₦airaland Forum

Moneywomen17:
don’t fall for the fake news about Benin empire. Places like Otun ekiti were strictly under oyo. It’s very hard to control the ondo and ekiti people cuz even if u defeat them years later they will fight u again. If Benin conquered those places. The question is during the kriji war that was fought why were the place which Benin claimed they rule e.g ekiti that was not even a kingdom but several kingdom. Why was ekiti parapo along ijesha fighting independently against the Ibadan forces.

benin empire declined much earlier Ibadan was the new kid on the block. Benin itself was tributary to Ibadan.

gregyboy:
I had meant an ondo lady in uniben she told me her name and it was yoruba name , so i was like you're yoruba nice, and she was like she aint originally yoruba that they were originally from benin who thier benin ancestor had migrated to ondo by the orders of the oba of benin, to oversee trade in akure state



Some of this people returned to benin after the benin penuitive expendition by the British oba eweka 11 who called for the returned of the Benin chiefs and thier families over the different vassal state to return home so they can help him build the remains of the war......
Some came back and some remained


So if you hear them speaking a distinct yoruba called lucumi or whatever you call it, you shouldn't mistake it with something else
Before you go around embrassing yourself again

yes they had a distinct Yoruba dialect which was the lingua franca. This is what I want us to agree upon.

gregyboy:
Nigga you're a Yoruba bigot

You're youre not here to defend yoruba put pride on lies.....

I pity the others who will take you serious if you could open your mouth and say benin never influenced yorubas then your case is sorry....

the Benin that influenced eastern Yoruba were Yoruba speaking Benin not the edo.

Igbosmoker:
oga shut up

was Benin speaking edo to them in ekiti,akure and other parts of the empire? Yoruba was the palace language which reflects in their town names like ughoton and agenebode, both are Yoruba names.

Igbosmoker:
so Yoruba language magically vanished from our mouth? Lmao

edo was spoken in the suburbs and people from the suburbs overwhelmed the palace recently.

Igbosmoker:
From ondo to Lagos, then ekiti to even osun and ibadan you'll see some Benin presence.

So of your king's even have ada vbe eben a staffs meant to show allegiance to Benin kingdom.

The only thing Yoruba have is population and because Benin people were kind not to enforce their language to the territories they conquered.

Hence ondo and Lagos would have been speaking Benin

benin empire was speaking Yoruba as lingua franca.

Igbosmoker:
I stopped reading when I saw this.

God punish who ever wrote that, no Benin comes from ile ife.

every human being came from Ile Ife!.

RedboneSmith:
I do not know where you read this, but the people of Ugbodu and by extension the Olukwumi, do not claim Benin origin. They came from parts of Eastern Yorubaland that were under Benin hegemony. In their oral traditions Owo and Akure are specifically mentioned.

wikipedia says they came to ugbodu from akure,owo via Benin. They came from the Benin empire, my mistake but that does not change the fact that Yoruba was Benin lingua franca in the past. The palace language was Yoruba.

Gambari is Yoruba for Hausa not Fulani. The Gambaris are from Balogun Gambari family.

mfm04622:
What makes him Yoruba?
What makes him Hausa and not Fulani?

he is Yoruba because if you ask him, that's what he will tell you. He is yoruba of Hausa not Fulani descent.

mfm04622:
I don't know how he came about the surname. However, know that even though not as pronounced as Fulani, Hausas have been living in Ilorin since it was established. However, he is Fulani since he belongs to the ruling family of Ilorin Emirate

the emir is a Yoruba man of Hausa not Fulani descent.

mfm04622:
He is Fulani, not Yoruba! The name Gambari should have told you that

the name Gambari shows he is Hausa descent.

The first land was the first Ife.

TAO11:
That is if we assume that they have the word "oba" in their language.

They don't have the word "oba" in their language.

The word they have is similar in appearance but totally different in meaning.

Their own word in that phrase is "n'oba".

It means "that which shines".

It comes from the Edo root word "Bà" which signifies: "Red"/"Shine" --- just as it is seen in the Yoruba word "Oka Bà" ---> "Red Sorghum".

The tone for this "Bà" (i.e. do) in "Red" is clearly different from the tone for the "Ba" (i.e. re) in "King".

While they have the one for red in their language, they don't have the one for "King" in their language.

The one for "King" is loaned from Yoruba into their language. They don't have it originally. What they have originality is the one for "red" (which Yoruba language too has originally).

So when they say: "Omo N'Oba N'Edo", they mean: "The child who shines for Edo" (their language)

But when they address any of their kings as "Oba", they are borrowing a word from a foreign language (Yoruba language) which means "King".

I hope I was able to do some clarification.

i am assuming the phrase is Yoruba not edo.

Moneywomen17:
oh boy u have already start lying again oba means king in Yoruba and according to u it means shining in edo. It doesn’t mean king in Benin and there is nothing even called oba in Benin according to u and ur brethren. It’s omo noba nedo. Ole when to run � and claim something different when he realize that all evidence point to Yoruba having the world oba. Chai TA011 come and see ur boys

omonobanedo in Yoruba means the child is king in edo.

WoruSulyman:
@lawani
@PabloAfricanus

I was searching for historical facts and stumbled upon this interesting thread.

Firstly, I am amazed how black men are clawing at each other's throat with history which we have no way of verifying and at best, we all have biased and distorted knowledge of. To be clear, everybody telling you history; the Yorubas, Fulanis, Hausas, Igbos or even british will only tell you with them at the heroic centre of history, so which ever history you know is as wrong as it is right. Also other races are constantly degrading the black man and some try to deny it's liberty, it is sad we will do worse to ourselves in the name of history, one that divide us, and pride that is yet to raise the black race to the equal of all other race.

I am Ilorin in every sense of it and I have a modest understanding of it's history. I will like to clear some little misgivings I have seen on this thread.

1. Ilorin was founded by neither Afonja nor Alimi, it was a man Ojo isekuse who was the first settler in Ilorin. Ojo was a yoruba man. Ilorin was a meeting point for hunters, Ojo and his family were the sole settlers.

2. Ojo left after a scandal. The Asaju's settled, they are yorubas and settled around the Ilorin sharpening stone, their family house is still there. At this point neither Afonja nor Alimi resides in Ilorin.

3. Then the Sholagberus, they are said to be Fulanis. Then numerous small individual settlers came from both the north and the south. There was no town, just individual settlers, so no king. Though, each settlers congregated by tribe and they had individual leaders. It was said there was serikin gambari then for the hausa settlers. Note; no Afonja, no Alimi.

4. Alimi went to Oyo from Gwandu preaching Islam before backtracking to Ilorin because of political turmoil in the old Oyo empire. It was said that was the first time Afonja heard about the cleric.

5. Afonja had a falling out with the then Alafin because of a war he was sent to fight that he considered a suicide mission. By Oyo tradition, when you go to war it is either you win or you die in battle, if not, you will be compelled to commit suicide back home. Afonja refused and went to hide in Ilorin.

6. Alimi later got to Ilorin too. The Alaafin was furious and sent a punitive expedition to Ilorin for Afonja. Afonja knew he wasn't going to win against Oyo and he consulted Alimi for spiritual and military help.
Note: at this point Afonja had the most military power in the town but there was no king, no leader still individual settlements.

7. Alimi wrote to Gwandu for military support for Jihad, he was obliged. Then came the Jama'a to the area now called Ilorin, it wasn't still a town at that point, Oyo lost because the Oyo army wasn't expecting to meet the Jama'as calvary. The problem wasn't solved get.

8. Alaafin became much angry and sent message to Oyo's vassal states to send military men to finish the Afonja rebels/the Jama'a. The forces in Ilorin could not withstand the might of Oyo, so Alimi again wrote to Gwandu. Gwandu refused citing ongoing Jihad in the north.

9. Alimi informed Afonja that no reinforcement is coming, but they could adopt a strategy called a pre-emptive attack, this meant that before Oyo could organize it's army, Ilorin which is not too far from the old Oyo empire marched on old Oyo empire before they were prepared for war.

10. Old Oyo fell and was burnt to the ground. Former smaller tributary villages of Oyo close to Ilorin were scared of attack from Ilorin and brought gifts. There was vacuum in the leadership of Ilorin which by the fall of Oyo become a baby town. Alimi was far older than Afonja (his real name was Salihu and was given the alias Sheu Alim roughly meaning "knowledgeable elderly one) and by virtue that the superior military power in the town (the jama'as) were loyal to him, he was the defacto leader but never named an Oba or an Emir, he never lived in any palace.

11. He sent for his family from Gwandu, he had four(4) sons and a daughter. After his demise, there was leadership tussle between Afonja, Alimi's sons and the Ilorin mallams(Alimi met some mallams in Ilorin and they accepted him as their leader because of his superior Islamic knowledge). The mallams was laying claim to an Islamic caliphate that won't be hereditary but knowledge based, Afonja because the whole rebellion was about him and there wasn't a king to that point, while the sons wanted to continue where their father stopped.

12. The sons had superior military might, so they killed everybody that opposed their rule including Afonja. They started Ilorin Emirate and AbdulSalam became the 1st Emir of Ilorin and was succeeded by Shitta, the emirship has been shared by these twos descendants ever since.

13. On balogun Biala of Ajikobi, he became powerful during the reign of Oba Moma. He maneuvered the other baloguns against Moma and used the Emir's immediate junior brother in a rebellion against him, the Emir was killed and Sulayman was installed. Sulayman was naturally fearful of the powerful balogun(similar to bashorun gaa) and hence was loyal till the British invasion in 1897.

14. Lastly, Ilorin lost the jalumi war but was never at the threat of annihilation by Ibadan. In fact, Ilorin successfully annexed much of the smaller towns of yoruba land as tributary states, including some Ibolo, igbomina and Ekiti towns, even Jebba and Shao were being administered by Ilorin princes until very recently. Ibadan was the Yoruba town that blocked the path of Ilorin expansion southwards.

History is a curious thing, where we have been can explain to us a lot about where we are and it can guide us on where we are going. But history is delicate and should be approached with caution as sometimes when we get to the root of history, we may discover we are not even who we think we are.
Also, everybody moved from somewhere and dominated other tribes at a point. The history of the world is that of migration and no man germinated like a seed where they now call home. Ilorin is what it is, it is not hausa nor fulani nor yoruba, it is more than a tribe, irrespective of language, rulers or it's culture, an homogeneous society has emerged from it's heterogeneous make up and it is better to learn to live with that.
Ilorin is Ilorin.

And I expect more pan-Africa discussions among us not ethnocentrism that was planted by our colonists to always keep us apart.

thanks for your interesting contribution!

davidnazee:
Then why is Sijuade addressed as Oba Sijuade or Ogunwusi addressed as Oba Ogunwusi? they should have been addressed as Ooni Sijuade or Ooni Ogunwusi and not Oba..

oba sijuade was the ooni of ife that is how it is. The oba of ife is the ooni. I hope you understand.

davidnazee:
They are Obas (rulers) no doubt but were not using the word Oba as a title.. only the Benin kings were called Oba as a title.. The yorubas trying to equate themselves with the Powerful kings of Benin adopted the Oba title..

they are not obas but they have oja oba and otunba? They have their orikis but oba is the only word for king. Only Lagos is doing what you are accusing everyone of. All Yoruba obas are addressed with their orikis or styles

davidnazee:
That is what I'm saying..
He was called Alafin Sango and not Oba Sango..
you guys should just admit.. the styling of Oba as a title was adopted from Benin.. The word Oba may be as old as your language just likewise as in Edo.. but as a title it is new to you.

we don't have another word for king except oba but different obas have different styles but they are all oba.

davidnazee:
none were using it before the 20th century.. before the 20th century, Oba Sijuade will be called Ooni Sijuade and not Oba Sijuade so also Oba Adeyemi would have been called Alaafin Adeyemi and not Oba.. none was using the Oba title along with their names till around the begining of the 20th century.
That style was copied from Benin..

yet Alaafin Sango was nicknamed obakoso in the 15th century?

The Yoruba produce it, the igbo worship it, the Hausa consume it.

Moneywomen17:
shut up and stop lying oba is yoruba word. The title otunba a very prominent title in all yoruba land means king right hand man. So tell me how yoruba copy Benin when it’s clear as day it’s the other way around. Every market in Yoruba land there is oja oba. Even the Europeans wrote about it. The truth is Benin adopted the word when oranmiyab from came to rule ur people. Cuz the word oba has no meaning regarding leadership in Benin language while it does in Yoruba.

thanks for this insight.

The Phoenicians are the ancestors of Arabs. They referred to Europe as I Europa meaning westerners. When Arabs became Muslims and Europe prospered without accepting Islam, the name Europa came to mean those who prospered without submitting to Allah. The Songhai were Muslims and they corrupted Europa to Yoruba giving the name to the oyo empire because oyo prospered without submitting to Allah. The name is proto Arabic being originally of Phoenician origin.

gregyboy:
Lol, go sleep you need am......


When you wakeoup leave this thread as soon as possible your kind are not found here

I don't know to use my phone to post links but I mentioned ugbodu in delta state in my write up. Do some digging yourself, it is not rocket science. I

gregyboy:
Oya post your source

I am posting offhand from research I have done much earlier. You don't need more than common sense to understand. Maybe you think edo was Benin lingua franca lol.

gregyboy:
Na true


By the 19c benin colonize the entire yoruba bation even ibadan untill the British invaded benin......

Due to our population our language couldn't spread over those areas but our kingship did

An example is the owa of ijesha in osun state who dresses like the benin enogi

Owa in benin means house
Ibokun=welcome


Oba gha to kpere

your language was the vernacular spoken in the Benin countryside. The Benin palace was a city on its own and they spoke Yoruba. The British sacked the Benin city not empire, the empire had declined much earlier.

TAO11:
I'm from all parts of Yoruba as my parents have parents, and their parents also with parents, and so on adinfinitum all iver Yorubaland.

Is their anyway an answer to that question will help you explain why ordinary Ibadan attacked, raided, and decimated your Benin Kingdom??

ibadan is not ordinary, they were the successor of oyo and they made it seem as if they were under the Alaafin in those days in the 19th century.

gregyboy:
Were is your proof, how did ibadan influence benin


You talk is cheap



I. Would stop replying if you keep talking like a kg1 student who just repeat word after his teacher



When everyone talk here the cite an article to backup your claim, but you my friend you keep cite the foolish brain of your ancestors

by the mid 19th century Benin had declined they were not receiving tribute from anywhere again. Ibadan was the new kid on the block and they extracted tribute from Benin, Akure, Ijesa, ilorin and etc.

samuk:
That will be nice but what would you do about the fact that most of your people and obas have to look towards the Sokoto caliphate for their spiritual guidance rather than Ife and the Ooni.

You may get political freedom from Nigeria but will still be under the religious and spiritual leadership of the Fulani Sultan of Sokoto.

All Yoruba muslims are still under the supremacy of the Sultan of Sokoto. He is the one that has to sight the moon before you guys begin the Muslim festivals.

if Yoruba Muslims are under the sultan of sokoto what about edo Muslims?

gregyboy:
Lol..... I aceept go and sleep


You think we binis will buy into the yoruba myth
Or did you forget the itsekiri didnt just call us ubinu for nothing,
If not for the British bini will be overlording you all


Confused different foolish tribe hiding on the canopy of a non existed man for political reasons




Moneywomen17 come here come prove the existence of oduduwas and stop misinterpreting urself

when the British arrived in the 19th century, Benin and everyone else were tributary to Ibadan before the civil war.

gregyboy:
You know history is full of myth



Oya. Bring a video showing. Benin speaking yoruba

even correspondence between Benin and Britain was in Yoruba.

The Benin empire was a Yoruba empire thorough and thorough. The Yoruba language was used as lingua franca during the days of the empire before it declined in the 18th century. The people of ugbodu in delta state migrated from the Benin empire according to their history and they still speak a Yoruba dialect today. Benin empire was a sister state to Ijesa, Ijebu and etc, they spoke the same language. The Benin palace was a sprawling complex home to over 50 thousand people and all those people spoke Yoruba as mother tongue. It was in the 19th century that edo people from the suburbs overwhelmed the palace. Nowadays some edo revisionist try so hard to rewrite the history as an edo empire but this is far from the truth.