AreaFada2: Only a raving bastard without any respect for his mother can contemplate calling anyone any bastard.
wrong but only a bastard will continuously express hatred for a people he constantly claims to descend from Nobody ever asked you to claim part Yoruba, you did that thinking it would aide your anti Yoruba arguments on this forum. So the question remains did you lie or are you a bastard??
daddytime: It is supposed to refer to every black born and raised away from Africa, and could be used to describe even a Nigerian who lives outside the shores of Africa.
However, over time, it has seemed to be restricted to just the African Americans for whatever reason.
I remember how we used to refer to anyone who had traveled abroad and came back on a visit back home as "Akatarian".
Back then when I had decided to make a run for it too out of Nigeria, I and some of my mates would look at ourselves, marvel at, and refer to ourselves as " soon to be Akatarians'" even though our destination was Europe. Lol
I think its the other way round.
That is..first used to refer to African Americans before its application to any African who has been away for so long and lost the culture. Because that was also the motif to naming the African Americans so in the first place I say this because Afro Brazilians have always been called Aguda and referring to them as Akátá is would be wrong
AreaFada2: The way someone who would call himself omoluabi uses the word bastard effortlessly says more about. That not what people brag to be that matters but by their fruits, you shall know them. Good luck to you.
read your own comment very carefully, multiple times if you need to until it actually sinks in
We know your tactics. You choose are you a bastard or just a lying hater?
You forget these are people who can stop their oral traditions and create a new age tale to fit an agenda against the Yoruba Why can't they reconfigure their language to do same
Soon new Bini Blogs will have "Ayé" as God on their basic Bini language vocabulary lists
AreaFada2: Ah! If my relative was deposed for having a different political position to Awo, then not surprising that Yoruba that claim being accommodators can be very intolerant towards even the highest of Yoruba stock.
Your talk of bastard is the regular intolerance FKK, Fayoshe and Yinka Odumakin/Afenifere endure in Yorubaland daily.
It's all political brainwash by the Yoruba political god of the hour. It was Awo, now Tinubu.
That just rubbishes the touted tolerance you guys brag about. The only tolerance is of Fulani impunity.
Bastard to me is he who cannot tolerate their people for having a different political stand but would lie and kowtow to his killers hoping to be rewarded with Aso Rock. To walk upon the corpses of his people to Aso Rock.
Lol coon. We are talking about your inherent hatred and constant attack on anything Yoruba on this forum, what is again expressed in this post. and you are talking about Awolowo and Tinubu Again if you are part Yoruba as you claim then you are acting as a bastard and need to seek forgiveness from your ancestors. So you choose I'm not discussing Nigerian politics here
AreaFada2: . I have no hatred for any human being. But some of our Yoruba people baffle me with their ignorance despite many degrees. I have seen Yoruba people with PhD in diaspora lump Benin with Igbo people.
To begin with, you yourself do not have more stake in Yoruba story more than me. I dare say you probably don't have a Yoruba pedigree as high as mine. Another guy argued it with me days days ago. I wanted to show him proof. I have not heard from him. He disappeared when he realised I was serious.
Same old talk. If you claim to have Yoruba ancestry then I put it to you that you are acting like a bastard And need to seek forgiveness from your Yoruba ancestors
AreaFada2: But in Nigeria nobody originated anything except Yoruba. As much as I like our Yoruba people to excel and create many things, not everything should be hurriedly and condescendingly claimed.
Other tribes were not looking at Yoruba ayanyan all these millenniums doing nothing.
I trust to see one Nupe or Gbagyi person claiming Yoruba rush here huffing and puffing like puff adder soon.
gregyboy
The hatred you have for Yoruba will not make your brain function properly
Yoruba don't claim what does not belong to us. That we claim many things only mean we created many things If you don't like it you can run far away to a place Yoruba culture and influence won't reach you
Dedetwo: Ndigbo are not loudmouthed as your forbearers and will never give silly narratives of Igbo people different from what is\are obtained on the ground. Till today, Igala has no inches of Igbo land or any Igbo land is incorporated under Emirates as Igala land does. Even the stools of rulership in Igala land have been Islamized because it was identity mark of Caliphate which conquered all places and placed them under the Emirates. The Caliphate never had a foot hold in places where they did battle with Akagbe and collective Igbo warriors in Idoma and Igala lands. There was no Oba of Benin who wanted to entangle with Agbor talk less large collective of Igbo warriors beyond Agbor. When Yari.ba peeps were driven out of Oyo Ile, the traces of the wounds littered all the over the places including Oshogbo and Ogbomosho. Offa still remains a total and unconditional testament to the doctrine of Sokoto Caliphate. No such sign was even remotely registered in the smallest village in the northern most outskirts of Igbo land.
you folks are so empty and lacking in historical records of your own that you must also refer to Yoruba historical events. See all the Yoruba history you think you know, if only you knew your history like this
It must suck to not have historical records of your own
Obalatule: You are off-point, Binis where an offshoot of early Igbo ancestors, Building an empire later-on has nothing to do with it...... Through out all their conquering and wars they never looked east towards the Igbos,but they were always traversing yerobaland with impunity..have you asked yourself why?
Benin were constantly conquering igbo lands, lands that they never lost once conquered unlike the more constantly rebelling lands to the west.
Today you have Ika and several other original igbo speaking people who had been under the Bini for so long they spit if you call them igbo
Only reason Bini did not encroach further east was the Niger river. Which served as a natural defence for more eastward igbos, if the historiography of Onitcha [Azikwe 1930] is to be taken seriously then we can agree that after Onitcha people fled from their previous location because of Bini, Bini found it unresourceful to invest in an invading naval force to recapture them
Obalatule: Binis where actually an offshoot of an ancient Igbo group which also included the"Isu" group of Igbos and the ARO,...The ISU and idu(Bini) and Aro along with two other relatives which included the igala ancestors, that's why Igbos,Bini and igala use the word "isee" to seal prayers signifying the original five branches.
Bini are a branch of the Igbo race. They left Nri under the leadership of Igodo to found Igodomigodo due to nso - ani. Hence Bini language and culture is similar to Igbo.
The Bini Igue Festival is borrowed from Nri Iguaro festival.
The Bini 4 days of the week - Eken, Afon, Orien, Nkwon were borrowed from Nri.
The Bini succession by primogeniture is an adaptation of the Okpalabisi Igbo system that grants total rights of succession to the first son.
The customary Bini breaking of Kolanut is also derived from Nri. 'Onye wetere oji wetere ndu'.
The New Yam festival is a carry over from Nri. It is still celebrated with pomp and pageantry in Benin.
The Ogiso dynasty of Igodo migodo is Igbo. Ogie - so means leader who must be followed.
Till date Nri Priests are important in the coronation functions of the Obas of Benin.
The word OKORO which is the finest specimen of the male species amongst Igbos, also means Prince in Bini.
Most people don't know that even Bini counting is very similar to Igbo counting.
Do you know that the Bini still use the Igbo word EGO, EGHO for money.
Many Bini towns still bear their Igbo names till date eg ISIUWA, IGUOBAZUWA.
The Benin Prince called Oduduwa /Izoduwa /Imaduwa who left to Ife just 900 years ago bears his Igbo name and its meanings on leadership is clear to every Igbo.
This post is just oozing with stinky ignorance.
Rely less on imagination when dealing with history please
Most ethnicities of the South and Middle belt are ancestrally connected. But there is no special connection between Gbagyi and Yoruba in particular but Yoruba were in very deep contact with Nupe. Gbagyi are the closest ethnicity to the Nupe so even if records of interaction are scarce between Yoruba and Gbagyi, interaction definitely happened
Africans don't want to be ancestrally connected to Africa Except it's Egypt So many people coming up with nonsense about Egyptian, Israel or Arab origin
And this is something that sane Africans must resist and challenge. Its a big blow to our pride and dignity
absoluteSuccess: [s] I don't think you have useful intelligence.
I demonstrated in my book that ateworo is quite different from atewonro, putting the meaning side by side. That implies I have the understanding ahead of you.[/s]
Atewonro: "Oduduwa fa ewon ro..." To "descend"; ateworo; (i.e Olofin), A (the) te (bend) ewo (òfìn) ro (soft). You can check out the manuscript to the book I earlier shared below.
[s] That said, I am the one exposing you to the different meaning of ro, it's you at the end of the road, not me. I have done my homework before coming here, it's you that here is your "University".
You are not smart.
Now I think you have obsessive compulsion disorder syndrome with lying. You lie and get caught and you make the lie, "the truth".
Do \ Re Mi /[/s]
Eba yi ro- do-do-mi-do: ro here is /do Ojo n ro - do-do mi-do: ro here is dó.
Ro in eba yi ro is (do) soft. Ro in Atẹwọrọ is (do) soft. Ro in atewonro is (do) soft. "Ro" in "atewonro" is (do) cling. "Ro" in macof is (do) descended.
[s] But the ro that macof has chosen is re, which is to "wither", now you have proven me right once again that your intellect is withering. Albeit you can never win a pathological psychopath. You are always at fault with them.
Forcing hard confession from a pathological liar
How will "soft" serve as "descended" in "Ojo ng ro" and fail as the same word in "eba yi ro"? Macof explain it's tonal, this fellow is unaware of "ambiguity in all his years of learning.
He choose "wither" orthography for the Yoruba and clung to "descend" in English. He's so confused, forced to compare two words meaning the same thing in a language he don't speak.
You can put the blame on me.[/s]
clown. I have said it severally that your command of the Yoruba language is poor. You cannot identify different tones because you don't think like a Yoruba, you think like a middle eastern peasant. You are a lost soul, far far gone
It is "Ẹba yìí rọ̀" Like "Ẹja Arọ̀"
Then Òjò ń rọ like Atẹ̀wọ̀nrọ
Your attempt to place the two words as one and the same falls on its face immediately you look for other examples but even with these 4 examples it's clear that the word that goes with "Òjò" (rain) is the same word in "Atewonro/Ateworo" which is different from that which goes with "soft eba" This foolish fraud wants me to believe that it is "rain is softening" instead of "rain is falling"
This fool is so bad at Yoruba language but never brave enough to admit his limitations, instead resorting to guess work from his imagination and stubbornly claiming his wrong interpretation is right.
I won't bother on this topic again, go and learn how to differentiate Ẹ̀wọ̀n from Ewọ and Rọ from Rọ̀
ABULARdotCOM: Some of the words! Most of words in that in that journal are actually Yoruba.
I intentionally highlighted it in my last post. The only problem I have with the work is that I have no means to verify the Coptic words he compared Yoruba words with. But I don't know why obenga would lie, so I am more inclined to trust those Coptic words.
The video was only provided to backup some points made my obenga and omokri's medium post.
The lack of records or evidence is what we are trying to recreate.
Not lie. I wouldn't say that's a lie. But rather he was misled by his source or had no source
absoluteSuccess: Indeed, it's great how Yoruba language adapt itself to science. This attribute can be employed to find time tested truth that eludes one in Yoruba language.
Olofin Adimula Oodua
In the above phrases, the truth about Yoruba history and the tradition about Oduduwa is kept. But there's practical aspect of each phrase that we can fathom in intellectual exercise.
But before that, one must understand what makes a simple sentence? A noun, pronoun or preposition, then a verb.× 1. Olofin is a simple sentence, we can figure out it's meaning.
Studies in Yoruba semantic morphology
We don't know how morphology happened in language, but one of the residue of linguistic morphology is the creation of synonyms, where two or more words in a language targets one meaning as part of their set meanings.
What we got to do is simple: how do we get the mind of the Yoruba wordsmiths much more easier the next time we try? They have other entries that validate any of our choices.
2. When "ro" becomes "lo"
Our choice here is limited to the examples we've used here earlier, namely Olofin and ìrìn. What we're going to do Is this: what happens when r evolve to l (consonant change) in Yorùbá?
The verb ro is created as cognate for the verb lo, like you have in kwa language where oruka is false friends true cognates with olaaka, using an inter-lingual example.
Diachronic displacement ensure that the "follow come" vowel was position earlier., Or, Ol, etc. This happened to make provision for the conjunction vowel that will fuse the word being created together.
But wait, what happens where lo becomes ro? A synonym is born, therefore, one meaning helps us to decode the other. Synonym means two words have same meaning. Let us apply our theory at this point
[s] Ofin, law. When ro becomes lo, it applies to Òfìn and a simple sentence is created, which is made up of a preposition, then a verb and possibly a pronoun. let's see how it works.
1. Òfìn + lo: O/lo/fin. (Olofin) The verb lo is synonymous with ro, meaning bend or twist. We don't have another synonym as replacement.
2. Irin + lo: I/lo/rin: (Ilorin). The verb lo applies here and by the scientific method, the most tenable meaning is "iron bending". Iron bending was the original meaning of ilorin.
This scientific exercise revealed the most tenable meaning of the word in question in the most interesting way. Now how about when lo becomes ro also, using the same example? [/s]
Except you can't figure out it's meaning. You see fact staring at you but no, you rather try to propagate nonsense . As stated before, Ọlọfin is a CY dialectic version of Alafin. With Aọfin/Ọfin being Afin in standard Yoruba
2. First time ever that something of value came out of your pseudo filled brain. After all, you've learnt many things from me
Unfortunately you still don't know what false friends in linguitucs mean
absoluteSuccess: Sikasika a fikan serae. So the actual version of ro that you have for descend is "ro"? So it's actually "atewonro", and not "atewonrò" which version do you now have for withered?
This is what I've been saying, the work you must do as an Igbo man bending Yoruba origin in Igbo direction. You have a lot to do with your artificial intelligence interpreter.
You have just exposed yourself as a man relying on software to interpret the Yoruba language instead of learning from human intelligence. Your machine has deceived you, it's a friendly fire!
The ro you choose is to wither, the one you said I choose is the actual one that address the point you are making, hitherto, it's you exposing yourself. Guy you are a glory hunter.
You shot others down and claim their glory.
I have said it before, you are clever but unintelligent fool playing intellectual. I've shown you how to make you sing. Now you are coming out.
Confused Igbo, you have no clue what I've gotten you to confess there, when I finally show you, you will twist to another line of argument as a chameleon.
What an Igbo ego, go back to your dp, all your thread is bringing down the Bible or it's precepts, you can't do much without hunting or hurting others for your good. Here you meet your Waterloo.
Lati orun ni Oodua ro wa:
do the needful.
You can't possibly prove wrong what is wrong. It's wrong already. Can you make black to be black when it is black already?
Why labour to prove wrong what is wrong again? That is leaving substance to pursue shadows.
Lmao Clown.
So at the end of the road you accept that the word in "Òjò ń rọ" is different from that in "Ẹba yìí rọ̀" But where you still fail is switching them up. You aren't good at differentiating Yoruba words of same alphabets.
It is to be expected anyway, after you think like a Hebrew (people who don't do tones in their words) and not a Yoruba.
TAO11: You appear to be the Yoruba version of gregyboy. In other words, the very things which demolishes your point is what you always present as evidence. Ironic, isn’t it?
Your screenshot here (from Isaac Adeniji Ogunbiyi) made it clear that the effort to link Yoruba words to Arabic is simply an attempt, and by doctrinaire Islam scholars.
Do you even know what the English word doctrinaire means? You obviously don’t, because if you do, you certainly wouldn’t be making a mess of yourself like this.
Doctrinaire means: “seeking to impose a doctrine in all circumstances without regard to practical considerations.”
In other words, according to the same professor whom you seek to misrepresent; the attempt to link Yoruba words to Arabic is pseudo-academic, it is done by religious dogmatist, and it is against reality.
What else will refute you more than this same attachment you put forward with your own hand??
Stop bothering me with your bullshit. I hope I am clear enough.
Macof, please come and carry your illiterate and unteachable Hebrew/Arab wannabe.
that guy ehn. I've never seen a Yoruba person be that oblivious to simple facts staring him in the face. So embarrassing
The reason I think some of the words in Obenga's work are strange to us is, because the Yoruba we speak today was not the same our ancestors spoke (there are lot of corruption). Same way various Yoruba clans speak Yoruba that have some differences.
cc Olu317
Languages evolve, fair enough but how did Obenga get words that the ancestors spoke but no Yoruba understands today. How can you verify that the words he gave mean what he said they mean in any Yoruba dialect or at any time in any Yoruba dialect. Plus if he knew he was citing lost Yoruba words, don't you also think he would have stated that and provide a source to how he got those words?
About the video, much of that is very inaccurate. 1. Yorùbá do not call our Land, Ilẹ̀ Adúláwò. That is a recently formed word for "Africa". It does not belong to ancient Yoruba vocabulary. 2. Kemet does not mean "land of black people" but "black land" in reference to the black soil. 3. "Irawo" means Star in Yoruba, Irawo is not a deity, nor does it mean "rising sun" 4. Osun is not a moon god but a River Goddess 5. There are no records of Egyptians migrating South 1500 years ago.
absoluteSuccess: Your insult is well deserving. At least you have learned that Yoruba verbal reasoning doesn't correspond with that of English in the example you use.
Why aren't you fighting that the replacement of idea, turning "descended" to "soften" in the first sentence you read shouldn't be? A mad dog must always bark and bite.
You asked for just a point, you got it and became mad as usual. Sorry I made you go through the trouble of finding out other synonyms.
It's not easy for an hateful Igbo man that must learn Yoruba and teach Yorubas their history by fire by force. Ndo.
You use software to interpret Oodua descended from heaven to "Lati orun ni Oodua ro wa". I asked you a very simple question: in "akoto ede Yoruba", where should "ti" be placed in your sentence?
"Lati orun ni Oodua ro wa"
I dare not ask you what akoto means. Omo Igbo to'mo history Yoruba daada, ekuuse opolo.
In what way did you debunk my point of "ro" meaning to "descend"?? This fool came with "eba yi rọ̀" (This eba is soft) not knowing that "rọ" and "rọ̀" are two different words Keep embarrassing yourself
I'm still waiting for you to debunk one point. I know you are intensively searching and running around all my post. Essentially you are not after knowledge or facts. You know well you cannot bebunk the facts I present but you cannot except it it's all about being Hebrew by imagination and stupidity only
absoluteSuccess: Thanks very much sir, God bless you. If I say "eba yi ro", could it translate back to English that "this eba is descending"
would that make sense given that you are rooted for one meaning one tone in this regard?
So, then the Yoruba had the properties of Semitic languages that you really disdain to associate with. Or possibly your theory is impractical in practice. You have poetic license here or something?
Ateworo
Point of corrections: "ateworo", "atewonro", it means "one who beat the trappings of the law" you are not Yoruba hence interpretation is a bit difficult to remember. One who beat the taboo.
Olofin, one who twist the law (to his or her own favor). Thus ateworo is word that implies that the bearer was held, but science demands that we can agree on a point when it's repeated twice.
Therefore, the Yoruba scholars of old had coined "Olofin" to answer to that need. It's Oduduwa we are taking about: what would she have said? "Oranmiyan", that is, "my cause is justified".
Her cause, her court case. The case ended in her favor to a great extent and it reflected on her psyche for a child's name, okanbi.
A pseudohistorian is one who fluctuate from one claim to the other in quick succession. You claim Onisoro and obadio are the validators of Oduduwa tradition on page 72.
And you ask I should go and confront them, I posted an excerpt from my book, yet here you are hijacking the tradition you never know to exist prior to the book I posted.
2. Ojo n ro
As a Yoruba man, I should help you understand Yoruba language better. Yoruba language doesn't translate straightforward to English in all cases, except for a mediocre.
It's the nearest meaning to the English equivalent of the phrase that you've given. And a linguist of your caliber should know better. Here's it.
Ojo ng ro: rain is falling: that is not the exact interpretation. It's akin to what you once called "lazy interpretation". Should you be caught in the same act?
Ojo ng ro: rain is pouring: this is the most exact interpretation. Ro is not falling, it's pouring in the sense that connects with the rain in Yoruba psyche.
Egun have exactly what you intended.
Jokun no jah: rain is falling.
Jah is "falling" or "coming" in Egun, jokun no jah is never mistaken for "rain is coming" because it's already happening, "no", "ng", "ing" is visible in all cases.
The replacement for English gerund are no and ng. With due respect, your interpretation is what stands you out as a foreigner to the nuances of the Yoruba language.
You can't be comparing ancient Yoruba tradition with recent simple sentence here and when we check back or move forward, you are for the theory of how "ro" changed to "lo", as you have been doing.
And now you have the opportunity to validate the entry "ro" from kwa equivalent with ideas of its morphology. Or the future holds the secret to the past I think. So why live on baseless theory?
3. Give us your simple demonstration on Ori-sa.
4. In "akoto ede Yoruba", if you are not writing from some software, and someone who claims to always be in Lagos, where should "ti" be in your Yoruba sentence
"Lati orun ni Oodua ro wa"?
I did not bother to read past that first statement (@bold) Clearly you don't have a good understanding of the Yoruba language
There is a difference between "rọ" (descend) and "rọ̀" (softened, withered)
When I say you are an incapable linguist not the "great genius decoder of yoruba language" as you claim, you best believe what I say. Nobody who properly looks at yoruba words would make that statement @bold
absoluteSuccess: Do you see how long it's taking that Igbo guy to do his braggadocio? He's nursing the open wound: "conscience is an open wound, only the truth can heal it". Uthman Dan Fodio.
He's yet to find his confidence again. Imagine a man who can tell us I'm interpreting Yoruba word ateworo in my book from "nairaland level of knowledge":
1. He can tell us how grounded Yoruba is in Niger Congo, from low tone, ambiguous etc.
2. He knows the fact of how consonants evolved from proto-language and speak nothing but the fact. But this one beats him.
3. Our guy couldn't figure out how "ro" evolved from Niger Congo linguistic family to validate his claim. So he resorted to Google.
Google redirected to kid Primer...
"And rọ Simple... Like Òjò n rọ Láti Ọ̀run ni Oodua rọ wa"
Can you imagine a great teacher who disdain toddler interpretation putting this across as his "simpleton" validation of historical fact?
Consider how short and simple the fact was with the load of junks, and he called others ranter. Oh no, that guy is incredible.
So if Lati orun ni Oodua ro wa, this idea juxtaposed with Elarowa would mean?
Lati Orun ni Ela ro wa... so does this also means Ela came on the same chain as Oduduwa?
Yoruba Primer
Obo oba, obe baba, obe baba ja Saba baba alata, a o ba baba mu Bata a o ba mu.
Ode nfa ofa, o fa, Ofa fo, o fo Ife oba, Ife oba fo, a o ba baba be oba, a o ba be.
As a toddler, I hated the last part, why should I be part of the people to beg the king.
Macof, what's the name of the book that this was taken from?
this unfortunate clown still pained and bitter over my correcting his stupid translation of "atewonro" and "ọlọfin". If you don't want to embarrass yourself, srutinuze yourself or ask a sensible person to do so before going out in public to make stupid claims like "atewonro" means "committed a taboo" or whatever the nonsense you said was again
I'm still waiting for you to show how my translation is wrong
You see this "And rọ Simple... Like Òjò n rọ (It's raining /rain is falling) (it is from Ọ̀run that oduduwa descended) Láti Ọ̀run ni Oodua rọ wá" Which ìs giving you serious chest pains. That is simple as you rightly said, simple straightforward to illustrate that indeed "rọ" means "to descend"
I'm still waiting for you to debunk a single point I've made.
PS. @Olu317. You don't have to respond to this but the message if very relevant. Maybe you can help each other scrutinize yourselves before making a mess of yourselves
macof: You know what's shocking is that it was after I corrected absoluteSuccess that you came with your interpretation of Ateworo and Olofin. and this happens all the time with all 3 of you Ordinary if I didn't make my input you wouldn't have given us your "accurate" interpretation. If you are so sure of yourself, teach your brother absoluteSuccess by correcting him when he's wrong. Because you came to defend him but even your interpretation is far from his... So who is wrong?
absoluteSuccess: I am all that your life is about. It's not the other way round. My findings are the resources for your destiny. I made the inputs, you debunk it.
That's the difference.
clown
You have made absolutely no findings. Not even one You are a ranter and a pseudohistorian and incapable linguists who thinks like a ten year old Samuel is Orisa, Ebora is Deborah/Abraham These are what you call "findings"? You are an embarrassment to human intellect
Olu317: You that can't differentiate between T'eri and ba eri ,but got stuck into ‘ Teriba ,' because, you saw it in a dictionary,without sieving Koine Yoruba word from Classic Yoruba dialects ! Bigotry is what you stand for. It is obvious you lacked the pedigree to be called a Yoruba person. Learn Yoruba more :
Te eri : bend your head or bow your head
Ba eri : bend your head or bow your head
Bowo : bow your head in submission
English's bow : bend your head in submission.
Bow has it foundation as a loaned word from Classic Hebrew into English lexicon and has true cognate with it.
Mr. lair liar ,yu're in for more shocks because I can't find Ibos or Ewe, sharing this word as true cognate with Yoruba's ?
Have you even taken time to study the language families in Benin Republic and other Franco phone Yoruba language is found ?
Perhaps, you will learn more to see that the Yorubas are linguistically different from Ewe , Gun , Fon etc in this country's classification.
Stop going in circles. I have dealt with this
macof: LOL. Accuse me of using mere rhetoric to end up doing exactly that which you accuse others of.
1. There's absolutely nothing wrong with your interpretation of the word Ààfin.. Where you are right I will tell you But that is Infact the interpretation of the word "Palace" as well. There is no Palace of a sovereign in the world that is a mere residential area. It is in the Palace that official state matters are handled
You understood every well what my post was you are just trying to save face and salvage the pieces after the wrong translations @absolutesuccess gave in his book
Interestingly, you aren't supporting him that Ọlọfin means one who twists the law
I don't know what concerns Ọ̀ru with this matter but you can bring that up later.. Should be interesting. Also, there's no correlation between the name oduduwa and the name David/Dawud... Because I know that is what you are gunning for with this nonsense Dawaodu you wrote there
2. you've never been good at Yoruba accent marks. I remember how you confused Ibí for Ibì
We all know Atẹwọnrọ refers to Oduduwa not ogun And my break down of the word is actually very consistent with every single translation of "Atẹwọnrọ" out there
Now let me address what you think you broke down accurately Tẹ̀ doesn't mean to bend... Tẹ means to bend (notice the difference?) ie. tẹrí balẹ̀ "bend the head to the ground [in homage]
Tẹ̀ can be found in tẹ̀lé, tẹ̀dó... That's not "to bend" in these words
And rọ Simple... Like Òjò n rọ Láti Ọ̀run ni Oodua rọ wa
You know what's shocking is that it was after I corrected absoluteSuccess that you came with your interpretation of Ateworo and Olofin. And this happens all the time with all 3 of you Ordinary if I didn't make my input you wouldn't have given us your "accurate" interpretation. If you are so sure of yourself, teach your brother absoluteSuccess by correcting him when he's wrong. Because you came to defend him but even your interpretation is far from his... So who is wrong?
Amujale: Berber are a mixture of European and West Asian, these are what history affirms.
As stated earlier, the term 'Berber' transpires from olden day Greek.
These are the people that occupied the area of the continent that they called the 'Maghrib'.
Has nothing to does with Ancient Egypt.
They invaded the area, not they they originated from there, they originate from Europe and West Asia, even the language they speak can attest to this.
The similiarities you point out is perhaps the language systems of those days that they must've adopted from the region.
These are periods in history that predates the battle of 'Ain Ja lut', pre-Islamic era.
I can't disagree or agree to this. But this really isn't the point of language classification.
The origin of a language can be different from the origin of the speakers of said language. People adopt languages you know. @bold : you can say that I guess
Berber languages are related to some of the first invaders of North Africa from Europe and the Medeterranian.
One could easily assert that the Berber language is Afro-asiatic due to the vast amount of years spent on the continent; thousands of years to be precise.
The term 'Berber' simply means those in Europe and West Asia that didnt speak Greek.
It was the Greeks that coined that term.
You wont find a Berber language related term in Ancient Egypt.
Furthermore, there was no such thing as a 'Berber' during the period of Ancient Egypt.
The foreigners in the times of Kemit was the, 'Sea people', Hyskos and than later the Assyrians.
The Assyrians became more prominant in Olden days Egypt and not Ancient Egypt.
There are still so many things you misunderstand and mix together in regard to language classification
We might have to take it, one step at a time
But know this
Similarities between Berber languages and Ancient Egyptian exist such as: VSO sentence order, two-gender system in the singular with adding ‘t’ to the feminine"
absoluteSuccess: If that's what you expected, it proofs that you have no inclination what you claim to be. What makes olaaka cognate with oruka? What makes natus cognate with cognate? What makes ego cognate with owo?
You are a fool, I've asked you that if you find an ancient orthography, you can't understand it at a glance and that's what you often do except for your own seldom inputs like owo and ego.
Why not look for owo and ego in either languages? You can't use one rule here and abandon the same rule there. If Odion is Odiyan is hard to swallow for you, how much more this?
You have your answer here. Stop going in circles
macof: Very hilarious comments, ultimately exposing more stubborn and committed ignorance. All 4 came hot because of my post on patterns of sound change.. That post really scared the hell out of all of you. It was fun to read the angry reactions and honestly it's just because I've given up on you people already otherwise it ought to be a sad thing. No messiah can save you from your hebetudinous intellect and willful ignorance.
I will explain for the last time to you on this matter of language.
#1 Yoruba placement First of all, none of you are linguists and your command of the Yoruba language has been shown on this thread to be unimpressive so how can you claim to know that expert linguists are wrong on a matter you don't know enough about?
Scholars (Africans and non Africans alike) who have studied the Yoruba language and other languages in the Volta-Niger (East Kwa) language group, have reported the result of their study and research. And nobody has condemned the existence of a Niger - congo language group nor Yoruba Language 's relatedness to other languages in its immediate language family. So your blabbings are restricted to your clique of Hebrew and Arab wannabes who do not rely on facts. Funny how you 4 can claim because a European was the first to come up with the label "Kwa languages" the idea must be false . But it was also Europeans who came up with the idea of "semitic languages". So this point of referring to who came up with the idea is hypocritical. Trying to remove Yoruba from Kwa on grounds that the language group was labelled by linguists of European descent, only to try to put Yoruba in Semitic - a language group created by linguists of European descent You all lack consistent arguments
Secondly, the fact that these language groups were first penned by someone of European descent does not mean the language groups are false. The ancestry of the scholar is inconsequential. A thing is not false because of who said it.. A thing is false simply because it is not true nor based on anything that can stand scrutiny.
The linguists of European descent who were vital to the rise of linguistics in Africa were not racist or schizophrenic. That's an unnecessary label, one that is frankly untrue. You don't think the semitic people who you want to be are racist despite all the things they wrote in their holy books? You think they like you? Anyway that's a topic for another day, another thread.
The placement of Yoruba, Ewe, Nupe, Igbo , Edo, Idoma, Igala, Fon fon, Ga etc as related languages have not been rejected by any renowned scholar, rather our knowledge of the science of these languages has improved because of the initial work that grouped these languages together. My own ongoing research for my thesis on ancient Yoruba history has been aided by the work of historical linguists so historians can testify.
If you want some popular Yoruba linguists, here are some : Odutayo Akinkugbe, Bolaji Aremo, Abiodun Adetugbo People actually study these things. So it's not for any of you 4 to tell linguists that they are all wrong when your argument makes no sense.
#2. Comparative Historical Linguistics Even from my own research and reflection as a historian who has keen interest in linguistics All Kwa languages possess identical properties... To name a few: - a high and low tone and occasional mid tone; absence of gender and plural forms of words; - no verb conjugations, nor change in verb morphology during change in grammatical aspects eg. O lọ : he goes / he went (lọ will always remain lọ in every aspect without undergoing a morphological change)
Totally different from semitic languages
Plus I have demonstrated that there are patterns of change in the consonant sounds of words in Kwa languages
An etymon is a word or morpheme from which a later word is derived. Cognages are words that share common etymological origin..
That is cognates are siblings and have an etymon as their parent. You jump on my post to argue with my sound pattern without actually debunking it because you don't understand what cognates and etymon mean. You just have to jump on it because you can't agree to it and still claim Yoruba is semitic Even you guys aren't dumb enough to contradict yourselves like that
But I'm waiting for you to actually show how those patterns are false
Cognates are not words that look alike when written down and share similar meaning. (Iron and Ìrìn are not cognates, neither are Apá and Apart) That is not the meaning of cognate.
You have to study 1. The pronunciation of the words or change in pronunciation over time. Words are phonological (concerning pronunciation) first before being about letters and alphabets
Iron and Ìrìn do not sound alike nor do they trace back in pronunciation to the same word
2. The break down of the words Break the words down if possible into syllables and let's see if they still hold the illusion of being connected
3. Etymology. That is the original meaning of a word, or how that word came to be
And why are you trying to argue that Apá is cognate with Apart Apart comes from Latin "Ad Partem" .. Or now Latin too is a semitic language Or Latin borrowed the word "Ad Partem" from Hebrew?
You guys are the bumbest 4 on this forum if you can't see the stupidity in this particular argument. It's hilarious because you guys really think you are making sense
Here are two links on the basics of historical linguistics. Explaining the comparative method and how two languages can be said to be related
While you are saying Yoruba Apá is cognate with Latin Ad Partem People who know better say Yoruba Apá (and Iká: finger) is cognate with igbo Aka
Here's a link to some linguists and anthropologists compiling a limited list of cognate words between Yoruba and Igbo (the two biggest Volta-Niger languages)
# 3 Trusting Experts Why can we trust the experts who say Yoruba language is related to languages spoken around Yorùbáland instead of trusting you random 4 young men who do not even belong to any academic community who say Yoruba language is not related to languages around but rather to languages over 7,000 Kilometers away in a different continent spoken by people who don't look anything like yorubas
1. There is no record of mass migration into Yorùbáland, Igboland, Idomaland, Igalaland, Edoland, Nupeland. We can assume based on this alone that these neighbours have lived close to each other for thousands of years and probably share common origin, so their languages must be related 2. These languages share identical properties. Tonal languages, No verb morphology, no definite article In case you don't know what definite article means (which you 4 most likely don't) : Definite article is the word "the" used before a noun eg. The Car. 3. Words like Ewure (Yoruba) - Ewe (Edo) Ewu (Igbo) : Goat Akuko (Yoruba) - Okhokho (Edo) - Okuko (Igbo) : Fowl Erin (Yoruba) - Eni (Edo) - Enyi (Igbo) : Elephant Nti (Igbo) - Eti (Yoruba) : Ear Ọnu (Igbo) - Ẹnu (Yoruba) : Mouth Miri (Igbo) - Omi (Yoruba) :Water
You get the point? Refer to my earlier link on similar words in igbo and Yoruba, you can also use any igbo dictionary to check the authenticity of the igbo words since you don't speak igbo
This is how you know people who went to school and take knowledge seriously
Interesting thing is that you may say that "Ọkhọkhọ" in Edo is cognate with "Cockk" in English But you will disagree that Ewu, Ewure and Ewe are cognates
I have given priceless education on this thread, hit you back to back with facts and information. That is yet to be debunked. I am waiting for any of you to show any of my statements false like I do with yours on a regular At this point anyone who wants to learn more should simply ask questions. I will be responding only to relevant posts on this topic from now on because it has been over flogged if anyone still thinks Yoruba language is not related to neighbouring languages then believe what you like. It is yourself you are embarrassing.
Words are really about sound and the meaning attributed to specific sounds put together not the letters and alphabet. So you don't focus on looking for two words that have same alphabets like you embarrassed yourself with "Sa-muel" being "Òrì-ṣà" or Iron being Ìrìn
And how do we confirm that two words from two different languages are cognates? Through the comparative method which aims to highlight the change in sound between the two words
Consonant sound change in East Kwa (Volta-Niger) languages gh - w, h, g eg. Money : Owo, Ogho (Yoruboid) Igho (Edoid) Ego (Igboid)/ You sg. : iwọ (Yoruboid), ihọ (Edoid), gi (Igboid) / They : wọn, ghan, gha (Yoruboid and Edoid), ha (igboid). Or kp - k eg. Hand: Apá [Akpá] (Yoruboid) Aka (igboid)/ Frog : Ọpọlọ[Ọkpọlọ] (yoruboid), Eko (edoid), Akolo (igboid). Or l - n, r eg. Neck: Ọrùn, Olu (yoruboid and igboid) Onu (igboid)/ Ring : Òrùka, Oluka(Yoruboid), Olaaka (Igboid) / Sky/Above : Ọ̀run, Ọlu (Yoruboid and Igboid), Elu (Igboid) / In/at : ni, li, na (Yoruboid, edoid and igboid)
uncertain: i don't like posting things i'm still researching but take this as a bonus Or ny - n, y eg.´Elephant: Erin (Yoruboid), Eni (Edoid), Enyi (Igboid) /Mother : Iye, Nne from possibly "Inye" . Nna (Father or Mother in Igboid, depending on dialect) and Iya (Mother in Yoruba) could then be safely established as cognates
Yoruboid includes Igala. Edoid includes urhobo. Igboid includes Ekpeye
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Apart comes from Latin "Ad Partem" .. Or now Latin too is a semitic language