₦airaland Forum

Mossadd:
Olofa should be held responsible for this, he invited them and they have arrived with full force now so my home town is no longer safe again thanks to Asumon Okin Mufutau Gbadamosi

do the necessary things to depose him.
It is your future at stake here. Fulani are like a plague, give them an inch and they take it all. Ofa is now set to be a fulani haven, soon you won't be able to dare speak for yourself

Kingluqman:
This is Offa we are talking about here, not Ilorin. Olodo.

Offa is 100% Yoruba of Oyo Empire and not among conquered Afonja people.

Oga The current Olofa has sworn himself to ilorin and fulani lordship

How many years this one cannot still answer simple questions to defend his obsession

I pity anybody who takes this Olu guy seriously

Etinosa1234:
What's your proof...?

For some reason I cant post Screenshots

Get a copy of Ajayi Crowther dictionary of 1852 and see the Real meaning of master...

If Ajayi Crowther didn't know any word such as Oga to mean master in 1852.. how does that make Yoruba people in 2021 to be the originator of the word

when silliness has become your nature.

Crowther used the word "oga" in his dictionary and he translated it as "champion, distinguished person" this is semantically not far from "master"

below is a screenshit from a 1937 Bini dictionary by Hans Melzian... clearly stating that by 1937 it was a word used by the younger generation.
Show me an earlier bini dictionary showing the word to mean anything close to "master" or "champion" that doesn't reference yoruba

Dupamecano:
Don't forget the Rumawa who are believed to have originated from the Byzantine empire. The sharifai who are descendants of Muhammad Al Maghili and various other families who directly descended from Berbers and Arabs. In general Kano is a mixed bag of various sahelian and sudanian ethnic groups. Even the founding dynasty of the Kingdom Kano Kano are believed to be of eastern origin. Whether this is middle Eastern or eastern African is hard to determine.

Larabawa, Rumawa...
I don't understand how having a name for a people equates to "mixing" with those people in particular.

Kano just being a commercial hub doesn't make it a mixing ground, it's more complex than that.

And even though as I already admitted many West African groups have Eurasian genes, there are many factors involved... like how only a few hardly significant number of carries who first appeared in the region can have many descendants and the same genes gets passed like wildfire.
Hence as long as people have always been marrying foreigners you can't expect to be pure anything. No matter how many generations removed you are.

drealzum:
Hausa words that have influenced pidgin I can think of now.
Uwaka - Meaning your mother in hausa.

I think soldiers made the word popular when they were organizing disorderly Nigerians during military regime since most soldiers are from the north.

Jaki- Meaning Donkey.
You hear statement like, "He wants me to do him 'jaki work' ". That is doing donkey work. Donkey is a beast of burden. It is used for all kinda domestic work in northern part of Nigeria.

Mai guard- Meaning security man who guards.
'Mai' in hausa is someone who does something.
So Mai guard is one who provides security. Just as you have Mai ruwa and Mai suya.
I think these names sticker because northerners provide more of this kinda services.

Somehow I always knew "waka" was from hausa but I didn't know how

Rissimenky:
DUMBO. If Nigeria breaks, what makes you so sure that that will be the end of your problems in this world?

How do you know it won't be just the beginning?

What...you TRUST other people - total strangers - to do right by you just because you share the same language?

So naive and thoughtless, 99% of you.

You will be calling people names that applies to you.

So if we can't trust ourselves and familiar people who speak our language and share our shared Yoruba pride it is someone who can't speak our language we would trust?
You are the real dumbo, naive and thoughtless

Chigboboss:
https://www.channelstv.com/2021/06/08/yoruba-group-reject-calls-for-nigerias-disintegration/

Lol even those who collected the 2k each that APC ogun chapter shared would vote for Yoruba independence should we have our referendum right now.

I pity those who are sharing 2k each

[quote author= post=102422078]This is exactly what this thread is talking about.
RELIGION and senseless TRIBALISM.
But you still have to show your tribal bigotry on this same thread.
You and your ilks simply can't help it.
TRIBALISM is in you like peak milk.

You better change your ways before it becomes too late and learn to love your neighbours as your self.

Let us leave it at this point this beautiful Sunday morning.
Go and sin no more Belial!
(What a moniker!) [/quote]Beautiful Sunday morning indeed. Fulani attack and kill people in Igangan today and you are talking nonsense
Let everyone face their ethnicity and defend themselves

theTranslator:
He is Igbo
He said that in mock

lol.. The Adeba guy is just looking for anyone to support his claims.. Literally anyone
What he doesn't realise is that he has a lot to learn and understand on the subject

EmekaA125:
E pain am ooo

Continue living in denial, Abugu is not an Igbo ancestral name.

What we have is Abogu, Nwogu or Mbogu. I don't have time to argue with you.

Useless troll. Everything is not about butthurt im just sorry for your stupidity, ignorance and uselessness
Ipob should gather and rid igbo nation of useless heads like yours, banish you to sokoto because you are not offering anything. Hate is all you know

EmekaA125:
Abugu is not an Igbo surname. Probably a Yoruba man from Ondo, Kwara or Kogi State

So you are a foolish triabalist who doesn't even know anything about igbo people. You come here acting as if you are igbo defender but you are so ignorant not to know that Abugu is an igbo name
What is your usefulness then

sofiscatedmoron:
Yoraper man

But from the contours on his face he is likely 45 years and not 35

Afonja and rape

AchalugoNwa:


OFONJAAAA

Typical empty heads

Adeba01:
You're to brainwashed in your own propaganda to read the links I charitably and kindly shared. As I warned you beforehand do not bother discussing this particular topic with me until you have read the actual data.
Quit your nonsense propaganda, and furthermore you are on ignore mode. As I believe in what the Chinese sages rightfully state which is "never argue with a fool, not only will he drag you down to his level but he will beat you with experience". I adhere to these principles.

You are just silly. You are yet to prove your point that yoruba have light skin as a result of Berber admixture and you call me brainwashed. Lol brainwashed because I'm not silly to accept your utter bullshiit and ignorance on the science of skin color and gene mutation over the course of human existence. According to this dullard here light skin must be traced to some European gene
You are looking for who will accept your claim without doing the work to prove it - is that not brainwash? That word describes what you intend to do here unfortunately for you nobody is buying it

What data do you have? And if you read my response to your link you would know that I read it and there's nothing new there. However your links do not serve as data to support your claim. Give us the data that your claim about the Yoruba is based on. The burden of proof lays with you. You are the real fool here. Dummies always thinking themselves wise on this forum

Adeba01:
@Macof

Unbelievable for you to be throwing the word 'silly' in your post, when you're making absurd statements.

By the way Fulanis are mixed;

https://www.discovermagazine.com/the-sciences/the-fulani-have-an-old-berber-element

https://bmcgenomics.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12864-019-6296-7

Deal with it, make sure you read the links I kindly and charitably sent to you before discussing this particular subject with me.

This is not about me dealing with anything. You can't just come spewing trash based on half knowledge out of a few Internet articles.

Fulani are not the only ones found with percentages of Eurasian genes, Hausa, Songhai, Kanuri, Cushitic language speakers like Somali also do. Nobody said Africans carry no percentage of genes that mutated outside Africa. What I said is, light skin amongst Yoruba is not about admixture with fulani, given many factors, chief of which is that fulani are not even mainly light skin

If you want to stick to genetic analysis do so. Don't come here making up trash that light skin among Yoruba is due to mixing with fulani who in turn mix with Berbers who in turn mix with Europeans
What's all that

Olu317:
Is that the ony dictionary ? Like I had mentioned, revisit books.
2. Diacritics on what ? There's imperfection in Yoruba diacritics In as much as , Yoruba language orthography is patterned after Latin and it diacritic ; circumflex, Grave and acute. So, stop accusation when you see dictionary to that effect.

Please help yourself more with comprehensive Yoruba dictions through below scholars works

*Abraham 1958 (Dictionary of Modern Yoruba)*

Adewole 2000 (Beginning Yorùbá, part I) Adewole 2001 (Beginning Yorùbá, part II)

Bamgbose 1966 (A Grammar of Yoruba)

Delano 1958 (Atúmò ede Yorùbá)

Ladipo 1972 (Oba Kò So)

Lindfors & Owomoyela 1973 (Yoruba proverbs)

Ogunbowale 1967 (The Essentials of the Yoruba language)

Rowlands 1969 (Teach yourself Yoruba)

Sachnine 1997 (Dictionnaire usuel yorùbá-français)

Ward 1952 (An Introduction to the Yoruba Language)

Although Yoruba of Nigeria are trying but need much work on modification of yoruba lexicons be done As far as Iam concerned , ibadan, use s to replace ṣ etc. This is not a default but pure accent.

Furthermore,among the Akokos , Oka- ufe group has
her dialect often replaces or substitute a front short spread vowel sound /i/ with a short back rounded vowel sound /u/ when compare with that of the Yoruba language, for examples:

Ise- Utse Job
Igba-Ugba time
Iwe-Uwe book
Ile-uli house
Ipe-upe calling
Igbo-ugbo bush
Ijo-udzo dancing
Olu-Elu lord
Okunrin-okinrin male
Obinrin obunrin female

Another most noticeable in the dialect is a palato-alveolar affricate voiced consonant /dz/ which it uses to substitute for /j/ in the Yoruba lexical items, as it can be seen below:
Yoruba Language Owalusin dialect English Language
Eje edze blood
Ijoye idzoje chief
Joka dzoka what/card
Ijala udzala oral poem for hunter
Eja edza fish
Ojogbon odzogben knowledgeable
Ajo adzo journey

Apart from this group other enclaves dialects have been reviewed thoroughly through out Yorubaland.

Lastly, I have never been an incorrectable personality. If Iam, then I must have been a spirit. Although far from it. So, nullify such in heart and understand it that ,it is not about self pride.

All these things has nothing to do with the point at all.

You are just running all over the place, because your "Ȃrẹ" is neither Akokoid nor Yoruba dialects in Akoko or Benin Republic.
And none of the dictionaries or random Screenshots you keep posting show that word as crown or a type of crown

Go back to that Rhektor's post I quoted to learn how to write what you are trying to write with this "Ȃrẹ"
I guess you have never heard the crown called before.. You only read about it without diacritics and are forced to assume its pronunciation
You are talking to people here who actually know how it's pronounced

Christistruth00:
1. The Yoruba are not indigenous to Nigeria; they were immi-
grants from a region where they came under the influences of ancient Egyptians, Etruscans and Jews. Their original home in the middle east..whether it was in Upper Egypt or Yemen...

2. When it arrived in the area which is now Northern Nigeria, the Yoruba wave passed through the confluence of the Niger and the Benue and left a Yoruba settle- ment round Idah. These Yoruba immigrants subsequently became known as the Igara.

3... The second wave, the Oduduwa migration, is the best known in tradition. It arose from the pressure which the incursion of the Arabs into the Sudan exercised upon remnants of the Yoruba and must have taken place towards the end of the 10th century A.D
.. where they could practise their traditional religion in safety

In addition to what TAO11 has said I want to address some key points of the content

But first I'll say...
This is why knowledge of World history is important.
When you understand that the history of any one people is only a small part of the history of all peoples you would know that an accurate narrative must be consistent and fit with facts of events happening elsewhere. Especially when you start claiming one people migrated from somewhere.. You need to know the history of that "somewhere"

1. Ancient Egyptians, Etruscans and Jews?? ... Jews are not contemporary of Etruscans and ancient Egyptians
Maybe if it was stated "ancient Hebrews" I guess that might fly
But so many problems here still...

First, I don't know why it is implied that Egypt is middle east.

Secondly, What are the influences in Yoruba from these 3 groups? And how come Etruscans influenced only Yoruba in the middle east (if we are to believe that) but no other group of middle eastern people have or had any Etruscan influence?

Surely if the basis for this narrative is claimed to be "influences" we should have a description of these influences. And proof to add, that they were from outside to inside not the other way round ie. not the Yoruba influencing these people

And none of these 3 groups mentioned are known to have influenced anybody in Yemen in ancient times. So if Yemen is the Yoruba original home, we should first look look for ancient Egyptian, Etruscan or Hebrew influences there, then we see if any found are comparable to any influence found in yorubaland.

Same for upper Egypt.. We start there by looking for Etruscan and Hebrew influence.

2. From the middle east to Kogi State Nigeria, we cannot believe this "Yoruba migration" did not stop somewhere to found settlements until Idah in the Igala country. Or none still in existence except Igala settlements in Nigeria. No Yoruba settlements in hausaland, Niger Republik, Chad etc
It is so convenient that Igala's are mentioned because obviously they speak a Yoruboid language as anybody could tell by just listening to Igala and this fact was well known when this article was written in the 70s.
But the knowledge of the yoruboid language family belonging to a language group that includes other languages spoken around wasn't well known and explored until the 80s/90s

3. OK so here I think this alludes to the fall of Nubia. But this was only after the annulment of the Baqt treaty in the 13th century.
So any mass migration from Sudan due to Arabs or Muslims would be from the 13th century down not earlier. And the Nubians were Christians not traditionalists
So If the "oduduwa group" were from this region they would have brought Christianity to yorubaland.

0balufonlll:
Obatala founded & reigned at Iranje [and later, Ife].

His descendants resident in Iranje recorded a phenomenon sometime around the 19th century. This event was very impactful such that they thought to commemorate the event in a descriptive term [Idita] which was added to the original name of the town founded by Obatala. Hence, Iranje-Idita.

Obatala's descendants started Idita, several centuries after Obatala founded Iranje. It was a form of change and continuity.

What I'm trying to say is, your theory about the etymology of Obatala is not workable bro.

Interesting. I knew Idita was Iranje sure but that the term came centuries after Obatala is new information.

0balufonlll:
Interesting perspective!
However, I am going to say that Obatala was one of the several titles or appellations for this important deified culture hero. The title Obatala stemmed from the particularism of this figure for white clothes and efun (white chalks).

Each of the Irun imole (400 deities) have specific colour(s) they identified with in the form of fabric, and spatial aesthetics. These deities either identified with this colour alone (such as Oduduwa - black; Ogun - red; Orunmila - green and brown with some white; Esu Ola Ilu - red & black etc.) or belonged to a group of deities associated with the colour.

Obatala is the leading deity among the 400 deities. This may be argued in the form of political power, age and other mythical imaginations within Yoruba folklore. In addition to being the leading personage among the 400 deities, Obatala is also the King of all deities associated with colour white and I think this is where the title 'Oba ti ala', king of white cloths or king of all things white, emanated from. Some of the 'white' wearing deities include but are not limited to Olufon (Obatala's first son), Oluorogbo, Orisa Ikire, Obarese, & Ogiyan. Obatala is their leader, their king.

The Obatala personage had several titles descriptive of his actions or choices. These include Etirigbo, Oseremagbo, Oba Ugbo, & Olufe to mention a few. They all reflected the shifts in or the trajectory/flow of his life and times.

Baba


The thing that set TAO11 and I on this theory spry is that the name "Ọbàtálá" seems to carry a connotation that is different from Aṣọ Àlà

Obatala himself is in no doubt in association with the colour white and the Aṣọ Àlà but the question is what else is he in association with that could be the possible original connotation of the name "Ọbàtálá"

TAO11:
Got it.
___
I get your point here.

Both means father obviously, but the first appears clearly to have been the original Yoruba form vis-a-vis its etymology — from “ba,” viz. to “couch,” to “lord,” etc.

In the light of the foregoing, “bàbá” appears then to have been a form which evolved later from “baba” or/ and from other similarly-sounding words for “father” in other near/distant cultures.

————
My following note is not so relevant to the point here:

I would say ìbà, means “homage,” and júbà (or ṣèbà) means to “pay homage”.

Cheers!

To be honest it is indeed "ọba". I was trying to make a point with examples like Baba/Bàbá and Ìbà where I was proposing a derivation from "bà" could produce a logical etymology. But it's too much a stretch for that to be the case with "Ọba". There was a bit of wishful thinking on my part

Reason why I don't think I can apply that baba /Bàbá logic is that, the word for father might be from baby talk baba/dada/papa etc
(just to add another theory to the mix )

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/10/words-mom-dad-similar-languages/409810/

Olu317:
Not hard feeling but just that will sum up these questions of yours and allegations in tripod perspective because I am in a tripod position.
1. Research is just enquiry into facts or theories. So no qualm on such terminology

2. I have never added up words in a twisting way because I have shown each word with it Yoruba dictionary and the one you can't find in this screenshot will be dealt with later. Even if you claim you know yoruba language or speak it more than I do isn't a problem to me.

2b. I'm aware that when teaching Yoruba literacy, solfège names of musical notes are used to name the tones: low is do, mid is re, and high is mi. Tentatively the current orthography of Yoruba was developed from a 1966 report of the Yoruba Orthography Committee, along with Ayọ Bamgboṣe's 1965 Yoruba Orthography


A B D E Ẹ F G Gb H I J K
a b d e ẹ f g gb h i j k L M N O Ọ P R S Ṣ T U W
l m n o ọ p r s ṣ t u w Y
y


Meanwhile in Benin Republic , Yoruba uses a different orthography. The Yoruba alphabet was standardized along with other Benin languages in the National Languages Alphabet by the National Language Commission in 1975, and revised in 1990 and 2008 by the National Center for Applied Linguistics. Benin alphabet

A B D E Ɛ F G Gb H I J K
a b d e ɛ f g gb h i j k Kp L M N O Ɔ P R S Sh T U
kp l m n o ɔ p r s sh t u
W Y
w y


So, as you can see yoruba language has not been fully understood by the modern day writers because knowledgeof the language is as old as mankind's existence on planet earth. So, I am aware of Yoruba's language vast ancient strength.Altough you may choose to disagree.

what about @rhektor 's post is this even relevant to??

That Yoruba language in Benin Republic is written with modified alphabets different from that written in Nigeria has no relevance to the point he is making. The tones don't change simply because it is Yoruba orthography in Benin Republic.
Besides let's even argue it does, you constantly give strange tone marks and alphabets to a word and never have you stated that you were using the orthography popular in Benin Republic

All this one na scam

3. Àrẹ ("a" sound in bad~ b"a"d) was what I posited and not Àrè.One of the variant option is that according Yoruba dictionary Ȃrẹ is attested to have circumflex on the "A" AArẹ ,which means eldest child,apparent heir etc. Although homophone and homophene exist in this word which makes Yoruba lexicon intiguing. But like I had stated Ȃrẹ is known to mean a crown.


Furthmore, Ȃrolè is older in term of meaning, apparent reigning heir on the throne or incharge of a position of his ancestors.

In conclusion, below is a screenahot of Ȃrẹ, which is a crown.

SMH. Everything you read from him didn't even marinate in your head, you just keep saying your own lmao

rhektor:
Finally, there's nothing like Àrè on its own that translate to crown, crown is Adé. For example we have a type of crown called Adé ìṣẹ̀m̀báyé while we equally have a type of crown called Adé-àrè.

I hope this get to you in good faith, cheers

TAO11:
I am not certain too, and that is very key to that proposed etymology.

I’d beg to respectfully differ oo. The O-B-A in “Obaluaye” is actually the same “Ọba” for “King” oo. Yes it is actually “Ọbalúayé”.

The same applies to the O-B-A in “Obalufon”. The O-B-A here is also the same as “Ọba“ for “King”. Yes it is actually “Ọbalùfọ̀n”.

However, “Obatala” is actually “Ọbàtálá” — but the “Ọbà“ comes originally from the “Ọba” for “King” as I had proposed.

It's an interesting angle that I will keep looking into, I didn't come across it even because of ọbàtálá but just generally. And since we started talking about ọbàtálá it was a good chance to post the idea here
___

What do you say about "baba" and "bàbá" rendered for Father

And "bà" (exert/perch) as opposed to "ba" (hide)
And "júbà" (homage)

TAO11:
I like the “Ọbà tí ó lá” angle to explaining the name Ọbàtálá.

It clearly has a greater explanatory scope and power than the popular etymology from: “Ọba ti àlà”.

The bigger question (to which a related one is already anticipated), however, is as follows:

Can we be certain that the Yorubas (or any Yoruba subgroup) use, or once used “lá” for “sleep”?

More than that, there seems to be a difficulty (one which may be impossible to fix) with this etymology.

This difficulty stems from the phrase “Ọbà tí ó lá” as the proposed components of the name Ọbàtálá.

This phrase is supposed to literally mean: “the king who fell asleep,” the word “Ọbà” as it appears there doesn’t translate to “king”.

On the flip side, even if one were to propose that the etymology is: “Ọba tí ó lá,” (in which case the “Ọba” now translates to “king”, another problem surfaces.

And this is the problem of reconciling this etymology (Ọba tí ó lá) with the actual name “Ọbàtálá“ which shows “Ọbà”, and NOT “Ọba”.

In other words, how does one account linguistically for the shift of the “Ọba” in “Ọba tí ó lá“ (particularly the ‘re’ sound of the “a”) to the “Ọbà“ in “Ọbàtálá“ (particularly the ‘do’ sound of the “a”)?

In contrast to the etymology from “Ọba Ìdẹ̀ta Ńlá,” the shift of the “Ọba” in “Ọba Ìdẹ̀ta Ńlá“ to the “Ọbà“ in “Ọbàtálá“ is clearly explainable — just as the shift from the ta” to “tá”.

Indeed it is not without complications.

I'm not certain of the "lá" = sleep idea yet among Yoruboid groups as I'm only familiar with two other words that roughly express the same concept "orun" and "sùn"
But - la type words appear in other related languages.
In addition to the example in igbo I mentioned in my previous post.. In Nupe it is "le" ie. "Le ele". Which is consistent with Nupe-Yoruba vowel shift of e - a But on the flip side " to dream" is "na ena" which could be a consonant shift of n - l .. But I have no examples so I'm not holding the consonant shift possibility on the same level as the vowel shift

Alternatively maybe "ena" and "ele" are derived from the same source in Nupe

___

Well, if we look at other historical cum spiritual figures like Ọbàlúayé and Ọbàlùfọ̀n we have "Ọbà" just as in Ọbàtálá
And "bà" which means to "exert oneself", "to perch".
Although I know it is more common to render it as "Ọba".

Regarding the Yoruba word “Òrìṣà”, to which its nearest corresponding form is the Istesikiris’ “Òrìṣẹ̀“.

This Itsekiris’ version appears to be the oldest known form and usage.

In other words, it is the form whose components can be reasonably analyzed in the Yoruba language.

If that indeed is the case, then the Yoruba word “Òrìṣà” would have initially applied to the supreme being himself.

In that case this word would clearly translate to the source from which all emanates” — that is, “Òrìṣẹ̀“.

There appears to be some scholarly support for this as wee read the following from Professor Akintoye’s “A History of the Yoruba People”:

“The realm of the spirits was conceived as consisting of two spheres — a higher and a lower. The higher was the place of the Supreme Olodumare who created all things and ruled over all existence. This Supreme Being was first given the name Orisa — roughly meaning “the source from which all things emanated.” Later, to this name was added Olorun (king of heaven) and Oluwa (king over all). Though some Yoruba groups (especially the southern and eastern peoples like the Ijesa, Ondo, Ikale, Owo and Ekiti) continued to apply the name Orisa to the Supreme Being, that name generally came to be used for the highest heavenly beings who were said to have being with the Supreme Being at the time when the Supreme Being created all things, and whom the Supreme Being later sent to the lower spiritual sphere where they became the most senior gods.”

~ S. Adebanji Akintoye, “A History of the Yoruba People,” Amalion Publishing 2010, pp. 31-32.

Cc: macof, RedboneSmith, 0balufonlll

It's really interesting to think that Òrìṣàlà might have been given the name of the supreme being.. Or perhaps worshipped as one part of the supreme being as it appears there might have been a sort of duality with the supreme being in ancient times.

I wonder how "Olisa" can be broken down in igbo

TAO11:
My Position:

(1) “Ọbàtálá” (from: “Ọba-Ìdẹ̀ta-Ńlá”) = “Great King of ìdẹ̀ta”. (Was deified as Òrìṣà-Ńlá. He ruled Ìdẹ̀ta).

(2) “Òrìṣà” (from: “Òrìṣẹ̀”) = “The Source of Emergence”. (Applies originally to God Almighty himself, and later to the deified heroes & heroines).

Cc: macof

I think this is a better thread for this.

I have to commend this here. It shows a deep attention to details and I never saw the possibility of "ideta" being referenced there but I can see how it is possible now.


Here's mine...
I'm also playing around with the idea that "lá" could be an old word for "sleep" hence connecting it to "àlá". Ie. "Ọbà ti ó lá"

Obatala is one of the most ancient deities to be worshipped if not oldest but I just don't see the name "Obatala" to be anywhere as old as the veneration of the deity. Just like you, I think the name is from the Ife-Ugbo schism era in reference to the historical events of that time. Those who are familiar with Obatala's reputation to have slept on the job would know that is what is regarded to have cost him his loss to oduduwa. Another possible name in reference to this could be "Obalesun". Òrìṣà Ńlá and Òrìṣàlà are the more ancient names of the deity

Another factor to this is that in Igbo, "la ula" means to "to sleep" where Yoruba would say "la ala" to say "to dream"

You may ask what then happened to the older word for "dream" if my theory is correct Well I'll respond later.. I promise its interesting

As to "òrìṣà" I'm still trying to understand the - Ṣà/ṣẹ̀ - bit. I don't want to focus only on yoruba since forms of the word is present in related languages. But just as I said about ọbàtálá being in my opinion the oldest deity worshipped by our ancestors.. Aspects of this diety today might be derived from the supreme being or vice versa. Names like Lisa among the Fon, Olisa among the Igbo, Oniso/Osa among Edoid speakers and Oritse in Itsekiri influence this thought.

@redbonesmith, 0balufonlll

PissfulProtester:
you dey mind the idiot wey dey find relevance at all cost

as you can't find relevance even if you search for it

NaijirianKing:
His statements are designed to cause division among brothers.

Whether he is christian or not is irrelevant, it is a fact that he is not under the submission of Allah, he is a foreigner to Islam, and yet he is trying to dictate to Muslims. He can only do this in the south, if he is brave, tell him to come up North and see how the results turn out...

He should allow those who follow Allah to practice without interference from an outsider. A word is enough for the wise.

Will you keep quiet. Was the message addressed to you in the North?

You are the foreigner in this discussion. This is yorubaland matters

thorpido:
It's a big lie.She did not consent to have sex with you.You tried to rape her and while she struggled,you maimed her.

Anuofia

on a norms even if his story is true (which nobody with common sense will believe) it is still rape

You lured her, restricted her and threatened her and gave sex as only option of her freedom
That's rape

TAO11:
Yeah one can be creative like that. Just like “white board,” “snow,” etc. can be “likened” to “purity”.

But if we’re asking what the word actually says, then we must be honest enough (not creative) to admit that the name “Obatala” doesn’t by itself say that.

Its etymology is generally acclaimed to be “oba t’ ala”. IF that’s indeed the case, then we can’t simply discard some words, and unceremoniously reinterpret others.

In other words, we can’t simply ignore “oba,” and “ti,” as well as skip the primary fact that “ala” is equivalent to “white cloth”.

Cheers!
—————
PS:
Personally, I have my reservations for the widely held etymological derivation from “oba t’ ala”.

But the point is, IF this widely held derivation is indeed the case, then my foregoing comments stand true.

Peace!

I also have personal reservations. Part of my working theory on the name's - la ending
Just as I do for the word "Orisa"
This isn't the thread for this conversation though

Simplyleo:
This is one of the animals listening to the nonsense being spread by ipob pigs on social media. So a Christian will now tell Muslims how they should practise their religion?

Once the moon is sighted by any of the moon sighting committees across the country, the message is conveyed to the sultan and he announces accordingly for the purpose of uniformity. If you, Sunday Igboho (a Christian) like, you are free to celebrate any day you want, that is entirely your foolish business. The sultanate never forced anyone to comply with its directive.

Bauchi celebrated their Sallah yesterday, did you hear any noise? The choice is entirely yours but Muslims who know what it means to be obedient to leaders will comply with the announcement of sultan.

Funny how fools who spend all their useless days insulting Islam as a religion will now tell you how Islam should be practised.

We don't divide ourselves by religion in yorubaland.
Take your nonsense impression and shove it down your asss

BTW igboho has never insulted Islam

Olu317:
Yorubas such as una type make me laugh because you are uneducated linguistically. You people are the set of ignorants that make people assume Yoruba as twisting her oral history. No wonder,Rev Ajayi crowder, who is your mentor and hero did serious damage to support una nonentity ideology of yoruba being originated from West Africa; Present day Nigeria. Lol

On the subject matter, kindly help me with any international standard of transcribing the 'i' of Yoruba if it falls within proper Yoruba pronunciation . ìrú ìrú ọbẹ̀ gbẹ̀gírí

Plainly, International Phonetic Alphabet(IPA)is a system of transcribing the sounds of languages which consists of some Latin and Greek letters (the pattern Yoruba copied) and a variety of additional symbols and diacritics,has shown that the objective of trancribing is to represent each recognisable sound in a unique fashion. The IPA was developed at the end of the last century; the acronym stands for International Phonetic Alphabet. Examples:

Yoruba: 'i', being pronunce as e doesnt fall within the correct accent as be. Instead itis 'bi'

Standardly 'i' is pronunced as 'ai'


1.Hi/hi=
Pronunciation
IPA: /haɪ/

2. By=
Pronunciation
(British, America) enPR: bī, IPA: /baɪ/

bi-=
Pronunciation
IPA: /baɪ-/, /bɪ-/
Example

Pronunciation
(RP, GA) IPA: /aɪ/
(Southern American English) IPA: /aː/
(AU, New Zealand) IPA: /ɑe/

Ignorant TA O11 learn!Come to Benin Republic to learn more from Yoruba's scholars without your copy and paste wannabe tipatipa pseudo Nigeria's Yoruba.No wonder Nigeria's Yoruba has so many errors. Meanwhile, oga at the top combine together to help out too with the sound . I shall turn your knowledge into shred before other Yorubas.Egocentric empty barrels.........!!!

Mr. Man shut up and stop ranting. Focus on one point.
We have not finished your kèrè nonsense you are jumping to start another senseless and incoherent argument from nowhere

Olu317:
Just reread what you posted! Are you really lettered? Do Yoruba have 'i' ~hi sound? This is because you sneak it in Lol . So
easy for you to use absurd words on just something, you arent paid.You see, I am a writer with intense research on the subject matter i posit on. You and I arent competing and nothing I have posted that there is no journal written on them by names I mentioned so far. Anyway, enjoy yourself.

Lol wtf! Smh

TAO11:
Oga stop saying nonsense.

(1) Nobody enters the Kaaba with the back — bring your evidence if you must remain ignorant.

(2) I didn’t talk about about black stone at any point. So, stop the childish distraction. And the black stone does not belong to Abraham, anyways.

(3) Nobody dances around the Kaaba in Islam — bring your evidence if you must remain ignorant.

(4) Nobody throws stone to any devil at Mecca, it is done at Mina (a different city) — bring your evidence if you must remain ignorant.

First of all, you clearly know absolutely nothing about tonal diacritics of Yoruba words. Humble yourself I may teach you that — free of charge.

Secondly, the dictionary you attached does not support one thing from what you’ve been typing — not one thing.

You said “kèrè” (a meaningless word) has the meaning “proclamation”.

Yet the closest thing to it on your screenshot is “kéré” meaning “small,” or “little”.

Why are you embarrassing yourself all around?

You too have seen the guy is a slowpoke suffering from some mental problems hindering cognition.

He can't process information logically but rather through preconceived sentimental notions, so for him facts are shaped by his super powers of thinking it into reality .. Rather than allowing his thoughts be shaped by facts. That's why the overwhelming majority of his posts on this forum are nonsense and he is confident enough to start documentation of the kind of posts he makes here for publication I pity the people that will use money to buy the book

That's how he started with claiming "kèrè" (a non existent word as far as I'm concerned) means proclamation only to post a dictionary screenshot showing only "kéré" meaning small
Like how does that help his argument
Somehow "kéré" is supposed to magically transform to "kèrè" and adopt the meaning "proclamation"