₦airaland Forum

Janosky:
Bros, 1 John 5:7 and 1 Timothy 3:16 are Trinitarian forgeries. Please find out.

Did Isaiah 9:6 tell you God was born on earth?

Do explain 1 Timothy 3:16 from your understanding.

"Beyond all question, the mystery from which true godliness springs is great: He appeared in the flesh, was vindicated by the Spirit, was seen by angels, was preached among the nations, was believed on in the world, was taken up in glory."

OpenYourEyes3:
How do we reconcile this two verses:

1. "If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved" — Romans 10:9
(NIV)


2. "Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven." — Matthew 7:21



The truth is saying JESUS is LORD carnally, without believing, obedience and doing GOD's will won't save you. You have to believe in JESUS and obey HIS teachings in order to be have eternal life or be saved.

Another biblical contradiction.

Emvico34:
U say? Abiara are u sure u hear from God? How can u associate urself with such a man? Many are in hell wailing and gnashing their teeth because of his misleading messages and u are still calling him ur son. Pls stop listening to tb josua's messages if u want to make heaven

Can you point to any of his misleading messages?
The only issue CAN, PFN and other pastors had against TB Joshua was simply his miracles. Which they claimed was not from God, perhaps to save face for their own lack of miracles. Perhaps they were right but we'll never know since they had no evidence.

Bear in mind that the Jewish leaders also accused Jesus Christ the same way because of his miracles while they could not perform any.
They even claimed he performed healings through Belzebub (the devil). Sound familiar?

Only God knows who are his and who aren't.
Judging by his fruits which Christ urged us to look out for, TB Joshua is more like Christ than most of the other pastors and gods of men our generation celebrates.

Fahdiga1:
God hates sinners and everything about them

But the bible says everyone, even Kumuyi is a sinner.

According to the book of 1 John (quoted below) bearing in mind that John was the only apostle called the beloved of Jesus and the only one to never taste death until his old age.

Meaning Pastor Kumuyi would have to refund all the tithes and offering he has ever received.

Did Pastor Kumuyi think this through at all or he had some specific members he was preaching about? We know pastors seldom preach to address their personal issues with church members.

1 John 1:8-10
8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.

MaxInDHouse:
It's not easy when you don't want to believe that there is an evil genius somewhere that is confusing the readers of the book {2Corinthians 4:4} and that the Almighty Author (God) is using His active force (Holy Spirit) to direct His own people into finding the correct Interpretation of His word {John 14:26, 16:12-13} which undeniable evidence is clear as a global family of peace loving worshipers simply emerged in our own time! Isaiah 2:2-4 compare to Daniel 12:10

Why do Christians make excuses for the bible's errors/contradictions but not other religious books like the Quran (Islam) or Talmud (Judaism) and other books?
Cos by this excuse every other religion can claim it's errors/contradictions too are simply caused by the devil.

At the end of the day, everyone is just following the religion or belief system that helps them make meaning to life and fulfills them.

TeDesQ:
I disagree

When people no longer have strong grip over controlling people, they feel threatened.

It's control freaks that would have such ìdeologies seeing that massive amount of people they once had as captives are no longer captives of their ìdeologies and control.


The world will continue to be a free place for people and will never return to an era where people are dominated and controlled people by fiat

It's control freaks that need to develop restraint and control themselves

You disagree that social media is making most youths of this generation less productive?
You disagree that social media consumes most of the time of the youths that could have been used instead for productivity viz- work, study, physical socialization, etc?
You disagree that majority of social media users only use it for unproductive and illegal activities?

Yes, there's still a sizeable number of youth that use social media productively, but it's negative impact on the youth of our generation cannot be denied.

Should it be regulated? And to what extent, should be the issue at hand.

MaxInDHouse:
This is the perfect understanding of the concept!

When i was a Muslim i used to read the Bible but do you know my intention back then?
Well it was to find contradicting verses so i can have something say when arguing with the Christians, then i came into a verse that put me in a tight spot: Matthew 26:52 here Jesus condemned the use of weapons which means if everyone truly believe in Jesus there will be no more wars!
So i began searching for the group that's keeping this verse, do you notice that i've advanced from just reading to find contradicting verses to another stage?
Then i discovered that there are so much contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines even in the midst of those claiming Christians but i never allowed that to stop me from progressing, i believe i'll find Jesus' true followers who are keeping this verse one day.
Moreover i was a soldier and i know the evil consequences of wars in the human society so i'm not ready to let go until i found Jesus' true followers who are lovers of peace!
Today i'm no more a weapon carrier and i'm also teaching others to think of other ways to resolve issues amicably without the use of weapons!
That's what i meant by level of understanding, you too can make progress instead of arguing always about the seeming contradictions caused by trinitarian translaors!

That's a powerful testimony. And I'm glad to hear that.

I hope to some day stop seeing the contradictions.
Cos it makes it difficult to hold a conviction of the teachings of the bible.

MaxInDHouse:
Well that's the level of your own understanding. According to the Bible God has many sons (angels) in heaven {Job 38:7} and Jesus is just one of them which God transformed into an embryo in the womb of Mary, that's the simple explanation.
No wonder he always talk about his home and his father's house (heaven) John 14:1-4

Well on that we agree.
The bible is revealed according to our levels of understanding and interpretation.
Read Hebrews 1.

MaxInDHouse:
John the baptist and Jesus of Nazareth also called the Pharisees "sons of the Serpent"
So who was Satan's wife?

I believe you get the point by now.

Jesus being the Son of God only applies to earthy connotation.
As we see from the his birth, Jesus was conceived by God (the Holyspirit) producing himself on earth through a human vessel Mary.

Luke 1:34-35
And Mary said to the angel, “How will this be, since I am a virgin?”

And the angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy—the Son of God.

This is what it means that Jesus is the Son of God.

We know according to Jesus' teachings that there is nothing like husband or wife in heaven so God having a literal son in heaven would contradict that.

MaxInDHouse:
If you have a house full of tenants but they're spoiling things in your house what do you think is the best thing to do before eviction?

Well God gave them His rules on how to live and keep His house in other (Commandments) but because the Commandments seems difficult for them to grasp so He sent His son who lives with Him in His own abode to come and live with this tenants at least for them to learn how the Landlord wants people to take good care of His house, He (God) now told His son to warn them that whoever refuse to trust (beleive) in the counseling given by His son will later be evicted! John 3:16

I don't see anything difficult in this simple illustration though i was a Muslim but this is what makes the best sense to me and the reason why i quit Islam to become one of true Christians (Jehovah's Witnesses)

By your explanation Jesus is the literal son of God., Meaning that God just like a human being must have a wife in heaven. They had sex and gave birth to Jesus. Right?

If Jesus is the literal son of God then who is God's wife in heaven?

MaxInDHouse:
Focus is who receives worship between Jesus and God? Is there a difference between these two or they're the same person?

It will continue to escalate into fruitless arguments just as the churches have been doing for the past two thousand years!

So to avoid all that unnecessary waste of time why not go straight and ask which God is working out what is profitable in the midst of his worshipers?
Can we assess the true God through what is happening in the midst of his worshipers?

I think Jesus emphasized on this when he said "by their FRUITS (what is happening in their midst) everyone will recognize those having the true God with them" Matthew 7:16-18

That's what i'm saying!

By your own understanding, what does it mean when the bible says Jesus is the Son of God?
Can you explain what that means?

MaxInDHouse:
Satan immediately went into action after Jesus' departure and Jesus told us what will be the result of this evil genius move! Matthew 13:24-25

So instead of contemplating on the verses that wasn't written in English, why not be on the lookout for where it is working out as expected? If it's not yielding positive results then you should know that that's not what God inspired the writer to pen down. It has been adulterated. Haba you are educated nah, don't you know what will happen when a medicine has been adulterated? Do you think it will work as expected?
And when you finally see where it's working out fine is that the time to start arguing over it's ingredients? Matthew 7:16-18 compare to James 2:18-26



@ Isaiah 9:6 Mighty God means Jesus will serve as a God in the land of Israel just as Moses did in Egypt! Exodus 7:1
Moses foretold that God will raise a prophet like himself in the midst of Israelites and it happened exactly so because Jesus served as both God and Prophet! Deuteronomy 18:15-18 compare to Act 3:22

Everlasting Father means Jesus is the perfect replacement of Adam our father who is no more! 1Corinthians 15:45

The rest of the quotations has been tampered with by Interpreters that why it's not working out anything benefitial in the midst of those adhering to it!

For the word of God is alive and exerts power and is sharper than any two-edged sword and pierces even to the dividing of soul and spirit, and of joints from the marrow, and is able to discern thoughts and intentions of the heart. Hebrews 4:12

If it's the accurate Interpretation of God's word that everyone is reading surely it will yield positivity just as people are seeing it globally in the gathering of Jehovah's Witnesses! James 2:18-26 compare to Matthew 7:16-18

If you say the old versions of the bible I quoted were adulterated does that not make your own newer JW version even more adulterated?

Any way, my intention was not for you to agree but simply to point you to why not everyone shares the same interpretation of the bible which you have simply confirmed.

MaxInDHouse:
You're very funny you know!

Just imagine science students from Nigeria arguing profusely and challenging science students from China and someone comes up to say "There is lots of contradictions in the subject matter"
Even a fool knows that there's no need counting on their fruitless arguments because the Nigerian will speak grammar and terms to continue arguing but ask them to come and perform that's when the grammarian will hide his face in shame as the Chinese keeps producing all the things expected of a true scientist! Matthew 7:16-18

So continue deceiving yourself!

What you call deception is scriptural verses.

On that premise, do share your honest explanation of the verses below, emphasis on the bolded;

1. Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

2. John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

3.1 John 5:7 (I believe this was omitted from JW bible)
For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, kthe Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

4. 1 Timothy 3:16
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”

Authority1o1:
Okay...

As you know, I rarely quote.

But salvation is the new life that comes with the acceptance of Jesus Christ as your Savior and Lord, and the joy that follows thereof.

Wait, shouldn't a more pressing question be why most atheists and agnostics are found in the Religion section?
Are they just unsure of their stand, or are they dissatisfied? Or maybe, they are on a conversion spree.

If I were one, I wouldn't mind much trying to talk sense into those who worship a god they can't see. After all, when they die, it will all be clear to them. But why such exertion of energy two-four-seven?

An answer please.



1. Time is against me now. If I had enough to spare, I would have run through your posts for this week. I may be lucky to find a thousand and one persons who had given you the same answer I would have given now. So why do you think mine will be different? If you don't think you have the need to be saved, so be it brother.

2. I almost always curse myself each time I remember I haven't devoted much time in reaching out to people and carrying out the Great Commission. It is my duty,my call as a Christian to do so.

But whose calling is it to meander from thread to thread in a bid to convert people who are blind to reality? Let them die,and see what useful time they have wasted in serving an illusion called God. Infact,I would be occasionally dragging from a wrap of marijuana and puffing on their cyber accounts.

Atheists still go about in search of what they still don't understand. They are not satisfied. They are eternally unsure.

Hold me by my word. I never mentioned unbelievers.

You're more confused than the atheists you're attacking.

You opened a thread to attack other believers when you yourself in this single post just epitomized 1, 2 and 5 of what you claimed Pentecostals Christians who you termed "church-goers" are guilty of.

I would ask you some salient scriptural questions but you can't even hold your own conversation and thread.
Before you judge others, before you remove the speck in the eyes of others, be sure you've removed the log in yours.

jesusjnr2020:
Regardless of whether the room was cursed or not, the truth is that if you're spiritually secure, they wouldn't be able to toy with you in dreams the way they're doing. Even if they tried, they'd fail as you'd be able to overpower them.

So even if you change rooms, as long as that thing in you that gives them that license to do as they pleased was still there, you'd still be vulnerable, because you're not free.

Quit the double life, and completely yield yourself to God so that you'd be secured.

Sin gives the devil access to our lives and the license to do damage.

So if you want a lasting solution not just a temporary one to your problem, you have to stop doing things that make you vulnerable to the devices of the devil.

God bless.

Jesus, I mean the real one in the bible, did not ask people to repent or become holy before healing them or casting out demons.

But then again, your own Jesus is the junior one so I understand you don't have any power, just advice.

It is well.
Then again, a man can receive nothing unless it is given to him from heaven. John 3:27

HRSweetness:
Awww, so sweet to see couple banter like this.

How come there's no love emoji amongst Nairaland's emoji collections?

Cos Seun and his mods are loveless.

RichBoy247:
This guy should be arrested, prosecuted and jailed forever.

Before being jailed, he should be treated for psychiatric disorders, mental imbalance and hallucinations.

I am a Muslim, but I have an "A" in WAEC Christian Religious Study, where in the Bible did you psychiatric Church goer see that Autistic Humans are being punished by God or are you chronic sinner talking about god of Thunder that will strike you soon?

This guy is the type of mentally unstable Church goers that give Christianity a bad name. This guy is not different from the so called Islamic idiots that kill for their "god". if left with a autistic human, the guy will kill him/her saying the autistic killed in his past life.

And you should be banned from Social Media. Cry baby.

Any intelligent reader knows I was simply answering the question another poster asked albeit explaining both the perspective of the bible and also the more neutral de-religionised perspective.
I didn't even share my own stand on the issue.

Though for this to trigger you this much says a lot about you. Let me not even begin to psycho-analyse you.

hupernikao:
@Janosky
@MaxInDHouse

Its obvious you didn't get the key element of what livingchrist stated in his topic. This has made you go into wrong conclusion.

His Topic
Is JESUS the same Person as the FATHER

he isn't questioning this
Is JESUS The same person as GOD

That little details is where you have been missing the point of the concept.

I have told you severally, that the moment one say Jesus, you are refering to a man born of a woman. This is God in the flesh, now exist as man.

This was clear in his writeup.

I guess the new age concept of explaining trinity flying all around has affected your own knowledge and patience of studying the concept. I have done a proper context of the concept for you earlier. Go reread.

Long time no see/hear.
I think on this issue neither party is wrong.
Which brings us back to the issue of biblical contradictions yet again.

-The Trinitarian is not wrong as some bible verses confirm this. John 5:7 and 1 Timothy 3:16, Isaiah 9:6

-Also the one who separates God the Father from Jesus Chist is neither wrong. As supporting verses abound even more in the bible.

Kondomatic:
Both Tonto and the school are mad.

Ops caption is misleading.
No where did Tonto say she received it from the school. Most likely a gift her son made for her at the school's Father's day celebration.

blueAgent:
And that same Bible shows us that to love God is to keep his commandments (10commandments)



1 John 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

1 John 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.


Jesus did not give a new commandments, rather his saying the commandments he is referring to has been there since the beginning and has been known by his audience.

2 John 1:5 And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that we love one another.

2 John 1:6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in .

I wish to know your interpretation of this verse.

John 13:34-35
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”

OnionBandit:
C'mn..No be everybody dey naija na...I know you to be more reasonable than this

Jack is now the most patriotic Nigerian alive...but despite all these patriotism, the government isn't even looking his direction.

When I say our government gat ballz, I know waraimean.

Aswearugad, Nigeria is a country with ballz

God bless the Federal Republic of Nigeria

I used to be pro 1 Nigeria until I understood the mindset of the average Northerner.

dotclean:
Adeyinka Alaseyori, a new gospel singer who came into limelight few years ago was berated by Tope Alabi for referring to God as a staunch supporter/pillar in her song. Tope Alabi said this during a programme where she was invited to minister, she emphasized that song ministers should seek guidance from the Holy Spirit before releasing their songs always; she claimed it was foolish for someone to refer to God as a guarantor.

This has generated a lot of arguments among fans of the duo and some tagged Tope Alabi as being jealous of the young gospel artist who is making wave. See the video below where Tope Alabi made the unwelcoming statement.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvhrRtf5Yyc&t=241s

It is rather ignorant to say God cannot be referred to as Guarantor.

Although to be more scripturally balanced,it is Christ who is our Guarantor before God.

The idea of Christianity stands on Jesus Christ standing as Guarantor to every believer.
Having placed your faith in Christ, God no longer sees our flaws and sins but sees Christ in every believer. 2 Cor 5:21
God no longer sees the sinner but sees the Christ he has placed his faith in.

So every time a believer sins or errs God remembers the Suffering and Death of Christ on the Cross. And by that instead of judgement, his mercy is extended to the believer.

Christ also through the Holy Spirit helping the sinner by strengthening them not to continue to fall for the same sins.

falseprophet:
Is a newborn baby a human being or an alien?

I like that answer.
Meaning he's a Christian already whether or not he is able to be as perfect as Jesus was.

So there you already have your answer.
It is difficult to determine who is a Christian or not especially in this age of false teachers.

Because you could find a false teacher/prophet who has the gifts of the Spirit but lacking the Character (fruit) of the Spirit.

You could find a growing Christian who still yet lacks the fruit of the Spirit but growing.

You could also find those who are called Tares and were intentionally planted by the devil to make others fall in the church.

sonmvayina:
The purpose of the sabath is to reat from any work. It was the basis of the covenant God had with Jacob. So to violate it is a sin

So who gave him the authority to define what a mother is? ..your mother ask to see you, go and see her and find out why she wants to...not saying rubbish...

Does that mean that a Pastor should not preach on Sabath or a Prophet should not prophesy on Sabath?
Like I said they only sought to accuse him,which was why they accused him of working when all he did was heal the sick.

As a Preacher, should he have left his preaching to attend to his mother and siblings or should he complete his preaching first and go and attend to his mother and siblings?

sonmvayina:
He did not keep the Sabath.

When his mother and siblings sort to see him, did he honor her by accepting the summon?

-How did he not keep the Sabath pls explain.

-The bible never mentioned that he did not see his mother and siblings.
The bible simply says he corrected those who summoned him that it is those who hear his teachings and practise them that are his mother and brothers. Luke 8:21

falseprophet:
I am not a christian, never claimed to be one because I do certain things Jesus never did! But I respect christians and avoid those bringing shame to what Christ represents

If I may ask, a new convert to Christianity who has repented and accepted Jesus Christ as his saviour, is he a Christian or not?

sonmvayina:
1. Remember the Sabath day to keep it holy.

2. Honor your father and your mother....so that your days may be long...( little wonder his days was cut short..)

1. He did keep the Sabath holy. The pharisees only sought to claim he worked on the sabath because he healed the sick on a Sabath.

2. Where, when and how did he dishonor his father or mother?

sonmvayina:
Really should I list two for you that he broke?

Do share.

sonmvayina:
Which of Gods commandments did Jesus not break?

You claim to be like Christ.
The bible says Jesus did not commit any sin.
1 Peter 2: 21-22
So I'm asking you can you say the same about your self?
Otherwise according to your own opinion, you're not a Christian.

falseprophet:
No need to twist facts, if you can't be like Christ then don't call yourself a Christian! No be by force to be like Christ

I'm letting you know your idea of Christianity is unrealistic.

Are you yourself like Christ?
Are you living without any sin? (Since Christ did not commit any sin) 1 Peter 2:21-22
Have you blessed your enemies lately?
Did the clouds open on the day of your baptism?
Have you healed anyone?
Have you performed miracles?
Have you fasted for 40 days and 40 nights in the wilderness?
Have you abandoned your family to pursue ministry?
Have you multiplied any food to feed your followers?
Do you manifest all the fruit of the spirit?

The list goes on because it easy to point fingers at others when the gospel was meant to change you first.

falseprophet:
Very few christians in Nigeria actually know what being christian means, there's no such thing as a true believer or an unserious christian, its either you are for Christ or against Him.

Christianity literally means living like Christ, now these are things He didnt do while He walked this earth:

1. Murder
2. Immorality
3. Engage in politics
4. Pick up arms
5. Collect tithe
6. Acquire material things (private jets, real estates etc)
7. Open churches and called Himself G.O
8. Hate non-believers
and many more fine attributes of this righteous Son of Man!

Now if you do any of the above stop calling yourself a christian because you are nothing like Christ!

You have rightly listed the things Christ did not engage in while on earth.
But did he actually mention that his followers should not do any of the things you mentioned above?

While I agree with some, I'll list my disagreements.

Murder;
Take for example the Christians in the North being attacked by Boko Haram. Are they not allowed to defend themselves by picking up arms?
Or if Nigeria were to be a Christian nation. Is it not allowed to have an army that defends it?
While a Christian should not murder, there are exceptional cases. Which was why eventhough God's commandment says You shall not Kill. He himself often sent Israel to kill enemy nations.

Engage in Politics;
Jesus truly did not engage in politics.
Does that mean Christians are not meant to rule? A Christian born into a royal family is not allowed to be a king? Should Christians not become Governors? Or even Presidents?
What does it mean that Christians will inherit the earth (Matt 5:5) and Judge the world in righteousness? (1 Cor 6:2)

Pick up Arms;
While Christ did stop Peter and his disciples from picking up arms to defend him, I believe it was because in that situation their fight would have been against God's will.
Jesus Christ already knew it was his purpose to be arrested, beaten and crucified. In fact he was expectant of that hour.
So his disciples would have only ended up being themselves killed for resisting his arrest.
Who then would propagate the gospel?

Acquire Material Things;
Is everything on earth not material things?
Your phone is a material thing, why did you acquire it?
Your cloths are material things, why do you have more than one?
Your degrees are material things, why did you go to school?
The caution here is simply to have self- control and not be obsessed with material things. Knowing how to give these things generously if there's a need to.

Opening Churches and calling themselves GOs;
The early churches also did the same. Read Revelations 2-3 and you will know that there are 7 churches that were addressed. Each one having her own Angel (Messenger/Apostle).
There of course is a need for these leaders not to get carried away and lose their humility, not be given to vain titles, and not exalt themselves as gods of men.

Conclusively, it is not entirely accurate to ask Christians to simply model their lives after Jesus Christ alone.
Cos his purpose was different from ours.
He was a Nazarene (like Samson). His purpose was to die so that we may have eternal life.
We don't expect all Christians to experience the opening of the heavens at their baptism.
We don't expect all Christians to have the fullness of the Holyspirit in them manifesting all the divine powers and fruit.

This is why we have the Acts of Apostles as well to learn from the disciples. We saw their weaknesses and growth.
Also the reason for the Holyspirit which Christ prayed that God should give every one who believes in Him.
Why? Because there were so many things he could not share because without the Holyspirit they could not be truly understood. (John 16:12-14)