₦airaland Forum

Joagbaje:
They were schedulled to be ministered to alongdide other people.but the man was impatient feeling the wife would give up because of the deteriorating condition . You could see ushers pulling him away. If it had been scripted, the cameramen would have been ready to catch him when he was dragging her to stage . He took everybody by surprise , because they were scheduled to be prayed for, they were even interviewed.

Dont worry Jo, when I'm less busy, I'll post a link to a healing school video to show you exactly what aletheia means by 'scripted'

Zikkyy:
It’s good to read you say you give (though I don’t know the nature of giving here).

If pastor chris sell off or sow his cars today, he will probably receive 20 times more. Pastor chris cannot enter brt na! As the pastor/c-in-c/ceo of Christ embassy, church members will allow it. Oga Jo, the reason you get another car is simply because of your status as area father  pastor. Abeg no turn God to kalo-kalo machine by deceiving ‘ordinary’ church members into sowing off their prized possessions believing it will work for them as well. Stories of the ‘poor’ members of the congregation receiving prado jeeps from wealthy members will be more interesting. But I no sure say dat one fit happen. It would be nice to know you sow your prado jeep to the lives of the ‘have nots’ in your church and get that multiple replacement, Christ will be pleased.

InesQor:
@Joagbaje: Ok Im back. I was very angry yesterday at your reply so if I replied you, I wont have made a useful post.

The videos mean nothing. The way it should work is the Biblical pattern: there was a man/woman, everybody around them knew their problem. God healed them. Here is what they had. Here's what they have now. Spot the difference. Simple! Someone on TV or even a live show who gets "healed" may as well be an actor or actress. Yes, I believe in documented reports. You know why? If the problem concerned you, you would have gone to places! Several physicians wont produce shady details at the same time. Doctors that have at least completed the housemanship program, know their onions!

Are you familiar with the term "Advanced Fee Fraud"? When you ask someone to sow a seed to guarantee their healing, while simultaneously signing a Caveat Emptor saying they cant sue if it fails, then you have defrauded such a person. Thats social engineering ("Yahoo yahoo runs"! The more subtle "healers" will give myriads of examples about those for whom it worked. Details will be glossed over. The buyer gets comfortable and believes he/she is ready to exercise faith. Then the final phase is the placebo and/or fear factor phase. Either the buyer keeps dying inside, thinking its their faith that is weak but they are actually healed; or else they are scared to say it didnt work cos that would make them look faithless, or that would make the "healer" look fake and they dont want to incur God's wrath. So they live in falsehood. We say, come forward with evidence. They cant. Cos there's none. They are either wallowing in a placebo or else they are scared of what people will say. (I believe Its the same reason some people make a conscious effort to "fall under the annoying-thing" when they should rather have the anointing of God coursing through them). There was nobody Jesus healed who wasnt ready to download every detail. Why? It was real.

Hmm! Spot on InesQor, you hit the nail right

Joagbaje:
I laugh, I believe Jesus and Paul have some explanation to do for their extotions. If that's what you call it

Luke 8:3
3 Joanna, whose husband Chusa was Herod's administrator; Susanna; and many other women. They provided financial support for Jesus and his disciples.

Galatians 6:6-7
6 Anyone who receives instruction in the word must share all good things with his instructor.
7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows.

It is the giver that benefits my dear friend, not the receiver. Read the bible well.

Acts 20:35
35 ----- and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive.

Dont try to hide behind bible passages young man, you and your mentor are not anywhere close to Paul and Jesus. Deal with it!

Joagbaje:
Sir John , don't start this, I may back off here because I don't want to sound offensive. But the wicked can prosper for a reason according to scriptures . I haven't said you're wicked . But there are biblical laws principles. But I will warn you not to boast against God. The grace of your good deed in time past and mercy may still be working for you. Couple with how you have followed God from childhood. He grace may have been expanded to cover your error till God brings you out of your distraction .

I have said this before and I will say it again: Diligence, honesty and hard work are the sure foundations of wealth not tithing, offering, partnership or , any such form of extortion.
But then on the other hand, these forms of giving does make rich yes it only enriches the collectors i.e the likes of Mr Chris and Joagbaje who prey on unsuspecting followers with sugarcoated lies.

Joagbaje:
Mr Enigma,
You can't be comparing me with the boy, Well he sold one , I sold four. But that's not the issue, I had with me artists that are known more internationally , and to have 4 works sold and some of them still came back home with unsold work  is a miracle for me. So look at it in that perspective.

There are miraculous things that have been happening to me through my givings, I can't tell them all. A couple gave me a brand new prado jeep, fresh from factory, i didn't ask them for it. They said God told them to give me. Guess what ? I only used it for a year I gave it as a seed this year , I have a principle not to use a car for more than two years. I can't tell all the mind blowing strange things that I experience through giving.

Petty Minds, small minds!
theres a lot going on out there in the world you know; you sit in your little enclave in yenogoa and think you've seen big things? wake up bro!

Joagbaje:
@Kay 17

I didn't intend to comment on rhem before. I have said in several thread . The tithes and offering are Gods financial security for his people. It is by faith , even though its not by force , it is a necessity for any wise person. I am a tither and I know the grace I work in through my tithing . Above all things , it is my honour and worship, recognising God as source of my prosperity. I participated in an art exhibition recently with some great painters. In one day I sold 4 paintings . While some " great painters" haven't sold. Why will I not tithe?. The consequences of not tithing is absence of grace that tithing carries. Every obedience to the word carries a blessing. If you obey some , you have benefit of it's grace, if you don't , you loose the benefit it contains.  Tithing is also a primary way by which the work of the ministry is supported.  It is came through the revelation of God to men of faith before the law came. God officially made it compulsory through the law. Some say I give offering but not tithe, sorry, they go together to support ministers and work of ministry.

OMG! this is very comical, I cant help but feel so sorry for your ignorance. I am a successful businessman and I seal major deals every month in millions; I DO NOT TITHE!!

[quote author=siyanda.N link=topic=193649.msg6856300#msg6856300 date=1285939890]Hallow everyone! I also left Christ Embassy Randburg under Ose Oyakhilome! Some of the reasons:
1 First Fruit Offering - well every January we were required to give all our salaries for the month of January as first fruit offering. Now what we were never told was "to whom was the church giving its firstfruit offering to" Imagine that nonsense.
2. Tithing - I look after my parents since they are both retired. I give them R3000 a month and my sisters and brothers also give them. Now Ose once preached that if we dont tithe we are CURSED. This hurt me and I went to the leaders of the church to tell them that I cant really give 10% of my salary because I support myu parents, my child, my self, I pay my bond, my car, food, clothing, etc I told them my 10% is going to my parents but I do give R1000 towards tithe, they told me STOP giving your aprents money because it is God's money. That grieved me. I prayed and God told me give as your heart desires!
3. Award Ceremony for Best givers - They hold the year end awards ceremony where people who gave more that others are awarded. hahaha such manipulation. Who does that?? they manipulate people to make sure they give during the year so they can also get those awards. You should see people who cant afford to give so much made feel useless.
4. Tongues - I attended a service last year where Ose was preaching on tongues, telling people that they need to "practise" speaking in tongues. She started making some sounds telling people how to speak in tongues. She then told the whole church to stand up and speak in tongues. Now, 5 minutes after they stopped. And Ose called for people who want to be born again, hahaha the same people she was teaching to speak in tongues 5 minutes earlier  GOT UP! I realised that this church is a joke.
6. Pastor Chris - I had a cd from Pastor Chris teaching people to NOT PRAY like OLD christians who prayed "God if its your will let it be" I thought to myself WHAT ? Jesus taught His disciples to pray "Your will be Done" and this Chris is telling people to pray for their OWN will.
7. Healing School - I never understood what went on there! People who were sick on the floor were placed right at the back and people who were quiet well to me were put on stretchers, wheelchairs and were prayed for.
8. They never preached about REPENTANCE never!! Fornication and wordliness in that church!!! and they would speak in tongues whilst they live in with boyfriends and drink themselves sick. But the Ose pays no attention to it
Most of my friends left and I pray for some that are still trapped in that CULT to be released in the Name of Jesus.
If you want more info send me email.[/quote]@siyanda.N
Its quite an interesting post you've put up here; I had wanted to sit this one out but again I'm compelled to comment. I'm sure the likes of Joagbaje may have thought I was trying to use a new ID to bring up this thread again, but I can see he read your posts from other threads; at least thats proof enough that you are in SA and that you know what you are saying. I'm happy that more and more people are getting to know the truth and walking out of these grand deception masquerading as the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I may not completely agree with your outburst of hatred against Nigerians in diaspora (as seen from your posts on other threads) but I would rather not talk about that on this thread.

What nonsense!!!

Joagbaje do you see what this thread has degenerated into? even though I do not have anything serious against the initial title but you can clearly see that in the end you did not achieve anything but insults and disregard for Chris.

Joagbaje:
Mind prayer is unscriptural. B[b]ut there is room for meditation[/b]. Which renews your mind, but it's not a prayer. Your Greg Braden guy is not a Christian

Joagbaje, you seen not to slack at any opportunity to spread your WOF/ new age nonsense: 'THE SPOKEN WORD'. not everything is verbalized Joagbaje.
Again Joagbaje can you please tell us how Chris defines 'meditation' no pranks please

Joagbaje:
I have a case of a diabetic woman that got healed, I will post the details today.

I think my question to you was clear but just in case you try to play blind as usual, I'll remind you:

SirJohn:
Joagbaje, tell us about the folks you sent there, I'm sure they must be healed by now.

@ Mabel & Joeagbaje,
the healing school session in lagos has long ended. Mabel I'm waiting for testimonies of outstanding miracles.
Joagbaje, tell us about the folks you sent there, I'm sure they must be healed by now.

@Mazaje,
This is really a sad one but it shouldn't be a means to ridicule Christians; the truth is this: 'God still heals' yeah I said it cos I know a lot of folks here would be "what!! is that coming from sirjohn"
Yes God heals but they have refused to accept that medical science is one of Gods way of bringing healing to man. whether a headache is cured by aspirin administration or by mind power or faith, the bottom line is that you eventually got rid off the headache.
I really do hope that child gets treated eventually, again I say "how sad"

you should probably check the email address to make sure its spelled correctly

okay thanks, please check your email

Hi Invisible, may I have your email address?

kITA TITA:
I don't believe anything in that book. A friend gave me a copy and I read and I think the writer is delusional.

Delusional, that's the word

Joagbaje:
There is no need for insults.Explain yourself . besides you didn't answer the question.

You keep shooting yourself in the foot Joagbaje, The scripture you quoted does not prove you can call forth 'thousands' or 'millions' nor does it prove that the christian can live a life here on earth without any form of sickness or pain based on his level of faith _{at least that is how WOF describes divine health}.
you have only shown by that scripture that God allows you to ask, and I'm sure you also agree (your post below shows so) that God cannot grant all wishes or prayers. So I am asking that you show me where scripture supports the concept of divine health or the calling forth of different amount of money based on ones faith

Joagbaje:
What is his will?. His will has to do with his provisions for  us in christ Jesus. His will is in accordance with his word. I cant pray for another man's wife for example . God wont grant that.

Joagbaje:
What is your business? The discussion was between me and sirjohn. A lady brought her son to church ,he couldnt walk but lying donw on his belly ,said the doctor diagnosed he has hole in the heart. It was sugested to her either by the doctor or whoever ,that she should look for Kanu because the operation will cost 5million naira. To cut the long story short ,the boy Got healed and began to run arround. Since sirjohn belives that mirtacles ended with the last apostle, I told him of countless of miracles arround us daily. I shared this child's own among many many others that even members of cec performs. He ask for medical proof if any x-ray was done after the healing to prove the hole is gone. I him to provide the 2 x-rays but on talking to the woman. She said they didnt do any previous xtray that the doctor just told her the child had hole in the heart. At that point there was no need to do any confirmatory x-ray again since there was no previous one. So i offer other testimonies to sirjohn of hiv, leg cancer etc ,which have medical report . But he began to change his language.And I felt he wasnt really sincere to have proof of a miracle.

Hey guys permit me to draw you guys back a bit.

Joagbaje, you know I wont let you spread your lies here.
It was a phone conversation, you told me about the little boy and that you can provide X-Ray evidence I said fine; later you found out there was no X-Ray and then you gave me numbers to call a I said it was most inappropriate.
Now I want everyone to be the judge of this: Since Joagbaje could not provide the X-Rays evidence to prove the little boy was indeed healed of a hole in the heart, and he has evidence for HIV and leg cancer, let him go ahead and share the evidence here with us. I'm not the one who needs to redeem myself rather it is him.

Joagbaje:
It Is scriptural to call forth what you desire in prayer.

Mark 11:24
24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive[ them], and ye shall have[ them].

why would you think it is unscrptural to call forth what you desire , be it finance or health .

I'm not surprised at all, you are a chip off the old block (chris) with a well known reputation and penchant for twisting scriptures to suite your various ungodly teachings.

Whether or not it is scriptural?

Oh come on joagbaje, you're too big for this childish game; you still haven't answered the questions. its okay if you say you dont have the answers. provide 'good biblical explanation' thats what I said.

So?

Joagbaje:
I am not Leroy Tompson , didn't talk about money cometh. You asked about Gods will for us to prosper and I gave a scripture for it.

You didn't answer my questions cos I never said anything about Gods will for us to prosper. These were my question[b]s[/b]:

SirJohn:
Wow! off all examples in the world is this the best you can come up with? 'praying for another mans wife' we're talking of common real life scenarios and you're talking of another mans wife, how many christians would pray for that?
I gave an example in my last post which you ignored (as usual).

Now joagbaje, is calling forth money part of his provisions for us in christ Jesus? is divine health part of his provisions for us in christ Jesus?I'm curious to know and I need good biblical explanation
Thank you!

with reference to your statement below sir!

Joagbaje:
A man faith may be able to call forth 1,000 naira and it works but a bigger faith will be required for millions.

Joagbaje:
The word of God speaks for itself sir.

2 Corinthians 8:9
9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

How does the above scripture support the 'money cometh' doctrine?

where is Joagbaje??

@uche13
Can you explain to us what 'offer 7' means in Christ Embassy church?

[quote author=petres_007 link=topic=474352.msg6424377#msg6424377 date=1279715218]That's a joke, right?[/quote]No joke man, the guy is a professor

@Enigma, I hope you know Oyaks is a professor of Pneumatology. well just for your information

Joagbaje:
What is his will?. His will has to do with his provisions for us in christ Jesus. His will is in accordance with his word. I cant pray for another man's wife for example . God wont grant that.

Wow! off all examples in the world is this the best you can come up with? 'praying for another mans wife' we're talking of common real life scenarios and you're talking of another mans wife, how many christians would pray for that?
I gave an example in my last post which you ignored (as usual).

Now joagbaje, is calling forth money part of his provisions for us in christ Jesus? is divine health part of his provisions for us in christ Jesus?
I'm curious to know and I need good biblical explanation
Thank you!