₦airaland Forum

mistakay, trenchcoat, knowall,

Sleeping with small girls age 9 -15yrs in today's world is despoil, no matter the circumstances and no matter the religion. You cannot use religion as a cover for pedophilia. The situation whereby a small girl is sold by  her parents  and forced to have intimacy with an old man in the name of marriage is barbaric. You people are very callous, you are supporting sexual exploitation of the weak and innocent small girls and in support of elite oppressors. I hope you are not one. Give a thought to the small girl who is supposed to have her future ahead of her, why not let her reach the age where she is fit to make a choice  whether she wants to be the 99th wife of a 99 yr old man.

Please you make it seem like to periodically have intimacy with young girls in the name of marriage, is an Islamic Injunction. Even Saudi Arabia, which is the seat of Islam would frown at such actions

seanet02:
@wiznet i agree with you my brother that the fragility of the Niger delta is the divide and rule being used by fg and the oil companies. But you also have to accept that there are some enemies within your rank, people like annenih, uduaghan, ibori and all other thieves that are embezzling your money should be the main target of the militants not foreigners. We are still on the same path my brother.

Within any group of people' it is expected that there would be one Judas in 12 people. So the FG and the oil companies always fish out the Judases at the expense of the others.

You will realize that these Judases are being funded and protected by the FG and oil companies.

seanet02:
@wiznet i did not say shell should not bring their office to your hometown, what i meant is that you can not take a headquarters that will accommodate thousands of people to fragile regions like nigerdelta. Settles your question.

My brother, the issue is much more complex than that. The region had not been that fragile since inception but only became fragile as a result of the divide and rule tactics that was employed by the federal government and the oil companies.

All we ask for is to have a voice in how the land is exploited, If the oil companies see the oil communities as important to their operations, they would call all stake holder to a round table discussion (and not a few thieving elites). Most stakeholders in the communities would be satisfied and the oil companies would be free to do whatever the like (within the terms of the agreement), including where they decide to site their offices.

But the practice of siting offices in Abuja or Lagos and flying over the heads of the communities to get to their oil rigs, with minimum interaction with the host communities is callous and is not practiced any where else.

There are no schools in the communities, no health services, no drinking water, i could go on and on, and yet the oil companies say the people are unemployable, so they bring in workers from outside the region. That was the genesis of the fragile  situation.

Becomrich0:
wirinet you are an igboman. what your business in this. ? mind your own business. Obasanjo created the niger delta. 

Obama can call Obasanjo and verify this .

It was formerly call OMPADEC , headed by Prof Opia.

http://www.sunnewsonline.com/webpages/opinion/2008/oct/29/opinion-29-10-2008-002.htm

Which your oil in the OMPADEC are you talking about.

Nigeria constitution says the sea belong to the govt of nigeria. We told you let amend constitution , you refuse. This is the point I am getting to. constitution says the sea belong to the federal govt.


Itsekiri people are Yorubas, President Obama can go to the National association of Itsekiri people in the USA and ask were they belong.

Here are sample of the name of the national officer in the USA, do this name note tell you thier root and where they belong.   This is from the national body of itsekiri people living in the USA.   

Do you know the meaning of  omansan , it means the child is good.  any yoruba person in the USA would tell you the name. Obama can go and ask Akeem Olajuwon (Yoruba)  the meaning of the names.

Omasan,Ayomike,Mogbeyi,Bawo,

Honestly, i do not know what you are getting at. I do not see the relevance of you above post with the issue of Nigerdelta oil not belonging to the Nigerdeltans. Also i do not understand Obama's business in all these. Obama is barely one year as the president of the US, so i do not understand how he could have been responsible for the naming of the Nigerdelta.

For your information, I am full blooded Itsekiri, so i can lecture you on our history, yes we have lots in common with the Yorubas including language, but we are distinct from the Yorubas. We have never denied our relationship with the Yorubas, but that does not mean that we have to submit our oil wells (both onshore and offshore) to the Yorubas. We also have connections with the Bini people, that does not make us Binis.

seanet02:
@becomerich. I am a YORUBA MAN, but i can tell you that 99.9999 percent of Nigerias oil is in niger delta, and if you did not do geography in school, ondo state is part of niger delta, or why is it part of niger delta development commission, folks like you are the main trouble makers in this country and honestly i can tell you the federal goverment is cheating this people, they own this thing, why could the northern states like kano be earning more than edo from the federal allocation. As for shell taking there office to the delta, i dont subscribe to that, the security there is not good at all.

You do not understand that becomrich's agenda is to form a new country from benin republic and Oduduwa, taking the Nigerdelta oil with him.

If you do not subscribe to shell taking their office to Nigerdelta because of security, how come you subscribe to them working in the same Nigerdelta, or you think that they should be drilling the oil from Lagos.

Becomrich0:
Are you people serious or sick.

Shell , chervon, mobil are company with several business in Nigeria. Oil drilling is not the only business they do.

So Look at the satellite picture. Imagine shell or mobil was relocate to bayelsa how many people are they going to market to. And how many petrol station do you think, is there for them.

If you own a business are you going to stay close to your market were you make money or go someone else.

Where is the largest market in Nigeria , answer lagos,,
where do you think mobil, shell and chveron have more petrol station , answer is lagos, that is why they are in lagos.

Nobody leave where they make money.

With drilling they can drill from the sea and never step thier foot on nigeria, it is the marketing that why they have contact with nigerian. Noone leaves is money and go someone else. You want them to go broke.

Is like you asking Nduka to move thisday to his home town. If He does that he would go broke.

In business you go where the market is. And that is why shell, mobil, etc are in lagos.

Becomrich, you have becomeverygreedy. You have been looking for a way since i have known you, to take all the oil belonging to the Nigerdelta and transferring it to Ondo, so that you can take the oil with you to your Benin Republic.

Shell , chervon, mobil are company with several business in Nigeria. Oil drilling is not the only business they do.

Several businesses? Please tell me which other business they do?

So Look at the satellite picture. Imagine shell or mobil was relocate to bayelsa how many people are they going to market to. And how many petrol station do you think, is there for them.

What are they marketing? crude oil?. You seem to be ignorant how petroleum marketing works. Most of it is done on franchise basis, it is mostly individuals marketing products using the name of big oil companies. And besides, petroleum marketing business in a very infinitesimal part of the business of the major oil producing companies.

With drilling they can drill from the sea and never step thier foot on nigeria, it is the marketing that why they have contact with nigerian. Noone leaves is money and go someone else. You want them to go broke.

I do not blame people for suspecting your sanity. So the seas are no more part of Nigeria. If so why did they need permission from Nigeria.

Once again, marketing of what? So the oil companies need to come to Nigeria to Market the crude oil they drill off seas?

Is like you asking Nduka to move thisday to his home town. If He does that he would go broke.

In business you go where the market is. And that is why shell, mobil, etc are in lagos.

This statement need no response. Shell (which produces over 60% of Nigeria's oil)is even not even involved in refined petroleum products marketing in Nigeria

@Mistakay,

It is surprising that you cannot connect societal vices like pedophilia, extravagance lifestyles and other sexual vices going on in high places with our general lack of electricity, education, health care, etc. These people steal money to indulge in their vices. If yerima does not have stolen money he did not work for, i am sure he will not be paying $100,000 just as a bride price, and we are not even talking about the money that was expended on the illegal marriage itself including the money used to ship in the "bride" and her family.

thehomer:
@ Mad_Max

The evidence shows that simply presenting the facts does not work. As was demonstrated with HIV causing AIDS, and now with the extent of humans affecting the climate. One that was resolved after a lot of noise was the link between smoking and lung cancer.

Also, I don't understand why people keep attacking scientists for doing what humans do all the time. Some have presented their views on religion and evolution in books. Should they not do so?
They feel the evidence of evolution supports their views. Should they not write these books out of fear of offending religious people? Some people have become non-religious due to these books others have learned more about other people's views which I consider a good thing.

When they do write text books for class education, they are reviewed and the bias is removed this is why text books unless written with some religious or political bent are good sources of information.

With regards to religious people who do not agree with evolution, I don't think there is a reason for any one to make excuses for them.
There are Christian groups that agree with the theory, and on this forum, there are religious people who also agree with it after reviewing the evidence.
In this information age and the presence of sites (some which have been posted on this very thread) simply presenting the evidence without a religious bent, they actively choose to ignore the evidence before them.

The above quote of yours is simply untrue. Atheist scientists have not attempted to stop religious books or materials being published neither do they try to stop private religious practice. Religious people have tried and succeeded in delaying research in stem-cell at least in the U.S. This was just recently overturned.

Yes scientists hold religious or non religious views, but that has nothing to do with science as a discipline, its just personal views. The problem is that most Christians tries to cage the scientist by trying scientific questions with his religion. He ask questions like where humans come from, where did the sun come from, what makes thunder and lightening, what is life and he provides one answer - GOD. But when scientist explain that there is no observable evidence of his god being responsible for these things, the Christian starts attacking science and equate it with atheism.

Most European countries have have more than 50% of their populations not believing in any God, meanwhile most of them do not have a basic understanding of science.

Even the person that more or less "converted" me to atheism was Tai Solarin and he never understood or talked about evolution of species or big bang.

Mad_Max:
To kunleoshob and toba:

I partly understand your outlook, though I wasn't explaining things to either of you and it strictly wasn't your concern. The hostility of some Christians to evolution is partly being caused by some scientists themselves. Instead of simply presenting the facts, some atheist scientists hold up evolution as 'proof' that God doesn't exist, when it proves NO such thing, ridiculing and alienating Christians. Christians are then forced to fight back by rejecting the theory without understanding it. The more the theory is shown to be correct, the weaker the Christians who reject it look. Because some know-nothings have falsely tacked 'God does not exist' to the back of evolution, whenever the theory scores points, it looks like it's the idea that God does not exist that is winning, when it is merely evolution. Very sly and dishonest. Atheist scientists meddle with religion more than religionists meddle with science. What has any scientist ever found in the research field or laboratory that 'proves' God does not exist? NOTHING, and they never will.

This lunatic fringe of science are dolts. If the facts of evolution had simply been presented without colouring it with their atheistic beliefs, Christians would have gotten to the point of knowing the bible isn't a science document much faster, and the theory would have been accepted. Scientists complain Christians aren't letting them teach evolution in schools. Why should they, when they know some daft scientists won't stick to the facts, but will dishonestly use the integrity of science, and evolution, as a propaganda tool to spread their own personal, unproven beliefs.   

I have to add though that Christians comprise less than 20% of the world's population, so their view of creation is by no means the majority view. Other faiths and other cultures have their own beliefs. The nonsensical belief that the bible is infallible stifled progressive thought for centuries, a belief based on nothing but indoctrination, whose origins can be traced to the Vatican's quest to dominate the monarchies of Europe through the Church and who did not wish their authority and the bible on which it rested questioned.

That God exists is a belief. That God does not exist is also belief. Each side has reasons for its belief and neither has empirical proof of its belief. No position is more 'rational' or superior to the other. For some atheist scienstist to use evolution to spread their own beliefs, when they're two different things, is low and contemptible. But these people don't represent science. There are Christians, Moslems, Buddhists, agnostics, and believers of every faith who are scientists. Atheist scientists do not represent science in any way, and not all atheists in science engage in this irresponsible behavior. Only a few.  They're free to spread their own beliefs, other faiths do, but not to use evolution, which is religion-free, to do it. Or label those who don't share their beliefs as 'delusional'. Science is one thing, your personal beliefs are another. Keep them out of science and state only the facts.

The facts you stated is only half of the story of the conflict between atheists and Christians. You did not highlight the persecution atheist had suffered in the hands of Christians through the centuries. At on time anyone holding contrary views to the Christians authorities would be put to death. You are not highlighting the damage being done by fringe lunatic of Christians.

Christians are the one still persecuting the atheists using more subtle approach. Christians first try to make the atheist see reason by peaceful means, preaching love of jesus, joy of christianity, etc, then the take it a step further with threats, like you will spend eternity in hell, you  like will be miserable for refusing Jesus, you are an agent of the devil, etc. If that fails to work, the go to the philosophical ream by asking the questions, like who do you think created you, the universe or all the mysteries contained?. The Christian further postulates that evidence and the bible clearly proves that it is the bible God. When the atheist attempts to offer scientific explanations to explain all these phenomenon and that the bible god is not required for the universe or me to exist. The Christain the switches to discrediting science and accepted and established scientific theories (even though they understand very little elementary science). It is even getting to ridiculous levels now as they attempt to equate science with atheism. I have never known a scientist or a science discipline that studies and tries to prove god or gods.  The irony is that almost most of the theories were propounded by Christian scientists.

Even when we point out that scientific theories has little to do with atheism and that there are many Christians that accepts theories like evolution of species, earths formations, relativity and even quantum physics, they fail to even see the argument and go on equating science with atheism. ( i even know the G.O of a church that accept the theory of evolution).

The major problem some Christian have is the attempt to confuse the aim of religion with the aim of science. The writers of the great religious books never intended it to be a science journal, and the same time science was never intended to answer theological questions. It is like tying to use an accounting book to answer geological questions.

Is is very annoying when some people say that science is the basis of atheism, i for one decide to become an atheist by 18, even though i understood very little science then. You will be surprised that many atheists and deists on nairaland understand very little science.

lagerwhenindoubt:
Some people evolve quicker than most. Religion had its uses in old times when humans were still trying to understand their environment and why things happened the way they did, for lack of a better explanation; they believed in all-powerful cosmic beings who would solve all heir problems and give broad answers to the unknown. The world used to be Flat and it was considered blasphemy to say otherwise, and the earth was the center of the universe as Catholic institutions had thousands put to death for heresy. but now we know better and for lack of better things to do, they turned craddle-robbers (had to add that for special effect )

I agree that religion is very important in the early stages of a society's evolution, it helps unite people under a common purpose especially in a hostile environment with hostile enemies and rulers. Our society is in its very early stage of this evolution. Most old societies have jettisoned religion all together, the only ones holding on to it are those still in conflict and autocracy. If there is peace in the middle east for a sustained period and the society becomes democratic, Islam will start fading in that region of the world.

e-resource:
I have to tell all you guys that posted here. These posts are quite interesting.

@ Jinwitemi: Religion has always been in existence before Christians, Moslems etc, and I do not agree with you that humans will outgrow it. If not anything else, it will evolve to something else, of course humans will catalyze that. it has always been human nature to depend/believe in something, even the "scientists" who don't believe in God believe in science which is their religion. I can assure, it won't fade away.

@ benodic: To blame religion because there are some people you met and aren't so "accommodating" because of your religion is a bit shallow. Someone once asked me, if half Nigerians were truly religious, wouldn't we be the most developed country in Africa, probably the world?
I have met wonderful Christians and wonderful non-Christians, and I have met those that are not so wonderful too.

I quite agree with Jesoul, "it is we who choose what to do with the religion we're armed with.

I am 100% sure that with time humans will outgrow religion as presently practiced. Religion thrives in autocratic, poor, ignorant and harsh environments. But as societies becomes truly democratic, enlightened, just and prosperous, Gods and its special representatives(priests) would lose relevance, as is seen in most prosperous societies in the world today (who were even more religious than we are).

Jenwitemi:
My friend, quit the kneejerk reaction or i will have to mistake you for a religious fundermentalist. You know very damn well that the last person to propagate religious viewpoints around here is Jenwitemi. But that does not mean that i will have to endorse the viewpoint of the "other side" (evolutionists), whose views on this issue also stink. And i do not fully  endorse the religious viewpoint on this issue, either. I have already expressed this view in my earlier post.

I am not interested in your "either or" war with your religious opponents about this issue, so do not drag me into it. I just want to know what the truth is about human origins and evolutionist explanations just does not cut it for me, and so do the religious explanations. If you want to know where my viewpoint on this lie, then watch those videos in the link i provided.
Watch the Lloyd Pye videos in which he exposed quite clearly and in great details where the loopholes are. He is the expert, not i. And he is far from being a religious man.

Sorry, if i sounded a bit harsh, but you seem to be mixing up lots of issues together. The post was about how black people got their black (actually dark brown) skin pigmentation, and i felt that lots of people had taken time to give the scientific explanation. So i thought you wanted to start another creation vs evolution debate again.

If you actually wanted to discuss other possible origin of man (homo sapiens) or why there are different races, you should have said so, and maybe started another thread in that regard.

I am not against, looking a issues from a different perspective. In fact at one phase of my life, i was highly interested in the intervention (aliens) theory. I have read most of Erik Von Daniken's books, i even downloaded, printed and studied The Thiaoouba prophecy. So you see i had really given the issue some thought.


The problem was that as my science understanding improved, i started picking wide gaping holes in these theories. If i should go into them, i will have to write a whole book. But the most obvious ones are that, It is scientifically impossible to break the distance barrier between our solar system and the next solar system capable of sustaining life. secondly, it is highly improbable that life from another planet would look exactly like we do, and can survive in our atmosphere not to talk of being able to breed, that is even if they can be beamed directly here.

I enjoyed watching the videos, and i think there might be some merit in some of his postulations, like the one about some hominids still surviving til today (even though it is yet to be conclusively proven). But to say that we (homo sapiens are not indigenous to earth to me is ridiculous. If you say not indigenous to lower and colder latitudes, i agree. But you cannot say we are not adapted to the tropics.

I will look further into Lloyd Pre's postulations and let you know.

Jenwitemi:
You must excuse me, agathamari, but evolution does not adequately explain the origins of man, nor does it explain the the pigmentation question, nor the diverse features. Too many loopholes that need to be filled up. Watch the videos in the utube link i posted. I remain with the intervention theory till the acaedemic anthropology priesthood comes out with a theory that is more reasonable. What they have now is nonsense.

Mr Jenwitemi, if you are really interested in learning about differences in physical features of man, such as skin pigmentation, then i believe page number three of this thread would have answered most of your questions, but if you want to propagate religious teachings, then you should let us know, so that you can get input from theologians.

What do you mean by loopholes, and what are the loopholes that have not been filled. (in the area of skin pigmentation). Is the academic theology priesthood able to provides the answers that is water tight without any loophole?. Maybe the theologians should take over from the scientists, in our universities and research centres.

Tudor, What everybody is saying is that the portion about 419 is totally out of context. Meaning the context in which it is used is false, inappropriate and sarcastic.
No body is disputing the fact that millions of spam mails is sent from Nigeria each year. But for a journalist to  write the profile of a country's football team and input his conjectures and assumptions is totally unprofessional. There is no scientific study to suggest that during a football tournament, spam mails from Nigeria reduces. If the reporter had actually carried out such a study, he should have provided the facts.

Even the best excuse the BBC could come up with is that it was a joke, because was glaring that it was not applicable to the said profile. So i am surprised you are the only one who do not see any wrong with the profile. You seem to hate anything Nigerian and support anybody who takes takes cheap shots at Nigerians and Nigeria.

If the said piece was in a tabloid or a less serious section, most people would have laughed it off, but to pass that a news or a profile of the National team is unprofessional.

redsun:
Whaoo,seventy million pounds!!!These motherfuckers are living large at the expense of suffering nigerian.

Like someone rightly said,british sentencing could be very lenient and even if they are in jail,they live like they are in holiday camp.

The most important thing is to make sure the loot is recovered from them,even though recovering it will mean giving it back to thieving nigerian politicians again and the vicious circle goes on and on.

The sentencing cannot be too hash because, the crime was a minor one. They were not convicted for stealing, since the money was not stolen from Britain,but for breaking Britain's money laundering laws. It is Nigeria that can prosecute for stealing and corruption. ( that is if the government is genuinely interested).

These two were even not under investigation in Nigeria.

bouymoyo:
@wirinet am sure u don't know our to play football, football nowadays is not about running d whole field but what u can do with ball.my dear case closed we won, King kanu is playin at 2010 world cup.

Iam sorry, but it is you that lacks a basic understanding of modern football. Modern football discourages straitjacket compartmentalization of players into positions, especially in the midfield. Modern football requires physical fitness , - ask morihno, Wenger or Ferguson, who impose very strick physical and dietary regime on their players.

Kanu had not been very fit since after his arsenal days, and had had an outstanding performance since then.

Princek12:
You are probably right. That is why I said that it may be true, but no one knows definitely that it is true. Like I said earlier, I think anyone who is offended should complain to BBC, but ultimately we should try to clean up our own society.

I agree 101% that we need to clean up our act, that was why i said if the journalist wrote that part in another context, in another article, i would not have quarreled with it. But this is supposed to be about the Nigerian National team to the world cup for God sake. Even FIFA discourages mixing politics with football.

Princek12:
I don't think the BBC writer meant that 419 represents most Nigerians, but rather that the 419ers will be busy watching the Super Eagles, a time during which they will refrain from sending scam emails to their targets, effectively reducing the amount of scam emails that will be received in the inbox of targets. While this may be true, I think anyone who is offended by this email has every right to complain against BBC, for BBC's stories about Nigeria lately are edging around outright disrespect to Nigerians.

Again, this story should send to Nigerians a message that we should self police ourselves and  try to stop all these 419 and deceptive activities so that other countries will not continue to ridicule us.

Mr prince, that section of the article is totally flawed and out of context, it reeks of malicious intent. If you have a basic knowledge of how the internet works, you would know that spam mails are not manually, it would be impossible to send thousands of span mail without the use of software - Email extractor and emailer. And these software work automatically, with very minimal human intervention. These emailers send mails to thousands of people day and night.

So i do not see how watching a few 90 mins football matches for a one month period can significantly reduce spam mails from Nigeria.

I do not mind Journalist writing about the 419 phenomenon in a related story, my only surprised was how the bbc journalist was able to link the profile of the Nigerian National team to 419. It is completely out of context.  It looks as if a different story was mistakenly inserted into his main story without the knowledge of the writer.

Every country has issues it is grappling with, like North Korea, Greece, and even Columbia. I do not see what an article on the Greek economic crisis would be doing in the middle of the profile of the Greek national team.

BBC seems to have lost it lately.

Rmc1:
It has been free for all looting since the efcc czar ribadu left, it is very clear that OGD wants to embezzle this loan after all, 2010 is around the corner the next gov of ogun state can pay off the loan.Nigerians will never learn.

I do not understand the above statement.

Are you saying that when your so called Czar was in office, that there was not looting going on? Or that OGD was not looting during Ribadu's time?

Me too, I believe in the non existence of UFO (aliens), so that must make me religious.

Kobojunkie:
I spent over 20 years of my life in Ikorodu as well. So?
Is the US now Britannica? Are we to suddenly assume that all sources that do not corroborate your version are no longer acceptable? Come on now! You and I know it is one thing to know of a place and another to know of a place's history and how things came to be as we percieve them.

Dude, Ikorodu is believed to have been founded by Oga. History has it that Oga was from Ile ife, and not from Ijebu. Ikorodu was a trading post and its proximity to Sagamu/remo area would make sense for why the Ijebus are found in Ikorodu. There also exists a link to the Benin people as well, those from Ibadan areas. I remember one of the keji son's telling me a story of the benin link to Ikorodu. The Awori story I heard some time ago and I seem to find from some sources online, and since they make up a huge part of lagos, it makes sense to me. That some in Ikorodu speak Ijebu does not necessarily mean Ikorodu was always ijebu. I do know for a fact that even those in Itumoja, Itupate, Italewa areas do not speak the same dialect as you would find say in isiu, agbowa areas. And those are closer to what you would get to Ijebu areas though.

Like I said, I have found so many twists on this at this point that I will rather wait for more to verify this as I have not really done much research on the subject myself but I heard quite a lot of history from folks I grew up around about the town and that is much of what I go by to this date. I just called home to a friend who I know is Ijebu and he promises he will get me a write up on the history of the towns in the area. He considers himself an Ijebu man living in Ikorodu, and he seems to be well versed in history of Ijebus and Ikorodu areas and I intend to dig as deep as I can with him. So, I prefer not to continue this until I get some facts to work with.
And?
They are still not pronounced only now since we live in the 21st century, it makes sense that with media everywhere, it is easy to think it is the case today when it is probably not changed.

I agree that there ought to be fewer states and that states should definitely fend for themselves but I don't believe nothing is stopping any state from doing that even to this day. Mega Projects should not be the states priority in my opinion. I think states ought to focus on projects that directly improve the standard of living of their own people and these projects do not have to be mega to be necessary. Leave the mega to the private sector where there are higher chances they will be better handled and maintained.

States are not to use Tax-Payer money/money that belongs to the people for projects that do not come with guarantees such as building of shopping malls and all that lot. States ought to busy themselves with projects that help lift the people and help them better compete in the country and the globe as a whole.

I am impressed with your response. It is a pity that even in the 21st century, we still rely on oral traditions and stories to understand our history and have to rely on foreigners to tell us about our history. That is why we have so many different versions. I wonder what our history professors are doing?

I honestly do not understand what you meant by Ikorodu was founded by Oga and that Oga was said to come from Ile-ife.  Does that mean that the area now called Ikorodu was uninhabited before Oga came?.
I suspect people claim Oga came from Ife because Ife was the spiritual centre of the Yoruba Religion and every tribe tries to claim it origin from there. Just like the Hausa tries to claim Saudi ancestry or Igbo Jewish ancestry.
Please furnish me with more info when you get it.

I mean since Ogun state generates very little internal revenue, they would go completely broke if sufficient subvention does not come from Abuja, thereby leading to social problems.

When i talk of mega projects, i mean projects that would have massive impact on the people, not shopping malls, stadiums,airports or free trade zones. I mean power projects (which is highly capital intensive), railway system, modern expressways, and other infrastructures like water, etc. that would have direct impact on the lives of the masses.

Kobojunkie:
I have read so many versions of this story and I think it is futile arguing it without facts.

I think more highly of you than what you are engaging in now, which is arguing in a cul de sac. I told you I live among Ikorodu people, So many Yarubas have come to confirm that Ikorodu people are from Ijebu subtribe of yoruba, and no Ikorodu person had come to dispute the fact (and i am sure we have some ikorodu indigene here), and you are still looking for fact? where are you looking for the facts form? - the US?. Is that where you got your info from that the Ikorodus are Aworis?

Kobojunkie:
Why would that lead to disaster?

When revenue Abuja dries up, where will the money to run the government come from?. Poverty usually leads to social upheaval as is currently happening in some parts of Nigeria now.

Kobojunkie:
Inter/intra tribal conflictes existed long before we came together as a nation -- way before creation of the first states. Merging states will not fix that problem.

Yes that was because the tribes were under different autonomous governments, with very little interference from a central government. That kind of arrangement tend to divide people rather than unite them. were those inter/inter tribal conflicts pronounced when the whole of the yorubas came under one government?

Kobojunkie:
Nothing currently STOPS each town/state from fending for itself. more than 75% of the states we have today are capable of doing that. Like I said earlier, Ogun can definitely fend for itself if it was truly serious about doing that and it could actually compete, some day with Lagos if it learned to use it's resources to it's advantage. Ogun may not have the population Lagos boasts of today but it does have resources a-plenty and that is gold.

I did not say each local government or town should not fend for itself, what i am saying is that at the state level, it would me better to have fewer states. Mega projects can be prosecuted at the state level that cannot be done if the state is too small to generate sufficient revenue. Most of the biggest projects in Yoruba land was executed by the mega western Nigeria state, even without oil revenue.

Kobojunkie, I live at the heart of Ikorodu. The Ikorodu people see themselves as Ijebu. I have never met an Ikorodu man that says he has Awori roots.

Although I strongly advocate for merging of states, because the current arrangements will lead to disaster in the long run. That is when oil dries out or the price of oil crashes for a sustained period. The reason why there is so much inter tribal and intra tribal conflicts is because of the "rent" economy we are currently operating. If each town, state or region has to fend for itself and compete (in a healthy manner) with other towns states or regions, then they would see the wisdom and strength in merging units with close relationships to each other.

I am surprised some Ogun State indegines are too proud to consider joining with lagos, because the present Ogun state economy is heavily tied to the economy of lagos. Also most Ijebus has very strong ties with lagos, whether economic or social. In fact i can say that a considerable number of people calling themselves Lagos indigenes today have their roots in Ogun state.

Kobojunkie:
Correction: Ikorodus are NOT Ijebus.

I seriously doubt the people of the two states would ever really vote for such a move. I know I would't.

Why would you not vote for such a move? I thought you are an advocate for good and effective governance. But at one time the whole of the south west except lagos was under one government, was it a terrible thing then. Were the Yorubas not more united then. was the government not far more efficient then?

SapeleGuy:
When you look at the respective budgets, Lagos N420 billion versus Ogun N100 billion, Greed will kill this idea stone dead.
Will Ogun on the other hand be prepared to share their mineral wealth with Lagos- I think not.

Yes there is a huge disparity in budgets now, but if money form the joint state is used to rapidly expand and develop new areas, in no time the the Internal Generated Revenue of the  Ogun section will also increase appreciably.  The revenue generating potential from the ports, airports and other infrastructure far outstrips any mineral wealth that Ogun has. besides Granite, i do not know which other mineral is being exploited in Ogun right now.

Sapeleguy, how would you see a merged state of OGUN/LAGOS with an annual revenue of close to N600 billion but with a recurrent expenditure of less than N100 billion. The state would be world class in less than 5 yrs, if the money is not stolen.

Bindex, you get time o. The poster is trying to argue topics he does not have a clue about? so are just wasting you time trying to educate him. He has already come to the conclusion that atheist's non acceptance of his god or any other gods amounts to a religion, and that their are various religious sects of this no god believers who meet and worship their non existence entity. so leave him to his reasoning, he is entitled to it.

Beloveed, you are right, belief in Atoms is a religion, Atoms have never been seen, it is only a religious belief of scientists, or is it evolutionists.

bindex:
Wirinet, Its been a while, hope life is treating your good, warm regards.

My brother i dey, had some minor health challenge but i am alright now. Well life in Niga is not easy o, but we are surviving.

I hope you are doing fine in all regards.

Well take care.

Some of you Christians just want to justify your self by attempting to use reverse psychology. You want to bring everybody to your level of reasoning, no matter how inappropriate it may be. So you peddle misinformation, misdefinition  and deliberate false hood.

If you do not understand an issue try and research before you copy and paste. Let me just correct a few of your misinformation and misdefinitions;

1. Although i am an Evolutionist, not every atheist accepts the Theory of Evolution of Species as propounded by Charles Darwin.  In the opposite side of the spectrum, you have lots, i mean millions of Christians that subscribe to the evolution theory. So you cannot divide Atheists and Theist along the evolution devide.

2. Cosmologists (not evolutionists) did not say that the earth was created from nothing, they did not even say that the universe was created from nothing. I do not know where your source got that from?

3. About the spoken words, you cannot have words in a vacuum. So sound as per Hebrew words could not have predated the air filled earth.

4. Please check the definition of the word sect and explain how it applies to atheists.

5. I do not understand what you mean by million died because of Atheist Ideology. If you do not know Karl marxs ideology was a socio-political ideology and not an atheist idology, just like Adam Smiths ideology was not a Christian ideology. Further more religious wars are quiet different from ideological or economic wars. There had never been any war to propagate Atheist beliefs.

What do you mean theist have history written by men? Have you seen any institution using any religious book as as an historical book?.

Compete manual for what? for making the computer you are typing on?. Yes science will forever be discovering new things.

Who told you Atoms have not been seen? Go to a well equipped laboratory with an electron microscope and you will see what atoms look like.

ode remo:
do you guys think running a state is like managing your private company where accounts a merged for consolidation?
why should state be merged,. for a minute i thought OGUN was so viable the IJEBUS cant wait to slide out of the state. merge ko , merge ni.
OGD, just go jejele.

I think the Yorubas should lobby for the merging of Lagos and Ogun States. That would be of immense benefit to both states, and these are my reasons why?

1. Merging up the two state would half the recurrent expenditure of the two states and leave more money for capital projects.

2. The boundary between the two states have merged anyway in that most time you cannot tell if a boundary town is in Lagos or ogun, Examples are Agbara, Akute, Ogijo and Isheri, etc.

3. Lagos is too small (too narrow), the distance from the Atlantic to the northernmost boundary of lagos, i.e Odogunyan, Isheri or Alagbado is less than 40kms, and besides all these border Local government areas were taken from Ogun State.

4. The people in border towns have the same sub ethnic grouping on both sides of the state, ie Ikorodus are Ijebus, while Alagbados are Egba.

4. Merging the two state would make the new state a very powerful economic force in Africa. The combine economy would rival that of the whole of Nigeria.

5. Merging them also would give Lagos the opportunity to create new maga city centres as the present ogun has lots of land instead of choking up the already scarce land available or spending billions reclaiming land from the Atlantic.

6. The new Lagos would have enough arable land to provide agriculture to feed the new mega cities.

If two countries - East and West Germany could merge after being separate for more than 40 years, why can't Lagos and Ogun that had been separated for less than the same 40 years.

The process of merging is easy, A referendum by the people of the two states can be held, and if it is voted for by the peoples of the two states, the proposals can be passes as a bill at their respective national assemblies. And once it becomes law, it only needed to be vetted by the National assembly. (that is if they are ready to do their job).

Even Europe is gradually merging, why are we always going in the opposite direction?

Beaf:
Enh!!
You need to know that Ibori graduated from stealing sheets of zinc roofing in Nigeria to shoplifting and credit card fraud in the UK; from "consulting" for Abacha to stealing from Delta state, becoming Yar Adua's godfather and the cabals mentor / financier. How much more federal can that get?
The smallest thief with access to power is a danger to the whole country. Thats the lesson of Ibori.

I hate it when people employ strange and diversionary arguments in defense of those that have looted us blind. Why mention Rufai or Ribadu? Its just so off-point and shambolic and illogical. Even if all the people you mentioned are found to be the worst criminals (which they aren't), how would that affect the arguments against Ibori? Would that somehow make him innocent?

Mr Beaf, you are being unfair to us Delta State indigenes, Delta State itself and Ibori. Ibori was imposed on us in 1999, because the Name was an unknown entity prior to that. By the time the Delta people recovered and found out his back ground, we complained about his unwholesome past. Ogboru to the case of a convicted criminal all the way to the supreme court. Since the case span over to the end of his first term, we were hoping he would not be allowed to contest again for the second term, but Alas! what happened? the supreme court acknowledged that that yes one Onanefe Ibori was convicted, but since the all relevant documents related to the case has mysteriously gone missing, it cannot be proven that this same Ibori was that Ibori, Even though the judge that actually convicted Ibori came to court to Identify Ibori the governor as the Ibori he convicted. So on the eve of the 2003 elections, Ibori was clared by the OBJ led supreme court to run.

I say that you are being unfair to Ibori, because he had been used as a tool by the powers that be to achieve their aims, he was used first by Atiku, then had to switch over to OBJ for obvious reasons, then he was used by Yaradua - Jonathan), so just because he went over board in his support of Yaradua and opposition to Jonathan's presidency means he had suddenly become the devil?.

Does Jonathan's war on corruption start and stop with Ibori?, since Ibori's sel;f exile, will the war on corruption be put on hold?, What about all the other past governors, what is happening to Dariye?, what about ALL the present Governors - are there not numerous allegations hanging on their head?, What about even Uduaghan? Are the Delta State indigenes doing better than when Ibori was governor?

You people shouting crucify Ibori does not understand how Nigeria works,Power play in Nigeria is usually between two power blocks, and eventually they always reach a compromise, Ibori's faction will just buy time until they can reach a compromise with Johnathan's group . It is a family affair - remember?

As i said Ibori's major problem is in England and not Nigeria.

Kudos to the Poster, at least he is thinking of doing something about the situation instead of just engaging in debating the problem.

I do not think you need the CP himself, there are various departments of the Nigerian police that deals with such issues. I know their public complaint dept is somewhere near Issac John in Ikeja. Also the public relation office at Alausa handles complains very well.

I want people to provide contacts to these offices.

If most of Us starts complaining and protesting and not wait until the day we are directly affected, things would start to improve.

Ikomi, you be Itse? related to the royal family?