oral: Visit Ijio, Odin and Oke’jan in Ife to get proper oral account of Oduduwa and his exploits.
2. For Ebi: Visit Oduduwa’s first palace at Idio. Go to his shrine, observe & discuss with the priests. Hang around at the Idio compound to speak with his family there.
3. Divine: Go to Oke Itase compound, it is directly beside Oduduwa’s palace and opposite Ogun’s palace [the present Ooni’s palace]. Odudwa directed Ifa to stay there as his diviner & Idio clan members were also learning Ifa there. Go to this place to get information bordering on divine.
4. Sculpture: Oduduwa is the only diety with no sculpture in Ife because he was killed [strange story eh?] only awos know this & I won’t drop further information on that. Sculpture didn’t start properly until the time of Obalufon Alayemore. So sculpture won’t tell you nothing on Oduduwa.
5. Ram: Go to Eredumi town in Ife, meet with Chief Eredumi the priest of Oranmiyan, he is the one who kills the white ram with Odudwa’s sword during Oduduwa’s festival.
6. Pigeons/Cocks: all of that is irrelevant as practically all deities take that. Even Edan [iba] collect those, Ori takes those & so on.
So except you’ve explored Ife in & out, you really have 0 knowledge on Oduduwa and what you have are mere arm chair analysis/stories. As Awolowo and Ladoke Akintola both belong to all Yoruba people, only Ikenne and Ogbomoso have detailed history about their early life. This is same for Oduduwa, the man & his exploits are Ife property and it is why Ife is the only place he is worshipped. Ife alone can tell you what the sourceof Oduduwa is, no other source.
Cheers.
Superb Comment. This is an Ife man for such
Your knowledge of the important families to Oduduwa is incredible. i already know your former moniker
You do realize Bini is African right, therefore that post applies to Bini as well? Bini history like other people of sub-saharan africa is based on oral traditions. learn to be open minded especially to matters of your fellow africans, you could be damaging yourself by trying to attack a neighbor without purpose
Culture › Re: The Great Benin Empire by macof(m): 12:46am On Feb 10, 2018
ikunle ni mo wa. Answer the question 
I have to admit, I also wonder about the Sudanese and Arabia connection to Yoruba. Maybe science can refute or confirm them in the near future.