₦airaland Forum

Image123:
Give us an example of a perfect being that doesn't get angry?

No such perfect being exists, to my knowledge.

dalaman:
Where was God's judgement when America enslaved Africans for hundreds of years? where was he during segregation and Jim crow? Suddenly its gay union that will make him to come and pass judgement?

Exactly. God is willing to watch millions of people get murdered and he does absolutely nothing. But this perfect being gets angry about gay things. (How does a perfect being get angry by the way?)

ifeness:
That is no evidence of a god one bit. Try harder next time.

I know, right? I was expecting something significant, not this mess. I want my wasted minute back.

I have done similar miracles myself. In addition, I even made a lame man blind.

Congrats to the USA Supreme Court. Well done for applying the constitution as it reads. If people want to reverse it they can change the constitution. That's how the rule of law works.

jude2011:
I don't know what to do. Can I acknowledge the existence of God without practicing any religion? My question is ''can I believe in GOD and not practice any religion?''. If yes, what is the term called. Secondely, Can an atheist go to church and pretend as if he believes in the bible? Thanks

Someone who believes in a passive, uninvolved god and who does not have a religion is called a 'deist'. There are some out there. 'Pantheist' is another type of belief in a god without religion. In this case they believe that the universe and god are essentially one and the same.

I personally am agnostic atheist; I don't believe in any god but i cannot prove that there are no gods. But certainly all religions are man-made and have quite a bit of nonsense.

AcesIni:
.

And unlike the rest of us lesser people who masturbate, they rape themselves to death.

Please please tell me how to do that. I am an atheist and would love to r.ape myself.

Nonsense. The door on a fish lorry opened and spilled the fish. Nothing about god, unless he opened the door of the lorry just to have a laugh.

I hate to cite the Daily Fail, but in this case they appear to be telling the truth.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/peoplesdaily/article-3002503/Now-s-slip-road-Lorry-driver-spills-SEVEN-TONS-catfish-Chinese-highway-door-truck-pops-open-driving-bump.html

ZoranderGraeme:
Sahih International
And of the people is he who disputes about Allah without knowledge and follows every rebellious devil.

Allaah also Says what means: "And those who disbelieved will be driven to Hell in groups until, when they reach it, its gates are opened and its keepers will say: 'Did there not come to you messengers from yourselves, reciting to you the verses of your Lord and warning you of the meeting of this Day of yours?' They will say: 'Yes, but the word [i.e. decree] of punishment has come into effect upon the disbelievers.'" [Quran 39: 71]

Allaah also Says what means: "And for those who disbelieved in their Lord is the punishment of Hell, and wretched is the destination. When they are thrown into it, they hear from it a [dreadful] inhaling while it boils up. It almost bursts with rage. Every time a company is thrown into it, its keepers ask them: ‘Did there not come to you a warner?'" [Quran 67: 6-8]

O you who believe! seek help with patient Perseverance and Prayer: for Allah is with those who patiently persevere.
[2: Al-Baqara-153]

"Verily, to Us will be their return: -Then verily, for Us will be their Reckoning." ( Surat Al-Ghashiah, Verses 25 and 26)

3:9 (Asad) "O our Sustainer! Verily, Thou wilt gather mankind together to witness the Day about [the coming of] which there is no doubt: verily, God never fails to fulfil His promise." -

3:106 (Asad) on the Day [of Judgment] when some faces will shine [with happiness] and some faces will be dark [with grief]. And as for those with faces darkened, [they shall be told:] "Did you deny the truth after having attained to faith? Taste, then, this suffering for having denied the truth!" -

It's not Allah talking because he doesn't exist. It's Muhammad. And he's wrong.

Exactly. He did exactly what Jesus wanted him to do. He is one of the most faithful and loyal followers of Jesus.

Bush did not convert to Islam. It's the same type of lie as the one about Neil Armstrong hearing the call to prayer on moon. Rubbish.

However, let me say that I am glad he is a Christian and not an atheist which would dirty our reputation.

ZoranderGraeme:
Did you? Did you really? Well if you did,


002:171 Yusufali
:
The parable of those who reject Faith is as if one were to shout Like a goat-herd, to things that listen to nothing but calls and cries: Deaf, dumb, and blind, they are void of wisdom.

Surah 2:26

Lo! Allah disdaineth not to coin the similitude even of a gnat. Those who believe know that it is the truth from their Lord; but those who disbelieve say: What doth Allah wish (to teach) by such a similitude ? He misleadeth many thereby, and He guideth many thereby; and He misleadeth thereby only miscreants;

What a petty god. talk is cheap.

When someone tells me they are atheist, I think "congratulations my brother/sister!"

ProphetUdeme:
If i didnt believe in the existence of God. I wouldnt have been wasting my time on religion section. I mean there are lots of interesting sections for these atheist like politics, jokes, education, football, romance etc.
But we see these atheist mostly on religion section bashing, derailing, abusing and cursing. I guess some of them were once christians but were overcame by the devil thru trials temptations and tribulations and they eventually gave up and renounced God. Thats why many of them are more gifted in the bible verses more than some christians. Notable among them are plaetton, zikdik, onetrack, ifeness, johnydon22, mmsen, judas2013 etc.
My prayer is that as they keep on perambulating on this religion section. The Spirit from God on a post will touch an convict their stony hearts and lead them to believe the truth because God is not willing that they should perish.
My fellow christians in the truth pls lets keep mentioning them in our prayers and show them love and not treat them as enemies. Thanks

But I'll bet that you have no problem with me criticising Islam, which I do often enough.

Empiree:
I know. But in Hindu majority country, India, they too cause problems and subjugate minority.

They surely can and have caused problems in India.

I think only the Jains among ancient religions can claim to have never engaged in oppression. Extremist Jains are actually extremely nonviolent--not even harming flies or plants.

Empiree:
Problem with Hinduism is they believe everything is god almighty. I wish I am able to post a video of questions and answers so you could see Hindu says he's god almighty. And no, prophet Muhammad is far from being protestant. That's very incorrect. Yes, if GBS said Islam is intolerant about idol, absolutely correct. There is zero toleant for it. Dont christians have stuff like that in the Bible?

But not being tolerant of idol worship does not mean hating/killing idol worshipers. I never for once took GBS seriously, whether is quote was correct or not. I found it and I quoted it. onetrack should also provide his source of this write of about Mr. Shaw

The quote is from one of his letters. It's found in a book called "Bernard Shaw Collected Letters, 1926-1950" published in 1988.

Shaw, being a writer, had a lot to say about a lot of things, and he has a very long list of famous quotes. It's clear, however, that he didn't hold religion in high regard, even Hinduism. If he said positive things about any religion, they were the exceptions rather than the rule.

And yes, injunctions against idols are found in the Bible, that's why Shaw compared Muhammad to the Protestants, because they traditionally don't pray to saints or in front of statues unlike the Catholics. He's saying that Muhammad and the Protestants are similar in that regard.

I don't really care if Muslims have their own section, though such fora often become echo-chambers (though I suppose that the Sunni and Shia could have plenty to argue about). I wouldn't want such a thing for atheists because we generally thrive on debate; let the god-believers bring their best (and worst)!

About G.B. Shaw: he was a lifelong non-religious person, who occasionally described himself as an atheist. He was very critical of organized religion.

Here's a quote from one of his letters:

"The apparent multiplicity of Gods is bewildering at the first glance; but you presently discover that they are all the same one God in different aspects and functions and even sexes. There is always one uttermost God who defies personification. This makes Hinduism the most tolerant religion in the world, because its one transcendent God includes all possible Gods… Hinduism is so elastic and so subtle that the profoundest Methodist and the crudest idolater are equally at home in it.
Islam is very different, being ferociously intolerant. What I may call Manifold Monotheism becomes in the minds of very simple folk an absurdly polytheistic idolatry, just as European peasants not only worship Saints and the Virgin as Gods, but will fight fanatically for their faith in the ugly little black doll who is the Virgin of their own Church against the black doll of the next village. When the Arabs had run this sort of idolatry to such extremes … they did this without black dolls and worshipped any stone that looked funny, Muhammad rose up at the risk of his life and insulted the stones shockingly, declaring that there is only one God, Allah, the glorious, the great… And there was to be no nonsense about toleration. You accepted Allah or you had your throat cut by someone who did accept him, and who went to Paradise for having sent you to Hell. Muhammad was a great Protestant religious force, like George Fox or Wesley"

I personally think that Hinduism may be dogmatically very tolerant (some Hindus claim that all religions are just forms of Hinduism, including Christianity and Islam), but tolerating things like widow-burning and thuggee (ritual strangulation) is a bit overly tolerant.

Ultimate001:
Jesus, Abraham, e.t.c are not enough evidence? Please stop living in denial...God bless!

No more evidence than Harry Potter, or Zeus, or Sango.

I've read the Quran. The whole thing. I've read many of the hadiths, and also the tafsir (generally Ibn-Kathir, but occasionally others) for certain surahs where the context was not evident. The Quran is not particularly long and only took a week or so to read.

I came to the exact opposite conclusion as the woman you cite. The Quran could not have been written by a god; it is a man-made book just like every other book in existence.

You forgot a sign:

Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established till the buttocks of the women of the tribe of Daus move while going round Dhi-al-Khalasa." Dhi-al-Khalasa was the idol of the Daus tribe which they used to worship in the Pre Islamic Period of ignorance.

In other words, people in Yemen are going to have to rebuild a long-destroyed pagan shrine and the women of a certain tribe are going have to to twerk around it before the Islamic end times.

It's not only in Nigeria where people claim this kind of foolishness. I am working in another country in West Africa quite far from Nigeria but men here occasionally claim that some has stolen their d!ck.

One case I remember some people took a man (whose d!ck had been 'stolen') to see a doctor, who found that the guy's d!ck was still there, and the man told him 'but it's much smaller than it used to be!'.

In another case the police were going to take the man to the hospital, but the man suddenly claimed that his d!ck had been returned and all was well.

Another time a man claimed that someone stole his d!ck with a handshake while in a mosque. The person who was accused of doing it was beaten and then taken from the mosque to a sacred forest to undo the sorcery.

Liars the lot of them. Unfortunately innocent people get beaten over this type of accusation.

KellamLeTorneau:
What makes you think this is not the way it was meant to be interpreted?

Nothing. But it's not falsifiable. That is, if the moon really did generate its own light then the Quran could be interpreted in a manner which supported that as well. Just like the flat earth. If the earth really was flat and the heavens were a solid dome, the Quran has plenty of verses to back it up, yet Islamic scholars now interpret such verses to try to show that it supports the claim that the earth is round. In the past some Islamic scholars have supported the flat earth theory.

And there are many muslim scholars who think all apostates must die. That's none of my business.

And it's unfortunate that the religion has so many interpretations that Islamic scholars can find ways to support almost anything they want (just like Christians of course)

I know you have no faith, but faith in the right thing is not a bad thing, like he said in his article religion is like the human beings users manual? Which of the Qurans claims have been debunked?

For me faith is never a good thing. I can have trust in something, but that is based entirely on past evidence. Faith has no past evidence or any basis to make a trustworthy claim. I reject it 100%

KellamLeTorneau:
The Greeks had a theory, so did many others, but what is the probability of islam picking the right one. If you read the post carefully you'd see where he mentioned the issue of probability.

I beg to differ.

"By the sun and its radiant light, and the moon that trails (and reflects) its light. By the day that magnifies and glorifies (جلاها) its brightness. (The Noble Quran, 91:1-3)"

'' Blessed is He who has placed in the sky great stars and placed therein a [burning] lamp and luminous moon.'' (25:61)

Nothing here suggests that the moon is reflecting the light from the sun. Adding 'and reflects' in parenthesis is not something found in the five translations I just consulted. It's a very selective interpretation of vague verses. See all the 'predictions' that Nostradamus made which turned out to be 'true' only because people interpreted his verses in a particular way.

Doesn't he? Mate, you refuse to bother with the rest because you don't want to. Stop trying as hard as possible to reject faith. if truly you are in search of the truth I suggest you read the book he recommended, I'm sure you can get it for free some where online.

Please recognize that there are even many Muslim scholars who have little regard for Naik. Why should I?

By the way, I have no faith. I regard faith as actually a bad quality to have, because it means that you believe in something for which there is no proof. The claims made by the Quran and Bible have been thoroughly debunked. At the end they are just books written by men.

The problem with Naik's claim is that the Quran does not make scientific claims, because there is nothing stated scientifically. You will find very few western scientists willing to say that the Quran contains specific scientific claims. In addition, to the extent that we can guess at the interpretations of various vague verses, the science contained therein has obvious errors.

Take Naik's claim about Muhammad (in the Quran) saying that every living thing is composed partially from water, for example, which is in fact true. But the Greeks knew this long before, and in fact almost anyone who has observed animals and plants can see that they all need water, and therefore water must be a part of their composition. There is nothing miraculous about this piece of information. Naik makes it sound impressive, but I'm not impressed.

He also says that the Quran says that the moon contains reflected light, when in fact all it says is that the moon gives light (I looked at 5 different translations of the Quran), and does not identify it as reflected. This is therefore an unsubstantiated claim and cannot be used to reference a scientific miracle in the Quran. In any case the Greeks already knew that the moon was reflected light 1000 years before the Quran.

Why bother with the rest? He has no credibility.

KellamLeTorneau:
1. Allah is most Merciful
The Qur’an says several times that Allah is the most Merciful. In fact all the 114 Surahs i.e. chapters of the Glorious Qur’an except for Surah Taubah chapter 9, begin with the beautiful formula, Bismillah-hir-Rahman-nir-Rahim, which means, "In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful".

2. Allah is Forgiving
The Glorious Qur’an mentions in several verses including Surah Nisa, chapter 4 verse 25 and Surah Maidah, chapter 5 verse 74:

"And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful."

3. Allah gives severe punishment to the deserving
Allah besides being Merciful and Forgiving is also strict in giving punishment to the deserving. The Qur’an mentions in several verses that Allah will give severe punishment to the unbelievers and rejecters of faith. He will give punishment to all those who disobey Him. Several verses of the Qur’an describe the various types of severe punishment that Allah will give in hell to all those who disobey.

"Those who reject our Signs, we shall soon cast into the Fire; as often as their skins

Are roasted through, we shall change them for fresh skins, that they may taste the penalty: for Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise".
[Al-Qur’an 4:56]

4. Allah is Just
The question is, whether Allah is forgiving or revengeful? An important point to be noted is that Allah besides being Merciful and Forgiving, He also has to give severe punishment to the deserving wicked or evil people, because He is also Just. The Qur’an mentions in Surah Nisa: "Allah is never unjust in the least degree".
[Al-Qur’an 4:40]

It is further mentioned in Surah Al-Ambiya:

"We shall set up scales of justice for the day of Judgement, so that not a soul will be dealt with unjustly in the least. And if there be (no more than) the weight of a mustard seed, we will bring it (to account): and enough are we to take account".
[Al-Qur’an 21:47]

5. Example: Teacher forgives a student who copies in the examination
If during an examination, a student copies and the teacher who supervises in the examination catches the student red-handed, the teacher says that he is very merciful and kind and forgives him and allows him to continue copying. Those students who have worked hard for the examination will not call the teacher merciful and kind but will call him unjust. This merciful act of the teacher will encourage the other students to also copy. If all the teachers are merciful and kind and allow the students to copy then no student will ever study for examinations and all will pass with flying colours by copying. The theoretical results of the examinations will be excellent in which all the students will pass with first class and distinction but practically these students will be a failure in life. The whole purpose of the examination would be defeated.

6. This Life is a Test for the Hereafter
The life in this world is a test for the Hereafter. The Qur’an says in Surah Al Mulk: "He who created Death and Life, that He may try which of you is best in deed; and He is the Exalted in Might, Oft-Forgiving".
[Al-Qur’an 67:2]

7. If Allah forgives all and punishes none, who will obey him?
If Allah (swt) forgives each and every human being and punishes no one, then why should the human beings obey the command of Allah (swt)? I do agree that no one will go to hell, but this world would become hell to live in. If all human beings are going to go to heaven then what is the purpose and use of the human beings to come to this world, this life cannot be called a test for the hereafter.

8. Allah only forgives if a person repents
Allah (swt) only forgives if a person repents. The Qur’an says in Surah Al-Zumar, chapter 39 verse 53-55:

"Say: ‘O my servants who have transgressed against their souls! Despair not of the Mercy of Allah: for Allah forgives all sins for He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful."

"Turn ye to your Lord (in repentance) and bow to His (will), before the penalty comes on you - after that ye shall not be helped."

"And follow the best of (the courses) revealed to you from your Lord, before the penalty comes on you - of a sudden, while ye perceive not!"
[Al-Qur’an 39:53-55]

There are four criteria for repentance: First, agree that the act is wrong. Secondly, stop it immediately. Thirdly, never do it again in future. And lastly, compensate for the loss if caused to anyone.

What a terrible god! Fortunately he only exists in people's imaginations.

KellamLeTorneau:
Similarly, following are some of the many unique attributes possessed by none other than the Creator of the universe, Almighty Allah:

"Ar-Raheem", the Most Merciful

So when one asks, "Who is ‘Ar-Raheem’, (the Most Merciful)?", there can only be one answer: "Almighty Allah".

I've always found it amusing that 'Allah' calls himself the Most Merciful in the very first verse of the Quran and then goes on to say countless times how he is going to inflict all kinds of torture on so many human beings. By that definition, I, too, can claim to be Most Merciful.

KellamLeTorneau:
You know nothing about middle eastern politics do you? Syria is a Sunni majority country but the Shias control the country and oppress the Sunnis, clearly the Shia rule is against the wishes of majority of the people, the Shias run a sort of dictatorship, a democrat like you should appreciate that the KSA is against such acts. Yemen also another Sunni majority country elected a Sunni president but Shia rebels overthrew him, going against the wish of democracy and the wish of the people. There did not go and knock on the door and fling him out, no! They shed the blood of innocents, such heinous crimes must not be allowed for sanity to be upheld in societies. There's no justification for bombing people but this is a close to a good one. As for Iran, do you see the Sunnis trying to impose a Sunni leader on them or other Shia countries like Azerbaijan? Think with your head mate, don't just speak out of the ignorance of hate.

For many years the Sunnis imposed themselves on Iraq, a Shia majority country, so by your own logic you should have supported the US removal of Saddam Hussein in order to allow the Shia to rule Iraq.

You should also support the overthrow of the Bahrain government for the same reason (Sunni ruler, Shia majority)

I don't like Islam, but I have nothing against individual Muslims as long as they don't try to force anything on me. Same as Christianity.

A case could certainly be made that the Quran itself is 'phobic' against Jews, Christians, and Pagans.

MizJanet:

Okay, when Jesus Die , Did the real person called Jesus died or its just his useless container that died ?

Christians started arguing about that very issue within two hundred years of his death. People actually were killed over this in the 4th and 5th centuries.

UyiIredia:
Why u answer the babe, the girl (plus u) na MUGU.

You have brought a devastating argument I can't refute. I guess I'll become a theist.

Ubenedictus:
it seems you didn't research on the nazi topic before posting.

There are continous publications of catholic bishops and conferences of catholic bishops against nazi ideology. Infact the jews thanked the church for supporting and rescueing them during the nazi regim.

Even more importantly the pope wrote an encyclical on the issue, the highest form of ordinary papal teaching is an encyclical. Usually all encyclicals are published in latin, but this one is actually in german not latin, it was smuggled in germany and read to the people on sundays, the mit brennender sorge.

Have a look.

[url]w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xi/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-xi_enc_14031937_mit-brennender-sorge.html[/url]

Once again, the encyclical comes out of breaches of the Reichskonkordat by the Nazi party, and not in reaction to antisemitism or nazi ideology, except it issues a mild criticism of the way that the Nazis glorified race. If the Nazis had not started to turn against the Church, the Pope would not have issued that encyclical.

If this god just wants us to find him, he only has to reveal himself directly. No need to play games by whispering into the ears of long-dead men who called themselves prophets.