₦airaland Forum

nuclearboy:
^^ You, Joagbaje, keep saying it is more blessed to give than to receive but once the issue of 'pastors' comes up, you are quick to say Paul received and above you justify the Corinthian experience. Basically then, your mien is that pastors are to receive so that the world can be blessed. But this is totally unscriptural.

To maximise your returns in blessings you need to sow/give unto an anointing which can only be found in a pastor. Other form of giving does not yield as much returns. The act of giving provoke an (otherwise dormant) pastoral anointing resulting in the flow of blessings to the giver.

BTW Jo is not interested in scriptures that will not add value to the pastor's bank account

nuclearboy:
Why cannot your pastors give to the congregation or to society?

Because God gave all born again people the option of material wealth. Pastor don exercise him own option (collect him money), you go and exercise yours The pastor cannot be feeding congregation na when they can easily invoke their own option. Its a simple matter really. The only difference being pastor must collect his own from the congregation while individual members will search for their own outside. Helping the pastor to realise his own will provide direction (if only the giver is spiritual enough to see it) as to the location of his wealth

Joagbaje:
Paul didn't Mary either, he sees it as a distraction. But does that make it a law for every minister? We should know how to balance issues with word of truth. Paul only worked in corinth because of the carnal nature of the corithians. They don't like giving and paul didn't want anybody to look down on him there. He took money from other churches.

All your own na money BTW what are you doing here You no go S.A abi you no get ticket

mabell:
I've passed by churches during their services and see the big and flashy cars parked, I've also seen the houses some members live in and its nothing compared to what their pastors live in.

wetin you dey do for other church members house

Whose lifestyle set the benchmark for Christian living, Pastor or congregation

mabell:
wait o! just noticed something, you all talk about men of God living large but the members also live large, drive better cars and live in luxurious houses or you have not come across any

So if the members hang out in brothels pastor should do same abi if some members worship sango as backup, pastor should do same abi Then again, your post does reflect the reality of the situation. Now what we get from the pulpit is being influenced/shaped by the yearning of the congregation I sometimes wonder if pastors actually add value to the life of believers

newmi:
this is not about a church but is all about the church

newmi:
@zikkyy
stop running your mouth purposelessly unguarded amigo l mentioned "a church" and "the church" or do you require any assistance to draw the line?

'a church' 'the church' what's the difference anyway you look at it, it's still about CEC. You still dont get it see your oga joagbaje for further briefing I am sure he will be able to explain why he advised you stop mentioning church names

newmi:
And l know you are shying away from the aspect that talks about you sharing your own testimonies of your love for Jesus and concern for lost souls and what you are doing to that regard, the forum is interested an would want to learn and b inspired it. o ya fire down amigo.

Thanks for the invitation But that thread was created by a god for gods (and goddesses ) to discuss, it's possible i will share when a similar thread is created for men

newmi:
@gbadura
Pastor Chris is the pastor of Christ embassy and author of best selling daily devotional-Rhapsody of Reality,

Best selling ke I thought it was free

Azibalua:
Never enough for who
Tell me who receives more the one who gives or the one who receives

We are saying the same thing; you want more, your wants/needs are insatiable

Joagbaje:
Jesus used chartered boats and ship . Was it luxury or necessity?

And I never said pastors should not charter a KLM or BA flight (if they have the crowd to fill it). On whether private jet can be considered a luxury or necessity, the question is what value does it add to the preaching of the gospel?

Joagbaje:
Before we criticise a minister we should find out his reasons. Did he buy it? Was it a gift. Creflo dollar got his first plane free from copeland. Idahosa was once offered a plane ,he rejected it, he didn't feel a need for it.

My concern is not just the source of the asset. It could be a gift, no problem. Should a pastor store up gift he will not need in the near future or gift that will not be adding value to his work other than make him much more comfortable? Accepting a private jet at a time church members are losing their jobs (when some members probably feed once in two days) does not reflect an MOG led by the Holy Spirit.

Joagbaje:
And as a man is trusted to serve God with what he has , he receives more grace to have more.

This priority of the prosperity gospel preacher/advocate; it's always about 'more', then much 'more'. It is never enough

frosbel:
I am not saying that God does not bring financial blessings to people who are generous. He does. But the perversion comes when it is reduced to a "law" or "formula" and the emphasis is on the money, not on the true priorities of the Holy Spirit. The hypnotic words of the preacher urging generous gifts become the substitute for God's voice. Lies are employed in order to make people empty their wallets. These practices, according to the Scriptures, will SURELY bring the destruction of God upon the perpetrators.

True talk.

Joagbaje:
The early church had reasons to raise money. Paul raised money.

Very true that Paul raised money but what was the purpose was it to meet needs of the very poor brothers or was it for the purchase of a 'state of the art' horse drawn carriage i am sure Paul did more travelling than most MOGs of our time.

@newmi, i think this is the wrong thread

newmi:
Do you by any chance have other meaningful contributions otherthan trying to raise arguments about a church, can you simply open your eyes and see the writing on the wall that this is not about a church but is all about the church perhaps you could share your own testimonies of your love for Jesus and concern for perishing souls, that is if peradventure there is any.

EarsWide:
@Newmi

The meaningful contribution is exposing 419ers and MOFs - men of fraud

Thank you jare

newmi:
can you simply open your eyes and see the writing on the wall that this is not about a church but is all about the church

Which wall and which writing i think you are fast losing your grip on reality The only church i see here is CEC. Is CEC the 'church'

Joagbaje:
Many pastors recieve gifts . Those who have been touched give gifts to their pastor. So the so called big cars are mostly gifts. And for a real pastor. It's just a vehicle. He is not moved by the glamour.

This is where you are wrong Jo, real pastors are moved by the Godly spirit in them. No real pastor will indulge in extreme luxury when their brothers are unable to afford a meal/day, none. Its true pastors receives gifts by virtue of their position, but a real man of God will not store up/lock up gifts in excess of his requirement when there is a brother in need.

Joagbaje:
You should judge people motives by the content of there words and defence and not by our assumption.

The content of words does not always tell who you are, the true info lies in the heart. And I think the content of the heart is better expressed in actions & physical (body) expressions. We should only rely on words as a last resort (in the absence of any other info). We assess pastors by their actions and not what they preach.

@ JOAGBAJE AKHOZEM or is it AKHOZEM JOAGBAJE

I am not so sure now which is first name and which is surname I really think it was the Holy Spirit that led you to make that blunder yesterday Attempting to change ID without obtaining approval from the ‘house’ you know that’s not right

Anyways, if you are really concern about the reactions of your people ‘back home’, I think you can still make that ID change work (in the long run). As long as people continue to see the ID joagbaje, what comes to mind is Pastor Joe Agbaje and this sometimes influences their response. It won’t be a bad idea letting people know the joagbaje ID has been retired

KunleOshob:
I also strongly suggest you change your user name as you can't help but embarass urself regularly.

I think it make sense too.

mabell:
what is even in the double id thing afterall others do it

mabell, what are your other I.Ds its confession time com'on, out with it

Joagbaje:
Several friends have advised me to change I.D. But I like joagbaje,

I dont know why you would want to change your I.D, we love Joagbaje Besides i dont see how you can pretend to be somebody else, we go catch you in no time. There is no need really.

Joagbaje voted for himself with a different ID damn

I have to agree with Jo though, i dont think he is mabel

Edit: Oga Jo, what does AKHOZEM mean is it latin for 'CASH'

Joagbaje:
There is no numerous I.D. Joagbaje has been viciously attacked on NL. I have made several complains to moderators , but nothing was done. And there is need for another ID. While joagbaje fades gradually. so that gave birth to AKHOZEM.

try again

Joagbaje:
Faith is involved, if a man believes that poverty is humility, he can't have. That's the problem with the erroneous poverty preaching. It is devilish. Prosperity is of God and he wants us to do well. when a man gives he positions himself for receiving . Either it's healing, or financial miracle, when a man doesn't have faith due the unbelief ,God cant help him. That's why people must know their rights and privileges in christ.

You know, I get the impression (please correct me if I am wrong) that the purpose of the healing school is to build your faith level and only those that are able to achieve this get to meet oyaks. Why don’t you apply same to giving Why collect money from the ‘faithless’ or men of little faith. Why not help them build their faith first, before they start giving CEC members have been taught to believe this, how many are truly rich, how many pretend to be rich We all know the statistics, so how can a pastor say he has been successful in building men & woman of faith

Joagbaje:
A man must have faith to recieve. When there's a giving there's a receiving .

I can see from your post, one only require faith to receive, no faith is required when you give. Just give, that’s what is important, then build the required faith to receive the millions.

Joagbaje:
Two reason why a real pastor will continually have .
1.  He receives because he gives
2.  People bless him with money or gifts because he has affected their lives positively.

You can't take those two things from a real man of God. They must happen. God rewards them .

Your post sound materialistic probably why you get plenty of insults. It not expected of a man your status. God rewards, that I believe. And I believe it is those that have adhered to his commandment of loving God and their neighbor, not those that give for returns.  

Joagbaje:
If you are a tither , you should not have problem in paying your bills.

Jo, can you say with all tithers (without exception) have no problem meeting their bills? Can you say this Jo

Joagbaje:
I just got a contract that is fetching over 10 million. I didn't ask for it. I gave a gift to someone and people saw it at the presidency . They made Order for it. I was too shocked, it's one of the beautiful surprises of a giving heart.

Jo talk true You know you have Aso rock connection I no go accept this example ooh give another one abeg How many people go give gift that will get to presidency, not to talk of making order. And the order even came to you, haba you think say presidency no get special vendor for inflating contract. Come to think of it, I hope you no play ball with those crooks at the presidency by inflating the value of the contract Presidency give pastor contract You never give us the full gist

Joagbaje:
The mistake some of you make is to think that money given in a church belongs to Mr pastor. It's not true. He is the first giver and tither. He is only a custodian .

Who dey chop the money Na the congregation

Joagbaje:
Elijah didn't ask her for food because he was hungry, he gave her opportunity to practice the law of sowing and reaping. God knows how to take care of a man of God. Did God not feed him with roasted meat supernaturally?

Jo this na why I dey vex for you most times Why you dey lie like this I dey fear you walahi You dey talk like say na only you get access to bible

1 Kings 17:5-9 (KJV)
5So he went and did according unto the word of the LORD: for he went and dwelt by the brook Cherith, that is before Jordan.  6And the ravens brought him bread and flesh in the morning, and bread and flesh in the evening; and he drank of the brook.  7And it came to pass after a while, that the brook dried up, because there had been no rain in the land.
8And the word of the LORD came unto him, saying,
9Arise, get thee to Zarephath, which belongeth to Zidon, and dwell there: behold, I have commanded a widow woman there to sustain thee.

Elijah no hungry abi but he was thirsty You see yourself na Tell me why anybody go take you seriously. Walahi, if I be member for your church, I for don dey ask for refund in tithe & offerings cos I am not impressed with the quality of service you are providing

Joagbaje:
A plane is just a vehicle, a church or pastor has no business with it except it's required. And if they feel it's necessary to have one. Let God judge that. If you have missed important meetings due to flight delays, you will consider hire. If buying a plane on the long run will be more economical for this who's calling takes them all over the world.

A private jet is not just a plane oga Jo. It is a luxury the pastor can do without. BTW it is not more economical, long run or short run.

Joagbaje:
The church primary responsibility is to preach the gospel. A pastor primary responsibility is his congregation and not folks on the streets.

Maybe I don’t understand you, but I don’t quite agree. Who makes up the pastors congregation? I am sure the congregation didn’t drop from the sky. I think the congregation results from interaction with folks on the street. Is he going to close the front door after achieving a set threshold? So how do separate the folks on the street from the congregation?

Joagbaje:
Most real pastor put their personal money into the work. They are in it for service and not for gains.

Yes, it’s possible ‘real’ pastors put their money into the work. I agree with you here. You can see I don’t always disagree with everything you post

AKHOZEM:
i talk to responsible people dear. please let my interviwer talk, he seems more responsible.

Who be this

Joagbaje:
Most pastors are first examples in giving .

They are also first examples in receiving

Joagbaje:
How did it make sense for elijah to ask a widow to give her last meal for him to eat?

Unlike you, Elijah did not place a burden on anybody. It made sense for Elijah to ask cos he was acting based on directive from God. Are you saying pastors milking the poor today based on similar directive Elijah knew the woman jar of flour would not run dry. Can you say the same for the poor you currently fleece I wonder why the woman did not reap enough reward to build her a mansion and live like a queen considering Elijah’s anointing.

Joagbaje:
The solution to poverty is GIVING.

Na wa ooh You suppose recommend this your theory to GEJ, the man need to find a solution to our economic crisis. I think armed robbers and kidnappers should give more, this will help eliminate crime. Talk to GEJ abeg, the man fit make you senior economic adviser

Joagbaje:
Are they not human beings ? Are planes made for monkeys?

The way you talk sef You no dey talk like Christian at all What do mean are they not human beings We know they are human, and should enjoy the necessities of life. But a life of extreme luxury right in the middle of extreme poverty does not reflect a Christ-like personality You pastors paint the picture of a shepherd (on a very cold winter night) treating himself to the very best wine and cuisine (which might probably include lamp loin chops ) in the comfort of his warm living room, while the sheep struggle to stay warm out in the cold. I know you go talk say them be sheeps, so they belong outside

EarsWide:
By the Elijah was starving as well so at least he had a reason to ask for food, what exactly do the churches/pastors lack ?

You talk true my brother.

Joagbaje:
Dude and dudes,
These exhortations are excerpts from the rhapsody you Erroneously criticised without reading it. See what I mean?.

Wetin concern me with ROR and what do you really mean You sure say you read my post very well

nuclearboy:
Bah !! Its all just marketing - let them join in first and the poison will be administered. On truths above, give him 48 hours & he'll be back preaching the MOG is the "ONE" gospel

e fit be say the man dey visit NL oo maybe after reading joagbaje status report (the man fit dey debrief joagbaje on a periodic basis), he decides to change tactics Anyways, dat na big gamble cos he could lose some customers in the process

Nice sermon. Oyaks don dey try

Joagbaje:
Some others try to “help” God by dictating to Him how they want Him to do what they want Him to do.

Very true talk but na you pastors dey cause am. You peeps are the one misleading the congregation

Joagbaje:
Always remember that God is your help not man. The psalmist said, “I will lift up mine eyes unto the hills, from whence cometh my help. My help cometh from the Lord, which made heaven and earth” (Psalm 121:1-2).

Of course God will use people to bless and help you but He doesn’t have to do it through a particular person as you have it in your mind. He doesn’t want your attention to be on any man! He can use anybody and anything to fulfill His Word in your life.

Finally!! somebody agrees receiving blessing is not based on the degree of anointing God can use your pastor same way he can use the man/woman next door. So if you keep surrendering your money to your pastor thinking thats where your blessing will be coming from, you are on your own ooo It is not by anoiting (that is assuming the pastor is truly anointed)

Joagbaje:
Many people have God all figured out. They pray but nothing happens, meanwhile they’re responsible for limiting God in their lives. Once they expect things to happen a certain way, all their attention and focus is toward that direction, which mostly is away from God and His Word.

An example is the rendering of a 10% to your pastor some people so much believe their blessing is going to come from giving 10% to their pastor, when God has other plans for them. So for some of you the 'get rich sharp-sharp or tithe trying' approach will not work ooo

Joagbaje:
Quit looking up to man for help, look to the Lord; for your help is in the Name of the LORD!

You talk true my brother. Good one, clap for yourself

Azibalua:
@zikky
What do you think I am saying?

Na wa for you if i know i wont be asking

Azibalua:
Every meeting has it's purpose and reason

True talk.

Azibalua:
For those who are attending again it can only be from glory to glory

What are you saying

mabell:
It's an appointment with destiny where you'll hear that specific word from God that will transform your life, and you'll be enraptured in the glory of His presence!!!

What about attendees at the last ‘night of bliss’ that will also be attending this one Will their life be re-transformed Will they be meeting a revised destiny this time

Enigma:
Wey dem??

You want us to expose our yansh for here We (prosperity preachers & lovers) are not interested jare when there are more rewarding stuff to be done (like sowing more seeds)

wales:
When I went to his house in Asaba, Delta State, and confronted him, his wife reprimanded me for talking to a man of God that way. When I told her to watch her tongue, she entered into the inner room and suddenly brandished an empty bottle and broke it on my head. With blood gushing from my head,

KunleOshob:
@image123
You sound more like a goat than a sheep to me with your stubborn endorsement of manipulated carnal doctrines.

My thoughts as well. Only a goat will be that sturborn

Well, i think the best place to keep your millions is the bank (if you are not willing to invest or spend).

Joagbaje:
Those who sought Jesus ought to have been healed in their houses by Almighty God as well

Matthew 14:36
36 And besought him that they might only touch the hem of his garment: and as many as touched were made perfectly whole.

That was pre-crucifixion. or are you saying oyaks = Christ Are you also saying Christ is only available for consultation at the crusade ground

mabell:
Get ready for a special Holy Ghost Night of the Miraculous, Blessings, Revelation and Impartation at the Night Of Bliss in Jo'burg, South Africa.

Do I have to wait for a special event to get my blessings & miracles

KunleOshob:
You are not exactly right, there is potentially a lot of money that could be made on social networking sites. Facebook forinstance has revenues in excess of $800 million per annum. The more members you have the greater your advertizing revenue. So basically CEC is just trying to develop a money spinning website using their church members as a starting point and marketing instruments. When you get to understand CEC well you would realize that everything they do is ultimately about making money for it's promoter.

You do have a point. I wasn’t thinking