₦airaland Forum

@Godson2009: « #273 on: Today at 12:19:53 AM »  

im still waiting for you to tell me what the reward of good muslim women will be in paradise, is that soo hard to answer?okay please i beg you in god's name

You must have taking us for christians who beg in the name of god Jesus! You begging in the name of your god is completely rejected.

@olabowale
i forgot to ask you,why is the quran arranged haphazardly and in no sensible order with the bible from genesis to revelations,everything is in order the strory follows each other even to the census and you can even corellate some facts in the old testament with the new but not so for the quran,its either verses are expunged for some reason,or one verse has abrogated others or something funny like that, thank  GOD there was no tippex during the time of mohammad

in no sensible order, you said? Please show us two consequent chapters that are completely in disagreement and they do not flow naturally from the former to the latter? Now that you have said that arrangement of the Chapters in the Quran is completely different from that of the Bible, if you can not find any fault in the arrangement of the Quran, then your Bible is 100% wrong. By the way whats your datum/yardstick for sensible arrangement of a thing that was the first and only of its kind, are there other Bibles or earlier bible before what you call Bible today? I guess there are the version will have to count since catholic Bible existed and Protestant Bible came later with "less books", so now tellme which one of them is correct?

And going to the Quran, since your intention is to compare them, then tell us which Chapter of the Bble will be comparable to Surah Iklas (Chapter 112)?

@Kolaxy: « #56 on: Today at 11:18:36 PM »  

Proverbs Chapter 3:5-6 reads: "Trust in the Lord with all your heart and do not lean on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge Him and He will make your paths straight." This is a promise of guidance. God will direct our paths if we fulfil the conditions. What are the conditions?

We see that the good stuffs are all from after Jesus in the Bible, yet they say he is their god, trying to be Christ-like, and rarely do the quote him, alwasy an after thought or a snippet in the sea of Paul and gang stuffs. Maybe this is the reason they failed to follow the injuction of Jesus on the Laws and the prophets situation, they learn how to trust later. If he is this ineffective in your life, my cling to him, just for the blood? Your disregarding him is a litmus of the effectiveness of his blood; Zero effectivenss!



]quote]First of all: Trust in the Lord with all your heart and don't lean on your own reason and intelligence. It doesn't say there that we should not use our reason or intelligence, but not to depend on it. God created our powers of reasoning and our intelligence. But like God created Eve to be subject to Adam, reason must be subject to the Holy Spirit. A wife is most useful in a home. But if she takes over the headship of the home, there will be chaos - as when Eve took over the headship in Eden and sinned. We have to use our reason (and intelligence) to find God's will, Without our intelligence we would not be able to study God's Word or even live in this world. But we must depend on the Holy Spirit to enlighten our reason. Faith is not contrary to reason but is beyond reason - just like multiplication is not against addition but is beyond addition.

[/quote]And the Christians lie that Islam is a way that subjugates women, while we say it is not so, then the puntit Kolaxy representing Christianity brought about the true position of women in Christianity! We in Islam say that Adam and Eve were both equally responsible and there was no curse on any of them, part of the plan of Allah who created them in heaven so that they willeventually have a reason to live on earth to procreate as the viceroy, and the very reason that they were the first He accepted their repentance showing them mercy! Your whole concept above is borne of your own desire without a shred of good evidence! Your Bible is corrupt and when you disobey the instruction of the prophet you love to follow so much that you called him god, ten we ask you, is there anything truthul that can come out of your mouth? This is why all that you wrote seem to us as a Romantic novel, fantasy it is, far away from reality!



[quote]Secondly: Acknowledge God in all your ways. That means to obey every single thing that God reveals to you. Give the Lord first place in every area of your life. Then the Lord will lead you in His perfect will.

Without these two, no one will never understand God

Is there a people that do this as much as the Uncorrupted Quranic Muslims, while yu disobey Jesus, we see a lot of corruptions in your Bible and you structure your lives as you please, even your worship methodology is make up, the rason you have no uniform process, use catholics and Protestants as your example, yet we see many of the old sects make salah gesture like Muslims!

Muhammad (AS) is indeed the answer of acceptance of the Prayer of Prophet Ibrahim (AS) after he and his son, Ismail (AS) finished the building of Kaaba, using the visible foundation line left after the Flood of Nuh (AS)!

Evidetly you dont know that.

The explanation he may have to make to his Lord. No?


Alhamdulillah, I will not have to make any explanation to father, or ghost, or son! I am 100% muslim.

@Reindeer: If Gani lives forever, you see why Muhammad (AS) dont have to be alive to live forever as the "Another Comforter!?" I personally dont care what he left behind as a will, or how he conducted his life. There are many unsong heroes around the world and indeed Nigeria, who is not cause any controversy or let you know what they are all about, in life and in death!

Charity and Philanthropy are not the first thing muslims will be asked, its how you worship and obey Sharia and Sunnah, by the highest being My Lord is Allah My Religion/way is Islam and my last prophet/Messenger is Muhammad (AS).

I am sure if a notable Christian dies and they wrap him up like a muslim and buried him like one among Muslims, you will not be shocked. No and love it that this is truly Christianity that a person can do what he wants? Would you at least no wonder if intentional whats the bass and if the person is still a Christian?

We do not want to bloat, so keep your broom expression to yourself! You must be practicing bad medicine.

Bobbyaf: « #46 on: Today at 02:29:50 AM »

Quote
Since the Christians do not wish to discuss the Trinity in any shape or form, then let them be "with their Donkey book loading on its back syndrome". I am out!

Have you been reading my posts? Obviously not.

I read your posts, and unfortunately I know that you are an intellifgent man, but you suddenly jump to conclusion, without a methodical step by step process that is understandable, in human language and thoughts to get us from point A to point Z of the Trinity course, because you know that it does not make any sense!

How do you say you are a God when you are obviously a human, and say with your own mouth that you have limited knowledge, calling another God to help you, asking Him to aid you, saying you cant do anyhing of your own except He does it by allowing you to have the power of doing it, etc? If Trinity is the concept by which this fake God is calibrated to be God, then Trinity is destroyed by the simple fact that the human god is proven to be human alone and not in any shape a God! I read you Boobyaf, but your material is not qualified as a thing that proofs the existence of Trinity. Nothing does, and the more you struggle with it, the easier to see the follies of that effort!

What language is that Nezan "Wan ibume or"? I said Abuzola comes from good home because he has shown good quality of good home training, you disagree as you accused me of lying, except that I show you that I qualified his statement by saying if a person allows himself to be dragged in the mud, then I have no control of it.

I am sure am older than you, but you were on Nl when some of the people that my sons are in the same age with called me all kinds of names, and even went far as to talk about my wife, all of them are christians, you didnt say anything, or did you except to cheer them on. I am not doing that here, except that I have cautioned others and myself and its up to individuals to accept or reject since I can not force anyone.

I remember a little boy who was saying to me as if i am looking for a job that his father will employ me, and he later said that he and I are equal in age and qualified it that since am under 60 years of age, he in france still in college, can you imagine how old his father is if it were true, and if not can you imagine how angry my sons will be if they catch up with him, except that I raise good children?

Nezan, I developed thick skin and i am sure that the mercy and blessing that my Lord showers me, those youth who insult me, will be gunshy to do it, if we are standing in any corner of the street in Nigeria, in any village whatsoever! My actions are not personal anymore, otherwise i will not come to Nairaland. What for to be insulted by nephews or offsprings?

May Allah make David be like Suraqah, the slave of the disbeliever of Makka sent to shadow the Messenger during Hijr. This slaves horse got entangled in the sand and the realisation came upon him that this man Muhammad (AS) was the truth, hence he accepted Islam which he kept in his heart, not revealed to his master! May Allah make him like Washi, who finally became Muslim after the death of Sayidina Hamzah bin Abi Mutalib. Amin. May Allah make these enemies become illustrous member of the Ummah. Amin.

@Davidylan: « #35 on: Yesterday at 11:52:26 PM »

Quote from: Abuzola on Yesterday at 11:51:22 PM
What a slowpoke. You open your stinking mouth and ask for blood and now claiming to be otherwise, say that to the pig

when we plead the blood, its not physical but in the spiritual . . . we dont go on killing rampage like you blood-thirsty serfs of demons.

Abuzola is kick man. David go take a break, because the blows are just too much, now the blood is spiritual, is there anything physical that can serve as evidence in Christendom?

We in Islam have Kaaba as Quibla for Masjid Haram, Masjid Al AL Nawawi in Madina, Jabal Arafat in Makka, Jabal Nur, Kahf Hira, all in Makka, and masjid Aqsa in Ilya. What do you have really, even the blood is now spiritual?!

@Kolaxy: « #265 on: Today at 05:52:21 AM »

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God- 1Cor 1:18

Post Jesus messages are foolishness, so corinthians, etc dont count. And when you find out that your cross message is worthless, it will be too late. But you show tremendous arrogance for a man who has three gods to say you are saved by the cross, now, not by the power of Jesus, but that of God, since Jesus and God are separate and not the same, your reason for not attempting to answer some 22 questions that I wrote above. No? This morning, it dawned on me that who do human beings will likely call when in need, its no one except God! Then I said to myself who would come to mind when God is mentioned in the earshot of the Christian or when he/she say God, it will never be Jesus picture or name, but the Unseen God Almighty, full of Power!! No, Mr. Kolaxy?

« #266 on: Today at 05:55:47 AM »
Theodore Roosevelt, 26th President of the United States, 1858-1919

“A thorough understanding of the Bible is better than a college education.”

Kolaxy, Roosevelt statement above is very similar to yours; both of you lied! You said that you are in heaven while you are on earth, and Roosevelt hung his hope on a dead god on the cross with a badly written book still going through editions, even as we speak, check out what Darby Publication company in USA is doing with the NIV, while in my life experience the Bible given to me in High School before 1971, is completely different from what the people who came in that year used! Same Bible, same publication, but different editions and revisions, and you are asking me to join you in worship of three gods, one dead, another unknown quantity and the third is a father on a chair, and your badly written book you want me to exchange against Quran, that the styles of recitation go right directly to the Messenger(AS) and not broken and will not till end of time?

@Davidylan and Uplawal: « #35 on: Today at 02:52:58 AM »

Quote from: uplawal on Today at 02:50:28 AM
if you like make it bolder than that,who cares? its for you and nobodyexcept they wanna have a share,KELERU GBERUE,

Please stop the fight guys. It will kill the spirit of dialogue. Ms. Lawal. Eku Odun O. Emi a she pupo o. Olorun a son fun gbogbo awa Muslim o. Amin.

Satanic coward . . . i'm patiently waiting. Spineless followers of a religion with a dead "god" who needs them to run around threatening others when they cant defend the apparent lies and deception.

The muslim curses Satan every time he/she begin recitation of Quran, making Salah or see or get into a condition he/she is not willing to be in. How can such a person be a satanic coward? Think about it for a moment.

But am shocked that you say that they are followers of a religion with dead god! We in Islam do not have Jesus as god. It is therefore you who is the follower of a religion with dead god, since you claim that Jesus died if only for part of three (3) days! No?

David is probably regretting that he called my attention to this thread, just about now! no, as you are reading the reality of your Biblical Jesus, please limit it to your side of the aisle, we do not worship or follow a dead god in Islam, we are worship of the Unseen God the Creator Allah the Almighty, the Irresistable. Is there any God but He alone, the one Solely sort out as to be deserving all worship?

« #23 on: Today at 12:11:50 AM »

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Quote from: Abuzola on Yesterday at 11:44:38 PM
Go and do your google search and bring just 3 contradiction and see if you won't be whpe off your ignorance

dont worry,we get our sources from everywhere my first contradiction from the quran is taken from the book"an introduction to islam"by frederick mathew denny page 53

check your quran in 53;19-23
have you considered el lat,el uzza and manat the third the other,what have you males and he females?that were indeed an unjust division.they are naught but names yourselves have named and your fathers;GOD has sent down no authority touching them.

[b]as you can see mohammad is justifying them,[/b]these verses so called the satanic verses were later removed when he realised how contradictory it was lol lol

Only a dead brain will claim that this is justification by Muhammad or Quran, considering the fact that Allah says He has not sent any authority to such a thing, indicating to them before that it was them and their fathers who have been the namers and the claimers of this! Or what does it mean to those who live in England? For me in my yankee new english, the reading is what i said, its a made up statements by tem and their fathers without authority from Allah!


If this is your dissertation i hope they send you back to do over, except that it was a Christian professor who you fooled with your mutual emotional leaning!

A fool is actaully born every day!

@Davidylan: « #13 on: Yesterday at 11:22:28 PM »

which is funny because we dont see any trace of this "true Jesus of God" anywhere in the quran save for a few haphazard claims by people who never met him.
funny because the main source of the words of this "true Jesus of God" comes from the bible that muslims reject.
Funny because this "true Jesus of God" is called the Messiah and "word of God" in the quran . . . words that have NO MEANING in islam.
Isnt it funny this same person says he hates lies.

Whats funny is that you contradict yourselfin your own writing! The best that the Christians have been able to use to tell us deceitfully that Jesus existed before his birth is his being the word of God, yet Jesus was mute (no a word coming from him so that we can know something else is with God, even as a listener), in all of the events until he spoke in the Quran as a babe defending his mother and telling his listeners his position as a prophet and what will happen to him all the way to his recreation for Judgement. It was much later than this that the said he spoke a word, just like any normal child, without a single shred of evidence that he will be anything special, even as the wise men came, they could have been been crazy for all intents and purposes.

The same word that you have used to qualify him, Muslim have used to indicate how he was created, a commitment that God gave of a thing that He God must do, through the virgin Mary because God decided it, and a command of bringing things to reality as in command to begin to happen, same was used for bringing Adam up as a living fully grown man from admixture of sand and water!

And without wasting any valuable time, did Jesus meet Abraham, yet he said he was before Abraham, but Muhammad who is the Messenger and Prophet of God to all mankind does not have to meet them before his Lord reveals ithe story of these men and indeed Jesus included to him. Or did God not know Jesus?

But wait a minute, Muhammad (AS) met Jesus and others twice: He led them and Jibril in a prayer called salatul Al Ibrahima in Masjid Aqsa in ilya.

Secondly when he was ascending to the the seventh heaven and beyond. He saw jesus and his cousin John in the 2nd heaven above Adam who was in 1st heaven to see the souls of his children as they die and passing, and below 3rd where Idris (Enoch) is elevated above the second is residing!

The facts are the Quranic stories are divergences and truly correct and unique from the Biblical Jewish since the Christians dont have their own, and you can make a litmus test on any story you wish to make as your trial run between islam and Judaismm and Christianity.

@Bobbyaf: « #11 on: Yesterday at 10:49:35 PM »

So why is it that Muslims are free to be Muslims in Christian countries and the reverse isn't tolerated in Muslim countries?

Show me a muslim country and i will show you corresponding fake Christians country you are claiming muslims are free in? This United States was debating encamping Muslims in the wake of the 911, as they did the japanese after Pearl harbor! And USA is not even a Christian Country, or is it?

Its obvious that the text under quote has been misunderstood by you, because deep down you know what Jesus was trying to say.

Teach us the the meaning of it, by using the Syric aramaic original revelation as it came, without the later writers and of course the Greeks' henonic mindset that perverted further the received messages from God to the prophets!

Incidentally the word hate is a strong word in that verse, but when one is faced with a decision betteen Jesus and family, one has to choose Jesus. In essence that will cause hatred in any family.

Then this shatters the notion that Jesus brought peace since families are torn apart on his account. No? This is what happens to all Messengers and prophets (AS), even their own families are torn to shreds, look at Noah, or Lut, whre the child and the wives actually did not follow their own family leadership!

I am sure Muslims who have accepted Jesus have been treated with hate.

The same applies to the Christians or Jews who accepted Islam, take all the Messengers and prophets as servants of Allah! Musa Cohn out of Brooklyn is a shining example. And you know Bilal Philip of Jamaica is a good example here!

@Davidylan: « #9 on: Yesterday at 10:27:17 PM »

Which is absurd because Christ is recorded as quoting from Deuteronomy, Genesis, Isaiah and the book of psalms.

If Jesus merely read from these 4 Books, is not an indication of lack of less than 100% perfection because he did he not read all of them and they are not the revelations in the Bible before the Gospels? Then compare that to the Quran which was revealed to Muhammad (AS) on issues that affected and came about in his community, and at the only hajj he participated in before his death, at least 100,000 Ujjaj (hajj people) were with him, some memorized the complete Quran, and no one of them did not know some part of it! Yet there were many still in Arabia in that ocassion who did not make the hajj, and you and your cohorts, limply claimed the Quran was written after him (AS)?

If you say binded to a single Book, yes, not written down is an absurd statement! Jesus reading of the four instead of everything with his claims that the scribes entered what they wished to enter, is an admission that the Bible was already corrupt, and by the time the Quran verse that proclaimed that the Bible is impure, and going by your statement that the copyist made mistakes, we must not accept that it has 100% purity, for whatever has mistake can not be without mistake, hence an indcation of corruption!

« #10 on: Yesterday at 10:31:12 PM »
Its not unbelievable, there is no doubt there are a few copyist errors in the bible that do nothing to invalidate its authenticity. That same bible goes on to CLEARLY tell us which age was correct (22 or 42).

1 Kings 8:17 tells us what age Ahaziah's father died (40), unless Ahaziah was born before his father there is no way 42 is correct, the right answer would be 22.

You must have taking many tests in your days, apart when a curving marking process is applied because many flunked the tests, if you make a mistake as you have stated about the Bible copyist, do you you get a perfect mark of 100%? The answer is no, and only a blind man will say you are perfect when there is a single mistake, a confirmation from your mouth that the Bible is not 100% and we cant trust it, if we wear our thinking cap right, but of course thats difficult for those who are already sold on a lie!

@Deep sight:

I repeat (as i would have to do to a toddler): Jesus said severally that he was one with the father in the same way as the church was one with each other and one with him. I said: clearly not an existential oneness but metaphorical oneness. What part of this do you not understand? ? ? ? ? ? ? Quote: "I and the father are one, just as ye and i are one" (Are you Jesus?) "Father, may they be one, just as we are one" (Are you Davidylan?).

While you asked the questions if Noetic is Jesus, and if Noetic is Davidylan, you coyly did not answer then! I will therefore say that if you say yes, you know that you are not telling the truth. And if you say no, you will be telling the truth and the reality on ground kills your metaphorical suggestions that you think we in islam and even smart Christians do not see, though the Christians stubbornly refuse to accept the reality that Jesus, can in reality and in metaphoriacl sense be God.

In the above you said that Jesus said as in a prayerful way I take it since it starts with father may "father may they be one, just as we are one" but then before that affirmed that "I (Jesus) and the father (God who sent him from acts) are one, just as ye and I(Jesus) are one". Can these two statements be one, especially when the latter was said as an affirmation of the oneness of the three with Jesus being the link between God on the one hand and "ye" on the other hand, really meaning that "ye" humans are already one with the father (God), while the other verse is now asking for the oneness that we assumed to have taken place when you read the "father may; a statement of request for something to happen", the reality is therefore murky like the face of "large body of water at the setting of the sun!"

Just for reality check, if all of what the above Biblical quotes are assumed to be correct and the audience of Jesus and if the Christians wish to include themselves in it, are true, and they are now metaphorically one with God, and jesus, the following are to be noted and one must ask cogent questions on them:

(a) God is now Jesus.

(b) God is now man.

(C) Jesus is now man.

(d) Jesus is now God.

(e) mann is now Jesus.

(f) Man is now God.

We should now ask ourselves and let the proponents of this idea above answer directly with waffling;

1. When God was alone before creation, in metaphorical sense, He was not really alone becasue Jesus and man were both with Him?

2. When God created heavens and earth before He spoke (Check you Bible; the Book of Genesis), Jesus and man were creating heavens and earth with Him?

3. When God spoke for the first time saying in "Command" let there be light, Jesus and man spoke those words in Command with Him?

4. When the word became flesh, as Jesus, then God and man became flesh?

5. When Mary was being overshadowed and coming upon, then man and Jesus and God and Holy spirit were all in the act?

6. When Jesus was praying, begging, crying and prostrating his face, and was in a sleepless prayer mode in the Garden of Geshemane, God and man were all doing this with him?

7. When Jesus was being beat up and then hung, God and man were all in this with him?

8. When Jesus died as the Christians say, then God and man died ?

9. When Jesus was in the cave, God and man were there, waiting for the three days and the three night to emerge but emerged sooner any way?

10. When Jesus was saying his body was sore from the hanging experience, God and man felt just that?

11. When Jesus was eating, man and God were eating?

12. When Jesus was lifted up, God and man were lifted up?

13. Are man and God on the right hand where Jesus is sitting now?

14. When man are dying here on earth, Jesus and God are dying?

15. When man is eating Jesus and God are eating?

16. When man is asleep, Jesus and God as asleep?

17. When man is crying, or sad, or any of the sorrows of life, God and man are?

18. Do Jesus and God participate in the procreation process when husband and wife are doing what the bees and birds do to bring about enjoyments and proccrearions?

19. When man dies do Jesus and God also die?

20. When man with the limited knowledge does not know a thing do Jesus and God ?

21. When man reads his Bible iare God and Jesus readingit?

22. When man prays to God, are god and Jesus doing the same/


And I just have to limit my limitless possibilities of the many questions that I can ask, as limitless as the number of man that have been in existence since Adam and that will still be created to include the generation of the last man. It the Christians still stubbornly cling to the idea that Jesus was sent to the whole world, then am correct to include every man and woman, male and female till the end of time!

I Olabowale, a muslim does not in reality and in metaphorical way say that God is in the same condition as Jesus and or man. God Himself is enough as my Witness. His Angels witness with me, and so are believers in man and jinn that laa ilaha ilAllah, Muhammadanr rasulullah (AS) My Lord is full of Powe, always Alive and Able to do all things, Unique in all aspects of Uniqueness.

@Deep sight: Below are sources for which you can TYC whichever definition of "metaphorical" you want us to take. I sign on with you on any that pleases you. With it, I will argue my case, cutting off the lifewire of your supposed by extension idea that Jesus is God, while you make the usual mistakes that always exposes lies; fabrication! Now read my next entry.

Web definitions for metaphorical
expressing one thing in terms normally denoting another; "a metaphorical expression"; "metaphoric language"
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn - Definition in context

Search Resultsmetaphorical - definition of metaphorical by the Free Online , A figure of speech in which a word or phrase that ordinarily designates one thing is used to designate another, thus making an implicit comparison, ,
www.thefreedictionary.com/metaphorical - Cached - Similar

@Deep sight: « #261 on: Yesterday at 07:49:30 PM »

This is sickening. I am beginning to become really circumspect and wary of Noetic's intelligence or rationality.

It is obvious that the man is every bit as unreasonably fanatical as the muslims he attacks so vociferously.

For crying out loud, even a kindergarten pupil would have seen that we clearly explained the "oneness" statements with the words of Jesus himself.

I repeat (as i would have to do to a toddler): Jesus said severally that he was one with the father in the same way as the church was one with each other and one with him. I said: clearly not an existential oneness but metaphorical oneness. What part of this do you not understand? ? ? ? ? ? ? Quote: "I and the father are one, just as ye and i are one" (Are you Jesus?) "Father, may they be one, just as we are one" (Are you Davidylan?).

Noetic, my respect for your faculties is fast depreciating. . .

You deep sight, i lost my respect for you. Actually, I do not have any for you after the above, in a metaphorical way, but mine is reality, since the similitude of the oneness actually involved the Catholic churches and interestingly the sheared away because foundamental and doctrine disagreement, the Protestant Churches! How do they remain one when you see that the disagree with each other, to the point that when the catholic had the upper hand, it killed the protestandts, and even now, there is never a snowball chance that i see to make Catholic man or woman become the Head of the goverrnment of England, be it the Royal branch or the executive branch, his or her highness or the prime minister respectively?


Since this is the best you can do, and your source is the Bible, then I summit to you that in so much that the concept from its face, with all the evidences in history to support me, it is impossible to be correct, just as catholic Church and protestant church are completely separate and always in disagreement, so is God completely separate and in totla disagreement in His Essence from Jesus who is completely human, strictly sent to the lost sheep of the house of israel and not tothe rst of the world, disciples declaring him as servant of God Who sent him!

Now deep sight, it is you and the writer of the part you quoted are the liar or is it me a muslim who cares diddly about your Bible and the Disciples on my side anyways are the liars?

Now you have to make a choice between your camp, containing the writers of the verses you quoted, and my camp with the eyewitness disciples, the speakers in the Act!


Am even willing that you call us liars for the whole world to see. You cant be honest enough in this case, yet you are blaming the equally deceitful Noetic, hitting him below the belt and stumping him on the ground wher he laid already beat up?!

Since the Christians do not wish to discuss the Trinity in any shape or form, then let them be "with their Donkey book loading on its back syndrome". I am out!

@davidylan; discuss trinity. leave Allah of islam out of it. leave allah of the pagan arabs out of it. this trinity is your archilles heel, so deal with it!

@ttalks; « #32 on: Today at 11:28:27 PM »  

Col 1:13-18

Obviously post Jesus era, so its all conjecture.

Joh 1:1-3
(1)  In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
(2)  The same was in the beginning with God.

We can now see why the muslims say that the Bible; Old Testaments and new Testaments oppose themselves. In Genesis which began the thread, it is quoted that heavens and earth were created before any spoken word. Hence Jesus was not there at the beginning if he was the word! Lol.

(3)  All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

And Morris argued that all things after heavens and earth, were made through him by God, but ttalks says he was the maker and not God the Speaker of the word! Can the Christians ever get together and present a common front, even if that front is a lie, but a singular common front, because your division makes it easy for somebody like me to be seeing so many hays, above a single niddle, instead of the more difficult task of looking for a niddle in a hayt stack!

@Kolaxy: « #28 on: Today at 11:12:58 PM »  

Quote
For instance, imagine if you(A) were hiding in a Cave and I heard your voice through the word(s) of your mouth, won't I recognize that it's you-(A) speaking? So also is God's WORD i.e JESUS.

@olabowale
Quote
Did Morris and kolaxy forgot that if you went to the cave you will find the Physical speaker of the word? Where was God the Speaker Whom Jesus was His "Word as HIM" according to the argument above?

With all due respect Sir Olabs, I'll say the above is the first reasonable analysis from you as far as this thread is concern.I'm not being respectful.You are right by saying I will find the Speaker in the above 'picture' cos it's physical desription.But we are discussing God here.Not Man.We are discussing:

And when you use aphysical thing to bring home a point, because we are humans, then i use the same physical thing to show you that the point is full of holes, fallacies and it is incorrect. And if you are discussing God, then His uniqueness aught to have told Mr. Morris and you that bringing Him to the level of human beings you will find people who are not gullible opposing your thought process, bringing you back, if we may to reality. I know its a shock to you.

-One with unlimited power, unlimited wisdom, unlimited holiness
-One who is the creator of all things, the sustainer of all things, the knower of all things
-One who is eternal, immortal, and invisible
Indeed, this Supreme Being fills the entire universe with His presence - Jer 23:23-24

Indeed if you believe that He is that Unique, then you must then have to accept that he would not have looked like anything since Moses and those before Jesus that no man have seen Him and lived, but Jesus was seen and everyone lived without a single death because of his sighting!

But through jesus we see God. In coming to this earth, Jesus declared or manifested God to us - Jn 1:18

And when Jesus was begging, crying and all the other, was he crying, begging the One you are seeing when you look at him doing all of those things? You see how unreal this idea is?

For one thing, He came to this earth from God, and is the only one who has truly seen Him - Jn 6:46

Everyone came to the earth from God! According to your Biblical statement, Adam was shaped by the hands of God, and He breath (mouth to mouth; no?) into him so that he came alive. And then poke to him. And finally after Adam and his wife ate the fruit, they hid from Him, and He was looking for them. Finally they heard His footsteps, and in the long run spoke to Him and He sent them out of the Garden of Eden. Are you now saying to me that throughout all these ordeals, Adam and indeed the woman, Eve did not see the Christian God, or is Jesus also Adam and Eve combined?

@Bobbyaf: « #11 on: Today at 07:48:35 PM »  

Quote
God sacrificing himself to himself so that he can forgive us of our sins.

No! God the Father sacrificed His Son who also shares the same title of God. God is not a name but a title.

Whats the name of God then? And what the name of Jesus? Are they the same name?

If they are in every respect, both died according to the christians and therefore at some time, there was God?

(3) GOD the FATHER, GOD the SON and GOD the HOLY SPIRIT (TRINITY) ONLY KNOWS ALL
1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word (the Son), and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one (KJV).

Sheepishly, he finally writes three (3)! Well then, how do you explain when the desciples who knows Jesus more than any one on earth and even earlier generations personalities like Paul, who were not eyewitnesses to Jesus ministry, while the disciples were and intimate friends and allies to him said about Jesus relationship to God; Jesus your servant whom you sent?

Finally,
I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End," says the Lord, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty." (Revelation 1:

Was Jesus saying this or somebody, a zealot saying it to justify his own position? But an alpha and omega is never interrupted, and if there is an interruption, it means there is a an end, and then a beginning again? Is this what Christian God the Creator is?

(2) GOD the FATHER, GOD the SON and GOD the HOLY SPIRIT (TRINITY) IN CREATION

Genesis 1:1-4 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
The earth was formless and empty, and darkness covered the deep waters. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters. And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness.[/]

[b]NOTE:'God said let there be light'. That's HIS WORD(Jesus). If you believe that [b]GOD'S WORD (Jesus)' is God's POWER,[/b]then you are there.   Through him(WORD)God created everything.

I am taking away 4 things from the above;

(a) God alone created heavens and earth, and no one was mentioned to be involved with Him.

(b)For the first time God saw light, because it was stated that He saw that light was good, showing that He did not have full knowledge! Is this what the Torah of the Jews and the Bible of the Christians take God the Creator to become?

(c)Jesus as the word in "light form" is introduced here (Jesus #1), he is complete and separate here. Therefore it will be taken that Jesus is separated from God as a ful other God person in this case and everytime that the same God who was alone before Jesus speaks from here on, end, another Jesus is produced, since when hHe created the heavens and the earth above, He did not speak and no Jesus came out! Or unless it can it be  explained any other way, snce the initial explanation of the man in the cave and his voice allows us to pinpoint the existence f the man in the cave and "nowhere else?"

(d)I am now and all of us now will have to believe that when God spoke another Jesus is produced, therefore by His spoken word which is now Jesus, Jinn is created, so Jinn and Jesus must be synanemous, so it is when it comes to birds of all types and kinds, animals, trees, stones, etc! So how many Jesus are there? Uncountable just as much as the creations are!

John 1:1-4, 14 In the beginning the Word(Jesus) already existed.

Liar because from your statement, until let there be light, Jesus did not exist! I guess this man does not think people will pay attention to his statement?

The Word(Jesus) was with God, and the Word(Jesus) was God. He(Jesus) existed in the beginning with God. God created everything through Him(Jesus), and nothing was created except through Him(Jesus).

Liar, from your own statement the heavens and earth were created before the Word was spoken! Your hypothesis is now in shamble! Christians with their archilles heels, all in an effort to deceive! Lol. I am going to leave the ridiculous propositions that he listed above alone where he is errounously claiming that Word and God are the same, its simply not, otherwise when word as Jesus died then the Speaker dies, too? And no one will say God is dead unless the atheists, agnostics and the peripherial atheists and agnostics, the Christians by the statements of saying that God and Jesus are the same!

The Word(Jesus) gave life to everything that was created, and His life brought light to everyone. At best if we accept your theory, since there are still "darkness" then Jesus as the word gave life as light when there is light, and in darkness, surprisingly there is life, so how do you explain the life without Jesus? I now propose that all that you say is conjecture, since Jesus as light is not always present, seeing that there is darkness before light and there is still darkness now, nighttime is darkness, no?

So the Word(Jesus) became human and made His home among us. He(Jesus) was full of unfailing love and faithfulness. And we have seen His glory, the glory of the Father's one and only Son.

Did anyone noticed how this man merged everything gradually into Jesus? We in my time say it is Wuru wuru to the answer! Not an aota of truth in it! It is illogical even going by his own standard since there are only two ways; Right or Wrong, and he is not right by a long shot, not 100%, so he has to be wrong, completely wrong!

John 8:58 "Jesus said to them, 'Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.' How possible? Answer above.

There is no answer above, and affirmatively, before Jesus was on earth, I Olabowale, I am! How possible; I was created as a soul removed from the back of Adam, still in the spiritual realm, even before Eve our mother was created as the mate of Adam, before they both went into the Garden of paradise, before they were tested by Sahitan, before they were sent out because they went close to the tree which they have been warned about! You see all my reason for saying that i am, instead of the illogical statement that Mt. Morris is providg? A 5th grader can see how silly his idea is!

"I and My Father are one." (John 10:30)

This does not make sense since you have the operative conductions and and the plural qualifier are in play, denoting the differences in entity, positions and place and the fact that the heavens and earth were created before the "word" was spoken the first time, Time itself. Funny enough, we did not hear Jesus talking in heavens, but until in earth, another proof that he did not exist at all, not in any form whatseever! God holds sway over all things and it shows by His ability to exist before creation and at best Jesus existed after heavens and earth were already created, only at time that light was "Commanded" by speech to come into existence, even then, God alone separated light from darkness! Did Jesus do anything? No because he was not there!

So, it's the Father working through Jesus the Son(WORD) and Holy Spirit that created everything that was, that is and that will be.

The answer is no, since He was able to create heavens and earth before He spoke a single word. Read your own statement to see how silly your propositions are! And it was not until light which according to you brought about Jesus. Even then we have darkness, so Jesus have really played no role and it is clear to me that God creates what He wills, Light and darkness, a form and its negative, like He being the Creator and the rest beinfg the creation!

1) GOD the FATHER, GOD the SON and GOD the HOLY SPIRIT (TRINITY) IN 'THE BIRTH OF JESUS'

That 'WORD' was what became 'Flesh or Man' in the womb of Virgin Mary through the Holy Spirit. Luke 1:34-35 reads, "How will this be," Mary asked the angel, "since I am a virgin?" The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the POWER of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the SON of GOD.

Note:the 'WORD' the power of God came to the Virgin Mary from God and with the help of the HOLY SPIRIT, it came upon the Virgin Mary and she became pregnant.

No sex? Is there a man who overshadows and comes upon his wife, and for the illicit sex patriots, women in the generic sense, and there is pregnancy as its outcome would say there is no sex and male semen discharges? This is why we mock that you people take Mary as wife of Holy Ghost since he is the one that did the overshadowing, coming upon (its all about mounting!)! And you love to deny this.

John 1:14 reads; The Word(Jesus) became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

(Rev 19:11-13) And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

Hogwash! And father is still complete. No, or this time he needs food to survive as a word? Should a Creator produces for Himself as Himself a complete Him having the attributes of creation and not of Himself, so He now dies, needs foot, cries, begs, weeps, prays, beat up, and do you guys want me to give you all the attributes of man, again??



I see Dog lovers call their animals their children, and when they conjugate, they produce sons and daughters who are now exactly like the cats, eating cat food or dog foods, being in litter boxs as cats and left in the dog house in the yard? Nonsense!

For instance, imagine if you(A) were hiding in a Cave and I heard your voice through the word(s) of your mouth, won't I recognize that it's you-(A) speaking? So also is God's WORD i.e JESUS.

Did Morris and kolaxy forgot that if you went to the cave you will find the Physical speaker of the word? Where was God the Speaker Whom Jesus was His "Word as HIM" according to the argument above?


God did not leave His position, hence His word, a simple Command; Come as My creation, the same as it was for Adam, Eve, and indeed all creation does not mean that word isnow God. If it were when Jesus was reported to have been hung, then the One Who spoke him out was also hung! It is was, then Jesus was ran into the wilderness by the devil, then the Speaker by which he is His word was also ran nto the the wilderness by the devil!

It it were, all the controls that the devil had over Jesus the word would just be exactly the same on the Speaker Who spoke him out!

If the word is the same with the Speaker, when Jesus said that he did not know the time of the hour, then The Speaker did not know the time of the Hour which Jesus said it is known only by God? Then Jesus of the Bible must have been not telling the truth, or it is Mr. Morris who is the big fat liar!

CHRISTIANS NEED TO MAKE A CHOICE RIGHT THIS MINUTE on who is lying; Jesus or Morris?

THE FOLLOWING ARE MY PERSONAL SUBMISSION WITH INSPIRATION FROM THE 'WORD' OF GOD

(Please I'll like to make it as simple as possible using 3 simple illustrations and I hope you'll read with an open mind)

Introduction

Jesus is God because He(Jesus) is the WORD of God.

Let's just imagine the word(s) coming out of our mouth. Are they not part of us? Our word(s) is part of 'us'. So also our 'spirit'.We cannot separate ourselves from the words coming out of our mouth and likewise our spirit. I cannot say the word(s) coming out of your mouth is/are not yours or part of you. Likewise your spirit. To me,'YOU',YOUR WORD(S) and YOUR SPIRIT are still WHO you are as an 'ENTITY'. Same for God. God cannot separate himself from His WORD(Jesus) and His Spirit.

This classic. So all the recording that people have made of my voice; the ones with my mother are me (say ten tapes and maybe 2 videos making 12 olabowales with mom, alone). How about the others with various family members? In the long run how many Olabowales running around in words, if we follow this brainless thinking of the most eminent Christian exegist, Mr. Morris?

TRI-UNITY — The teaching of the Bible concerning the Trinity might be summarized thus. God is a Tri-unity, with each Person of the Godhead equally and fully and eternally God. Each is necessary, and each is distinct, and yet all are one. The three Persons appear in a logical, causal order. The Father is the unseen, omnipresent Source of all being, revealed in and by the Son, experienced in and by the Holy Spirit. The Son proceeds from the Father, and the Spirit from the Son. With reference to God's creation, the Father is the Thought behind it, the Son is the Word calling it forth, and the Spirit is the Deed making it a reality.

See how openly shameless this writer is in his dishonesty? He cant bring himself to write the word of word three or the equivalent figure 3, yet he deceived us with the Tri, only well acquintted to people inclined in math as in Triginometry; 3?! I will have my saying about this later, but let me have fun on the dishonesty of this special christian man. He probably thinks he is doing them a favor penning something down. yauck!

@Kolaxy: « on: Today at 05:18:15 AM »

The doctrine of the Trinity — that God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit are each equally and eternally the one true God — is admittedly difficult to comprehend, and yet is the very foundation of Christian truth. Although skeptics may ridicule it as a mathematical impossibility, it is nevertheless a basic doctrine of Scripture as well as profoundly realistic in both universal experience and in the scientific understanding of the cosmos-Quote from Henry Morris

Henry Morris; you must have been smoking something that causes allucination to present from your own intro, a have wrong, concept even before you started any explanation and thinking afterwards, you will have any audience that will be gullible enough not to see how wide the window to iconoclastically trip down your concept that is empty in reality?

@No2Atheist: « #18 on: September 16, 2009, 11:12 PM »

Another slave of Allah refusing to reason . . .

Far better than the servant or slave of Jesus, who himself by the statement in "Acts" is a servant of his Lod God Eloi in a semitic language which is not Arabic!

1. Does it make sense for you to try to dictate to Gani wat he is supposed to do . . .

Exactly the same way I ask you if it makes sense for you to try to dictate to Allah what He is supposed to do in Mercy and justice to believers and disbelievers relatively in the day of Judgement.

2. Can you kindly show me the verses of the Quran that says people should be buried the next day. . .

The ahadith is the explainer what is not clear in the Quran, and so is the Sunnah. Muhammad (AS) the chairman of humans in Islam was buried same day, and Faweyinmi is better? Dont you think? Is there a better person than Moses among the Children of Israil? Afterall, Jesus never dare to change a jot out of the Book of Torah; No? So if this is the case, can anyone change the ruling of Moses except that such a one has practiced corruption(s)?

3. Is it islamic to copy Arabic culture . . . and unislamic not to do so . . .

Elstupido statement! What culture is it it to keep a body in the house for 2 weeks or even for any length of time? What; try your own tribe, because the yorubas that I am do not do that! Finally, arab culture is not islamic, the reason the Christians and jews among them have their own ways corresponding to their religion(s), so Islamic religion is what we see by reading of what Muhammad (AS) did, and what his comapanions (RA) did, and what the two folloing generations (ra) did! The keferis who cant even lean their behind after using the bathrooms wanna tell us what Islam is!


It is the right of the muslims to warn others not to copy any evil done by any muslims, and definitely not to take the fashions of the Keferis like you no2atheist!

You and the God of The Seeker made a pact of your statement above? If not then you are a liar and that your pray will not be accepted by Allah. Amin.

And bastards are many in Nigeria. Kola Abiola is one of them, yet he looks like his late father! A bastard by behavior is still a bastard.